Bono Dines With Jesse Helms

[Redstone]

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory?id=1402288

"CHARLOTTE, N.C. Dec 13, 2005 — Bono and Jesse Helms?

Not only are they friends, but the Irish rocker and archconservative former North Carolina senator also share a common cause: fighting AIDS in Africa"

"He (Bono) called us a couple of weeks ago and said he wanted to see his old friend the senator," said John Dodd, president of the Jesse Helms Center, who accompanied Helms and other family members to Monday's meeting."

Memo to Mr Holypants Bono: It's one thing to work for worthy causes, but when you get in bed with the devil, it kinda sorta gets you to be looking like a publicity whore.

Redstone

[Canuckistanian]

1. Helms? Fighting AIDS in Africa?

Is this true?

[Redstone]

3. Probably not. But he says he is. You believe him? I don't.

He's never been real fond of black folks, so it's kinda hard to think he'd go out of his way to keep any of them alive.

Or maybe he's only helping WHITE people in Africa who have AIDS.

Redstone

[electropop]

23. I thought Helms died?

:wtf:

[xxqqqzme]

29. I also thought the old reprobate

died.

Guess it's true only the good die young.

[electropop]

39. Just wishful thinking I guess.

Out of sight, out of mind.

[Buns_of_Fire]

42. You might be thinking of Strom Thurmond (nt)

[Javaman]

51. No, he just appears dead. n/t

[melm00se]

35. from the Helm's website

http://www.jessehelmscenter.org/news/default.asp?ID=80

Wingate, North Carolina (November 30, 2005) - US Senator Jesse Helms (retired) has recorded a personal video, "Make a Difference" to deliver his message on the scope of the AIDS crisis in Africa and his plea that those who might be tempted to turn away from such a large challenge would remember how they would respond if such devastation were to visit their own community, or their own family.

snip

The Senator committed to do all he could, for as long as he was able, to bring the AIDS fight to the attention of all who could help. In his memoir, Here’s Where I Stand, the Senator describes his change of heart and his hope that the United States will not be just the wealthiest power among the nations, but the wisest in the use of its resources for the good of those in desperate need of our help.

[Redstone]

44. He can scramble and bullshit all he wants to, but God can see his soul,

and will deal with him accordingly when the time comes.

All of a sudden, he wants to help Africans, most of whom happen to be black.

So, what, is it only American black folks he's spent his entire life trying to grind down?

Redstone

[melm00se]

48. so there is

no redemption possible?

[Redstone]

50. I can't speak for any deities, but I'd say he might want to consider

at least acknowledging and apologizing for his lifelong racism and contempt of homosexuals, and the very real damage that has caused to millions of people. That could be a good start toward redemption.

I do very much believe in redemption in case you're wondering, and I'm quick to forgive if the attempt at redemption seems sincere.

But all of a sudden deciding he's going to be an anti-AIDS champion, well, I don't see anything that tells me he's not the same blackhearted bigot he's been all along, despite that. And yes, I feel qualified to judge him, because he's a public figure.

Now this is more like a discussion that having someone call me a WASP. (Me? A WASP? That's just fucking hilarious. I am not even ONE thing that those letters stand for!)

So if you'd like to talk about it more, I'd be happy to do so. I'll be back around nine or so, I think.

Redstone

[Montauk6]

64. Yes, look at George Wallace.

[GatoLover]

57. I had no idea

Given Helms' rough history, I wonder what brought about this change of heart.

[Redstone]

60. Good question. If, that is, it's a real change of heart.

I'd not trust that old coot any farther than I could kick him.

Redstone

[GatoLover]

61. He retired from politics on his own terms

G-d knows I'm no admirer of Helms, but I can't see any motive for him to fake it at this point. He's not exactly planning to run for anything, you know?

[endarkenment]

2. Bono should stick to making creepy ads for itunes

and just give his money to aids ngos doing good work without sucking up to fascists.

[henslee]

4. F-ck Bono for legitimizing the c-ckbag (feeling a bit rudepunditish today)

[LostinVA]

12. I agree -- I lived in NC during the worst of Helm's anti-gay

Anti-AIDS rhetoric. He is fucking evil. I mean it. And Bono is making him legit by doing this. This makes me very upset, actually.

The son of one of Helm's friends died of AIDS. The boy's mom wrote a letter to Helm's asking if he STILL thought AIDS was a punishment from God for being an evil homosexual. He wrote a letter to her basically saying yeah, that the young man deserved it for being a fag. Great compassion. The only silver lining is that this middle-aged, conservative, Southern lady did a complete 180 in her beliefs, and started up am organization for AIDS awareness and acceptance.

[wovenpaint]

5. Wow

you just never know, do you?
I didn't know that Helms was involved in the AIDS fight.
I learn something new every day....

[gtar100]

6. Dine with Helms??? god, I'd have no appetite

[Freddie Stubbs]

7. If Darth Vader and Robert Byrd can change their stripes, then

perhaps Jesse Helms can too. But i wouldn't hold my breath.

[Joe Chi Minh]

8. Rock stars can't believe that they can mix with big-shots in

politics. It's embarrassing to see what push-overs they are for patronising by wingnut bigwigs. Geldorf is like a puppy dog with Blair.

[zbdent]

9. So we're to take Helms' word that Bono called him?

riiiiiiiight . . . and Bono was doing a fundraising concert for Rick Santorum, who just happened to scalp a few tickets for the show . . .

[silvermachine]

14. Not their first meeting by any means...

...http://archives.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/06/13/bono.helms/

<<<U2 lead singer and activist Bono called Republican Sen. Jesse Helms of North Carolina a "brave and bold man" for inviting him to lunch Wednesday to discuss the African AIDS crisis.>>>

snip

<<<Bono said he was impressed that Helms "cares deeply about what is happening in Africa right now" and that "there is a move here in the Capitol to do something more historic about it. ... >>>

He did what he did when hate came to town.

Frankly, Bono makes me a bit ill.
It's all about his messiah complex, not the "cause".
More about the messenger than the message.
He's more showman than shaman and hasn't an altruistic bone in his body.

[kskiska]

10. In Andrea Mitchell's latest book

she describes an interview she'd had with Helms during the Clinton administration. She received a call to return to Washington due to Ron Brown's death in the plane crash. When she explained to Helms that Brown had been killed, he smiled and said, "Good."

[Hypatia82]

11. The true measure of a man...

is in how he treats someone who can do him absolutely no good. A little Samuel Johnson quote. And there's also the simple matter that Bono just makes himself bigger than anything else by sitting and eating with someone he can't on the surface be too thrilled about. Any idiot can sit with someone they agree with. It's the people who sit and are friendly and cordial with those they disagree with that are worth knowing and worth praise.

[Rich Hunt]

13. you are correct

This is a fundamental part of Christian ethics - you sit down and 'break bread' with people you have differences with. How are we supposed to make any progress politically if we are unwilling to do this? Some people need to be reminded that the custom of 'shunning' or 'separating' from those with whom you have political differences is not universal. The United States as a nation is supposed to be based on the concept of civility.

[Redstone]

15. Ah, but he's helping that reactionary old bastard whitewash his image.

So tell, me, where's the good in that? What does it accomplish?

Redstone

[LostinVA]

20. Preaching to the choir, Redstone!

[Redstone]

21. I'll be damned. I thought, from what I saw around here, that most liberal

types considered Bono to be "one of us."

I stand corrected. I should have given DUers more credit for being smarter than average, which I know we are.

Redstone

[Rich Hunt]

25. So by your logic...

Bono is to be shunned because he spoke to a very conservative Republican.

I love how you people don't deign to explain or defend your baffling value system,
and you speak as if it should be apparent to all.

I told you already - the Irish Catholics don't do this. We believe in engaging
those with whom we disagree.

Please explain to me how social contact with a right-winger is automatic
disqualification from your fold. Please defend your unwritten social rules.

The common rules of American civility demand it.

[Redstone]

32. You can get off your Irish Catholic high horse now.

"We believe in engaging those with whom we disagree."

Uh-huh. Like the Irish Catholics and Protestants "engaged" with each other in Belfast.

Like the Irish Catholics "engaged" with the black schoolkids when the schools in South Boston were integrated (and some of those "engaging Irish catholics" were my relatives).

There's NO group of people who are saints. I know from Irish, and they're no better or worse as a group than anyone else.

And this doesn't have a fucking thing to do with him being Irish! Did you see one post here that denigrated him for being Irish?

Redstone's Rule #2: Never waste your time arguing with someone who sees things that aren't there.

Goodbye.

Redstone

[LostinVA]

52. My mother's family is Irish Catholic

And they believe that if you sleep with dogs, you rise with fleas.

[LetsGoMurphys]

63. you couldnt be more right about

"I told you already - the Irish Catholics don't do this. We believe in engaging
those with whom we disagree" very true in my family.

[Rich Hunt]

28. IN YOUR OPINION

Who is 'whitewashed' and who isn't is a SUBJECTIVE THING. You are expressing a PERSPECTIVE.

You and your types ought to realize that your cultural beliefs are not held by anyone.

That you PERCEIVE it to be so does not make it so.

How hard is it for you people to say, 'in my opinion'.

Looks like a lot of people need a lesson in civic discourse.

I guess if I extend your logic, the entire Senate along with anyone who may
have ever been nice to Jesse Helms is 'illegitimate'.

As an Irish of Catholic origin, I am well sick of your cultural biases and how they go unchallenged.
Your cultural standards will apply to us no more. You WILL recognize them as a subjective thing.

[Redstone]

45. Sorry, I couldnt' resist one more:

"You WILL recognize them as a subjective thing."

So, this is how the Irish (actually, you) "engage" and have "civic discourse" with people you disagree with?

By issuing them orders? Think you just shot yourself in the foot, in a logical sense, buddy.

Three words: Anger Management Counseling. Offered to you in compassion.

Redstone

[LostinVA]

53. Beat me to it, Redstone buddy

[Hypatia82]

62. I'd sit and have dinner...

with Louis Farrakhan if I was so invited. I won't refuse a gesture of kindness. Whitewashing is words. To treat another person with dignity even if they haven't always been so nice, no matter what happens afterwards, is an act never in vain. Nothing so softens a hard heart as unrelenting kindness and openess. And if I'd have dinner with Farrakhan you can imagine who else I'd have dinner with.

[RethugAssKicker]

16. Helms is "working" on Aids in Africa... to get in on the inside

so he can figure out a way to continue the genocide against Black Africans..

His real goal is to work with the World Health Organization.. so they can continue to taint their antiboitics with disease!

IMO

[onenote]

65. wow..nice tinfoil you're sporting today...

[MrPrax]

17. Confused...

Why is everyone surprised by Bono's frequent meetings with scum like Helms?

Seems most of the comments here appear to suggest that this rock star is legitimizing Helms.

Did it ever occur to anyone that Bono is also an arch conservative and probably shares MORE in common with Helms than Bono does with his average fan?

If you drop the unfounded idea that Bono is progressive, then there really is NO problem here. The complaints seem to rest entirely on this notion.

Birds of a feather, no?

[RethugAssKicker]

18. I agree... FUCK BONO...

[Megahurtz]

40. Totally Agreed. n/t

[Redstone]

19. Well, that sure clears it up. (Not sarcasm.)

"The unfounded idea that Bono is progressive."

That applies to me, since my pop-culture radar is really low-powered.

But how did Bono manage to make so many people think that way? As I said, I'm easy to fool with pop-culture stuff, but I did have the notion that he was a "progressive," especially given how much I got jumped on last time I posted something negative about him on DU.

I'd like to hear more on this so I can get my facts straight.

Redstone

[Rich Hunt]

24. excuse me??

Answer a few questions here, and don't dodge having to defend your thoughtless character assassination.

1) 'Progressive' is an American political term, with a very specific historical context. Are you applying
and then withdrawing this description from an Irishman?

2) If your concept of 'progressivism' has nothing to do with this American concept of it,
then what IS your definition of it?

3) How does his sitting down and talking with Jesse Helms negate that definition? Please be
specific. How can Democrats claim to be superior to Republicans when the intellectual
level of this discussion is hardly beyond an AOL chat bitchfest.

To me, progressivism implies 'civic engagement'. That means not being afraid to
talk to people with whom you may have differences.

Bono comes from an Irish Catholic culture that relishes debate and political
discussion and which does not believe in 'shunning' or scorning those with
whom you disagree. And I know you 'codespeak' people - that is what this is REALLY
all about. You disapprove of our culture.

[Redstone]

27. "You codespeak people?"

If I knew what the fuck you were talking about...

And furthermore, "disapprove of your culture?" I'm half Irish Catholic, you moron, so why would I do that? This doesn't have anything to do with him being Irish; it has to do with him cuddling up to a racist dinosaur!

Sheesh. Paranoid, much?

Redstone

[Rich Hunt]

31. oh bullshit

If you're 'half' Irish Catholic, you're fucking brainwashed.

Either that, or this is another one of their 'let's get one of their own to kill her',
or barring that, let's just fucking fake it.

Prove to me that you truly are by demonstrating a famliarity with our culture,
and by rejecting their bullshit puritanical 'shunning' 'guilt by association' values.

What's more, I asked you three questions, and you got personal and failed to answer them.

Go back and answer them. How does talking to a conservative make one a conservative?
Be logical.

[Redstone]

33. See Redstone's Rule #2 here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1986161&mesg_id=1986865

Again, goodbye.

Redstone

[Rich Hunt]

30. so, by bigoted WASP logic...

If you meet with a conservative, if you befriend a conservative...you ARE a conservative.

Well, that belies his statements and his musical track record, doesn't it?

Whose cultural standards are these? 'Guilt' by association? Those are yours.

The Irish people resent being judged by your unfair and illogical standards.

Get off our backs.

[MrPrax]

41. Say What?

First off, a bigot is someone tossing words like WASP around?
Also I don't think one's station, skin colour or demonination is necessarily a defense against being fooled by marketing.

I was really saying that looking over the topic scroll. People seemed shocked. Their shock might be genuine or explainable by NOT assuming why a 'left wing' guy would seek company with 'right wing' guy.

Other than a public charity persona and his musical products, what DO people know about Bono and what he really thinks.

We know what Helms is; a hypocritical M.O.D. lobby lackey, brimstone spewing Christian hate conservative.

But let's face it, most people don't KNOW Bono.

I can no more conclude anything from his politics from his lyrics than you, apparantly. But then again, Ted Nugent's lyrics generally don't reveal the truly barren depths of his crank politics and twisted worldview. But if Nugent was high-fiving his some politician widely regarded as Left or liberal, then I would ask the same question of that politician. In this case, it simply reversed, but no less important to be thinking critically and be aware Bono might be more marketing than reality.

He at one time seriously considered to head the World Bank instead of Wolfie and Bono is buddies with Wolfie as well.

So shoot me...

[Redstone]

43. But you're wrong! Ted Nugent's lyrics DO tell us something about him:

That he's a really BAD songwriter.

Redstone

[LostinVA]

54. You're the bloody bigot -- and not truly understanding who Helms is

I agree with Redstone 100% -- WTF does the Irish thing have to do with it??? And, I'm half Irish and half Sicilian, not a fucking drop of "WASP" in me, was raised Catholic, and have family members who are Sisters.

You are not American apparently, and I guess don't know how truly EVIL Helms is. He is EVIL. I lived in NC for decades when that slavery apologist ruled the roost, spreading his poison far and wide. He did the same thing for gays and women that he did for blacks: piss on them with his vitriolic. Pass laws against their very right to have a Constitutional right to freedom and happiness. You are known by who you willingly associate with, and sitting down and breaking bread with someone is a sign of acceptance, of willingness. Helms was almost truly as bad as Hitler in a microcosm, and given legitimacy to his nasty, poisonous views does indeed rub off on Bone. Because Helms has NOT changed his views one iota.

Do not preach to us. We have seen our country and its citizens raped by evil men for decades... and Helms was the one of the first in line unbuttoning his trousers.

Oh, and "Progressive"? It's most certainly not just an American political term. It means: "Promoting or favoring progress toward better conditions or new policies, ideas, or methods." And, I'm not a DEmocrat. I'm a Socialist.

We have a right to our opinion, boyo, just as you do to yours. And it's more personal to us.

And, wtf judged the Irish people? We're talking about Bono.

On edit: I know you're not a "boyo," before you flame me for that.

[Redstone]

59. Yes, that was pretty damn funny.

There's not ONE word represented by the letters in the acronym WASP that describes me, either.

Funny how some people are so fixated on a particular thing that they can't think of ANYTHING in termos of anything else...kind of like bush; ask him ANY question, and his answer is the same: 9/11, 9/11, 9/11...

Damn, if I had criticized, I dunno, Catherine Zeta-Jones, someone would have accused me of Welsh-bashing?

Redstone

[mitchum]

46. I agee with you, MrPrax

[onenote]

66. and on what facts do you base the bono = arch conservative claim?

Not saying it is or isn't true. Just would like to see some support for a rather unqualified claim.

onenote

[David Zephyr]

22. I think that Sonny Bono has reincarnated as just Bono.

[mitchum]

47. But Sonny, at least, cowrote "Needles And Pins", while Bono has...

never written a good song.
Both really bad singers, though.

[Redstone]

55. He co-wrote "Needles and Pins?"

That is indeed a big point in his favor. Great song.

And you might or might not like Sonny's singing, but you HAVE to admit that he was a lousy skier. At least that one time.

Redstone

[Rich Hunt]

26. 'it gets you to be looking'

'It gets you to be looking' - in whose eyes. YOURS.

You speak for yourself. You have subjectivity.

And yet, you imply by your words that your subjectivity ought to be apparent to all.

Well, it's not to me. I couldn't give a good goddamned who he talks to.

[Montauk6]

34. Reminds me of something from Malcolm's "Ballots/Bullets" speech

He was talking about how buddy-buddy LBJ was with Sen. Richard Russell (D-GA), one of the more notorious Dixiecrat segregationists.

That man's too tricky
'Specially if his friend is still Ol' Dicky...

Also, I kinda/sorta brought this up before, right after the Bono's "60 Minutes" appearance, where I dared be critical of Bono's slight dig at "bleeding heart" liberals; and some of the feedback was "leave the guy alone, he's doing good, what have YOU done to help the poor, etc."

[PhilipShore]

36. Can I sing better?

I can sing. Will the Republicans allow me and Bono a sing fight to see who wins?

[David Zephyr]

37. Here's all one needs to know about Jesse Helms and AIDS

He personally can be held responsible a great number of the patches on these quilts.

[brentspeak]

38. Good for Bono

Has the guts to open himself to howls of protest from the unwashed masses so he can get funding for worthy things.

[Idioteque]

49. Haha

[Redstone]

56. Gee, thanks. I neeed that.

Redstone

[donheld]

58. I for one don't give a damn