Mixed emotions among soldiers in Iraq

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8017492/

Sgt. Shawn Biederman is simply trying to survive the next two months and make it home. His unit mate, Spc. Brent Short, has just signed up for a one-year extension.

As another summer of searing heat bears down on Iraq, many soldiers in this troubled Sunni-dominated region of central Iraq say they remain as committed as ever to winning the war, however long it takes. Others fret about missing newborns’ first words or precious time with young wives.

Still others worry about the slow pace of creating an Iraqi force to relieve them, and say they aren’t sure they are accomplishing anything real.

“We want to hand it over to them. But when it comes down to it, the (Iraqi police) we’re hiring are all bad,” said Army Sgt. Nicholas Radde, 21, of LaCrosse, Wis., as his soldiers took a break from the heat in the parking lot of an abandoned storage area.

[leftchick]

1. I want what the sarge here is smoking...

~snip~

“Every day that we’re here it makes the region safer and it makes the U.S. safer,” said Sgt. 1st Class Jefferson Pridgen, a career Army soldier from Lakeland, Fla.

:eyes:

[Lucky Luciano]

2. Just run down to the loal market and pick up some Kool-Aid! nt

[Frederik]

18. Tastes kool-aid-licious!

:spray:

[silverweb]

3. Key words:

"...career Army soldier from Lakeland, Fla."

Double whammy. From Jebbieland and a career man.

He has to tow the company line, whatever it takes! Ain't gonna let no true facts get in his way!

[icehenge]

5. Whats a career army soldier?

[silverweb]

9. Seriously?

Career military people are in for a full 20 years to secure full retirement benefits. I have relatives who took that route, who "retired" before they were 40, drawing full military pension and benefits, then went on to new civilian careers. It can be rather lucrative if you survive the first 20 years in mind and body.

I'm not saying I'm against full pension and benefits for retired career military people. What I am saying is that "career" military people who are still in the military know which side their bread is buttered on. They generally feel it's wise not to make waves. I know plenty of people who have been through that gauntlet.

[TacticalPeek]

14. Knowing where the bread gets buttered is certainly part of it for lifers.

And there is often a difference between publicly stated opinion and private sentiment, sometimes a 180 degree difference, and that's up and down the ranks.

Also, I believe after 20 years you can retire at about half pay. After thirty years you retire at about full pay. And there is health care, some base privileges, etc. I've known guys that did their thirty, took a vacation, then came back to the same outfit as a civilian GS-10 or whatever at the next desk over and picked back up, salting it away.

[silverweb]

16. Thanks for the corroboration.

My relatives must have been bragging, because I never knew that they retired at half pay. *lol* Some things never change. Your statement of 30 years with full pay sounds more sensible.

After my divorce, an uncle who retired from the Coast Guard and then went on to a whole new career advised me to "fix yourself up real nice and look for a retiree. He'll be young enough to be functional and old enough to be secure." I laughed my ass off.

In any case, we agree that those still on active duty with both eyes on the retirement package are less likely to do anything that will jeopardize their plans.

[MADem]

25. Actually, in all circumstances, they only mean BASE pay

...not allowances. Depending on the area and if you live in off base, civilian housing (to include your own home), allowances can add more than a thousand tax-free bucks a month to your paycheck. Also, retirees' COLAs (cost of living allowances, adjusted annually) do not always keep pace with active allowances.

Stil though, it is a nice retirement, and the higher your paygrade, the nicer it is.

[tinymontgomery]

23. You don't retire with full pay

20 years get you 50% of the last 3 years average pay ie: 1 year as a e-6 (using numbers just to make it easy) $10,000, person advances to e-7 1 year $12,000 next year gets a pay raise makes $14,000. Add them together that makes $36,000 divide by 3 makes $12,000 a year divided by 12 months = $4,000 a month you get 50% of that if you joined after 8 sept 1980.

Also retirement is based on base pay, no special pay or other allowances taken into account. still not a bad retirement but believe me you earn every penny during that 20 years.

[MADem]

24. What is the benefit for a one year extension for enlisted folks, these

days? In the past, you got a choice of a monthly pay bump, a lump sum pay bump, or a free trip home and 15 extra days leave, or you pay your own way and get 30 extra days leave.

No one is extending out of pure patriotism. There's an INCENTIVE at work there--either your choice, guaranteed (assuming you live) follow on duty, extra leave, extra cash, or all of the above.

Hell, they've used these force shapers in peacetime to even out end strength at the regional and installation levels, surely they are doing it now.

[TacticalPeek]

26. Going NG for a burst of six gets a $15,000 tax-free bonus.

Yet, like Waits, he reenlisted for another six years before he left the Middle East. For both, there is the understanding that six more years in the National Guard will move them closer to a military pension and a more secure retirement. There is also the $15,000 tax-free bonus that each will receive for reenlisting.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0503/p01s01-usmi.html



Special skills can get you more.

Also announced in this message is the elevation of the ceiling limit on zone A nuclear ratings, as well as Cryptologic Technician’s Interpretive (CTI) holding the 9211, basic Mandarin Chinese linguist, or 9216, basic Arabic linguist, NEC from $45,000 to $60,000.

http://www.navycompass.com/news/newsview.asp?c=157013

[MADem]

28. I'm not thinking of reup bonuses, I am wondering if they have broadened

...the benefit for reTOURING (on your same enlistment) in a combat zone. It seems ulikely that one would do it without additional incentive, unless they have a death wish.

[w8liftinglady]

29. just hazardous duty pay(son is going for 2nd time)

...and why not get the re-up bonus?They are making these guys serve out their inactive reserve time(not letting them out) for no more money...

[MADem]

30. I'm not saying they should not get it

What I am wondering, from someone who has been there this time around, is if the policy to provide an additional benefit, beyond reup bonuses, beyond signing bonuses, beyond combat pay, beyond the tax free incentives, exists for those who are willing to do another year in the sandbox? Is there an additional carrot??? Like there is for remote and isolated duty?

[Elwood P Dowd]

4. It's just military brainwashing

When I was drafted during Vietnam the guys in the 18-20 age bracket fell for everything. Most of them really believed that we were saving the world from communism. Those that were older and better educated (I was almost 24 when drafted) knew better. When you get 'em enlisted while they're young and easily trained and manipulated, this is what you get.

A younger friend of mine has been in the military almost 20 years. He's just marking time until retirement. He says most of the troops actually believe Iraq was involved with 9-11, and that they're protecting us from terrorism.

[leftchick]

7. I have read of the brainwashing

Rush Limpballs to listen to, Fox Snews to watch and I also have read where the soldiers were shown the Twin Towers coming down over and over again on base in Baghdad. I can understand a young person (like my idiot Marine nephew) believing the horseshit for a while. But damn, you would think a lot more would have awakened to reality by now.

:(

[Elwood P Dowd]

12. Also, don't forget selective reporting here

You interview 20 troops, and half say this war is a crock of shit. When the article comes out you get quotes from more supporters than detractors.

Yes, the Limbaugh, Hannity, Fox propaganda is unbelievable. Here you have a bunch of cowards and draft dodgers influencing the troops, while war heroes such as John Kerry and Max Cleland are considered traitors. Most don't even know that Bush and Cheney are nothing but common rich boy, draft dodgers from the Vietnam era.

[dArKeR]

6. What ever happend to Christian honesty and morality? "Thou shall not tell

a lie!"

PS. I don't see the snip in the link.

[leftchick]

8. it is on the second page of the posted article

:hi:

[dArKeR]

10. Thanks. In fact it's the first time I've clicked on MSWHORE for over

a year. I didn't notice the second page. Thanks!

[bpilgrim]

17. Other soldiers are eagerly re-enlisting, and some are even asking to stay

Other soldiers are eagerly re-enlisting, and some are even asking to stay in Iraq longer.

Short, 22, of Odessa, Texas, who has already served 10 months in Iraq, requested a one-year extension.

“I think it’s going well here,” said Short, dismounting from a gunner’s turret atop a baking Humvee after his unit detained a man suspected of making fake Iraqi passports.

i guess it's better once you get there... maybe they ought to make these guys recruiters :shrug:

peace

[leftchick]

20. By the time this poor guy (and his family) gets back to the US

he will be one seriously fucked up mofo. You can take that to the bank!

[Dover]

11. Perhaps all our soldiers should read this PNAC statement about their

intent in Iraq:



As the neoconservative Project for the New
American Century argues; “the United States has for decades sought to play
a more permanent role in Gulf regional security. While the unresolved conflict
with Iraq provides the immediate justification, the need for a substantial
American force presence in the Gulf transcends the issue of the regime of
Saddam Hussein. (The need for bases) would endure even should Saddam
pass from the scene…and even should U.S.- Iranian relations
improve…because of longstanding American interests in the region.”
(Donnelly, 1997, 4) This aligns nicely with the thinking of Dr. Rice who
states; “To be sure, there is nothing wrong doing something that benefits all
humanity, but that is, in a sense, a second-order effect. America’s pursuit of
the national interest will create conditions that promote freedom, markets and
peace.” (Harding, 2003) Democracy for Iraq is of no real concern in either
of these statements, rather U.S. unilaterial needs are front and center while
freedom and peace become “second-order effects.”

Here it is worthwhile to take a short look at hegemonist (neocon) strategy for
the Middle East because this region occupies such a key position in world
affairs. Speaking to the Foreign Policy Research Institute, Perle unwraps
the strategy: “Those who think Iraq should not be next may want to think
about Syria or Iran or Sudan or Yemen or Somalia or North Korea or
Lebanon or the Palestinian Authority...if we do it right with respect to one
or two…we could deliver a short message, a two-word message. ‘Your
next.’ ” Continuing on about an U.S. occupation of Iraq, Perle boasts,
“look at what could be created, what could be organized, what could be
made cohesive with the power and authority of the United States.” (Perle,
2001)
Thus domination of the Middle East is the opening battle for what
hegemonists see as their end game, unquestioned U.S. military
preeminence in every corner of the world. This policy, which so
fundamentally rejects multilaterialism, has galvanized international globalist
opposition.

..snip..

Samuel Huntington wrote, “A military force
is fundamentally antihumanitarian: its purpose is to kill people in the most
efficient way possible.” (Huntington, 1993a, 43)

Maintaining this correct use of the military was central to the
argument put forward by geopolitical realists like Secretary of State Colin
Powell and National Security Advisor Dr. Condolezza Rice. As Rice
explained before 9-11; “The president must remember that the military is a
special instrument. It is lethal and it is meant to be. It is not a civilian police force. It is not a political referee. And it is most certainly not
designed to build a civilian society.” (Harding, 2003)



http://www.net4dem.org/mayglobal/Papers/JerryHarris_MilitaryIndustrialComplex.pdf

There IS no desire to turn things over to the Iraqis anytime soon...
It will take years...maybe decades to secure our hold on this area. Particularly when you understand that the neocons don't have any desire to do any nation building and still believe, despite evidence to the contrary, that high tech weaponry will make the need for more soldiers minimal if not obsolete. And the ones we have will continue to be spread thin and overworked. They are seen strictly as a killing force.

In the meantime, chaos is their game plan.

[0007]

13. Bring the troops home even against their will...

n/t

[rodeodance]

15. "the (Iraqi police) we’re hiring are all bad,”"---not much

confidense in the iragi troops from this soldier

[IndianaGreen]

19. The war was lost long ago! Come home and punish your leaders!

“I like to think we’re doing some good,” Lambert said. “But it’s hard to tell.”

The war was lost long ago! There is no shame when an aggressor loses a war against a weak victim. The only thing for US troops to do is to come home and punish their leaders responsible for this debacle, from their AWOL Commander-in-Chief, to those generals that put their careers ahead of country and planned for this war.

Like the Russian army in 1917, our troops must come home, storm the American equivalent of the Winter Palace, and topple the American Tsar.

[leftchick]

21. indeed IG

I happily await that day. That is the only salvation for the USofA.

[bpilgrim]

22. "The Road Home is Through Bagdad" - April, 2003

Baghdad falls to US forces

In a symbolic moment, an American armoured vehicle helped a crowd of cheering Iraqis to pull down a huge statue of Saddam Hussein in the al-Fardus square in front of the hotel.

Dozens of exultant people leapt on the deposed figure and stamped on it, shouting "Death to Saddam!".

source...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/2930913.stm

CIC Declares, Mission Accomplished

USS Abraham Lincoln May 1, 2003

July 2, 2003

http://images.Globalfreepress.com/flash

Bring'em HOME! NOW!!!

Jan 30, 2005

:cry:

peace

[Skittles]

27. one of the VERY popular items I send to soldiers in Iraq

are sweet, romantic cards for their gals back home - I am told they are snapped up and mailed immediately