Peace in Iraq 'Will Take at Least Five Years to Impose'

[chlamor]

Peace in Iraq 'will take at least five years to impose'

Richard Norton-Taylor and Michael Howard in Iraq
Wednesday May 25, 2005
The Guardian

It could take at least five years before Iraqi forces are strong enough to impose law and order on the country, the International Institute of Strategic Studies warned yesterday.

The thinktank's report said that Iraq had become a valuable recruiting ground for al-Qaida, and Iraqi forces were nowhere near close to matching the insurgency.

John Chipman, IISS director, said the Iraqi security forces faced a "huge task" and the continuing ability of the insurgents to inflict mass casualties "must cast doubt on US plans to redeploy American troops and eventually reduce their numbers".

Insurgents have killed 600 Iraqis since the new government was formed. The IISS report said: "Best estimates suggest that it will take up to five years to create anything close to an effective indigenous force able to impose and guarantee order across the country."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1491683,00.html

[Fire Walk With Me]

1. But..but..there's no money left...

How fast would they leave Iraq like a runaway bride if the money ran out?

[NNN0LHI]

9. No money left? There are no troops left. Can you say draft?

I knew you could.

Don

[Inland]

2. Can't anyone say something straight? Reports' tortured language:

"up to five years": that means a maximum of five years, right? WRONG! Next clause is: "to create anything CLOSE TO AN EFFECTIVE indigenous force". So unless we are shooting for "anything close to effective", as opposed to effective, we will be staying "up to" much more than five years.

Crap bureaucratic bullshit.

[4dsc]

3. Civil war first

What a bunch of crap.. The country is already headed for a civil war, if its not already in one, and this think tank believes this crap??

[Tansy_Gold]

4. How does one "impose" peace?

Am I the only one who thinks this is absolute nonsense????

[antonialee839]

7. I was thinking the same thing.

How do you "impose" peace?

[shadowknows69]

14. kill everyone that thinks you shouldn't be there n/t

[Tansy_Gold]

Oh, of course! Silly me! Why didn't I think of that?

:sarcasm:

Kinda like destroying the village to save it.

:puke:

[ashling]

25. The subject line says "peace"

the story says "order" . . . not necessarily the same thing.

[Sabriel]

8. "Hey, you! Put on this peace! Right now!"

You're right...impose is just an absurd and telling word choice. It's right up there with forcing calm.

[DELUSIONAL]

16. "impose peace" = oxymoron

Peace is something that is voluntary -- when there is agreement from the population that this is the way they want to live.

Jails are "peaceful" because the inmates know that the jailers have the power to murder them if they don't comply.

So what this says to me is that Iraq is considered a jailed population and the populations needs to be "pacified" by raw force. Or beaten into submission . . . . beaten until enough Iraqi give up and keep their eyes down in a submissive posture around the all powerful Americans.

[TheGunslinger]

17. Probably something like this:

(Samuel L. Jackson voice)


"I said make peace NOW, mother fvckers!"

[leftchick]

23. it is lunacy

I can't believe a "think tank" is using that wording.

[jimshoes]

5. we will have spent close to a trillion

dollars in 5 years. How can that be worth it? And this guy says they will only be close to having an effective force in place by then. :argh:

[shadowknows69]

15. I could throw iraqi soldiers

on my home pc with a copy of unreal and they'd be better trained than the farce which must be going on there.

[Mr_Spock]

6. Hehe - we gave al-Qaida incentive and a country to take over!!

We turned a bunch of thugs with some money into an impending empire - what the HECK were we thinking? This may just be as bad as it sounds!

[Mountainman]

10. The repugs are going to leave to the next President, a Dem to fix their

mess.

They only want the oil so if they get their hands on that they don't care.

[LynnTheDem]

11. NOTE: Beatings WILL continue until morale improves.

NOTE: Bombings WILL continue until peace is imposed.

[The_Casual_Observer]

12. Saddam/Iraq was making money while he imposed peace.

It was brutal no doubt, but probably less brutal than what I've seen going on in Iraq now.

[LynnTheDem]

18. As ICRC, HRW and AI say Hussein's govt wasn't committing atrocities

since 1991 when the govt put down the insurgents (both sides got hit with human rights violations reports in 1991)

and as we're now killing the crap out of the Iraqis, with an estimated 100,000 dead as of last year, I'd say "probably" is a wee bit of an understatement.

[fishnfla]

13. Study what happened to the Brits in the early 1900's

We are making the same damned mistakes. Their foray turned into 40 years.
There is never gonna be peace as long as we are there, and then even after we leave

[LynnTheDem]

19. "Iraqis Have Lived This Lie Before" by Haifa Zangana; required reading

imo;

In Iraq, we have an expression: same donkey, different saddle.

In Iraq we don't just read history at school - we carry it within ourselves. It's no wonder, then, that we view what is happening in Iraq now of "liberation-mandate-nominal sovereignty" as a replay of what took place in the 1920s and afterwards.

Within a year the occupiers have achieved what Saddam's regime failed to do over decades. They have killed our hope in democracy. What of tomorrow? It would be useful to reread history and take notice of Al Istiqlal Al Tam and above all Miss Bell's warning about Iraq: "There are so many quicksands."

http://www.countercurrents.org/iraq-zangana300604.htm

[LynnTheDem]

20. IRAQ 1917 by Robert Fisk (also s/be required reading)

They came as liberators but were met by fierce resistance outside Baghdad. Humiliating treatment of prisoners and heavy-handed action in Najaf and Fallujah further alienated the local population. A planned handover of power proved unworkable.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article6337.htm

[not fooled]

21. Of course, the crazy PNACers...

...have no intention of leaving (or, should I say, they have no intention of the MILITARY leaving, since the chickenhawk PNACrackpots were never there, being safely esconced in their cushy offices in Washington, while the poor soldiers have to deal with the chaos).

Can you say "14 permanent military bases"? We are never, ever leaving (at least before the oil runs out).

anyone who believes that we are leaving is swallowing just one more lie from the * admin

[saigon68]

24. They are NEVER LEAVING

The Bush Criminals and their NeoCon Corporate allies are in IRAQ-NAM

TO "KICK THEIR ASS AND STEAL THEIR GAS."

[spanone]

22. I think that is highly optimistic.

[BR_Parkway]

26. Peace in Iraq 'will take at least five years to impose'

It could take at least five years before Iraqi forces are strong enough to impose law and order on the country, the International Institute of Strategic Studies warned yesterday.

The thinktank's report said that Iraq had become a valuable recruiting ground for al-Qaida, and Iraqi forces were nowhere near close to matching the insurgency.

John Chipman, IISS director, said the Iraqi security forces faced a "huge task" and the continuing ability of the insurgents to inflict mass casualties "must cast doubt on US plans to redeploy American troops and eventually reduce their numbers".

<snip>

Toby Dodge, senior fellow at the IISS and expert on Iraq, estimated yesterday that there were about 1,000 foreign fighters in Iraq "perfecting the use of car bombs" and causing more problems across the region, including Saudi Arabia. There seemed to be no "viable exit strategy" for foreign troops.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1491683,00.html