NYT: Vermont Considers Lowering Drinking Age to 18

[DeepModem Mom]

Vermont Considers Lowering Drinking Age to 18
By PAM BELLUCK

Published: April 13, 2005


MONTPELIER, Vt., April 7 - Last fall, Richard C. Marron, a Republican state representative, was reading a newspaper column by the recently retired president of Middlebury College, John M. McCardell Jr.

One of Mr. McCardell's targets was the drinking age, which in Vermont, and every other state, is 21.

"The 21-year-old drinking age is bad social policy and terrible law," Mr. McCardell wrote, saying it had led to binge drinking by teenagers. "Our latter-day prohibitionists have driven drinking behind closed doors and underground."

Mr. Marron, a four-term legislator who is vice chairman of the appropriations committee, decided that the law needed changing, and he has introduced a bill to lower the drinking age to 18, setting off a debate about public safety, age discrimination and the rights of young people as well as whether it is possible to teach teenagers to drink responsibly....

***

Mr. Marron's bill is unlikely to pass, mainly because if it did, Vermont would lose $9.7 million in federal money for highway maintenance, grants available only if a state sets its drinking age at 21. And the state's public safety commissioner and health department, along with several legislators, argue that lowering the drinking age would simply worsen the problem of under-age drinking and drunken driving....


http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/13/national/13drink.html?ex=1114056000&en=7ff1550cf0ffc3d8&ei=5070

[Runcible Spoon]

1. I think the drinking age should be 18 and driving age 21

And I think a lot of young adults would love this. However, there are no federal subsidies in my plan so I guess it will never happen.

[UCLA Dem]

12. Thats the way it is in Europe. They can drink before they can drive.

Maybe kids will get their jollies out with drinking and by the time they are ready to drive, then they won't be so enamored with drinking.

Of course then we'd have to put in much better public transit systems, so young adults would have a way to get around...errrr.

:banghead:

[Tyrone Slothrop]

18. Or just give them bicycles n/t

[salib]

2. Finally

back to the issues of responsibility and participation. Remember the slogan "If you are old enough to go to war, you are old enough to drink"? A long battle, but I definitely remember how I felt at 18.

[renaissanceguy]

8. I think so. There is an awkward gap

socially between when someone graduates high school and can go to the bars.



http://www.cafepress.com/liberalissues/481947

[MADem]

9. Alternatively, raise the minimum enlistment age to 21 n/t

[wtbymark]

3. It still has legs

and debate is heated - the main arguement is that if we can send an 18 year old off to dye in war, then that person should be able to belly up to the bar for a beer. The increased revenue would exceed any highway money from the feds. So, it still may fly, maybe not this session, but soon (especially when they realize the revenue potential and savings of the corrections dept. for not prosecuting 18-21yo's for posession of alcohol)

[freedom_to_read]

5. this would be good for VT

IMHO because of the extra tourism they'd get. Lots and lots of colleges in the New England area (Dartmouth aka "Animal house" is right across the river). Don't know if it would be enough to offset the loss of federal highway funds, but it might.

Add that to the extra tourism income VT gets from people going there for their civil unions, and you have a living example of the old Yankee maxim, "Doing well by doing good."

[mutus_frutex]

4. I'll give you my perspective as a foreigner:

I come from a country where drinking is supposedly legal at 18, but the regulations are rarely enforced. Moreover, parents can allow adolescents to drink without facing penalties (if the drinking is within reasonable limits). I used to have half a glass of wine with lunch on sundays when I was 10-11. I started drinking beer at 13-14. My case is pretty typical.

My country doesn't have any problems with underage binge drinking. There is no pressure to drink and most adolescents and young people don't like hard liquor (in good part because that's what "old" people drink :-). By 18 most people have a good sense of what their limits are and have an appreciation for what they are drinking. They drink because they like it, not because they want to get drunk.

I have always thought that the 21 limit here in the states is just ridiculous, a throwback to other times, influenced by religious stupidity. I will probably challenge the law in the future by giving some wine to my daughter, so she learns to appreciate the good things in life: there is nothing like a good civet de lapin with a glass of bordeaux.. :-)

Cheers..

[customerserviceguy]

6. You make some good points

I used to have a goodly number of exchange students, and most of them were quite perplexed about the 21 year old drinking age. I did have to remind them that Prohibition was officially part of our Constitution once, and that should be a signal as to how seriously this country views underage consumption. They pointed out (correctly) that American teens can't handle drink, they heard enough stories at school about it!

Giving wine to your daughter would probably be OK in most states, a parent is permitted to decide for their own child in the privacy of their own home. At least that's the way it was in Washington State, where I lived until January of this year, here in Utah, its probably considered child abuse!

[mutus_frutex]

10. What are the chances?

I live in Seattle.. :-)

When I came to the states I lived in PA for quite a while. Until I got used to it, it was hell.. :-) Since you can't buy any wine on sundays, I had to remember to buy the day before every time I went to have lunch with friends and wanted to take something. You couldn't buy wine in supermarkets, only in liquor stores and it was horribly expensive. My wife went to the supermarket once and bought some wine. Of course, it was alcohol free and she only realized it when she tried it and it "tasted funny".. :-)

I'm a big fun of good wine, and WA is heaven for that. We have some pretty good wineries 10 minutes from home..

And yes, most of my friends in grad school found the ID checking totally stupid. I mean, I'm almost bald and got carded many, many times. For a long time we didn't have driver's licenses, so we used our passports. My wife didn't want to loose hers, so she got out one of the older ones with a big ANNULATO in red letter across the pages.. The bouncer didn't even realized that the passport wasn't even valid..

Cheers..

[NashVegas]

7. Go Vermont, Go!

My solution to the highway funds loss: threaten to turn the Interstates into toll roads.

Nothing will bring up the debate faster than threatening to hit people in the pocket book for this horrible legislation.

Liddy Dole - EAT MY SHORTS!

[toopers]

11. We do not put up with age discrimination in other areas . . .

why is it allowed here? There is probably a legal reason that it is allowed, though I am not sure I understand it. Any legal types out there that can comment? Thanks

[Retrograde]

13. I'll drink to that!

I went to college back in the 70s in a state where the drinking age was 18. Yes, there were the drunken frat parties - I think the correlation is more with fraternities than booze - but for most students the ready availablility of alcohol meant a few beers with friends on the weekends. More importantly, bars used large quantities of cheap food to lure in students, so for a little more than the cost of a beer (or non-alcoholic drink, if one chose) you could get a substantial meal. THAT was what was important when we were impecunious students.

[David__77]

14. I emphatically agree with lowering the age to 18.

All adults should have the same rights and responsibilities. We should not be engaging in this kind of prohibition.

[napi21]

15. When I was a teenager, NY law stated you could drink 3.2 beer

at age 18. Is that still in effect? I lived in PA, and lots of kids would drive to Buffalo for the weekend just to party.

I agree with VT. The American people whould realize by now that one of the reasons for teenage binge drinking is the "feeling you're getting away with something!"

I was born in PA, but my grandparents were from Germany. during family dinners, everyone was treated to a glass of wine. Even the little kids were given a little juice glass with about 1 1/2 inches of wine in it. HA Ha, I remember mind had little scottie dogs on it, and my cousin's had bunnies. It helps teach there's nothing wrong with a little wine, and takes away the mistique of "testing the unknown".

[driver8]

21. When I turned 18 in NY, we could drink anything! Not just 3.2 beer

What year was it that you could only drink 3.2 beer? I never remember that.

[KamaAina]

16. Bush**co ought to be all for this (sarcasm)

I mean, they're all huge states' rights supporters, right? Unless, of course, a state does something they oppose (e.g. Oregon's assisted suicide law), that is.

K/A
repeatedly victimized by the nanny state raising drinking ages in the '80s

[Javaman]

17. Hell, if they can go to Iraq and get a bullet in the head...

They should be able to goto a bar and get a shot in the gut.

[Radical Activist]

19. They could easily make up for the loss of federal highway money by

raising out of state tuition at the state universities and wait for the flood of students to come in.

[tritsofme]

20. I challenge one person to explain to me

How a young man is responsible enough to serve in the armed forces, but not to have drink.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

22. That's the way I feel about it, too.

If you're old enough to die for your country, you should be old enough to drink.