U.S. Has No Exit Strategy for Iraq, Rumsfeld Says

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=a8sZejFz9ssI&refer=top_world_news

April 12 (Bloomberg) -- The U.S. has no exit strategy or timetable for withdrawing its forces from Iraq and a pull-out depends on the readiness of the Iraqi Security Forces, U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld said.

``We don't have an exit strategy, we have a victory strategy,'' Rumsfeld told soldiers during a surprise visit to Baghdad, according to a pooled broadcast report from the capital. ``The goal is to help the Iraqi Forces develop the skills and the capacity to provide their own security.''

The defense secretary arrived in Iraq today to meet with Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari and President Jalal Talabani, Captain Darren Luke, a U.S. military spokesman, said by telephone from Baghdad. He'll press the two, who were both elected by National Assembly members last week, to continue moves toward democracy, the Associated Press reported.

The U.S. currently has 150,000 soldiers in Iraq, the strongest foreign contingent there followed by the U.K., South Korea and Italy. Poland, which has 1,700 troops in Iraq, today announced it would recall its forces by year's end, Polish TVN24 television reported.

more

[acmavm]

1. These dumb asses think that the have a 'victory strategy'? Every

damn day one of the f***wits say something that just proves that what passes for intelligence ain't necessarily intelligent. We've got a bunch of mad men and morans running around in Washington who, in a perfect world, wouldn't even be allowed outside without keepers. They're dangerous and blinded by their own arrogant ignorance.

This guy is one of, if not THE WORST.

[HeeBGBz]

3. Idiocy

Power hungry creeps. Victory, my ass.

[leftchick]

2. Their "Victory Strategy" includes a PERMANENT presence

In Iraq for at least a generation. It is getting drafty in here...

~snip~


Now comes a report in the New York Sun by Eli Lake revealing that the Pentagon is building a permanent military communications system in Iraq, a necessary foundation for any lasting troop presence. The new network will comprise twelve communications towers throughout Iraq, linking Camp Victory in Baghdad to other existing (and future) bases across the country, eventually connecting with US bases in Qatar, the United Arab Emirates and Afghanistan.

"People need to get realistic and think in terms of our presence being in Iraq for a generation or until democratic stability in the region is reached," Dewey Clarridge, the CIA's former chief of Arab operations (and Iran-contra point man), told the Sun.

The fabled "exit strategy" may be not to exit. Thomas Donnelly, a defense specialist at the American Enterprise Institute, said the new communication system resembles those built in West Germany and the Balkans, places where American troops remain today. "The operational advantages of US bases in Iraq should be obvious for other power-projection missions in the region," Donnelly wrote in an AEI policy paper.

Next time the Bush Administration hints at withdrawing troops, keep these grand plans in mind.


http://www.thenation.com/blogs/outrage?bid=13&pid=2132

[Jacobin]

9. "Communication Towers"? 12 of them?

I can hear the 'insurgents' salivating over those juicy targets from here.

[leftchick]

12. our Tax $$$$$

over and over they will be blown up. Just like the pipelines. Now I wonder who will profit from this. :banghead:

[Wright Patman]

4. The "victory strategy"

was articulated by the deposed Gen. Eric Shinseki. It would have required at least 300,000 soldiers. It was not followed.

http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq/attack/consequences/2003/0228pentagoncontra.htm

The opportunity for victory was two years ago. Now all they can do is take what is a disastrous waste of lives and money and upgrade it from total "disaster" to mere "fiasco."

[alcibiades_mystery]

5. "It could last six days, six weeks. I doubt six months."

- Donald Rumsfeld, February 7, 2003

Why does this incompetent still have a job?

[AG78]

10. Do you honestly

believe he's incompetent? Please detail what you find incompetent about him. He's dangerous, not incompetent. None of them in their whole clique are incompetent.

They're not morons, they're not stupid, they're not idiots.

Rumsfeld knew we were never leaving Iraq before the war. Wolfowitz knew it would cost more than a few billion. They know they're spreading their version of democracy and freedom, which do not meet any of our definitions. But that's the problem with words like freedom and democracy, they can mean different things to different people.

What they do well is war, killing, propaganda, and Machiavellian politics. These guys(and women) don't get their choice for a seat in every position of power on the planet without being very good at what they do.

None of the scandels will touch them. If they do get caught, they won't face a day in jail. If they're young enough, they'll be back in power in a decade(give or take).

[raccoon]

13. I'm afraid you're absolutely right, AG78 nt

[Mandate My Ass]

15. Agreed, the same criminals running the same illegal scams

since the Reagan era. They just weren't as visible then. The "incompetence" factor is a deflection used to shield them from facing the criminal charges they would face in any other country where breaking the law actually has consequences.

The press will continue to prop them up saying they mean well even if they didn't get it 100% right. The people will swallow it because it's too disturbing to them to believe that criminals have taken control of the country and are running it into the ground on purpose.

[jukes]

20. AG78

you're apsitively right, & we all need to realize this.

the world has changed, our personal dreams will be shattered, and we need to be prepared for severe hardship in the near future.

[bemildred]

23. Yes, I honestly think they are narrow, ignorant, incompetent,

and dumb as shit. This is based on their own inability to carry
out their own stated goals with the methods they chose. If you think
Iraq as it is now is what Dumbsfeldt set out to "achieve" then of
course you can argue otherwise. Read PNAC, read some of the stuff
about how Iraq was going to be a demonstration of our overwhelming
imperial power, the shock and awe shit. These fuckwits have taken the
largest, most-expensive military in the world into a debilitated nation
of 1/10 our size and had their ass handed to them on a plate.

[Rockerdem]

28. No. The other posters are correct.

Rumsfeld and claque dont want to end things. They dont want Osama caught. They dont want the insurgency to end. Why would they? It guarantees their continued power by giving the American people the purported need for their future services.

The American military could wipe out the Iraqi insurgency in a week. There are only 5 million Sunnis altogether, and Sadr's guys are a few million more. US weaonry could vaporize them in a heartbeat, but that is not Rumsfeld's goal. He and his ilk need a permanent enemy, and are ecstatic to have a low-grade insurgency that isnt any threat to take power (because of their own incompetence.)

These guys are both vile and brilliant. Its working for them.

[bemildred]

33. Whatever you say, Sir, have a nice day. nt

[manly]

36. have a nice day

H.L.Mencken's form letter response to EVERYONE was:
Dear Sir or Madam,
You may be right.

I've used it a few times. Very satisfying. Avoids hard feelings.

[bemildred]

41. Time makes fools of us all, Sir.

Or dead men. It's best to keep one's sense of humor.
:hi:

[manly]

62. time makes fools of us all, as does newsweek

dear bemildred,
your reply has me thoroughly obfuscated. regards to bewitched, bothered, and walt kelly.

[bemildred]

63. Always nice to meet a fellow Kelly fan. nt

[cliss]

38. I don't know what to believe.

But -- DU:ers, isn't this what we've been debating, wondering all along? Who are these people? What the hell are they doing, anyway? Are they as incompetent as they seem?

Or is it just a ruse?

I'm willing to bet that 50% of all the threads here are debating that very fact. I myself have pulled my hair out over this for weeks, months, years.

In order to figure out who these men are, we need to look at their past. How have they performed, in their decades of "service" in the government? Look at Cheney. Smart, but he made tons of mistakes. How about Rumsfeld? He has always been a mediocre performer. Wolfowitz? A high-paid pencil pusher who knows nothing about people.

My verdict: They're a strange combination of cunning & idiot. They're smart & cunning, but only as far as Jackals and hyenas go. I believe they just happened to be at the right place at the right time. The US was in a weakened position, and like a tapeworm or a virus, they saw their chance & moved in.

They think they can pull it off. They can't. I've seen the mistakes, the colossal errors.

[bemildred]

40. I like to compare with other examples of the same kind.

Some better, some worse, e.g. Napoleon, who was pretty competent,
the Nazis likewise in their way, or Mussolini who was a clown, just
to list a few. These fellows seem more in the clown category. But
it's worth remembering none of these folks generally had long runs.
It's the over-reaching that gets them.

But in particular, these guys have spelled out their agenda in some
detail and attempted to carry it out with considerable vigor, and it's
clear that they have failed. All variations of the "they are evil
geniuses" theory rely on claims that the current state of the
Middle East and of US power is the desired end and/or it was an
acceptable alternative outcome to US policy elites. I do not find
that credible. I prefer Mr. Kerry's observation that "who knew they'd
fuck it up this badly".

It is worth remembering in this context that they all have long uniform
records of bureaucratic success and policy debacles and failure.
I suppose if one considers such efforts as VietNam, Nicaragua, and
Lebanon "successes" then on may as well consider this a "success" too.
I consider that they are all failures and contributary factors in the
long, steep decline is US fortunes since WWII.

[Frederik]

52. Yes

definitely closer to Mussolini than to Hitler. Rumsfeld is no Napoleon. That doesn't mean they aren't wicked and crooked, they're just not very talented at it. If they're good at something it's personal enrichment, Ponzi schemes, and propaganda.

[leftchick]

53. your last paragraph says it all...

failures every one, as well as this new Iraq failure.

[cliss]

55. Really good analysis, and I

agree with you. I must admit, it took me YEARS to figure that out. I could never decide if the incompetence was deliberate, or if it was just a smokescreen for some "shadow government", or some plot to fool everybody into thinking they were really stupid, but in fact they were actually geniuses who caught us off guard. I must have read literally hundreds of other posts, which have asked or pondered the same thing.

Bush is another one that can drive you crazy, if you analyze him too much. You almost start to get paranoid: "he's stuttering on purpose!!! He's trying to trick me into believing he's really nuts, but in fact he's a cunning

Because this administration is so unique, so strange, that they've broken all the molds. We tend to judge the present by the past, or what we're used to. It won't work this time.

I agree with you that these men tried to carry out their plans with "considerable vigor". I believe they also felt that speed was necessary to accomplish their goals. They did NOT want to get mired down in messy, expensive quagmires.

They knew that time was not on their side. They had to act quickly because the window of opportunity would be closed within, say, 18 months.

I'd say the time is long past conquering the world. They now have to go to Plan B, and they are very much stuck by the way.

[Frederik]

51. I think you are right

Reading what these people have written over the years, there is always an emphasis on scaring potential adversaries into submission with overwhelming use of force and winning decisive victories, showing people and countries that any resistance is futile to the crazy imperial death machine. I don't know about you, but if I were a potential adversary to the US I wouldn't be very impressed by the Iraq debacle, to say the least. So I don't think it went completely according to plan. The plan was for the Iranians and Syrians to be begging for mercy by now. Instead, the Iranians seem to be happy to ignore the US and continue to build relations with the Russians and the Chinese, getting ready to trade oil in euros. Hugo Chavez does not appear to be very scared either. Also, the EU wasn't supposed to be this recalcitrant, they were supposed to provide the peacekeepers and pay for the reconstruction like in Afghanistan.

Then, we may still see war with Iran, in which case they will really screw up beyond all imagination.

[Demeter]

34. As Public Servants, They Are Incompetent

as tin pot dictators, they are frighteningly efficient and effective.

[Geo55]

54. Yep..........

They WILL control Iraq (in the name of FREEDOM n' DEMOCRACY)
an' when push comes to shuve....they MAY tell you the TRUTH.
'course the SUV's hafta run dry first.

[raccoon]

11. In this administration, the incompetents

are promoted, not fired.

[mmonk]

6. Can't have what you never had.

[signmike]

7. Rummy's hairdo . . .

I know it's off topic, but he was on TV a minute ago and I can't help but notice = while we spend $200 a day shaping Bush's hair, it looks like Wolfowitz does Rummy's
:puke:

[all.of.me]

8. ya pack up yer shit and git out! how hard is that?!

[rukkyg]

14. hard

when a year from now we start getting our country blown apart because iraq is full of unhampered terrorists and homeland security is more like homeland pez dispenser.

[uhhuh]

56. Won't Happen

Terrorists don't give a shit about attacking the U.S. anymore, if they ever did.

The current administation is actively destroying this country and causing divisions in the people that would suddenly go away if we were to be attacked.

The people of Iraq would run any terrorists out of town if they were left to deal with their own situation.

The chimp's foreign policy does nothing but support and ecourage terrorism to thrive. If we were to remove our people as targets, they would be a hinderance to the Iraqis getting their country in order and would be eliminated.

So, no, it would not be hard to just up and leave for the reasons you stated.

[rocktivity]

16. Remember your "entrance strategy" into Baghdad, Rummy?

:headbang:
rocknation

[KlatooBNikto]

17. US had no exit strategy in Vietnam so the Vietnamese gave them one.

[wicket]

18. "Victory means exit strategy"

"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the president to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
- George W. Bush - Houston Chronicle April 9, 1999


My my my how things change when Clinton is not the President :eyes:

[lockdown]

21. Nice catch

If only journalists had the resources to find and point out such inconsistencies. Maybe they're too busy discussing how the exit strategy is coming along.

[warrens]

19. Delusional, senile fuckwad

Every time I think I have decided who is the most evil of this gang of corrupt nazis, one of them says something to make me reconsider.

I hate them. I just hate them.

[DBoon]

22. No, we have a "colonial strategy"

We will NEVER exit. Their strategy was to conquer and administer Iraq as a US colony.

The right wing has turned the clock back in more ways than one.

[applegrove]

24. ***hole! Next time don't wittle down an invasion plan to 1/5th its size

just to prove what a 'big man' you are.

You did the worst thing possible. You lost the peace.

[enki23]

25. victory strategy, homicide bombers, and freedom fries

they think the american people are fucking retarded.

might they be right?

[NVMojo]

26. Their stupidity is leaking out of every crack they have ....

[saigon68]

27. Its Perpetual War on A Global Scale

Fought by $2,000.00 a day mercenaries.

And some rustic sheep who enlisted "for the bennies"

[SlavesandBulldozers]

44. saigon68 nails it again

"rustic sheep". my first reaction is to laugh, then the truth washes over - makes me sad. what became of hope?

[saigon68]

48. It makes me sad also

At the allure of glory, and false promises of patriotism, that allow nice people to become craven killers of women and children---


who do it for the applause of a few really evil, sick men like cheney and rumdumb

[Roland99]

29. Fuck him...tell him to tell that to the families of the dead

[Art_from_Ark]

30. So much for the "Powell Doctrine"...

[Journeyman]

31. What about Poland? Poland has an exit strategy! . . .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1388115

Poland to Pull Troops from Iraq at End of Year - Reuters

WARSAW (Reuters) - Poland's government decided on Tuesday to withdraw its troops from Iraq at the end of 2005, making official an earlier proposal, Defense Minister Jerzy Szmajdzinski said.

"At the time of the expiry of the Security Council's mandate -- meaning at the end of 2005 -- the operations of the Polish stabilization mission should be finished," Szmajdzinski told a news conference after a cabinet meeting."

[Az_lefty]

32. If they had a victory strategy this whole thing would be over by now

The problem is they don't have any real strategy, never did. It was totally naive of them to think we could invade a country and be met with a parade.

[strategery blunder]

35. Actually, they do have an exit strategy, two to be exact

1)Syria.
2)Iran.

They're "keeping their options open," so to speak.:puke:

[jpgray]

37. He thought that was clever, but he's going to the Rove woodshed for it

Now we can all say ad nauseam "They have no exit strategy" with a quote to back it up.

[The_Casual_Observer]

39. Well, at least we can say that he never fooled us.

Anybody paying attention to these dicks knew exactly what their real intentions were. After the next round of "elections" the "Iraqis" will proclaim that they are inviting the "coalition" to maintain a permanent presence in the region, via the bases that they have in place. These bases will be protected with the PC operated land mines that they were advertising yesterday.

As long as Iraqi army men are taking the brunt of the insurgency, and they are able to pump oil, US citizens aren't going to argue with the bush plan.

[indepat]

42. No need for an exit strategy if not leaving (14 permanent bases)

[nolabels]

45. Between Iraq and hard place (or as in Rummy, rock for brains)

Iraqis Increase Calls for U.S. to Leave

8 minutes ago

By TRACI CARL, Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Iraqis are increasingly calling on U.S. forces to leave their troubled nation, emboldened by a newly elected parliament and the growing presence of their blue-uniformed police forces — even though the new Iraqi leaders say it's too early to talk about a U.S. pullout.

The calls gained momentum when Shiite and Sunni religious clerics called for protests to mark the two-year anniversary of Baghdad's fall, prompting four days of demonstrations across the country.

Tens of thousands of mostly Shiite protesters, largely followers of militant cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, filled central Baghdad's streets Saturday, holding the largest anti-American protest since the invasion. Demonstrations have continued, all echoing the same demand: It's time for U.S. troops to leave.
(snip)
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050412/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_us_go_home&cid=540&ncid=1480

[SlavesandBulldozers]

43. 4 more years 4 more years!

hell yeah! gotta go Hee-Haw's on!

[MisterP]

46. a mating of Gorn and James Cromwell

[Mr_Spock]

47. Rumsfailed says, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed

Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed, Rumsfailed

I hate him.

[Frederik]

49. Victory Stategy!

It's not Kool-Aid, it's Victory-Aid. Now drink it up!

[SillyGoose]

50. U.S. Has No Exit Strategy for Iraq, Rumsfeld Says...DUH

We sure don't have a victory strategy either, Sherlock. God, these people make me nuts.

:crazy:

[lovuian]

57. we didn't have an exit strategy for Vietnam!!! Hop on planes & Run

We just got the hell out!!!

[symbolman]

58. Old joke in the 70's

Back when I was drafted...

"What do you call 300 people hanging from the bottom of a helicopter?"

"An Orderly Retreat from Cambodia."

I wish someone in the media would ask our brave soldiers to shoulder their weapons, refuse to fight, walk or drive peacefully to the nearest port, sit down and tell them they quit, and they are LEAVING.

Of course the local Halliburton thugs would attack them dressed in rags and say the "insurgents" did it, there can be no peace, even if our men wanted to STOP fighting.

[Dangerman]

59. What exit strategy?

We are about to place 14 permanent bases in Iraq. That's called occupation, lot liberation! I don't think the troops would be leaving soon.

DAMN YOU CHENEY, SO SHUT THE HELL UP, YOUR MURDERER! AND DAMN YOU BUSH TO THE DEPTHS OF HELL!!!

[Roland99]

60. And now the "victory strategy" includes less money for veterans' health

http://www.marinetimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-782283.php



Fucking bastards running our government into the ground.

[Zerex71]

61. Once again, a male pissing contest gone awry.

Too bad tens of thousands had to suffer because some crusty old white guy has ED and a massive inferiority complex.

[DulceDecorum]

64. The British were victorious over the Mau Mau

and once all parties acknowledged this,
the British left Kenya.
Forever.

Hopefully,
Muqtada al-Sadr will be soon persuaded to accept his defeat.