Creating an ally for students (School for Bullied & Harassed to open)

[truthpusher]

http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/mar05/307446.asp

Creating an ally for students
Alliance School to open doors to those who feel bullied, harassed
-----------------------------------
By SARAH CARR
Posted: March 6, 2005
-----------------------------------
(snip)

The school will be the first of its kind in the state, and possibly the nation, its founders say.

(snip)

"I saw a lot of students who were being bullied and no one was doing anything about it," said Tina Owen, a teacher at Milwaukee's Washington High School who will leave her job to become the lead teacher at Alliance. Some students who look and act different from the mainstream are "really tormented," she said. "I've even seen teachers be really hard on them."

The school will be open to all students, but the focus is on kids who are floundering socially or academically in traditional schools because of harassment or abuse.

(snip)

Luke Ashauer, who attends Clintonville High School, is thinking of moving to Milwaukee this summer to go to Alliance. He said his fellow students "are not exactly open to new concepts, such as being gay or just being different."

(snip)

"High schools are often the last opportunity to instill basic citizenship values, including tolerance for a pluralistic society, and removing victims from that environment is, in many ways, a concession. . . . If these administrators cannot guarantee a healthy and safe environment, the solution is to get new administrators, not create a new school."

complete story:
http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/mar05/307446.asp

[Trillo]

1. This reminds me of a "carrot,"

the kind of carrot that is kept just out of reach.

As a charter school, it's private, so they're allowed to deny constitutional rights to the students. How can a place that's legally allowed to discriminate eliminate discrimination?

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[MAlibdem]

5. wow

why waste your time making multiple accounts like that.


get a life.

[Name removed]

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[MAlibdem]

7. just hope the admins don't sue you then

because i would.

[MAlibdem]

4. Probably not a great idea.

It's like giving up. Instead of saying: 'we're going to work extra hard to make sure kids are normally socialized'; they say: 'we give up, let's put all the dorky kids together and get a big socially dysfunctional school.'

Example: when rhesus monkeys are raised completely alone with no contact with other monkeys, they never learn social interaction skills. However, when paired with a "counselor" monkey, they are able to make a strong (though usually not complete) recovery, compared to control monkeys who make no such social progress. I don't know if this experiment was continued, but I'd be willing to bet a lot that a room full of monkeys that never learned social interaction skills would not be pretty.

[booksenkatz]

8. I think I agree with you

I feel sorry for bullied kids, but how does this teach them how to deal with bullies? There will be bullies everywhere they go for the rest of their lives. As far as I know, there are few "bully-free" workplaces.

But truly, I feel sorry for bullied kids. Are there no other options here?

[Book Lover]

11. You know what taught me to deal with bullies?

Beating up and getting beaten after school. How often does *that* happen in the workplace? As a former tormented student, I am all behind this. Get the assholes out of my life when I'm trying to learn, thank you.

[booksenkatz]

15. Good point

For what it's worth, I was beaten up once in middle school, for absolutely no reason whatsoever. Just sitting and reading a book in the cafeteria when 3 girls, whom I didn't even know, began hammering on me. The problem really lies in the way so many schools do *nothing* about bullies. No child should be afraid to go to school.

On the other hand, I'm not sure it helps a child to give him/her an artificial environment for learning how to deal with the world. If we shelter a kid in a perfect environment for 18 years, then kick him into college, have we really done him/her a favor? My kid is in kindergarten with kids of every temperament and skill level, and I think it's better for him than a class full of quiet, sweet-tempered boys like himself. I don't want him to grow up thinking that everyone in the world is a carbon copy of himself, neither physically nor emotionally nor intellectually. He needs to learn to cope with that sector of human beings that is rude and loud and lacking in self-control, etc.

I'm really on the fence on this one, though. I can really see both sides.

edited for tiepoe

[Book Lover]

24. But school is already an artifical environment

Activities of daily life (social and work settings) don't group people by age, but by ability and skill set.

To me, school is for learning; anything you pick up about social structure is unlearned when you get out.

[booksenkatz]

27. Not sure I agree on that one (at least in my experience)

I know that in my work and social settings, I am rarely paired with people who share my abilities and/or skill sets! In work environments, I usually find myself working with utter fools or utter geniuses, LOL. Socially, I have all kinds of friends with all kinds of strengths/weaknesses/interests/abilities. Maybe I'm just more into neapolitan than vanilla?

Another weird thing: I always thought that high school "crap" would end once I graduated, but it seems to me (at the age of 44) that the entire social structure remains one great big high school. (But maybe that's just an experience that's unique to me.)

Peace.

[Tsiyu]

28. The Modern Institution of "School"

in the American tradition is THE most artificial environment we could choose as an option for our children.

Children by nature learn from exposure to the ACTUAL world, not the pretend or abstract world. Additionally, you do not train a young horse or dog while it is running with a herd of colts or pack of pups. You must first isolate it and provide it with some one-on-one attention- sans the fear or distraction peers often present. The same holds true for human babes.

Getting a depressed, socially isolated child out of the stronger "pack" and pairing it with other non-threatening students can be a lifesaver and a miracle for that kid.

[booksenkatz]

29. Interesting point! Thanks, bhg n/t

[MAlibdem]

21. No, the way you deal with it is not allowing an environment where bullies.

exist. You deal with the problem by deal with the source, not the victim. It's like saying that women should be veiled at all times for fear of rapists, instead of punishing the rapists.

There should be guidance counselors in every school. Many. And not just counselors to deal with intervention when situations get out of hand. The guidance counselors should know every student. Teachers should get much better child psychology training. We have places to invest in schools where we are not doing enough right now. You can't solve all problems by throwing money at them, but if you don't address problems, they won't go away.


on edit: though at a point if bullies can't be controlled for some reason or another, this might be an option for some.

[Toucano]

23. Exactly. I couldn't agree more.

EXPELL THE BULLIES!

Make their parents deal with hauling the anti-social monsters they're creating across town to another school.

Students who display a persistant disrespect for their fellow students should be the ones forced into counseling, along with their parents.

If the bullying doesn't cease, good-bye.

[distantearlywarning]

25. Yes. Thank you for making this point.

I am SICK TO DEATH of people talking about the "unsocialized" victims everytime somebody posts a bullying topic.

Let's deal with the assholes for once instead of blaming the victims.

[rocktivity]

30. I've heard of victim-blaming, but this is ridiculous

Why not start a school for the bullies and harassers? How does it help the victims of bullying to put them in an parallel universe and make them feel like THEY'RE the ones who can't "cut it" in the "real" world? LEAVE THEM IN SCHOOL AND ISOLATE THE BULLIES!!! Give them the counseling and treatment they need to learn how to act before they end up in juvenile incarceration!

:headbang:
rocknation

[shugah]

33. the hammer hits the nail

squarely on the head! you are exactly right, MAlibdem!

altho i don't think that too much money or additional staff is necessarily required. most teachers are aware of bullying - i bet 9 out of 10 could give an accurate list of which kids are bullies, and at least 7 of the 10 could tell you which kids are being bullied. unfortunately, there is a pervasive mentality that insists "kids are cruel" - and bullying is ignored. instead of shrugging off bullying as "just the way things are" teachers should actively focus on bullying. if the bullied kids felt they had any advocacy at all (which isn't literally forced by parents), and the bullies were shamed instead of the victims, i'm pretty sure you would see a change in the accepted status quo.

[AndyTiedye]

35. How WOULD You Teach Kids to Deal With Bullies?

> I feel sorry for bullied kids, but how does this teach them how to deal with bullies?

How would you teach them? What would you teach them?
Consider that the kids being bullied are usually the smallest,
weakest, and least-coordinated kids in the class.

> There will be bullies everywhere they go for the rest of their lives.

I never really encountered bullying once I got to college.
OK, the college was MIT, which is a haven for geeks, and way
too academically demanding for bullies.

> As far as I know, there are few "bully-free" workplaces.

It hasn't been a problem anywhere I've worked. Maybe has something
to do with working in the computer industry.

> But truly, I feel sorry for bullied kids. Are there no other options here?

For these kids, probably not. If they were physically able to fight
back, they would have done so already. If they have any kind of
social network in the school at all, they wouldn't want to change
schools. These are kids who are already being bullied and ostricized
by their classmates. "Telling on" the bullies is more likely to bring
retribution upon the victim than punishment on the bullies. Teachers
often look the other way anyway, and if they do get involved, they
are as likely to blame the victim for being a "troublemaker" than to
blame the bullies who were picking on him.

It is also likely to be a better learning environment than the one they are leaving.

[donco6]

26. I totally agree

There's something really wrong with a district that has to create a separate school for the bullied.

[antigone382]

9. I can see an upside and a downside to this.

I was homeschooled from first through seventh grade, and although it took me a few years to really acclimate myself to the social norms of public school (moving around a lot was actually a good thing for me), I have a much stronger sense of who I am and what my values are because of it, and an ability to think independently that is absent in a lot of my classmates. I think it would be wonderful for kids who are "different" to have a place where their uniqueness is encouraged instead of repressed.

On the other hand, I can see where it might be detrimental to kids to have to go to the "dork" school; they might either see themselves as totally socially unacceptable, or they might never learn to develop the thick skin necessary to function. Also, what happens when bullying crosses over into these sanctuaries, as it surely will? My greatest concern, however, is the effect on the "normal" kids. This definitely sends the message that those who are different have to be isolated, and it doesn't force kids to recognize and learn to accept people who deviate from the norm.

The court is still out for me; there are ways a school for bullied and harrassed children would be helpful enormously constructive, especially if it fosters and embraces the unique nature of each child; but there are also ways it could be destructive, by placing that uniqueness in a bubble, denying other children the chance to see it and learn to respect it for themselves.

[XemaSab]

14. I didn't go to the dork school

and I'm socially unacceptable.

[displacedtexan]

10. Let me tell you a bit about public school "tracking" and bullying...

My high school population was tracked: college bound; tech school bound; Viet Nam bound; and housewife bound.

Because I was college bound, the bullying and ridicule I witnessed had nothing to do with kids outside the mainstream...

There was no outside the mainstream in the '60's.

Consequently, the Band kids and the C students were the ones ridiculed and bullied.

It never stops, no matter how many groups try to escape or form their own schools.

The problem lies with lack of administrative leadership... which is a direct result of the almighty "Who's Your Daddy?" scale of importance.

[coffeenap]

12. Bullying is completely accepted by this society--the people in control

of our government and corporations were the bullies of their high schools or grew up to become them because they missed the chance earlier. Yes, growing a thick skin seems to be required in this world, but why should young kids have to suffer to earn it? This is the stuff of suicide and murder. When you are 15 or 16, and living in a middle- class section of society, this is REAL pain! If moving kids voluntarily to a different environment will save their lives or sanity, it is good. Then, let's change the world they had to leave behind.

[David__77]

13. I instinctively dislike this.

I was "bullied" in high school for being gay. What was my response? Fight back! And, I won, in fact. The "bulliers" decided it wasn't worth their effort, since I would make them pay too high a price since I am a determined person.

I am afraid this gives a free pass to administrators and teachers not to prevent such bullying activity. I personally had to fight them, too, to enforce my rights, and think that they need no further excuses to ignore the plight of their students.

[tblue37]

16. Administrators and teachers who do not protect children from bullies need

to do their damned job. If kids are being bullied, then adults are not looking out for them. If the state is going to take children from their parents for most of every weekday, then it at least owes those children safety. I'd say more lawsuits over bullying might wake those adults up to their responsibility.

When my son was in 7th grade, he was bullied on the bus and at school. The principal and vice principal ignored my complaints--until I threatened a lawsuit. Then the bullying ended, as I knew it would. It should never have come to my having to make that threat, but it did--and I did.

[rocktivity]

31. DING DING DING! Tblue37, you're our grand prize winner!

All schools should have a mechanism for dealing with bullies--counseling, special classes, detention if it's a serious. It should be written out and explained to every parent at the beginning of every school year.

[AndyTiedye]

36. That Is Not Always An Option

I was "bullied" in high school for being gay. What was my response? Fight back! And, I won, in fact. The "bulliers" decided it wasn't worth their effort, since I would make them pay too high a price since I am a determined person.

and because you had the size, strength, and coordination that made
it possible for you to fight back. If you were lacking all of those
things, it would not have gone at all well.

[DoYouEverWonder]

17. I put my son in a school

that has never allowed bullying.

It was one of the main things that attracted me to the school. One of their big rules is that 'they don't allow put downs.'

The school goes from K thru HS, with small classes all the way through. The kid's grow up in a safe positive environment, where they can focus on learning and they know they are safe because their teachers won't allow anyone to hurt them. What a concept.

Would you believe my kid rather be in school then on summer vacation. That's what can happen when you go to a 'good' school.

Besides he's already an orange belt in Aikido. I think he'll be able to handle himself in the 'real' world.

[cally]

18. I switched my daughter to a school like this

The school celebrates differences and encourages respect for all. So, many of the students are highly artistic. Some are very academic, some gay or lesbian, and some are typical teens. I wouldn't call this a dork school but rather one where the typical 'popular kid' crowd doesn't rule. I think it reflects my college and life experience much better than my HS experience.

As an aside, have you ever been back to a HS reunion. I went to one or two and those popular kids and bullies were often the least successful. The different kids and the nerds were the successful ones from my HS. One of the saddest comments was hearing one ex-cheerleader tell me HS was the best period of her life. :wow:

[DoYouEverWonder]

20. That's the fallacy of this article

this is not the first school in the country to create a safe environment for their kids. There are a lot of 'special' schools, you just have to look for them and of course, be able to afford tuition.

I went to a small all girl catholic hs. I haven't heard from anyone from there in years. If they had any reunions obviously they weren't able to find me. Oh well. Fortunately, just due to the environment at a school like that, bullying really wasn't an issue. The principal, Sister Tough Mama didn't put up with anybodies nonsense.

[MAlibdem]

22. There's another fallacy here...

in the article, that is.

It's supposes that only an environment full of bullied students can be supportive. Just because a school does not allow "put downs" does not mean it doesn't train kids socially. Case in point: the camp I work for, Camp Becket. It is a largely secular camp ("Judeo-Christian YMCA camp that is 1/2 jewish) that teaches ethical values and CERTAINLY does not allow bullying. I learned the vast majority of my advanced interpersonal skills there as a camper-how to work with others, get along in a group, etc-and now i teach those same skills to my campers.

bccymca.org i always said that if becket had a school, id want to go there. of course, i chose my college based on which one was most like camp.

[ucmike]

19. in a school full of victims, bullies will rise to the top.

its the natural order.

this is all a little too "feel good" for me. what happened to improving yourself in the face of a challenge. seems to me that this will do nothing except create kids who can't deal with adversity.

[Trillo]

32. Then why have any laws, or civilization for that matter?

Wouldn't we all be better off as hunter-gatherers? Biggest bully might not win: them against the wild animals; cooperation with others is key to survival.

Oh, right. It's even more fun for bullies when there are supposed to be laws that protect everyone, when in fact those laws are simple sham for all except them. -->Biggest bully wins, all the wild animals have been subdued.

[shugah]

34. the bullies are actually the ones in need of self improvement

bullies are not bullies because they feel good about themselves. an individual that bullies others is actually trying to feel better about his/her self by very inappropriate means.

i don't really understand what you think "the natural order" is. that bullies should bully because they can? that victims of bullying deserve it? that there is some kind of "natural order" that can be applied to bullying? :shrug:

so, if the victims of bullying just need to buck up and face the challenge and grow in the face of adversity - what do you suggest for the bullies?