Venezuela's Chavez Accuses U.S. of Delaying Parts for Aging F-16 Fleet

[Say_What]

<clips>

Venezuela's Chavez Accuses U.S. of Delaying Parts for Aging F-16 Fleet

Caracas, Venezuela, Feb 14, 2004 (Venezuelanalysis.com).- Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez accused the government of the United States of delaying the sale of parts for the repair and maintenance of Venezuela’s fleet of F-16 fighters.

"The Unites States is delaying the supply of spare parts, reducing the operating time of our planes. We are going to have to sign accords with other countries to see if we can get those parts or manufacture them here," Chavez said during his weekly live TV show.

Venezuela's leftist leader, who frequently clashes with the U.S. administration for his criticisms to capitalist neoliberalism, the U.S. aggressive "imperialist" foreign policy, and his cooperation with Cuban President Fidel Castro, said that the U.S. sold the F-16 planes to Venezuela "at a really high price". Venezuela bought a fleet of 24 F-16 from the U.S. in the early 80's. He also said the maintenance price of the fleet is also very high.

Sources close to the government have reported complains of very high prices from the U.S. for a proposed technological update of the aging fleet. Rumors about a possible purchase of Russian MIG-29 have been denied by several Venezuelan officials, which suggest that Venezuela might be applying pressure to negotiate better prices to update their old F-16 fighters.

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/news.php?newsno=1505


Venezuela's Chavez welcomed Brazilian President DaSilva who arrived in Venezuela for an official visit at which several agreements will be discussed, including the purchase of airplanes from Brazil's Embraer.
Credit: ABN

[sleipnir]

1. WTF is he thinking? You can't have it both ways.

He criticizes this admin and then turns around and gets angry when they won't sell him parts?

Come on Chavez, get real. If you're going to make anti-Bush comments you've got to realize you might piss someone off and thus, the Bushies aren't going to sell you parts.

[w4rma]

2. You do realize the Bush actually had Chavez kidnapped, before.

correct?

That's right. Kidnapped. Do *you* think *you'd* be just a little ticked off if you were kidnapped?

Also, note that it appears that the BFEE is trying everything in their power to destablize Venezuela.

What Chavez would *like* is if the U.S. would quit working against him and work with him as an equal partner. The problem is that Bush is trying to push his neo-conservative ideology onto this country by force and deception.

[DistantWind88]

3. I did not know that. Amazing

Where can I read about that?

[Solon]

5. Well, you can watch it happen...

in the documentary "The Revolution will not be Televised", or just read up on articles about the coup attempt in 2002. And before you say that it was the military there who took the initiative, remember this, only ONE diplomat was at their side when Chavez was arrested and taken away, none other than the U.S. Ambassador to Venezuela, curious, no?

[DistantWind88]

6. No

So you're saying that Bushco did not have him kidnapped? That is was their military?

[Solon]

7. WTF?!? Bush supported the coup, openly....

I believe the day afterwords he was quoted as saying "It was a great day for democracy in Venezuela." he never bothered making it a secret, only when the coup failed did he have to back pedal a little bit. Also, we still do not know all the details of what type of support the CIA gave to the military leaders there in ousting Chavez, all we know is that they were there. At the very least, Bush is complicit, at worst, he ordered it. What difference does it really make, Chavez knew the U.S. supported the coup, just like everyone else in the world, except for apparently some people in the United States. The fact of the matter is that given our history in such matters, this is the way we operate in Central and South America, along with other areas of the world. *cough*Mossadeq*cough

[Say_What]

21. Quotes and CIA support for Golpistas (coup makers)

On edit: Based on the continual US attempts to try to overthrow Chavez, these lies are extremely telling.

<clips>

The Bush Administration quickly announced, “We wish to express our solidarity to the Venezuelan people and look forward to working with all democratic forces in Venezuela to ensure the full exercise of democratic rights.”

http://www.agrnews.org/issues/170/

On April 12, 2002, White House spokesperson Ari Fleischer stated:

“Let me share with you the administration's thoughts about what's taking place in Venezuela. It remains a somewhat fluid situation. But yesterday's events in Venezuela resulted in a change in the government and the assumption of a transitional authority until new elections can be held.

....The results of these events are now that President Chavez has resigned the presidency. Before resigning, he dismissed the vice president and the cabinet, and a transitional civilian government has been installed. This government has promised early elections.

On that same day, U.S. Department of State spokesperson Philip T. Reeker, claimed:

...Yesterday's events in Venezuela resulted in a transitional government until new elections can be held. Though details are still unclear, undemocratic actions committed or encouraged by the Chavez administration provoked yesterday's crisis in Venezuela. According to the best information available, at this time: Yesterday, hundreds of thousands of Venezuelans gathered peacefully to seek redress of their grievances.

http://venezuelafoia.info/Press-Articles/CIA-coup-proof.htm

---

Like old days--U.S. role in Venezuela coup under scrutiny

...U.S. officials have confirmed that in the months and weeks leading up to the coup against the democratically elected left-leaning Chávez, a stream of Venezuelan businessmen, journalists, military officers and politicians opposed to Chávez met with U.S. officials in Caracas and Washington. They include Pedro Carmona, who replaced Chávez briefly as president and is head of Venezuela’s version of the Chamber of Commerce.

‘Informal, subtle signs’

Defending the meetings, White House spokesman Ari Fleischer said, “United States officials explicitly made clear repeatedly to opposition leaders that the United States would not support a coup.” U.S. officials say they also met with Chávez supporters. Contradicting Fleischer, a Defense Department official told The New York Times that in the U.S. officials’ meetings with Chávez foes, “We were not discouraging people. We were sending informal, subtle signs that we didn’t like this guy.”

...One turned out to be another coup leader, Vice Adm. Carlos Molina. Hrinak issued the order because U.S. officials had learned the dissidents were “involved in illegal activities or what would be illegal activities,” said a State Department official who asked not to be named.

Venezuelan and U.S. officials are investigating allegations that two high-level military officials from the U.S. embassy, including Army Lt. Col. James Rogers, were at Fuerte Tiuna military base the first night of the coup while Chávez was being held there.

...Chávez told The Washington Post that a Venezuelan coastal radar installation detected a foreign military ship, helicopter and airplane operating in and over Venezuelan waters that Saturday while he was being held on a small Caribbean island and military base, La Orchila. In its statement May 14, the embassy said that during the coup two U.S. Coast Guard ships and a U.S. Customs airplane were participating in a U.S.-Netherlands anti-narcotics training mission near Curacao and Aruba off Venezuela’s coast, but no U.S. military vessels or aircraft were involved.

Also raising questions is the general response of the United States to the coup, which initially it refused to condemn. Instead, it blamed Chávez for his own ouster. Then, on his first full day as “president,” Carmona shared breakfast in the presidential palace at about 9 a.m. with U.S. Ambassador Charles Shapiro.

“It shows you the depth of the U.S. connection to this thing,” Birns said in a phone interview in late April. “It’s the first few hours of his presidency. He hadn’t even been sworn in yet.”

http://www.natcath.com/NCR_Online/archives/053102/053102j.htm

[Say_What]

9. You need to do some research....

It's customary at DU to do some basic research about topics before posting stuff one knows little about. Here's a start for you:

<clips>

Miraflores Palace, Caracas
...13 Palast: But doesn't it worry you that Otto Reich is in charge of Latin American affairs for the Bush government? He spoke to Carmona, he spoke to other people who may be involved in the coup, he was previously involved in trying to overthrow a government when he worked for Bush the father. Doesn't it worry you that the man in charge of Latin American operations for the United States has made ties to your enemies and has a history of overthrowing governments?

Chávez: We are assessing all this behaviour, but more than concern me, I believe that this man that you mention has been very concerned himself and has been making a lot of effort to explain his behaviour to the world. And also for the image of the US government around the world, they should be concerned to clarify this to the world, for example to the European Union, Latin American countries, to the whole world. I believe the United States must be very concerned to clarify their real position on this coup, this assault on democracy.

I don't want to believe, not even for an instant, that the US actually supported this coup. This would be dreadful for the whole world, that a government that talks so much about democracy and spreads the words of democracy and human rights, would support this humungous atrocity. It would be like the negation of all their moral ethics and truths, their own words would be compromised as well as their credibility, a country as important as the United States.

...I have, for example, proof, the written proof, I have the time of the entries and exits of the two military officers from the United States into the headquarters of the coup-plotters. I have their names, who they met with, what they said, proof on video and on still photographs. This is being investigated, what those officers from the US military were doing here. I have in my hands a radar image of a military vessel that came into Venezuelan waters, near the Paraguana peninsula, on midday the 13th of April. I have radar images of a helicopter that takes off from that ship, and flies over Venezuela, and of other planes that violated Venezuelan airspace. Again, all this is being currently investigated.

I don't know if it was a US military ship yet, it could be from another country. In any case, I cannot give you any insights, it's a very serious investigation. I repeat what I already said, I am very interested in a fast resolution of all this, and I hope that the name and the democratic image of the United States government, that represents a people who love democracy, Abraham Lincoln's people, George Washington's people, Martin Luther King's people, the people of great poets, the American people who are brothers of the Venezuelan people, that's why I repeat -


http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=184&row=2

---

More Palast articles Venezuela and Chavez

NEDs funding of the opposition to overthrow Chavez

Venezuela – Colombia To Washington’s Chagrin, Economics Bridge Ideological Divide

[DistantWind88]

13. I didn't post

asserted information. I asked for something that said that Bush had Chavez kidnapped. There is no supporting proof of that assertion.

[Say_What]

14. American navy 'helped Venezuelan coup'

What part of US-orchestrated would-be coup don't you understand? This is basic US-Latin America history 101--overthrow democratically elected leaders and install US puppet dictators to look after US interests.

You obviously read none of the links or information posted, a little reading would enlighten you considerably.

---

<clips>
American navy 'helped Venezuelan coup'

..."I first heard of Lieutenant Colonel James Rogers going down there last June to set the ground," Mr Madsen, an intelligence analyst, said yesterday. "Some of our counter-narcotics agents were also involved."

He said that the navy was in the area for operations unconnected to the coup, but that he understood they had assisted with signals intelligence as the coup was played out.

...In Caracas, a congressman has accused the US ambassador to Venezuela, Charles Shapiro, and two US embassy military attaches of involvement in the coup.

Roger Rondon claimed that the military officers, whom he named as (James) Rogers and (Ronald) MacCammon, had been at the Fuerte Tiuna military headquarters with the coup leaders during the night of April 11-12.

And referring to Mr Shapiro, Mr Rondon said: "We saw him leaving Miraflores palace, all smiles and embraces, with the dictator Pedro Carmona Estanga (who was installed by the military for a day) ... {His} satisfaction was obvious. Shapiro's participation in the coup d'état in Venezuela is evident."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,706802,00.html

---

<clips>
US Officer Accused Of Involvement In Venezuelan Coup

...A Pentagon spokesman acknowledged MacCammon, the US army attaché in Caracas, and his deputy James Rodgers, had offices at Fort Tiuna, the military headquarters here, but denied they had anything to do with the failed overthrow.

The US State Department issued a communiqué that day, decrying "undemocratic actions committed or encouraged by the Chavez administration" that "provoked" the crisis.

Speaking on condition of anonymity, a State Department official in Washington acknowledged the United States had a military group liason at Fort Tiuna until Thursday morning, but added that "at some point Thursday they were told by the Venezuelans to leave and they did, along with all the other foreign military officials."

Earlier, a military source told AFP in Caracas that US Army Lieutenant Colonel James Rodgers, an aide to the US military attache, was present at Fort Tiuna in Caracas before Chavez was brought to that installation after the coup, and remained there until the self-proclaimed provisional government fell apart.

http://www.lovearth.net/ushelpedvenezuelacoup.htm



Hugo Chávez, surrounded by resolute supporters, makes a dramatic return to power on April 12, 2002 after the collapse of the first Latin American coup of the 21st century.

[DistantWind88]

15. No I read it

And dismissed it. It doesn't LINK BUSHCO with kindapping Chavez now , does it?

[Say_What]

16. Weak....

You can "dismiss" anything you want, but it doesn't change the FACT that the US WAS and IS heavily involved in trying to overthrow Chavez. Anyone who has followed Venezuela for ANY length of time knows this, except of course for brain-washed and befuddled 'MuriKans with their heads in the sand.


Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez (R) jokes with his Brazilian counterpart, Luiz Inacio Lula Da Silva, during a welcome ceremony at Simon Bolivar airport in Maiquetia near in Caracas, February 13, 2005. Lula is in Venezuela in a two-day visit. REUTERS/Jorge Silva

[Carl Brennan]

20. Yea, but

was Bush actually in Venezuela? Are there any pictures of him there? If not how can you claim he was involved?

So what if Poppy Bush "yachted" with the crook Cisneros who was instrumental in the overthrow, did Poppy give him an order to take Chavez out?


hee, hee.

[On the Road]

17. It's Not Clear Who Initiated the Plan

The Venezuelan elite was perfectly capable of a coup on their own. But the administration was heavily involved with the Carmona people.

When asked about US intervention, one of the leader of the coup said: "When we met with the US in December, the generals told us they weren't going to send troops." That's more than foreknowledge.

Here's a link from the UK guardian on US Navy involvement.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,706802,00.html

And one from The Nation:

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20020805&c=1&s=corn

There's more, but you won't find it in the US MSM. The foreign press tends to be a better source on something like this.

[NNN0LHI]

4. Let that be a lesson to other countries considering buying US weapons

The US will sell you the weapons but not the spare parts to keep them running. Better to purchase Russian weapons systems. Another nice move from the Chimpster and his minions.

Don

[JohnyCanuck]

8. Could this be it? Chavez is intentionally making some noise

about the US not allowing the purchase of parts for the F16s so that when they do buy Migs he can say that they were forced into it as they couldn't keep the F16s flyable due to the lack of spare parts. In light of the previous coup attempt (which dollars to donuts the CIA had a hand in assisting if not organizing) along with the current state of affairs between the two countries and the rhetoric flying back and forth, I'd be quite surprised if the US was still allowing significant arms shipments (or parts for same) to Venezuela. I'd be even more surprised that Chavez would assume he could have unfettered access to US technology to keep his armed forces competitive.

[Spazito]

10. I would bet you are right

So far, Chavez has outsmarted the bush admin at every turn so your theory would make eminent sense. The US could not make noises at the purchase of arms, etc, from other countries if they have refused to allow the purchase of replacement parts for arms sold to them by the US.

I am more and more impressed with Chavez the more I read about him.

[Say_What]

11. Tio Sam--a piss poor vendor

The refusal to supply parts has apparently been going on since the late 1990s. Additionally, Chavez, as well as other LatAm countries, is moving his country away from being dependent on the USSA--a smart move IMO.

<clips>

In May 1982, the government of Venezuela signed an agreement to buy 18 Block 15 F-16A's and six Block 15 F-16B's to replace the fleet of Mirage III interceptors and Mirage 5 ground-attack aircraft serving with the Fuerza Aérea Venezolana. This purchase was under the Peace Delta Foreign Military Sales program.

However, the Venzuelan order was not approved immediately because the US government wanted to sell Venezuela the F-16/79 (a slightly degraded F-16 version developed for export orders) instead. In 1983, the US government abandoned its hopes of selling the F-16/79, and finally approved the sale of the F100-powered F-16s to Venezuela

The FAV accepted its first aircraft in September 1983. FAV F-16s wear an attractive green/brown color scheme, with the insignia of the Aviacion de Combate (Combat Aviation) on the tail and roundels on the wings. A four-digit serial is painted on the fuselage just below the tail fin.

Of the original 24 aircraft that Venezuela bought, three have crashed: the first two, due to engine failure, and the second one, an F-16B, crashed during a maneuver on an air show at Base Aerea El Libertador, where Grupo 16 is based. In this accident, the first and second commander of the squadron where killed. The Venezuelan Air Force was looking for US government approval to replace these two aircraft and was planning to overhaul and update the remaining 22 airframes. At the end of October 1997, the US government approved the sale of the two F-16s, as well as an upgrade packet including the F-100-PW-220E. However, the purchase of the two attrition airframes has been halted until further notice.

http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article25.html

[AP]

12. The interesting thing about this: would McDonnel Douglas pass up

the revenue?

Why not renegotiate the contract and provide the parts?

[Riding this Donkey]

18. Lets not forget that the potus named Venezuela one of the axis

of evil states in his last two speeches, I say more power to Venezuela's Chavez. They are on the list that our american taliban have in their rifle sights. }(

[Carl Brennan]

19. This is starting to get real interesting.

It looks like Bush's aggressive foreign policy is going to backfire for the US Military Industrial Complex in Venezuela. If Bush keeps pissing off other countries they will stop buying US armaments. hmmmmmm.