New 9/11 Reports Shows Warnings About Hijackers - NYT

[adigal]

The FAA had warnings about suicide hijackers. NY Times link

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/10/politics/10terror.html?hp&ex=1108011600&en=50d329a477de39c5&ei=5094&partner=homepage

[Bozita]

1. Somebody HAD to ignore this!

from the NYT article:

The report discloses that the Federal Aviation Administration, despite being focused on risks of hijackings overseas, warned airports in the spring of 2001 that if "the intent of the hijacker is not to exchange hostages for prisoners, but to commit suicide in a spectacular explosion, a domestic hijacking would probably be preferable."

[old blue]

3. preferable to whom? n/t

[drdtroit]

15. Preferable to hijacking an overseas flight coming here. n/t

[havocmom]

22. which would likely mean LESS fuel in the explosion

:eyes: The bozos wanted big booms? Ah, LIHOP stock just went up.

[leesa]

226. The fuel was irrelevant. The fire was minimal.

[Carni]

11. Vague statements and inferences no one could have seen this coming...

YEAH RIGHT

Only question in my mind...LIHOP or MIHOP?

[ClintonTyree]

60. A PDB saying, in effect "Bin Laden wanting to attack in the United States

and all of these warnings?

Not in theur wildest DREAMS could they have forseen something like this happening! This attack came COMPLETELY out of the blue, NO WARNINGS WHATSOEVER!

Kindasleezy Rice didn't have a CLUE this could happen!

If this doesn't help the LIHOP theory, nothing does. Either that or the Administration is guiilty of GROSS INCOMPETENCE. Either way. SOMEBODY should pay for this complete lapse of security, not be given a presidential medal for meritorious service.

We ahve NO Independent Media in this country anymore, save the blogs. The MSM is involved in the cover up along with knowingly and willingly pushing bush propaganda as truth.

On the other hand, Princ Charles IS marrying Cammila Parker Bowles, that trumps any other story out there.

[adigal]

62. What is LIHOP please??? n/t

[Demeter]

66. Letting It Happen On Purpose

the less caloric version of Making It Happen On Purpose (MIHOP)

[egoprofit]

268. yeah... maybe a good reason to invade iraq...

bush is so crooked, he's the real evil dictator in this world.

[psychopomp]

67. Let It Happen On Purpose

The truth keeps leaking out.

[leveymg]

93. The truth keeps leaking out - Just More Tears Into a Sea of Sorrow

Who'd notice?

[Virginian]

68. Let It Happen On Purpose

Now do you want to know what MIHOP stands for or did you already figure out the "M" stands for "Made?"

[Rose Siding]

18. Together with the report title that Condi was forced to reveal...

"Bin Laden determined to strike within the US", all that's missing is a DIAGRAM.

[Bozita]

25. I LOVED watching her squirm while reciting the PDB title ...

... in front of the 9/11 Commission.

[EST]

102. And here I thought her squirming was

all because her vibrator batteries were getting weak.

[outrage]

126. all because her vibrator batteries were getting weak?

Oh, SNAP!

[eek]

185. yeah, her husb- borrowed 'em for his bulge

n.t.

[Mokito]

36. and an official invitation.

n/t

[leveymg]

95. "and an official invitation" TO A GRAND JURY.

Mr. Fitzgerald, please begin your opening statement for the jury.

[Journeyman]

38. Well, that . . . and seat numbers . . .

impossible to stop something like this without specific seat numbers . . .

[napi21]

134. Great the way Ben-Veniste asked the question too!

Good lawyers always do this...they know the answer to the question before they ask. It usually does put the whitness on the spot because they know the questioner knows the correct answer too!

Every time I see that replayed, I clap and cheer!

[leveymg]

250. BV restored some of my faith in that 9/11 Commissioner. Roemer was a dis-

appointment.

[AndrewJacksonFaction]

27. To understand why, you must refer to their ilk..........

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1339959/posts
----------------------------------------------------------------
To: prairiebreeze
And if only Clinton/Gore hadn't caved to Daschle's wife's lobbying group and had actually put in reinforced doors as a study recommended, 9/11 might not have happened at all.



3 posted on 02/09/2005 6:54:18 PM PST by Peach
---------------------------------------------------------------

To: fidelio

Translation: Clinton-Gore raised this issue to shake down the airline industry for campaign contributions. After hundreds of thousands in contributions had been paid, Clinton-Gore declared all was well and back to normal.


4 posted on 02/09/2005 6:55:25 PM PST by Mad_Tom_Rackham (This just in from CBS: "There is no bias at CBS")
< Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies >

===========================================================

just a few choice nuggets from that terrible board.

[GetTheRightVote]

2. So finally we see a bigger picture growing, why did the govt not react

even if the FAA did not ?? That is the real queston all of us should be asking.

:kick:

[Ian David]

41. The FAA *IS* part of the government

They are charged with PROTECTING and REGULATING and MARKETING the airlines industry.

That is a clear conflict of interest that needs to stop.

[Corgigal]

47. The airlines, then

were in charge of security at the airports. The FAA couldn't force the airlines to spend the money to upgrade their security. Which is why the Govt took over the screeners at airports.

Airlines didn't do a damn thing but got a giant bailout when they cried victim.

[purduejake]

74. The airlines already had a lot of taxes...

tacked onto ticket prices that was supposed to go to things like improving security, etc. However, the government has always used those taxes for things other than aviation. It's still that way and it one of the reasons the airlines continue to suffer.

Things haven't gotten much better. People in the industry like to call the TSA "Thousands Standing Around." We used to have 6 TSA agents here in West Lafayette with one commercial flight a day.

Just don't think the airlines are the only problem here.

[Corgigal]

198. No I don't

I just think that the FAA and the commercial airline corporations are so far in bed together that they take turns hitting the snooze alarm.

It's the responsibility of both the airlines and our govt to protect it's people.

[Jose Diablo]

285. The ATC strike in Reagans Administration

was all about air safety and putting in-place better 'systems' the government refused to spend the money to install. The press at that time spun it to make it seem like the controllers were striking for benefits only. Thus Reagan got a 'free pass' by J Q Public to bust the union. This was the early stages of the corporatism we see rampant today.

Since then, as you have stated there have been extra taxes tacked on to each ticket sale to add better security. Where did that tax money go?

[spooked911]

49. NORAD should have been on high alert. This is an outrage.

[leveymg]

100. NORAD was on alert. There was an exercise that day simulating a cruise

missile attack on the Pentagon and airliner hijackings. There was a squadron of F-15s near the DC airspace that morning, but somehow they weren't vectored to intercept Flt. 77.

Someone with inside access piggybacked onto these exercises. Mr. Ben-Veniste alluded to this during his questioning, but it's never been publicly explained.

[spooked911]

166. I know about the 9/11 wargames. They essentially diverted away our air

defenses. They fatally compromised our air defenses and we need to know what NORAD was thinking as well as how the attackers knew to exploit this gap.

[leesa]

227. Cheney was in charge of these excercises

[leveymg]

249. I've seen that. Is there a solid source? Please cite. n/t

[leveymg]

247. Most of all, we need to know who knew about these exercises and

how it was incorporated into the attack plans without any allied intel picking up on it. That assumes, of course, that it wasn't detected by any allied intel agency.

We know that the CIA was watching al-Midhar and al-Hazmi in Kuala Lumpur,and that according to Tenet this was passed onto the FBI liaison at CIC. Early after their arrival, the pair were watched closely by Saudi intel. The Israelis were trailing Atta's group (WTC attack) which later married up with the Flt. 77 hijackers (Pentagon).

We also know that the surveillance gathered in Kuala Lumpur (and later) wasn't provided when requested by either the Milwaukee or the NY FBI offices, both of which were seeking FISA warrants.

We know that before 9/11 the Pentagon website had a page describing an exercise involving a scenario attack of a suicide air crash. I don't think, however, that the cruise missile intercept exercises would have been public knowledge. That would have been low-level classified info which anyone with a US security clearance or any foreign state intel agency could get its hands on. That was likely passed on to al-Qaeda in Spring 2001. Most obvious explanation is that Saud intel or Pakistani ISI are the likely culprits on this.

Anyone have details to add to this?

[Corgigal]

203. inside access piggybacked onto these exercises

Can you explain this in a bit more detail? I am also aware of the exercise NORAD was running.

[Old and In the Way]

228. Search "Vigilante Warrior" and "Vigilent Guardian"

Vigilent Guardian was underway on 9/11. IIRC, Cheney went ballistic and wanted the Senate Intelligence committee members lie detector tested to see who leaked information about the intercepted transmission of Atta(?) saying the "match was on" the next day. Clearly, this exercise enhanced the success of the attacks. And check for "ptech", they are a Suadi based company whose software ran the wargames simulations for NORAD/FAA. I think they also have AQ connections.

What I really want to know is: was 175, 11, 93, and 77 involved with this exercise. That would be an important fact that we should know.

[leveymg]

254. See Post No. 247. n/t

[AuntiBush]

216. And this is "not" a test...

And hijacking exercises... so if the FAA stated this, as it clearly shows in the 9/11 Commission Report was there ever an explanation from anyone about this?

[leveymg]

248. No explanation offered publicly. Wasn't demanded by 9/11 Commission.

You'd better believe, however, that lots of CT and CI people in US intel who have looked into it. Some of this has already come out. There are loads of files and officers who know bits and pieces after the fact from the various investigations. This does not discount the possibility that what has been leaked publicly (Vigilante Warrior/Guardian) isn't disinformation, or that even the classified version isn't a cover story. Still needs digging.

[AuntiBush]

217. Do you think it was all about

money? Or a trade of secrets?

[Nashyra]

4. These fuckers should be put in jail

All this administration had to do if they WANTED to was to put into effect the same warnings and bulletins that the airline personnel recieved propr to the millineum. We were on a higher alert. All they had to do is copy Big Dog, they wanted this to happen, to damn easy to prevent.

[lyonn]

26. Exactly

Been saying that for years, Clinton's people warned that there could be some sort of attack during the millinium. 9-11 was not unexpected by many ordinary people. Had friends that spend New Years in NY and it seemed a risky trip at the time to me. Canadian guard discovered a person that proved to on his way to the US to do harm. It's all a big DUH.

[SpiralHawk]

5. 52 Frikking Warning from April to Sept.

Hello, Chimp and Cronies. Asleep at the frikkin wheel. As usual.

Just disgraceful.

Bush and BushCo failed America on 9/11.

[leesa]

7. They weren't asleep. They were either coordinating it or letting it happen

[Hissyspit]

20. Incompetent or Complicit

[kath]

6. How conveeeeeenient that this comes out after the election...

[NewYorkerfromMass]

12. Well, yes- the report has been around for 5 months

or since last September- so Bush had a lot to lose by letting it out then. The more galling quote for me was by the FAA's Laura J. Brown who says: "After 9/11, the F.A.A. and the entire aviation community took bold steps to improve aviation security, such as fortifying cockpit doors..."

How the hell can anything you do AFTER 9/11 be called "bold"? It's all just closing the empty barn's doors.
These fuckers all need to be publically flogged.

[flyarm]

31. this report has been completed and ready since june 2004!

i sat in a 15 people round table discussion with bob kerry in august and demanded to know why this report was being witheld from the american public..he would not answer me with a room full of college professors and phd's he was speachless when i demanded to know how this was possible that this was being witheld from the american public before our election!

that wasnt the only thing bob kerry would not answer !! he never answered one of my questions and i was sitting dead in front of him less than 3 feet from him..i left him speechless..and white faced...they were complicit in this so call bullshit commission..as complicit as * and company in letting 9/11 happen for their frigging agenda!

i walk through life with the angels of my co-workers on my shoulders..i will never stop fighting for the truth and those responsbile for the complicity of 9/11 to be held accountable..i will fight till the last breath i take!

fly

[Chelsea Patriot]

138. Thank You For Getting Into POS Kerrey's Face, flyam!!!

Thank you for letting him know that we know!

Complicit is right!

I would like to know to whom the 9/11 Commission took their oath when they agreed to not discuss these findings before the Election.

What civil authority do Kerrey, Hamilton, Gorelick, Thompson et al. answer to that is higher then the Constitution and the American Public?

Your Posts are always great!

Keep up the Great Work!

[Demeter]

69. Yes! Bring Back Flogging!

That will go nicely with the Torture. And we can see that the Torture Boys and their CiC get double helpings!

[Supersedeas]

202. Yet another POST election revelation based on a pre-election report

[rooboy]

8. Nobody could have known that terrorists would use planes as weapons...

can I be Secretary of State now, please?

[adigal]

9. If it weren't so sad, I would be cracking up right now

Thanks for the black humor comic relief.

[ProfessorGAC]

44. Sure! Let Us Rubber Stamp That Appointment For You

Questionable academic credentials? Check
Marginal Business Experience and Acumen? Check
Complete and Public Lack of Vision and Analytical Thought? Check
NSA Chief During Largest Attack on Continental U.S. Ever? Check

Move directly to State Dept. as Boss.
The Professor

[clydefrand]

10. But, but there were "only" 52 intelligence reports. They got #53

on 9/11.


"Among other things, the report says that leaders of the F.A.A. received 52 intelligence reports from their security branch that mentioned Mr. Bin Laden or Al Qaeda from April to Sept. 10, 2001. That represented half of all the intelligence summaries in that time."

[Ian David]

42. Well, if we'd had the flight numbers and seat numbers...

Condi would have been able to stop it.

Or, she would at least have made sure they didn't get any in-flight peanuts.

THAT would have showed 'em!

[tabasco]

13. Bush's #1 defense priority prior to 9-11 was STAR WARS - -

despite being warned by the Clinton administration that terrorism was the #1 threat.

NOTHING COULD GET IN THE WAY OF THE STAR WARS CORPORATE ENRICHMENT PROGRAM - - - THE GREATEST SCAM OF ALL TIME !!

Millions of US citizens were aware of this and voted for Bush anyway. WTF is wrong with these people?!?

[uppityperson]

14. But no specific information was given.

No specific date, time and flights, no specific airport (sounds like several were being watched by our security, how could they tell which one), no specific seat numbers or buildings to be knocked down. I mean, it all was just too general. Good thing they've taken the bold effort of beefing up cockpit doors now, after 9/11. Very bold indeed. (that was a quote from the article). I hate these people, this government I mean.

[eek]

196. however, specific enough to:

-no longer let asscrack fly commercial as of Summer '01

-to figure out who all or most of the terrorists were andwhere they'd parked their cars that day


aren't we all sick of being, apparently, so much smarter, deductive, well-researched, clued in than anyone in the MSM, or out Gubbmint?

hell - I don't even have a college degree and I knew about the buttloads of warnings from Mossad, Germany, Australia by approximately 09/12/01.
Didn't need no commission, neither.

(and that fraWd was a former business partner with bin Laden's brother among other things)


Boy o boy am I ever getting back into the ol MIHOP boat.

[uppityperson]

215. That was sarcasm. And I hate stupid people.

Like Mr. Bush, and the people who voted for him "to keep us safe". Notice I didn't say who elected him, but there were enough who voted for these people to apall me. Our gvt is smart in some ways, and really dumb too. Short term making money, yes, long term life, no.

[tlcandie]

279. YES, and exactly WHICH airline did Mr. Asscrack

generally fly previously? American Airlines?

[Rose Siding]

16. here are some snips

WASHINGTON, Feb. 9 - In the months before the Sept. 11 attacks, federal aviation officials reviewed dozens of intelligence reports that warned about Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda, some of which specifically discussed airline hijackings and suicide operations, according to a previously undisclosed report from the 9/11 commission.

But aviation officials were "lulled into a false sense of security," and "intelligence that indicated a real and growing threat leading up to 9/11 did not stimulate significant increases in security procedures," the commission report concluded.

The report discloses that the Federal Aviation Administration, despite being focused on risks of hijackings overseas, warned airports in the spring of 2001 that if "the intent of the hijacker is not to exchange hostages for prisoners, but to commit suicide in a spectacular explosion, a domestic hijacking would probably be preferable."

The report takes the F.A.A. to task for failing to pursue domestic security measures that could conceivably have altered the events of Sept. 11, 2001, like toughening airport screening procedures for weapons or expanding the use of on-flight air marshals. The report, completed last August, said officials appeared more concerned with reducing airline congestion, lessening delays, and easing airlines' financial woes than deterring a terrorist attack.

http://nytimes.com/2005/02/10/politics/10terror.html?hp&ex=1108011600&en=50d329a477de39c5&ei=5094&partner=homepage

[Ready4Change]

17. Wait wait wait.

I thought that this report, the development of which was resisted by the Bush administration, and the release of which has still been delayed by the Bush administration, was rumoured to have fingered the CIA as having been responsible for insufficient intelligence gathering and reporting and thus being responsible?

But now, THIS rumour seems to finger the FAA for not connecting the dots regarding all this information that the CIA supposedly didn't gather or report on.

So, did the CIA drop the ball? Or did the FAA drop the ball?

Or are WE expected to drop the ball and believe that this administration had NOOOOOO idea this was going to happen, despite PDB entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Attack Inside the United States" which was presented to the President on August 6th, 2001, just one month before the attacks on 9/11?

[KalicoKitty]

19. Remember August 6th, 2001?

August 6, 2001: At his Crawford ranch, the president is told about possible attacks, including that bin Laden may hijack airplanes. The CIA gives Bush an analytic report on al-Qaeda during his daily briefing, focusing on terrorist attacks inside the U.S.. The report was titled: "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S.". After receiving the report, Bush left work early and spent the rest of the day fishing.

[Hissyspit]

24. Here's where I was on Aug. 11, 2001

I was at the World Trade Center. On vacation. From my job as an art history professor. With my girlfriend. Trying to get Broadway tickets. Here's what I said to her: "I don't understand why people don't think they won't try it again. Americans are so complacent. They won't use truck bombs again because it didn't work the first time." I then tried to imagine how much damage the buildings would do if they fell.

So when Condi said to the world "No, one could have seen this coming," I knew I was listening to garbage. Don't let anyone tell you they couldn't have stopped this. One of the great cons in human history.

[spooked911]

45. One of the great cons in human history.

Absolutely.

Unfortunately our worthless media fell for it.

[HockeyMom]

139. Last weekend of August 2001 in New York

We had out of town friends visiting us that weekend. We took them to visit the Statute of Liberty. IT WAS CLOSED for SECURITY REASONS which they would not say why. WHY???????? Does the rest of the country know this? Sounds to me like they knew something was going on.

Remember, the FBI Arizona Report was not just send to DC, but also NEW YORK.

[Bozita]

28. Who read that PDB to him?

That was Tenet's job. But he was in DC.

Did Bush actually read it himself?

Think about this: Bush reading ... while on vacation.

[SoCalDem]

135. Tenet DID go to Crawford ... That came out in the hearings..

Whether he read the briefing to him (Whay can't he read his OWN paperwork) or not, I don't know.. But I do remember in the testimony that he DID go to Crawford.. Someoone here even posted a group photo, and Tenet was there

[leveymg]

252. The White House Website quotes Bush on 08/25 talking about Tenet's visit

the day before. They had a very long meeting on a "very important subject" with Condi, Rummy, and Gen. Myers. Among other stupid things, Bush talks too much. Google: "Tenet's perjury"

[NewYorkerfromMass]

21. Bojinka, Algerians in Paris... they knew.

.... the list is long and depressing. Rice either lied or is an incompetent.

http://www.rotten.com/library/crime/terrorism/terror-tactics/kamikaze-jet-hijacking

[Demeter]

70. Since We've Seen On TV How Badly Rice Lies...

she's incompetent. No Doubt about it.

[reprobate]

107. Disagree. Rice was one of the pivotal figures in the attack.

Without her cooperation it could not have been succesful. All that planning would have failed without her.

Then where would the administration have been. Worse than they were on 9/10/01. Which was sliding down the tube into oblivion. This attack was the one thing that saved their bacon.

[Demeter]

112. Competence in serving US--not Bush

I am quite sure that Condi had to swear an oath to the US service--so you would finger her as a traitor. I think if she were competent, she would have covered up the traces a whole lot better....

[RaleighNCDUer]

158. Right! We need a SOS who is a much better liar! nt

[adigal]

23. Who was giving the warnings??

Possibly the CIA??? The FBI??? And who ignored them? The FAA, also run by our govt. If this is true, and I admit I am just thinking out loud, is is any wonder the CIA tried to disgrace Bush before the election. He let them take the blame for 9/11, all except that dope, Tenet, who received the Medal of Honor.

[Virginian]

73. Refresh my memory please

"the CIA tried to disgrace Bush before the election."
What did the CIA do and why didn't they succeed? I forgot.

[flyarm]

29. well i will assure you as a flt crew for one of the 9/11 airlines..

we never got one state dept warning under gw *..not one!!

* was too busy getting his hands into our contract negotiations and threatening us with an old obsolete law he was going to invoke in june of 2001 against us if we went out on strike..but worry about security or giving warnings to flight crews of all the warnings he had..hellll no ,.that wasn't important to the safety of passengers and crew..that wasn't near as important than making sure a nasty union didnt declare a strike..nooo * was in bed with management to make sure we were their slaves and that we didnt stand up for security , or safety!!

i hate these cuss word ,cuss word assholes!!

my co-workers are dead because of the incompetance of this * cabal..they wanted this to happen..i have no other conclusions after over 3 yrs of doing my own investigations and search for truth..i really believe everyone in this administration at the least belongs in jail for manslaughter!!

fly

[classof56]

89. This keeps compounding into a more and more frightening

and incredibly evil scenario. I commend you on your efforts to seek and demand the truth and hold someone accountable. I am so sorry about your co-workers who were lost in the terrible (sorry, can't think of a strong enough word) 911 events. And to think now that their deaths and those of thousands of others could have been avoided but weren't...I just can't express my rage and now I do believe * and his minions did indeed want this to happen. I could not agree more that they all deserve no less than many years of jail time, though of course that will not happen. They have no regrets because they have no compassion, no feelings for others. They are evil.

I am glad you are safe and I am proud of have you as a fellow DUer. Keep up the good work. Be strong! We are with you.

BTW, I was scheduled to fly to DC from Portland, OR on Sept. 13, 2001. Obviously, that flight did not happen and I have not had the courage to take a commercial flight ever since. Shortly after 911, I took a cross-country rail trip to DC, then drove back to Oregon. I may fly once more but to date just can't get myself to do it.

Take good care.

Tired Old Cynic

[reprobate]

109. Not manslaughter. Premeditated first degree murder and treason.

[AuntiBush]

220. Go ahead and cuss...

Sometimes it does make one feel a bit better, but after reading you're postings I wanted to extend my condolences for the loss of your co-workers. I know, since you don't like to cuss, I'll do it for you!

In honor of "Fly-arm's Co-Workers," and behalf of Fly arms search for truth I do hereby say a cuss word just for you... ;)

Bastards! Assholes! F*kers! There, I know I feel better, but certainly you don't. Don't give-up. We're behind you in finding the truth. We all want to know for our fellow American's lost that day, along with our spirits and fricked leadership!

:mad:

[Skittles]

30. ALL OF YOU PLEASE REMEMBER

AFTER THE FIRST TOWER WAS HIT planes THEY KNEW WERE HIJACKED were allowed to hit the SECOND TOWER and the PENTAGON - AND NONE OF THE PEOPLE IN THOSE BUILDINGS WERE WARNED.

[Supersedeas]

209. but the Frat Boy in Chief thought the first plane was just a bad pilot,

he saw it on TV. Even though television footage of the first tower attack was not available for several days.

Yea, must have been one of them there exxxagggerrraations.

[lostnfound]

32. This is a diversion of blame to the FAA

They share some blame in it, for sure, but the FAA is NOT the primary agency for stopping terrorist acts. If they had blown up bridges, would they be focusing our attention on warnings given to the nation's city governments? Or on school officials, if it was a school attack?

The public will not blame the Bush Administration for the FAA, and that's why the FAA is getting most of the blame.

They cut the content out of the warnings because it would have drawn more attention to just how much Condi did know or should have known.

[leesa]

229. The guy they are going to try to pin it on, who was suddenly in charge

on 9-11...his very first day on the job, is the sacrificial lamb. He was promoted and is now in charge of the airspace over New York...how ironic!


So why did his predecessor suddenly walk off the job and leave a rookie in charge minutes before the hijackings?

[lostnfound]

234. Anybody know the name of the predecessor? nt

[Virginian]

33. Think back, try to remember 2001

Bush inaugurated.
Big issue about all keyboards missing the letter "W".
Lynne Cheney says they can't move into VP home because the Gores trashed it with their rowdy parties. It needs big repairs. No pictures were taken to document the claim.
Something came up about making it more difficult to file bankruptcy.
Bush takes a break (being President is hard work)
US spy plane forced down in China.
Bush has regular schedule. 8:00 - 5:00 Exercises after lunch.
It is noted that Bush does not hold press conferences.
Someone takes shots at White House. Bush unaware, was exercising.
Pilots and spies from spy plane return home. Bush does not greet them or welcome them home, doesn't want to take their spotlight.
Rumors are circulating that Cheney is really running the show.
Bush takes vacation (Eight to Five job of being President is hard work.)

Doesn't all that seem like he was just biding his time, waiting for something to happen? When you add the statement from PNAC that they need a "Pearl Harbor," and Bush writes in his journal that Sept 11 was his "Pearl Harbor," it sure makes one believe in MIHOP.

My heart still can't grasp MIHOP. I can't believe anyone in a position of responsibility is capable of LIHOP, much less MIHOP. My brain sees the clues, but my heart won't let me believe what my brain sees.

[Bozita]

34. He certainly avoided the White House ... until after 9/11

Avoided it like the plague.

[Virginian]

55. Yes, I forgot to add that in.

He left town as often as he could. It was like he didn't want to sleep in the White House. He doesn't seem to have that aversion now.

[dbt]

40. Nice recap, Virginian!

Let me add to it that the US plane was flown back to this country in a huge RUSSIAN cargo jet. And that bu$h did, in fact, apologize to the Chinese government after bragging that he would not do so.

:freak:
dbt

[Virginian]

65. Another flip flop? Just some of my rants.

"bu$h did, in fact, apologize to the Chinese government after bragging that he would not do so."

I had forgotten that part. Thanks for reminding me.

Someone please explain to me how Bushco was able to brand John Kerry as a flip-flopper and not have it blow back at them. This has been the most flip-flopping presidency I have ever known.


Rants and other trivia:
So the Russians were able to decypher the rest of the codes that the Chinese couldn't?
They were soo worried that the Chinese would learn our "secrets" from that spy plane, but we are constantly (since Reagan) sending satelites over there to outsource launchings.

I remember a cartoon on the editorial page just after China got "the bomb." It implied that they didn't have any way to deliver it if they ever chose to use it against us. The cartoon showed a million or so Chinese citizens carrying it over here on their shoulders. Now, thanks to Reagan, they can use satelite launch technology. So that was why he was so into star wars!

Businesses outsource manufacturing over there and then get indignant when Chinese knockoffs hit our markets. How can they send the plans for a product to a country that does not recognize our copyright laws and then get mad when those laws are violated. Don't they realize they are just setting themselves up?

[spooked911]

48. Believe it. You have to remember these aren't people of responsibility.

[KoKo]

63. Yes...remember all those reports of how he was "unengaged, didn't like

to travel overnight without his "pilly" (pillow) and the comparisons with how hard Clinton worked. The conclusion was that he was just a "laid back" President, happy to "delegate."

Then...BOOM, 9/11 happens and he's everywhere. Think about how he travelled during the election and how he's all over the US pushing his Social Security Destruction. He never rests it seems, dismantling what we know of government. But, before 9/11 he seemed to be on "auto-pilot."

[info being]

184. Really, what is the difference between LIHOP and MIHOP?

It's really the same thing we're talking about: complicity.

Let's speak English: "Our government was complicit in 9/11."

The difference between LIHOP and MIHOP is simply a matter of degree of complicity.

[MellowOne]

35. Agree with those who said it was plannedTHEY WANTED 9/11 to happen

It was a setup for the war in Iraq. Which is all about the oil, no-bid contracts.

It's was years in the making.

[BrklynLiberal]

37. I will always believe that Bush and his minions allowed 9/11 to happen

They had more than enough warnings from Clarke, from the Hart/Rudman report, from the infamous August 6 PDB.
If they had raised even the slightest alarm, it could have been prevented...They wanted another Pearl Harbor, and that is what they got.
They should all be prosecuted for treason.

[EST]

101. There seems to be ample evidence (not all of in the tin foil

variety) coming out now to support your conclusions.

[bklyncowgirl]

39. Nice that they waited until after the elections to release this.

I guess this pretty much confirms what we knew all along.

[Ian David]

43. Bush personally issued AN EXECUTIVE ORDER not to release it

IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!! IMPEACH!!!!

[psychopomp]

71. Link?

I missed that, could you point me out to a link?

[spooked911]

46. The important thing here is that none of this is Bush's fault (/sarcasm)

[MellowOne]

51. Bush is dumb

But tricky enough to have others do his dirty work. He's real good at shoveling out his crap and letting them take the fall.

[SammyWinstonJack]

57. Yeah, it's all Clinton/Gore's fault

:eyes: Just ask the FReepers.

[underpants]

50. File this with the mouse DNA story last week-WE ALREADY KNEW THAT

At least we knew that the Egyptian, French, German, Russian (from Putin directly though he denies it now), Israeli (MASSAD), and English intelligence agencies were SCREAMING at everyone in the US in the summer of 2001 that something big was about to happen.

[indepat]

52. Absolutely no one could have imagined airplanes being used as missles

[Ian David]

96. Oh, imagine it they did. Many times. In fiction and in the government

"I don't think anybody could have predicted that...they would try to use an airplane as a missile, a hijacked airplane as a missile," said National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice." -CBS (05/17/02)




The FOX TV series The Lone Gunmen (X-Files spin off) airs their opening episode "Pilot" six months before 9/11 which depicts a secret U.S. government agency behind a plot to crash a Boeing 727 into the WTC via remote control and blame it on foreign terrorists in the hopes of generating a bigger military budget.

-snip-

1981 - In the beginning of John Carpenter's film Escape from New York, a terrorist hijacks Air Force One in mid air and crashes it into a NYC building just a few buildings away from the WTC.

-snip-

December 7, 1987 - The last airplane hijacking in the U.S. was a suicide hijacking. "USAir employee David Burke...

-snip-

September 12, 1994 - Frank Eugene Corder crashes a stolen Cessna airplane into the south lawn of the White House.

-snip-

1996 - U.S. officials had considered the possibility that a plane could be flown into the main stadium at the 1996 Olympics in Atlanta, Georgia.

1997 - Tom Clancy's novel Debt of Honor and follow up novel Executive Orders depicts a terrorists hijacking a plane and suicide bombing it into the Capital building obliterating the President, Congress, and the Supreme Court.



More:
http://www.kjbbn.net/911planes.htm

[Supersedeas]

221. without Flight Numbers and Seat Assignments-its just a historical document

[One_Life_To_Give]

53. People beleive what they want to

Suicide Terrorists won't crash planes into buildings and the Japs can't attack Pearl Harbor.

[spooked911]

54. Everyone-- please write letters to the NYTimes about this!

We need to show some outrage and put some fire to these sick people in the administration.

The one thing they DO care about is public opinion!

Here's mine:
[e-mail]

To the Editor---

RE: 9/11 Report Cites Many Warnings About Hijackings, By ERIC LICHTBLAU
February 10, 2005

Reading this article, it seems very much like "the dots" were connected about Al Qaeda using airplanes in suicide attacks.

This article essentially blames the FAA for 9/11. However, didn't the Bush administration set priorities for the FAA? Why didn't the Bush administration make the FAA take better safeguards against attacks?

And apart from the FAA, why didn't the Bush administration put NORAD on high alert to defend our skies from hijacked planes?

Sincerely,

[yorkiemommie1]

56. Rated a '5' on YAhoo

this will surely be freeped

[Blower]

58. IMPORTANT: I talked about this before the election--

White House Memo Leads to Sept. 11th Money Trail By Dan Spillane and Audrey Mantey, The Liberty Whistle
-At least five normally independent indicators moved in sync after Bush warned
-On Sept. 10th, instead of US citizens getting a warning, Halliburton got a contract

(SEATTLE) 09/30/04 -

...

www.ideamouth.com/politics

The White House never answered my CERTIFIED letter.

[Blower]

59. Write letters indeed! n/t

[adigal]

61. My letter to the NY times, NY Post, NY Daily News

Dear Editor:
52 warnings. What did President Bush, the FAA and Condoleeza Rice need to protect our country? A fax from Osama bin Laden giving them the time, date and flight numbers? And then to hold the facts from the citizens of this country, by Bush's Executive Order, until after the election was over, is the most corrupt act I have ever heard performed by a President of the United States.

As the wife of a NYC fireman who was permanently disabled by the World Trade Center clean-up, I want President Bush held accountable for his incompetence and his cover-up. I want Congress to hold him responsible. Since Bush could not figure out that 52 warnings about airplanes being hijacked and used in suicide missions meant that they might be hijacked and used in suicide missions, yet could figure out how to hide this fact from us, I want him removed from office.

[KoKo]

64. What will the 9/11 Widows do with this? Would seem to also give RICO

lawsuits a boost...if there are still any out there after Ellen Mariani had to give up hers.

[graphixtech]

218. New Plaintiff

The 9/11 RICO lawsuit is still very much active.
The Plaintiff has changed.


Read about Mr. William Rodriguez here:
http://www.911forthetruth.com/pages/Rodriguez.htm

"WORLD TRADE CENTER RESCUE HERO SUES
BUSH AND OTHERS UNDER RICO STATUTE,
ALLEGES WILLFUL COMPLICITY IN ATTACKS
THAT KILLED 3,000"
The full RICO complaint is available for download here:
http://www.911forthetruth.com/index.htm


"9/11 Truth: The Key to Systemic Change"

http://www.911truth.org/index.php

[Massachusetts]

91. I will be baffled once again if there isn't OUTRAGE

by the American public over this! We should be well into IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS by now.

OUR GOVERNMENT IS FAILING US! Isn't the American public paying attention to whats happening to OUR fellow citizens, OUR $$$$$, OUR country, and OUR image and role in the world? Where is the OUTRAGE?

[bluedog]

72. never believe this bunch of LIARS

bush was warned..rice..... head of security should have known what the hell warnings were our there and given to the FAA.........her job was not to go to the pigfarm and play in the haystack with bushy boy.....

This blame is no ones but bushs........................
his watch.

[RamboLiberal]

75. LIHOP - PNAC on Nightline

JACKIE JUDD

(Voice Over) The letter to Mr. Clinton, was in essence, a preview of arguments that would have a more receptive audience five years later. The Clinton White House did bomb Baghdad in 1998, after America's containment policy of Saddam laid dormant, until a Tuesday morning in September. A 76-page white paper, circulating for a year and arguing for an aggressive US foreign policy, suddenly gained new relevance.

JACKIE JUDD (CONTINUED)

(Off Camera) In the blueprint, it says, the process of transformation is likely to be a long one. Absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor. Was 9/11, your Pearl Harbor?

GARY SCHMITT

I think it was the country's Pearl Harbor. I think it was the President's Pearl Harbor.

JACKIE JUDD

(Voice Over) The Project, agitating outside and now inside the Administration, seized an opportunity after 9/11, which made war inevitable, argues Professor Ian Lustick of the University of Pennsylvania.

PROFESSOR IAN LUSTICK

Before 9/11, this group was in the position it is in but could not win over the President to this extravagant image of what foreign policy required. After 9/11, it was able to benefit from the gigantic eruption of political capital, combined with the supply of military preponderance in the hands of the President. And this small group, therefore, was able to gain direct contact and even control, now, of the White House.

JACKIE JUDD

(Voice Over) According to the book "Bush At War," by Bob Woodward, it was only 30 hours after the 9/11 attacks, that Rumsfeld asked the President, why shouldn't the US go against Iraq, not just al-Qaeda? At the Pentagon on September 13th, Wolfowitz, for the first time, alluded to that broader goal.

Will the MSM question this - hell no. After all we got Prince Charles marrying Camilla and Michael Jackson. That Bush, Cheney and the PNAC cabal MIHOP, LIHOP or just out and out were grossly incompetent is of no importance.

[tuvor]

76. Report: FAA Had 52 Pre-9/11 Warnings

WASHINGTON - The Federal Aviation Administration received repeated warnings in the months prior to Sept. 11, 2001, about al-Qaida and its desire to attack airlines, according to a previously undisclosed report by the commission that investigated the terror attacks.

A previously undisclosed report by the 9/11 commission that investigated the suicide airliner attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon detailed 52 such warnings given to FAA leaders from April to Sept. 10, 2001, about the radical Islamic terrorist group and its leader, Osama bin Laden.

The commission report, written last August, said five security warnings mentioned al-Qaida's training for hijackings and two reports concerned suicide operations not connected to aviation. However, none of the warnings pinpointed what would happen on Sept. 11.

Al Felzenberg, former spokesman for the 9/11 commission, which went out of business last summer, said the government had not completed a review of the 120-page report for declassification purposes until recently.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&e=2&u=/ap/sept_11_faa

[fertilizeonarbusto]

77. WHAT? When did this come out?n/t

[Roland99]

78. see this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1225763&mesg_id=1225763

[cthrumatrix]

79. Condi "liar" Rice said "how could they have known"...52 warnings ?????

I think that classifies as more than chatter

Don't forget the title of the PDB "Bin Laden Determined to strike Within the US"


just chatter.........

[jswordy]

81. We like to spell it Condi-LIE-zza Rice! Heheheh! n/t

[jswordy]

80. NO, NO, it was ALL THE CIA'S FAULT for NOT warning them!

Geez, when will people ever LEARN to believe exactly what Bushco tells them? Sigh...

[TahitiNut]

82. LIHOP ... It's not the "lunatic fringe" anymore.

It's been obvious from the instant the planes hit the WTC. (The only question that has ever remained is the degree to which it was MIHOP.)

[Old and In the Way]

83. This report was stuffed until after the election.

"the government had not completed a review of the 120-page report for declassification purposes until recently. "

Decoded: Bush ordered this report held from the American people until after the selection.

When does criminal incompetence become criminal facilitation of the act? While we can't get all the facts...yet, the way this administration has obstructed justice in getting 9/11 investigated and exposed tells me they are quilty in allowing this hijacking to occur.

[leveymg]

90. When does criminal incompetence become criminal facilitation of the act?

That's precisely the question I've been asking:

http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0302/S00079.htm

[Old and In the Way]

105. Excellent article!

As you pointed out, there appears to have been key individuals within the FBI and CIA who blocked the field operatives from gaining information that would have exposed and thwarted the 9/11 plot. I recall that a mid-level FBI guy named Frasca was one of those people who bottled up information on the terrorists. I don't think he was ever called totestify in front of the 9/11 commission....and, oddly enough, rather than being fired or even reprimanded, the guy gets promoted! No one is held accountable within the organizations charged with our security, but those that seem to bear some responsibility in "letting it happen" have been rewarded for their incompetence.

3,000 innocent people died on 9/11 and no justice has been served. And all the same people who failed us are still in power.

[leveymg]

256. Dave Frasca? No, Blame Cofer Black if you're going to name mid-level

officers. He was in charge of CTC - Dale Watson was his FBI liaison there. These two had the UBL files. They either passed them on, or didn't. Also, lets not forget that Tenet was briefed at least twice about the Kuala Lumpur AQ summit. Likely, Freeh, as well, but he seems to have escaped scrutiny.

The evidence indicates that surveillance ops against the 9/11 cells were part of a larger, ongoing CI/CT operation that was gathering evidence of large-scale Saudi/Gulf sheikdom financing of terrorism and nuclear proliferation. Everything -- including the safety of air passengers --may have been made secondary to maintaining operational secrecy.

Recall, both the CIA and the FBI had been penetrated by hostile powers and "friendly" allied agencies, so both agencies distrusted each other and their partners. Both had ongoing investigations --conducted without lawful warrants -- that touched on the 9/11 hijackers. When Bush refused to order the cells rolled up, everyone just threw their arms up and hoped for the best. It was explained to me that "nobody rolls anything up unless the President orders it." That explains the CYA responses during the final weeks before 9/11.

Lots of potential for lots of people to go to jail here -- but, overriding all this, there seems to have been a legitimate operational imperative to track the terrorist money trail and the nukes flowing out of Pakistan.

Ultimately, POTUS bears responsibility for his refusal to roll up the AQ cells known to be inside the US. The 8/6/01 PDB referenced them. There's sufficient evidence to indict BushCo for 3,000 counts of negligent homicide, perjury and obstruction of justice. If the jury takes the rest as mitigating circumstances and acquits, that's okay with me. Just so long as the lies stop, along with the political capitalization on fear of terrorism. A federal jury and the American people need to decide what's a just outcome in this case.

[Old and In the Way]

265. That's very interesting.

"surveillance ops against the 9/11 cells were part of a larger, ongoing CI/CT operation that was gathering evidence of large-scale Saudi/Gulf sheikdom financing of terrorism and nuclear proliferation."

If so, there's been precious little evidence that this administration has followed through with their promise to "drain the financial swamps". Everything we know about this administration's WOT before 9/11 suggests that they were de-emphasizing our fight against AQ and jumpstarting the space defense initiative.

Personally, I think this administration is so compromised with their past associations with SA and the ME, that they are perhaps the worst possible choice to be waging a WOT. Looking at the House of Bush/House of Saud connections that go back decades, I don't wonder why the younger George is unable to muster an honest, objective fight against the country where 15/19 alledged hi-jackers originated from: Saudi Arabia. Certainly, SA is now deep into the US, financially and politically....if there is a national security problem it may well be that our government is being held hostage by the Kingdom.

It doesn't surprised me in the least that Republicans have resorted to systematic election fraud. Power must be maintained at any cost because they know that a Democratic Congress will expose the corruption and treasonous actions that have been committed against this nation, not the least being to serve justice for the 3,000 who died 9/11/01.

[leveymg]

273. I don't disagree about the unfitness of this Admin to carry out WOT, but

CT/CI/counterproliferation operations of which I have written are quite real. We're learning more details about pre-9/11 events, and that is the picture that's coming clear. The better part of this was a carry over from the Clinton years, and Bushco did much to obstruct or divert them. The present Administration contributed mightily to the 9/11 attacks coming off as they did, but that's not the complete cause. There's a bigger, more complex picture.

White House obstruction pissed a lot of operations level people off, and many of them have retired or been forced out. The scapegoating of the intel community makes them nuts. They're starting to talk -- but the whole thing was so fragmented and compartmentalized that no one, except Tenet (maybe) could give a first hand account (Big Picture) of both the terrorist cells surveillance/money trail/nuke proliferation operations and Bushco's obstruction of stuff that impacted their friends in low places.

[Old and In the Way]

274. Tenet's role in this administration has always intrigued me.

There's much about him we don't understand. Like, why didn't Bush play Tenet as the scapegoat after 9/11? He was a Clinton appointee afterall and I'm sure they could have pinned the blame on him (remember, this was before the 8/6 PDB was exposed). Same thing with the "bad intel" for the run up to Iraq war. In both cases, Bush gives him public support.

I thought maybe Tenet was waiting until he left the CIA to expose Bush, but that hasn't happened....and, in fact, he gets a service medal from Bush!

Seems to me that Tenet and Bush might be mutually compromised. Both must have dirt on each other that amounts to a MAD relationship.

I agree on a bigger, more complicated picture. We've seen glimpses of the truth, but, so far, the facts don't add up to anthing that unifies a theory to describe what has transpired over the past 50 years or so.

[leveymg]

280. If Bushco Could have plausibly pinned 9/11 on Tenet, they would have done

so long ago, when the "surprise attack" story started to fall apart. They did just that with Iraq WMD, recall the "slam dunk". That tells me that Tenet didn't withhold much from Shrub about what CIA knew about the hijacking plot during the summer of 2001, which was detailed and verified from numerous sources. Therefore, as a competent gov't official, Tenet must have passed the information up to the ultimate decision-maker, the President, and obeyed the resulting order to withhold info from the FBI and FAA, even though that proved a very bad one. That's the drill. Nothing tells me that anyone deviated from SOP.

You're right about the MAD scenario. Sure Tenet has his plan and everything is documented and copies have already been delivered to key, trusted people inside and outside the gov't. Bushco are going to get what they deserve. Just wait. Bush is screwing the rank-and-file CIA, FBI and DIA at his mortal peril.

As for a unified field theorum, its in Gibbon's "Rise and Fall". Nothing has changed about the transition from republics to empires. The process is bloody and ends badly.

Hang in there. Enjoy our chat.

[Old and In the Way]

281. Likewise!

I hope you are correct about the ultimate resolution.

As the great Jimmy Cliff put it, "The Harder They Come, The Harder They Fall....one and all."

:-)

[karlrschneider]

84. But no flight numbers and seat assignments...worthless intel

:eyes:

[leveymg]

85. The Other Side of the Story is the Security Stand-down In the Last Weeks

before 9/11. There's not a word about the how and why behind that decision. Seems that everyone -- the CIA, FBI, FAA -- went into head in the sand, CYA mode after Tenet briefed Bush on August 24th about the watchlisting of the Flt. 77 hijackers, al-Midhar and al-Hazmi, who crashed into the Pentagon.

See: http://progressivetrail.org/articles/040615Levey.shtml

[Walt Starr]

86. I guess we know why Ashcroft didn't fly the airlines

:shrug:

Fuck, we've been talking about this shit for over three years. We knew what the fuck was going on and these asshats in the administration covered the shit up.

This is the smoking gun. At the very least LIHTI is a fact. They Let It Happen Through Incompetence at the VERY LEAST!

[BamaBecky]

87. Call me crazy, but I thought I heard Condi say that there were no specific

warnings......lier, lier, pants on fire!!!:crazy:

[tanyev]

97. And what is Jane Garvey, former FAA administrator,

doing now?

APCO Creates Iraq Reconstruction Task Force

Washington, D.C. (May 20, 2003) - An Iraq Reconstruction Task Force, to help existing and potential clients navigate the complicated bureaucratic terrain of contracts and subcontracts from the United States government to rebuild Iraq, was named today by APCO Worldwide, announced Margery Kraus, president and CEO of APCO.

Joining him on the task force are:
Former Administrator Jane Garvey, led the Federal Aviation Administration during a five-year term and held a number of other senior positions in both state and federal government including acting administrator of the Federal Highway Administration and director of Boston's Logan International Airport. She is a recognized leader in the transportation industry.
http://www.prfirms.org/news/spotlight/apco_reconstruction.asp

Quite a few other interesting names on that task force.

[electricmonk]

88. Don't forget Ashcroft

Quit flying commercial airlines in July 2001.

They knew alright, they knew.

[jenn1977]

114. If they knew, why would Ashcroft and whoever else

involved stop flying commercial airlines all the way back in July? I absolutely believe it was LIHOP or MIHOP, but I'm confused and would like more information as to why "they" didn't know the date the attack was planned for - 9/11. Reading through this thread, some have mentioned things like Bush staying away from the White House before 911, Ashcroft stopped flying commerical airlines in July, etc. Didn't they know the date of the attack that they either helped plan or let happen?

Like I said, I'm sold on one of the LIHOP or MIHOP thing, I'm just trying to figure out which one.

[LunaC]

130. This may sway you to the MIHOP side of the fence

Check out the link in my sig line.

[jenn1977]

145. Thanks! Would it be too annoying though, if I asked you...

why you think that Ashcroft wouldn't fly on commercial airlines beginning in July 2001 if he and "they" made-it-happen? because if they did, Ashcroft would know the attack was scheduled for septemeber 11 right? so why wouldn't he fly on commercial airlines in july? sorry, this question is just stuck in my brain right now as i'm sifting through all this. thanks for all the research you've done and the post you put together.

also, i've pretty much come to the conclusion that it was MIHOP. i'm in the middle of reading War on Freedom.

[electricmonk]

150. When I say they knew...

Mostly I mean they knew something was up involving threats to commercial aircraft. They took it seriously enough to warn their own guys but didn't bother to clue anyone else into the threat. So I never bought that whole "we never imagined they would use a plane" BS.

Here's a story from July 26 2001. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml

[LunaC]

212. The wheels were in motion

After May's pay-off to Afghanistan and June's change to national air defense, the stage was set. They knew the Big Event was coming but it's possible that the specific date was left up to Osama since there were lots of Players that had to be moved into position and no one knew exactly when that would occur. Today's news reveals that the FAA had 52 pre-9/11 warnings so the threat was circulating behind the scenes even if the public wasn't aware of it.

[jenn1977]

213. A-ha! That's kind of what I figured...

It's just amazing to me how many people were involved in at least SOME part of the puzzle and yet "they" were still able to keep a lid on it, for the most part. It's truly mind-boggling. Then again, truth is often harder to believe than fiction.

Thanks for your input.

[Old and In the Way]

233. I think it is a red herring.......not really connected to the events

of 9/11. In fact, I think it's more a case of Ashcroft wanting to travel in the style of a corporate executive and they used a trumped up excuse of threats against Ashcroft as a justification. That said, I find the Pentagon senior officiers canceling trips the day before 9/11 quite suspicious.

[jenn1977]

264. OH geez...

Everytime I blink my eyes I hear of or read of information I hadn't heard before.

[V Lee]

92. The PNAC and Rice ... don't get me started ...

They did let it happen. The evidence is overwhelming.

As the PNAC neocons wrote, a "catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor" would help them move ahead with their plan of preemptive invasions (attacks) of oil-rich Middle Eastern countries, first Iraq, then Iran, and onward. All in cooperation with their buddies Israel and Saudi Arabia.

I've also heard that sometime in July-Aug of 2001 an FBI agent reported that he was "trying to stop someone from hijacking an airplane and crashing it into the World Trade Center."

Why do you think Bush spent so much of August 2001 away from Washington, safely at his ranch? They knew something big was coming and Washington was a target.

And why did they delete 27 pages of evidence from the 9/11 Commission report that showed that members of the Saudi government financially supported some of the 9/11 hijackers? And why did the FBI block court subpoenas to talk to them?

And then there's Rice. I just about lost it when, testifying before the 9/11 Commission, she said that no one could have imagined that Al Qaeda would use planes as missiles and crash them into things. HELLO!!! EARTH TO CONDI! HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF A LITTLE THING CALLED “WORLD WAR II?” THE JAPANESE? KAMIKAZE PILOTS??? RING ANY $@#^*&$ BELLS, CONDI???

Jumpin’ Jesus on a pogo stick … I just about blew cheese puffs out my nose when she said that.

The truth is, if your memory goes back farther than your last political campaign, you’ll realize that America’s enemies have used planes as missiles and crashed them into American targets thousands of times (in WWII alone) in the past. If you’re unable to imagine that it could happen again in the future, then you’re too @%#$*& incompetent to be in a high-level government position, period!

Condi, go home and spend some time watching the History Channel, you might learn something and we’d all be safer.

[EST]

104. Unfortunately, nothing new here.

My outrage fuses have pretty well burned out. Helpless, totally powerless outrage...

[driver8]

214. I know Condi is supposed to be a very intelligent woman but...

you wouldn't know it from listening to her bumble through those hearings. What more did she need? Copies of the hijacker's tickets?

The shrub and his administration are lazy -- they did not follow up on the numerous warnings they were given. These idiots should be in jail for dereliction of duty...or stupidity.

This is outrageous. If this happened on Clinton's watch...the rethugs would have strung him from a tree on the Whitehouse lawn.

[leesa]

231. She is lying because she was involved. We don't know WHO did 9-11

We only know who BushCo wants us to believe did 9-11. No investigation was ever conducted.

[Plato_Archanes]

94. What will the Neocon men going to say now?

I think we need to start the argument that 9/11 would not have occurred under a Gore presidency. Yes I know that many have been saying that, but it has not been loud enough. Under Gore, we would have still had Richard Clark in charge of Counter terrorism, and he would have not been ignored. We need to point out that Bush dropped the ball, did not read the PDB, and Condi was too engrossed with Russia and Putin. Remember, we knew GW had an intelligence problem during the 2000 election. Remember, he had never been outside of the US except partying in Mexico. They (as in them) will continue to revise history unless we keep the conversation on track. The latest NYTtimes article is further proof that they had their heads up their ass during 2001.

Instead it seems that many at the DU are focused on claiming that Gore and then Kerry purposely gave the election to Bush. We have plenty of proof that Bush Jr. is an idiot, and still we are talking about how stupid Kerry is, and how much we like Kucinich. Get with the program. 9/11 happened because the Republicans want war. They ignored terrorism in the US mainland because they wanted to get hit in order to justify a war. This was not a conspiracy, and they did not blow up the WTC. They win when we are at war, and they will start more wars so they can win again. They won the last election because they were at war (and cheated). We do not have to bring up the cheating because that does not help us. We need to reiterate that they planned on going to war even before 9/11, and wanted 9/11 in order to justify their plans. This latest article gives us another opportunity to remind the voters that Bushes people dropped the ball while he was on vacation. And, they may have dropped the ball on purpose in order to justify their plan. This is what we want Hannity and O’Reilly to be talking about, not private-personal accounts. Social insecurity is a smoke–screen to keep us in a fog. If we want to be heard through the smoke, we need to all yell the same thing, at the same time. Coordinating our efforts should be what this website is about. Instead it sounds like a big rumor mill at times.

Sorry to be so wordy, but this is my first post.

[Name removed]

98. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Plato_Archanes]

108. Why is this about Kerry and not Bush?

Another article blaming Kerry for 9/11. I don't know why anyone who is really a democrat (or an American) would post this trash on this website. This website is another conservative rant site. Look at the links, the ads and the editorials. They are trying to blame 9/11 on Kerry. Why not Ghandi and Roosevelt for that matter. The posters claim that "there is enough blame to go around" is an attempt to defuse the actual fact that George Bush was in charge (technically) when the US Government allowed 9/11 to occur. Kerry did not have access to the PDB, Bush did. The Busk has to stop somewhere. If posters post links from conservative propaganda machines and claim that we should read them as true, they should be banned.

[Name removed]

118. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

120. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[spooked911]

125. welcome to DU!!!!

:party: :toast:

[Name removed]

128. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Chelsea Patriot]

143. Wow!! A Under-50-Post Each Flame Fest!!!!!

Complete with accusations of being a Freeper!!

I've never seen that before here.

Welcome to DU!

[Name removed]

157. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[leesa]

230. Why do you support this traitorous Bush?

[TNOE]

110. Kerry WASN'T THE FREAKING PRESIDENT

WordNetDaily - Give me a fucking break. Was Kerry to get the Daily Briefings?? Aplogists and fools - this administration is laughing at your goose stepping in line with them. Stupidity of some Americans is what has let them get away with murdering their own citizens to get their war on - and make a ton of money doing it - WE'RE BEING ROBBED HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Name removed]

131. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TNOE]

140. Hey - YOU are getting robbed too

Troll - the $9 billion missing from Iraq - $12 TRILLION missing from the Pentagon - Bush is robbing SS to pay for this Iraq war - which Halliburton has been the biggest beneficiary - do you read? Do you know anything?? The parents of soldiers who've lost their sons and daughters have been robbed of more than just money.

Why don't you learn about a little something before you make such ignorant posts? Holding Kerry responsible is the most assinine thing I think I have ever heard - Republicans - the supposed party of personal responsibility - but yet so far everything has been Clinton or Kerry's fault. None of Bush's. Hopefully soon you will find out some day how completely foolish you've been - you and yours who support this criminal administration.

Bush's job as President is to PROTECT THIS COUNTRY. HE AND HIS ADMINISTRATION and no one else failed miserably on that day - and should be fired for incompetence if not treason. That is what we pay our tax dollars for. This whole war on "terrorism" is one big scam and the stupid Americans have fallen for it - just like the stupid Germans did for Hitler's Reichtag.

Did you know there were war games - SPECIFICALLY for airlines flying into buildings and yet Condi said NO ONE could have supsected? Is she the world's biggest liar - or retarded?

Did you know Bush Sr. was meeting with the Bin Laden Family on 9/11?

Did you know that Marvin Bush was in charge of the security for the WTC?

Did you know that NUMEROUS warning had come from all over the world in the months leading up to 9/11? AND WERE IGNORED?

People like you who put your party before your country deserve nothing. People like you are are so completely uncurious to get to the truth and make excuses are pathetic excuses for a human being. Do yourself a favor and read up a little on 9/11. The message will become painfully clear - who is at fault and who should be held fully responsible.

Here is only a handful of the TONS of websites to get you started. You need to smarten up - your country is at stake.
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/foreignwarnings.html

BUSH SR MET WITH BIN LADEN ON 9/11

http://www.propagandamatrix.com/041203metwithbinladen.html
http://www.davidicke.com/icke/index1c.html

INVESTIGATION FALLING APART
http://www.rense.com/general46/911V.HTM

CONFIRMATION OF 9/11 GAME
http://new.globalfreepress.com/article.pl?sid=03/12/05/2024242

CONDI DOESN’T WANT TO TESTIFY UNDER OATH
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,565974,00.html

EX NAVY SECRETARY SKEPTICAL

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/7546164.htm

EYEWITNESS ACCOUNTS OF EXPLOSIONS
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/eyewitness.html

INSURANCE SCAM

http://globalresearch.ca/articles/WTC312A.html

TERRORISM CLAUSE IN WTC

http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200109/msg00162.html

WTC - HISTORY
http://www.serendipity.li/wot/7wtc.html

SEPTEMBER 10

Newseek journalists Evan Thomas and Mark Hosenball reported on Septemberm24, 2001 that a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for September 11, 2001, apparently because of security concerns. Newsweek removed the story from the internet but you can read the transcript at the url below. Here is the relevant excerpt....
"On Sept. 10, NEWSWEEK has learned, a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns." (See yellow highlighted section)
http://www.freepressinternational.com/sept10.html

SEPTEMBER 10 – THE WAR ON WASTE
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/01/29/eveningnews/main325985.shtml


MARVIN BUSH
http://anderson.ath.cx:8000/911/hj05.html

STOCK OPTION TRADING
http://www.rense.com/general46/911.html

PRIOR WTC FLIGHTS
http://xymphora.blogspot.com/2003_12_01_xymphora_archive.html#107284533382009522

BUSH FAMILY MACHINISMS
http://www.indybay.org/news/2002/11/1546689.php

http://www.veteransforcommonsense.org/newsArticle.asp?id=1477

http://www.beachnet.com/~hoffman/Bush.html

[Bethany Rockafella]

111. You should get flamed. World Net Daily is a joke!

[Name removed]

117. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Plato_Archanes]

119. The source is a joke.

It seems that this post is about pissing off the DU. This kind of website, and this kind of post is designed to waste our time and get us to ague among ourselves. Rebel_blogger does not seem to be a democrat or a progressive and should be banned for Trolling to disrupt our conversation :puke:

[Name removed]

122. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cosmicdot]

187. hopefully, you're a yellow dog Democrat

many folks were born and raised Southern Democrats, only to later become Republicans

[Old and In the Way]

115. What Kerry could have done with the information is debatable.

How does Mr. Sullivan know that Kerry didn't pass on the information?

What I do know is that Bush/Cheney shitcanned the bi-partisan Hart-Rudman report on Terrorism that addressed US airport security. They also took subs off station in the Persian Gulf that were tasked with hitting AQ training camps. They took the Predator surveillance aircraft out of service. They mentioned AQ specifically only once in 9 months prior to 9/11. Bush ignored the 8/6/01 CIA PDB paper that said an AQ attack on US targets was imminent. But they were too busy planning the Iraqi invasion which was being done under the cover of Cheney's Energy Task Force. That's why they won't release the meeting minutes. Combine this with the PNAC observation that a Pearl Harbor type event was needed to get the war for oil underway, it makes sense to me that this administration had their reason to let this attack happen.

Yeah, Kerry's responsible for not stopping the 9/11 attacks, because this administration is not responsible for anything it does.

Do you remember who was in charge of our government on 9/11/01? Hint: It wasn't Kerry.

In looking for more info on Sullivan, I found this article which I think is interesting with regards to how those people in charge of airport security on 9/11 have been rewarded for their failure. This has been a curiously consistant consistant theme in all government agencies-

http://www.american-reporter.com/2,561W/604.html


The reassignments of these two officials may represent a pattern of inertia following 9/11, the experts suggest. In what Sullivan and other former red team members freely characterize as administrative inertia and a cult of in-crowd self-protection at best, and a cover-up at worst, almost every individual public official in a position of responsibility before 9-11 is still in one afterward, two years later.

Marcus Arroyo, for instance, was manager of the FAA's Eastern Region Security Division, which provided regulatory oversight of airports and airlines including Dulles and Newark, where the other two jumbo jets were hijacked. Arroyo is now the new Transportation Security Administration's Federal Security Director at Newark Airport.

Also, the FAA Security official in charge of Dulles Airport on 9/11, Mark Randol, was transferred out of Dulles shortly thereafter. Randol is now the TSA's Federal Security Director at Missoula International Airport, Mont. Arroyo's duties as Division Manager also included supervising Randol as Security Manager at Dulles.

"This is an interesting tale of not only a lack of accountability, but of rewarding failure," Sullivan sums up.

The story goes well beyond the East Coast, he says. However, Sullivan's focus is on the Logan, Newark and Dulles airports because they were the sites of the skyjacking of four jumbo jets used in the attacks. As he points out, none of the four people chiefly responsible for aviation security at these most sensitive sites have been held accountable. He is dismissive of claims that the personnel information is particularly sensitive.

"The purpose of sensitive security information, of keeping security information secret, is to protect national security," Sullivan said. "The purpose of secrecy is not, should not be, to protect FAA or other agency incompetence or to protect government incompetence."

[bunkerbuster1]

99. Great first post. Welcome.

And I agree heartily. We should've been KNEECAPPING that prick on 9/11 in 2004, but it's never too late to correct a mistake.

[underpants]

103. They weren't told the flight numbers and seat numbers

Great post.

[EST]

106. Welcome to DU!

Where have you been?

[keopeli]

235. Welcome to DU, Plato_Archanes!

[Southern Dem 2005]

113. You know, if someone said Bush was behind the JFK and

King assassinations people on here would probably accept it as true. Get a grip.

[Rebel_blogger]

116. That was my point ...

People around here are too quick to ignore anything that doesn't "fit". My point was that there is blame enough to go around. AND to the person who said KERRY WASN'T THE PRESIDENT. Well, he was asking to be THE PRESIDENT, wasn't he? Also, he was on the Senate Intelligence Committee and they don't get their information directly from the PRESIDENT. They have direct access to the CIA.

Go ahead and call me a Freeper Troll, but pointing out that there was failure all around doesn't make it so.

[Name removed]

124. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Rebel_blogger]

127. Ban me if you will, but that doesn't make my point any less valid

It will just mean you're closed minded and don't want to consider anything other than what you've already decided is so.

And NO, Bush's intel came from a wide variety of sources. I know this from a personal perspective, not your assumption.

The Congressional intel committees have access to ANY intel that the goverment gathers.

And by the way, your subject is very telling ... "please don't answer". Obvious you've made up your mind. Don't let any other facts get in the way, huh?

[TNOE]

144. Bwaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

So by your assinine logic - ANYBODY who was asking to be the President or running for the Presidency is or should be MORE responsible than the actual President. So I'll go along with you and hold every single memember of the Senate Intelligence Committee responsible - and put them on trial - and let's see where the truth falls? I'm up for that - and my money is on Bush/Cheney/Rice/Wolfowitz, Pearle and Bush Sr.

[Rebel_blogger]

163. You'd (that's short for YOU WOULD) loose your money.

You seem to be doing a lot of assuming.

[agincourt]

236. If they did not pay any attention to Richard Clarke,

whom worked in the Bush administration and previous ones all they way back to Reagen, they certainly would not listen to John Kerry. Bush is the one who could have prevented 9-11 not Kerry. If a successful towers collapse had occured in 1993, we certainly would not have heard of "blame to go around". We would have heard "see what you get when you elect a pot-smoking, skirt chasing, draft dodging, hedonist" 24-7 on every news channel. Kerry went through the right channels, no one listened.

[Bridget Burke]

246. Bush, Senior, was in Dallas on November 11, 1963

He's always said he can't remember where he was on that day.

I was in the school library when I heard & remember it clearly.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

283. There is DVD out JFKII. It links Bush Sr. with JFKs assassination.

Interesting information in it.

[Al-CIAda]

121. 9-11=Inside Job...PNAC's 'New Pearl Harbor' -eom

[outrage]

123. This passage speaks volumes to me...

The report, completed last August, said officials appeared more concerned with reducing airline congestion, lessening delays, and easing airlines' financial woes than deterring a terrorist attack.
Ah, what a lovely example of those good ol’ Republican values of profit before people. God bless ‘em.

[Supersedeas]

211. the volume couldn't be louder...but, what how this point is muffled by MSM

[Lloyd Christmas]

129. Man I hope this story, in some way, puts bush* on a hotseat.

All the failings of the current administration and they just seem to get away with anything.

I don't get it.

[JoMama49]

133. I actually heard this on this morning's CBS news -- first time

I've heard anything like this on the MSM! Of course, at the end, they repeated Condi's mantra about there not being any "specific" details for them to figure out.

[oasis]

132. The Bush Admisistration blocked this report for 5 months. Rove/elections.

Why is Rove called a political genius when he has the power of the executive office to suppress documents?

Some would say Hitler was a genius because he was able to control the minds of the German people.

[napi21]

136. I heard this on cspan this AM. Times reporter got the info from

some documents library. There was a LOT redacted, but he was able to gleen this info from them anyway.

WH still hasn't actually released the whole unredacted doc!

When the 911 Comm. released their report, you could hear them hedging about not being totally happy with some things that were still kept secret.

Let's hope this is the tip of a very large iceberg.

[Rebel_blogger]

137. It won't be the tip of the iceberg because too many ...

other people were aware. This is a failure of the WHOLE government, not just a specific administration. Why isn't this obvious? I'm not trying to be disruptive, just trying to point out that these intel failures have gone back for many years, starting in the Carter Administration, through Reagan's admin, into Clinton's admin and up to the present day. Radical Muslims declared war on the US over 25 years ago. We just didn't know it. To make this a partisan issue will just continue to make us LESS SAFE. I know I know ... Bush's war in Iraq makes us less safe. But that's true in this instance. Remember, the hostages in Iran? That was under Carter. Remember the Marine barracks in Beirut? That was under Reagan. Remember the Embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania? Those were under Clinton.

[napi21]

141. I don't disagree with you. It's not a partisan issue, but...

the info released today in the Times was about info that was apparently ignored by a lot of people. This was early 2001. I'm not trying to make it partisan, I don't know for sure that Shrub was told about these warnings or not. My point is, the heads of the organizations involved, FAA, NSA, FBI, CIA, SHOULD have made the Pres, & VP aware of the threats! If they didn't, they should pay a price for failurs to do their job! If they did, then the Pres & VP should pay a bigger price, because they are supposed to be in charge!

I just want the whole story reported. Who did or didn't do what? Then let the chips fall where they may!

[Rebel_blogger]

142. Reading the posts earlier, it was very partisan.

And I was being accused of being a troll because I was pointing out that other elected officials had been warned. If we're too quick to forgive Democrats for failures, how can we be taken seriously when we're demanding accountability on the part of Republicans. (and sorry, I won't call them repugs, repukes, etc because name calling is childish and weakens an argument).

[MsMagnificent]

146. There's a big difference between Accountability and Forgiveness

they're on opposite ends of a time line.

However, I will wholeheartedly agree that what is good for one party definitely holds true for the other.

I have NEVER supported the Dem's whenever they tried to whitewash some very bad decisions.
The Reprobates , on the other hand... heck, to keep track you'd need an atomic-powered calculator!


--and my 'name calling' is neither childish nor weakening... it's the perfect word for what that party has become.

[Rebel_blogger]

147. I disagree

There shouldn't been forgiveness WITHOUT accountability. They're not opposite ends of a time line. They're serial.

I still hold to my original statement about name calling. It weakens the argument in the eyes of a neutral party. And neutral parties are who we're going to have to appeal to in the next elections if we're going to win. Besides, assigning a pejorative name to someone is subjective and again weakens the objectivity of the argument.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

153. not everyone here calls names

welcome to DU, which is a very partisan message board. people often vent here. I don't believe DU is regarded by it's members as PR mouth piece for the Democratic party, it's called the Democratic Underground for a reason.

i prefer not to "name call" myself, but many here feel completely different. my advice would be to let it go as again, DU is a place where many people come to simply vent. there are all types of people here for all types of reasons. people are going to name call on DU, get used to it. i am not saying you are wrong, i am just saying you can save your keystrokes, people have different reasons for being here and all those reasons are not going to mesh into one polished PR masterpiece.

[Rebel_blogger]

173. Thanks for the welcome, Sheepy.

I've found myself being drawn into an argument I wouldn't have otherwise had. I'm not trying to defend the Bush Administration. I'm merely trying to point out that there was information spread around before 9/11 and lots more could have been done about it. However, just yelling "BUSH DID IT" gets us no where. Independents and Republicans tune it out.

[stray cat]

176. Hi Rebelblogger - welcome to DU

[Rebel_blogger]

186. THANKS dmordue!

I really didn't intend to be disruptive. REALLY. I was merely trying to make a point and then I got attacked. Accused of being a FREEPER TROLL, a lickspittle and bootlicker, and told I didn't have First Amendment rights.

[MsMagnificent]

165. Timeline:

Demand Accountability --> Investigate issue --> Separate Fact from Lies --> Reach logical conclusion based on Truths alone --> Disseminate results to Public --> Conclude (whether no 'punishment', offender reveal truth and ask for forgiveness, sanctions, corporal legal or other punishment, etc) --> Forgive

Each step builds on the previous. Forgiveness is positively correlated with how candid the offender is. False/incomplete apology &/or regret do not merit forgiveness.


Of course you're entitled to your own opinion -- but I shall always contend Reprobate is FAR from 'childish' -- it describes them, their words and their actions to a 'T'. It is an actual word, it is not slang nor is it crude. I do not see how the use of that word is weakening to any argument.


***Edit: fixed typo

[stray cat]

179. Our government failed to imagine or protect against 9-11

However, the buck stops at the person or people at the top or at least it should. As Bush said during the debates: a senator only has one vote; the president has the ultimate vote and the final say. I agree with Bush that ultimately the failure lies with the president and his administration.

Also, the administration actively prevented the report from being released prior to the election eventhough it was ready in June. I also heard senators pressing for it to be released but again the president had the power to prevent it.

[Beetwasher]

148. Bull-Fucking-Shit

Many people did their job properly and were totally ignored:

Sybil Edmunds
Colleen Rowley
John O'Neill
Richard Clarke
Phoenix Memo
Etc.

The evidence mounts and mounts and mounts that it WASN'T a gov't wide failure. It was a very specific ADMINISTRATION failure. This admin. absolutely REFUSED (for whatever reason) to listen to all the people screaming about an upcoming terror attack.

And remember, Moussaoui? He was in CUSTODY.

Additionally, after the first plane hit the first tower, it is UNCONSCIONABLE that nothing was done when they knew, absolutely that 3 other planes were hijacked and in the air.

Take your propoganda and shove it somewhere damp.

[Rebel_blogger]

149. Wow, what an articulate and logical argument!!!!!

Thank you for sharing your insightful thoughts.

And my response is pppsssssssstttttttttttt.

I mean really, how long are we going to be taken seriously if the answer to every problem is BUSH! BUSH! BUSH!?

Global warming = BUSH!
Famine = BUSH!
War = BUSH!
Bad economy = BUSH!
Child rape = BUSH!
Flu epidemic = BUSH!
I stubbed my toe = BUSH!

People start tuning it out after a while, and the next set of elections are going to be fruitless.

[EST]

151. As a rule, we are far too well informed

Here to accept such indictments.(S)

[Rebel_blogger]

152. Well informed from a single perspective. Need to have a ...

balanced perspective (no, I'm not saying Fair and Balanced at risk of being accused of being a Faux watcher).

Why was I flamed for contending that we should be willing to take an honest look at the failures of Democrats? Until we're willing to do that, we won't be taken seriously be the Independents and DEFINITELY not the Republicans.

[TNOE]

154. You still here?

Noticed you haven't replied to any of my posts in response to yours. No biggie - you CAN'T. The Republicans are the ones in power - so the buck starts with them. If it leads to some Democrats being charged in conlusion with them - so be it. But WHO benefited? Certainly not Al Gore, certainly not John Kerry - but CERTAINLY Bush/Cheney et al - they are the ones who are profiting from it.

As in the Watergate days - FOLLOW THE MONEY?

WHO MADE THE MONEY FROM THE STOCK TRADES ON 9/10 AND 9/11? ONE GUESS. Don't hear much about that story anymore do we? Explain that.

So zealous to blame it on the Democrats and want to go after them are you - if this would have happened under Clinton's watch - there would be a LOUD LONG ROAR for a special prosecutor and probably a billion dollar investigation to get to the bottom of it - wouldn't you imagine? Or are special prosecutors and investigations only for getting a blow job while in office?

[Rebel_blogger]

156. Curious as to why you started your post with "Troll"?

Is someone who has a different point of view a troll?

And pointing me to a bunch of websites doesn't constitute an argument. So you're good a copying and pasting. It merely shows that you're able to regurgitate stuff.

(AND BY THE WAY ... it DID happen under Clinton's watch. Do you not remember the Embassies and the USS Cole? Would you like a link to the websites?)

[TNOE]

159. God your pathetic -

go back to Right Nation or FreeRepublic or where ever you came from - or better yet - its okay with me that you stay - maybe you will learn something - but you strike me as not curious enough and way too closed minded - or maybe you just can't think logically enough.

A troll - if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck and acts like a duck - its a duck you can be sure - or a troll in your case.

Those websites I pointed you to are chock full of investigative documentation - something you are apparently very unfamilier with. Not only can I cut and paste - I can read and study too.

Yes things happened under Clinton's watch and Johnson's watch and Roosevelt's watch and Bush the 1st - etc, etc. - THINGS DO HAPPEN - BUT

9/11 HAPPENED ON BUSH'S WATCH. HE SAID HE WOULD HAVE MOVED HEAVEN & EARTH HAD HE KNOWN - WELL OBVIOUSLY HE KNEW OR SHOULD HAVE HAD A VERY GOOD INKLING.... so is your excuse he was just too stupid to listen or hear or to put the dots together? Is that acceptable in a commander and chief - COMPLETE STUPIDITY. Bush is as uncurious as you. No wonder you support the man.

[Rebel_blogger]

161. You're going to educate me?

First, let's start with the difference between YOUR and YOU'RE.

Yes, I can read. I can study. I can actually form thoughts and ideas completely on my own. I don't need other people to do it for me. It's great fun. You should try it.

[TNOE]

167. I'm not writing a book dude

so no reason to edit - I've got way more important things to do than spell check - I'm multi-tasking in a big way - so I no worry about spelling and you shouldn't either.......... (oh and the poor english - a joke) - deal with the subject matter why don't you.

[Name removed]

172. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MsMagnificent]

178. Oh - "subject matter" is grammar too? *sheesh*

[Beetwasher]

155. Actually, It Was

I gave you a list of very specific people who had very specific warnings. They were ignored by Bush's hand picked lackeys.

If you can't see how that's Bush's responsibility you're either a trememendous moron or a bootlicking toadie. Your choice.

[Name removed]

160. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

162. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Rebel_blogger]

168. You're wrong, you just can't admit it.

The information that other planes had been hi-jacked had not been relayed to the military, until it was too late. Once they had that information, F-16s were scambled from Langley (did you forget that?). And I can imagine the screaming and moaning that you'd be doing now if they HAD gotten there sooner. BUSH ORDERS SHOOT DOWN OF UNARMED AIRLINER.

And if Clarke was such a great asset, why did he recommend to Clinton that they NOT accept the hand over of Bin Laden? Please answer that?

And I wonder, for someone who is so well informed and educated, is the profanity necessary or is that the only way you know how to express yourself?

[Beetwasher]

171. Colleen Rowley, Sybil Edmunds, Zacharias Moussaoui

Richard Clarke and the list of warnings goes on.

Man, it must suck being a lickspittle and bootlicker for incompetent criminals. Making excuses for their crimes and incompetence is not easy. But keep trying!

I will not be baited by your strawman bullshit. They had LOADS of specific warnings and DID NOTHING!!! 3 planes in the air and THEY DID NOTHING. WARNED NO ONE. EVACUATED NO ONE. You can't refute that so you don't even try. You just post insane gobbledygoodk blaming Clinton. How droll.

How pathetic.

[Rebel_blogger]

174. Hmmm ... lickspittle and bootlicker.

Wow, that really hurts.

Ok, we'll do it your way. Who should they have notified? How many buildings should they have evacuated? And which buildings?

And please, from your obvious legal expertise, are the legal charges you're speaking of?

[Beetwasher]

175. Hmmm, Let's See, Mr. Counterintel Expert (LOL!)

How about the second tower for starters? Duh.

How about, before the hijackings, considering all the warnings, putting airports on alert. Duh.

For a counterintel person (LOL!), you're pretty unimaginative...

Here's one for you:

August 6th PDB "BIN LADEN DETERMINED TO STRIKE IN THE US"

Not specific enough for you I guess. No seat numbers.

[Rebel_blogger]

182. Ok, show me where in "Bin Laden Detemined to Strike in the US" ...

that it mentions airliners?

So, you're saying we should have evacuated the towers BEFORE the planes hit? Because, as I remember, firefighters were already in the buildings and trying to get people out.

Also, please share with me the "classified memo" you've got that said that the other plane was going to hit the other tower.

Can you tell me, how quickly all aircraft in the US were grounded once the hi-jackings occured?

[Name removed]

188. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Rebel_blogger]

189. Wow, you really get worked up don't you?

You've truly educated me. You truly have a grasp of the important and relevant issues concerning 9/11. Or at least, all that's available on the internet, which we both know is totatlly reliable. As well, as a firm grasp of how to use profanity effectively in a sentence.

Guess I should do my homework before I come here again, huh?

[Name removed]

190. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

192. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

194. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

195. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

180. hmm.. maybe if the people in tower 2 had known of a terrorist plot

to plow planes in the buildings, maybe those people would not have stayed put.

edit: funny how my post ended up alot like the one above, we posted at the same time, honest! :D

[TNOE]

164. Yea right - we all believe you

No really, we do - pfffftttttt - counter intelligence - come on - these guys have got to be way smarter than you. Hopefully anyway - if not this country really is screwed.
But thanks for the laugh.

[Rebel_blogger]

170. Good tactic ... question the messenger's qualifications.

Other than being able to copy and paste, what are yours as they relate to counter-intelligence? I'm all ears if you've got the experience.

[stray cat]

200. I will deny Sudan offered up Bin Laden to Clinton.

I've seen reports saying that rumor isn't credible. I would be willing to change my mind if the sources are nonpartisan and reliable. However, I presently think that was just another avert the blame smear campaign repeated enough times to appear credible.

[sonicx]

204. Definitely not credible...

Media Matters is your friend. :)

http://mediamatters.org/items/200407230005

[UCSBLiberalCat53]

278. Just an observation

It seems that which you mention above is the strategy of the right-wingers. Just replace Bush with Clinton.

[MsMagnificent]

177. The Facts

--the incoming Bush cabinet was informed by the outgoing Clinton administration that Terrorism, especially terrorism from OSAMA BIN LADEN was the primary and most dangerous threat to the U.S.

Bush, et al, ignored it.

--George Tenet tried in every way to get the Bush administration to comprehend the danger, to at least recognize it.

Bush, et al, ignored him.

--the "Terrorism Czar" tried in every way to get the Bush administration to comprehend the danger, to DO something -- even TALK about it.

Bush ignored it, then demoted Clark, a brilliant, worthwhile and remarkable survivor of FOUR, both Rep. & Dem., administrations (and a super-hawk if there ever was one!) to where he could only report to lackey's, not the principles.
They didn't want to hear it.

--John Ashcroft's daily briefings constantly tried to stress in every way the terrorism danger and to get him to comprehend it, to DO something, ANYTHING!

Ashcroft 'didn't want to hear about it anymore' and demanded that he no longer be briefed on terrorism; and that the briefing, for all of the problems of the entire United States, be less than ONE PAGE


When Clinton attacked bin Laden the Reprobates had a SCREAMING fit, howling it was unnecessary, a feint, that Clinton was 'Wagging the Dog' etc etc etc


Need I go on? ...because I have MANY more examples.
Sadly.
On and on and on.


Your argument holds as much water as a sieve.

[Rebel_blogger]

181. I asked for YOUR (not you're) personal experience and qualifications.

You questioned mine. I asked for yours.

Many of those you cited, had been in heavy CYA mode after 9/11. We only have their word for it.

You ignored my question about why Clarke, if we was the "Terrorism Czar" advised Clinton to not accept the handover of Bin Laden. And please remind me, when did we attack Bin Laden?

[MsMagnificent]

191. You are confused - take a break dude

You just go on and on -- doesn't matter if it's to the wrong person, or if it makes any sense, or if it's ill informed or biased... you gotta fight it.

You never requested MY personal experience.

The grammar you so condescendingly corrected was NOT MINE.

You never asked ME about Clarke advising Clinton.

You know full well when we attacked bin Laden -- and I dare say if Clinton DIDN'T attack him then we'd be hearing the WHINING of the Reprobates to this very day!

CLINTON-DID-IT!
CLINTON-DID-IT!
CLINTON-DID-IT! = Reprobate lesson on Accountability

You all act like spoiled children throwing tantrums and pointing at the kid next to you when in fact the urine puddle is under your own desk, beneath your own feet, and the only kid whose pants are wet ARE YOUR OWN.

Instead of sniveling, whining brats isn't it time TO GROW UP AND BECOME REAL MEN AND WOMEN? *YEESH*

[Rebel_blogger]

199. Don't call me dude ...

I apolgize if I misdirected a post to you. I've been attacked from all sides.

And, I never said "CLINTON DID IT". I merely pointed out that there were failures on the part of PAST and PRESENT administrations. Please show me where I said "CLINTON DID IT."

And no, I don't recall that we did, in fact, attack Bin Laden during the Clinton Administration. And if we did, using the same logic as has been used in Iraq, when had he attacked us first?

In reference to your "You all act like spoiled children throwing tantrums .. ", who is the ALL you're refering to?

[sonicx]

205. "And if we did, using the same logic as has been used in Iraq"

"when had he attacked us first?"

Saddam wasn't a threat to the US.

[stray cat]

193. I've heard the rumor of handing over Bin Laden but it appears to be false.

I have also heard it denied and have never seen any actual prove. The evidence seems to be that its a "blame Clinton" reflex that has no real basis in reality. I believed the accusation was true for awhile until I checked it out and decided their was no "handover" opportunity. I did find out that Clinton was the first to authorize the assasination of Bin Laden.

[sonicx]

201. The Clinton/Sudan story was debunked a long time ago...

http://mediamatters.org/items/200407230005

On July 20, ABC radio host Sean Hannity thrice repeated the false claim that former President Bill Clinton refused a 1996 offer from Sudan to hand Osama bin Laden over to the United States. Hannity has previously propagated this claim, for which the 9-11 Commission found "no reliable evidence to support."

As Media Matters for America has noted, the false claim originated in an August 11, 2002, article on right-wing news website NewsMax.com that distorted a statement Clinton made on February 15, 2002. While addressing the Long Island Association's annual luncheon, Clinton said he "pleaded with the Saudis" to accept Sudan's offer to hand bin Laden over to Saudi Arabia. Sudan never offered bin Laden to the United States, and Clinton did not admit to the Sudan offer in that speech or anywhere else. (Clinton's statements are posted here).

snip

The "evidence" to which Hannity referred is the 9-11 Commission report's statement: "ormer Sudanese officials claim that Sudan offered to expel Bin Ladin to the United States." But the report immediately continued: "Clinton administration officials deny ever receiving such an offer. We have not found any reliable evidence to support the Sudanese claim." Hannity, therefore, endorsed the claims of former officials of Sudan -- a country that the U.S. Department of State has designated as a state sponsor of terrorism every year since 1993 -- rather than the testimony of Clinton administration officials and the findings of the 9-11 Commission.

While Hannity had asserted on his radio program that the 9-11 Commission had "gathered" evidence "backing up the allegation" that Clinton had refused an offer for bin Laden, two days later -- on FOX News Channel's Hannity & Colmes -- he claimed the commission had "ignored" the allegation. Referring to Clinton's 2002 address to the Long Island Association, Hannity said: "oesn't that seem to validate the idea that the Sudan in fact did offer us bin Laden and we passed on him and that the commission ignored that? Are they not ignoring one of the most important failures of our intelligence leading up to this attack?"

snip

[Old and In the Way]

223. Remember the 8 year Inquisition of Clinton and his impeachment

for lying about sex? How about we get George Bush under oath with an " independent" prosecuter and ask him a few questions.

3,000 Americans and guests died because Bush, for whatever reason, did not do his job. Not Kerry, not any Democrat. Why do you think Kerry had any power to change anything at Logan? How do you know that, like every other warning Bush got, that this was ignored as well?

And you can bet that this Republican Party would have tried and sentenced Clinton to a hanging in downtown Washington, DC with FOX and CNN providing live coverage within a month of 9/11 if it had happened under his watch.

Do yourself a favor, get educated. Read up on what was really going down in 1979 when the 1st Bush first started selling this country down the drain by brokering cheap oil with the House of Saud. He was/is bought and paid for by big oil and the House of Saud. He gave us "Morning in America", he took down the Dept. of Energy and Carter's attempts to get us a diversified energy policy - it was the Big Oil Republicans who sold this country down the tubes. Remember, "Arms for Hostages"? Bush made a deal with the Iranians to hold the hostages (already in captivity for 400+ days) so they could use this against Carter in the '80 election. We're shedding American blood and treasure in Iraq now because of the Republican sell-out that started 30 years ago.

Stop being an apologist for these criminals.

[demo dutch]

169. Oh well.. half of the country voted for them anyway eventhough the report

has been out for 6 months, and our Senators confirmed Condi despite the "memo" whose content she doesn't remember! No one get held accountable in this administration

[MsMagnificent]

183. Republicans be held accountable?! HERESY!

Accountability is, like boo'ing at a SOTU speech, only pertinent to DEMOCRATS don't you know?
:crazy:

Geez, EVERYONE knows THAT!
You must be a commie :P


/sarcasm

[stray cat]

197. However, the report released 6 months ago was incomplete.

Bush prevented the full disclosure of this part of the report that was ready in June. I remember senators asking for it to be released months ago and Bush blocked it. Whats the criminal charge - obstruction of justice.

[Rebel_blogger]

206. Well, as you can see from my original post ...

I'm now dealing with the second shift. I doubt that I'll be allowed back as I'm sure to be banned as a FREEPER TROLL for my heresy. However, I'm being honest in saying that my original intent was to make a point, for which I was attacked.

Good night, ya'll.

[sonicx]

207. not a good idea to repeat debunked propaganda...

like the fake Clinton/Sudan story if you want to be taken seriously.

[TNOE]

210. If YOUR wish is to be enlightened

and if YOUR'RE serious - which I highly doubt -

then I'll give you just one site to read:

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/essay.jsp?article=essayairdefense


THIS HAS BEEN A VERY GOOD DAY -

AFTER 3 LONG YEARS THIS BOARD IS PRETTY MUCH ALL IN AGREEMENT THAT 9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB - DONE FOR AND BY THIS ADMINISTRATION TO BENEFIT THEM AND THEIRS.

WE'VE COME A LONG WAY BABY------------------------

THIS SHIP HAS NOT SAILED YET.

[graphixtech]

219. amen,

exponentiality!
:-)


"9/11 Truth: The Key to Systemic Change"

http://www.911truth.org/index.php

[MHalblaub]

251. or "Inside 9-11". Best to read. -NT-

[melissinha]

208. Stalling til after the election

Stalling the scramble the rogue planes..
So convenient... the Mr. Sliney Terrorist Coordinator at the FAA's FIRST day on the job, and this happens...sounds suspicious to me... and no scrambling happend til after the Pentagon had been hit.... cause this man who has over 35 years of experience with aviation was "not sure" about what to do.... WTF? Sounds like STALLING to me... Meanwhile NORAD is begging him for an okay...... WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Stalling admission that Saddam had nothing to do with Al Qaeda and that Saddam had no WMDs...

Misinformation my ass!

Let me tell you what they can't deny.... the Mark Ritter the Inspector General and the Inspectors where on the ground in Iraq upon invitation from Saddam when we pre-empted our planned attack.... and the documents proving there were no WMDs were here... as requested but oh yeah.. we struck a DAY after the 15,000 page documents were received..... yeah .. sounds like we didn't want to have to justtify with true facts and evidence cause they KNEW it didn't exist.

I say BushCo is deep into 911 and everyone's scared to challenge them.

[Old and In the Way]

225. Well, in fairness to Dick Cheney-

they needed some excuse to justify their Iraqi invasion and Operation Iraqi Liberation (OIL). Dick spent a lot time getting the plan squared away with Big Oil under the cover of his still secret Energy Policy meetings.

[adigal]

222. Will someone leak the memo

without all of the "redactions"? I pray someone leaks the original 9/11 memo so we can see what the hell they blacked out. That would tell us a lot.

[adigal]

224. My own Republican mother

when I just talked to her about this, said, "Get over it. You have a beautiful family, just thank God your husband is okay, and get over it."

Well, I don't know how long my husband will be okay for, and I know I have a wonderful family, but if I don't try to help safeguard the world in which they live, then it will be hell here for them.

So don't expect outrage.

[leesa]

232. She is a selfish woman. I'm sorry.

[adigal]

237. Yes, she is

And you didn't even have to meet her to know that!!! Took me 40 years to admit it.

[catgirl]

238. New Sept. 11 Report Cites Warnings About Hijackings

Link to the Reuters article:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050210/ts_nm/security_commission_faa_dc

I also heard on our local news that there were 52 direct warnings of possible suicide attacks using airplanes. These warnings were ignored.

[bowens43]

239. You KNOW that's not true

after all Condi told us that no one could have imagined that anyone would hijack a plane and use it as a weapon.....

[katinmn]

240. another shot in the arm for the conspiracy theorists

I mean REALLY.

No wonder Richard Clarke was pissed. You can't spell it out much clearer than this.

[catgirl]

242. Vote at the bottom of the article & keep it alive

It was practically buried when I found it.

[Bridget Burke]

241. This was discussed on BBC news this AM (bbcamerica)

They specifically mentioned (twice) the fact that the report was ready some months ago but release was delayed until after the election. And added that large chunks were still blacked out ("classified"); apparently, Democrats & 9/11 family members want to investigate.

[whistle]

243. Even Chris Mathews had the 9-11 commission heads on...

...Hardball last night, Thomas Keans and Lee Hamilton. Chris was throwing only softballs, but still Keans and Hamilton showed their willingness to continue to lie and cover up the truth concerning 9-11 and Condi's denial of having any knowledge that such events would occur. My observations of the 9-11 commission report and this latest demonstration and realization of a co-ordinated cover-up:

...Thomas Keans and Lee Hamilton to talk about the newly released warnings by intelligence sources to the FAA early in 2001. Four things that Keans and Hamilton said during the interview which has compromised their credibility:

A. When asked by Mathews why the report which the 9-11 commission had on this information only now has come out the commission heads answers were that the commission had released the report, but due to bureaucratic delays and just the way officials business works, the information was not declassified for the public until this week, nearly eight months after the commission gave its full report to the public and well after the presidential election. -- Commissioners Kean and Hamilton credibility compromised by blaming bureaucratic delays on something that the public needed to know about the events leading up to the 9-11 attacks.

B. Then Mathews asked why if the FAA had this information back in early 2001, well before the events and the intelligence clearly was suggesting that a suicidal terrorist high jacking of planes with spectacular explosions was eminent, why the FAA didn't prepare better, placed more sky marshals on planes tightened up security at domestic airports. -- Commissioners Kean and Hamilton credibility compromised by suggesting that no body was prepared because there was no past experience of such a thing happening here and the powers felt it was most likely to happen overseas anyway and not in the U.S.

C. Mathews then showed the video of the now famous press conference statement by Condi Rice where she stated that nobody could have foreseen these events and Chris makes his soft-hardball pitch that surely those who were at the head of the agencies should have been able to piece the intelligence together enough back before 9-11 attacks that some kind of alarm should have gone out. Commissioners Kean and Hamilton credibility compromised by claiming that there really was no one with the specific job to do such a thing at that time including Condi Rice whose job was National Security Advisor. Uhmmm.

D. Mathews then asked what the country has learned about terrorists threats are we in fact protected now and if so by whom and how. Thomas Keans made the statement that the best protection is by the passengers themselves and that if they suspect or see a threat to take matters into their own hands to stop it. Hamilton did not offer an alternative to that and even laughed along with Keans. -- Commissioners Kean and Hamilton credibility compromised by suggesting such an outrageous vigilante type solution as to have passengers take matters into their own hands to ensure their own safety.

I am now left with the impression that a bipartisan coverup has taken place on a massive scale and our government along with leaders in both parties are hiding critical facts about 9-11 from the American people and we will never be allowed to know what really happened. What do DUers think?

[TNOE]

286. Saw this

you're right - very LAME questions given what should be the severity of this report - maybe I saw Ben Vineste (sp?) on this program or on another one - but I recall him looking into the camera and saying something to the effect of "its important to get this information out to dispel THE CONSPIRACY THEORIES running rampant on the Internet".

THEY KNOW WE ARE ON TO THEM - and they're just hoping like hell this will just go away - but it won't and its not going to.

[many a good man]

244. Good for Condi this didn't come up BEFORE nomination hearings

"Nevertheless the FAA had indeed considered the possibility that terrorists would hijack a plane and use it as a weapon," said the August 2004 staff report, which gave more details on what the FAA knew than were included in the Sept 11 commission's overall report released in July.

...

"We don't rule it out ... If however, the intent of the hijacker is not to exchange hostages for prisoners, but to commit suicide in a spectacular explosion, a domestic hijacking would probably be preferable," the report cited the CD-ROM as saying.

[katinmn]

245. A bi-partsan cover-up: absolutely!

This omission in the original report is unforgiveable and clearly a cover-up. Our security advisor lied and people died.

[Bridget Burke]

253. Kristen Breitweiser speaks out...

Kristin Bretweiser, whose husband was killed in the World Trade Centre, said yesterday the newly released details undermined testimony from Condoleezza Rice, the former national security adviser, who told the commission that information about al-Qa'ida's threats seen by the administration was "historical in nature".

She told The Independent: "There were 52 threats that were mentioned. These were present threats - they were not historical. There were steps that could have been taken. Marshals could have been put on planes that spring. Condoleezza Rice's testimony is undermined." To the consternation of members of the commission who published the original report last year, the administration has been blocking the release of the latest information. An unclassified copy of this additional appendix was passed to the National Archives two weeks ago with large portions blacked out.


http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=609895

So--we still don't have the whole story.

[paulthompson]

255. Here's the FAA report, and an article to recall

This links to the censored report the New York Times article discusses. The first half goes through the FAA's actions on 9/11 minute by minute, and the second half look at their pre-9/11 actions:

http://www.familiesofseptember11.org/commission/commission2.asp?s=14#1015

Also, here's all of a short article to keep in mind when people say how little the FAA knew about attacks inside the US. The media and the the 9/11 Commission have completely "forgotten" about this:

Bin Laden's Trail

Rushdie's air ban

by James Doran
The London Times
September 27, 2001


The author Salman Rushdie believes that US authorities knew of an imminent terrorist strike when they banned him from taking internal flights in Canada and the US only a week before the attacks.

On September 3 the Federal Aviation Authority made an emergency ruling to prevent Mr Rushdie from flying unless airlines complied with strict and costly security measures. Mr Rushdie told The Times that the airlines would not upgrade their security.

The FAA told the author’s publisher that US intelligence had given warning of “something out there” but failed to give any further details. The FAA confirmed that it stepped up security measures concerning Mr Rushdie but refused to give a reason.

[Supersedeas]

267. sadly the true history of 9/11 has been blacked-out for political security

[NNN0LHI]

257. U.S. aviation received 52 al-Qaeda warnings before 9/11

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-1480093,00.html

America's aviation authority received numerous warnings about al-Qaeda attacks in the six months before 9/11, including five that mentioned hijackings and two that mentioned suicide operations, it has emerged.

A previously published report by the commission set up to investigate the September 11 attacks on the United States reveals that the US Federal Aviation Authority received 52 intelligence reports on al-Qaeda between April and September 2001.

The 911 Commission report criticises the FAA for failing to strengthen security measures in light of the reports, and accuses it of allowing a false sense of security to prevail.

The aviation industry was more concerned with hijacking threats overseas and did not appear to give serious credit to the idea of hijackings at home, the report added.

more

And Chimpy was taking month long vacations to cut brush for the cameras while this is all going on. Think about that for a moment. And then after that this idiot crackhead gets elected on his national security credentials. I need a drink.

[LinuxInsurgent]

258. well...that sure pokes a hole...

in the lie of "we didn't know 9/11 was gonna happen...how we would know they would use airplanes".

You would know through the 52 warnings you received about it...

Why isn't this evidence to impeach the President...isn't this CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE?

[NNN0LHI]

260. If this had been a Dem president in charge he'd a been tarred and feathered

And I would have helped warm up the tar.

Don

[jmcgowanjm]

259. The 3 most censored stories of the week

911 warnings

Jeff Gannon -L'Plame Affair

Yet, between 15 and 21 days later when Gannon conducts
a phone interview with Wilson, Gannon references the 2002
CIA memo definitively.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/2/9/191334/0754


US pulling troops from Iraq

WE ARE watching the beginning of the great American
exodus from Iraq. The cry will go up immediately that
President Bush has decided to “cut and
run”.
In a sense, that is perfectly true. The US marched its troops
into Iraq for the elections, and ten days later, is now
marching them out of Haifa Street, the most notorious
of Baghdad’s flashpoints. It is expected soon to pull some out
of Iraq altogether.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,7374-1479365,00.html

[leveymg]

262. Turn right at the end of Haifa Street, and march straight to the Iran

border. No secret here. None.

Wonder who set up that telephone interview? Thought it was a press conference/conference call.

Hi, James! Good to see you.

[underpants]

261. NO flight numbers no seat numbers it was irrelevant or historical

whichever suits your purpose. :eyes:

I guess a boat orr across someone's forehead might have worked.

[jenn1977]

263. Debate away, but take action too

I'm all for debating our different ideas/thoughts/beliefs about who should be held responsible for 911, but I do think that we all have a great opportunity (now that most Americans are over the shock of 911) to put the pressure on our elected officials, local and national media, and EACH OTHER to revisit 911. I think more people are finally able to process the information that has already been given to us.

On 911 and during the following the weeks and months I knew in my heart that something didn't seem right. But at the same time, I was in such a state of shock and disbelief, and so disturbed & distressed by the images of the planes hitting and the towers falling being played over and over and over and over on all the major networks, that I never even noticed nor processed the TRUTH that was laid out right before my eyes.

I'm currently reading a book that references hundreds of newspaper articles and evening news programs that were reporting a ton of information that pointed directly to PURPOSEFUL NEGLIGENCE on the part of the Bush administration and so many others. Now I'm looking back and wondering how the hell I missed all that! We have to give this another chance you guys. We HAVE to continue spreading the word, whether it be writing to your local newspaper or putting out fliers that cite specific examples of this negligence from sources that "mainstream America" feels comfortable with (NYT, WP), in places around your town.

Whether it was LIHOP or MIHOP I think most of us are on the same page as far as the purposeful negligence by the Bush Admin and others.

[TNOE]

287. You said a mouthful here

the whole point of showing the plane hitting again and again - was to do exactly what you have described - psychologically terrorize you. Man, I thought my Mom was going to lose it - and I just kept telling her - turn it off. That was the point - to make it so spectacular that people wouldn't think to ask the important questions.

[cascadiance]

266. Bush team tried to suppress pre-9/11 report into al-Qa'ida

This article focuses on how the FAA wasn't prepared for the 9/11 attack because of the lack of warnings it was given and the ones it did receive indicated it would likely be an event overseas rather than domestically.

Mods, perhaps merge this with the existing thread on the Richard Clarke memo, but this article doesn't really focus on that memo but that the FAA's lack of preparation due to it's not receiving the report.

snip--

Bush team tried to suppress pre-9/11 report into al-Qa'ida

By Andrew Buncombe in Washington
11 February 2005

Federal officials were repeatedly warned in the months before the 11 September 2001 terror attacks that Osama bin Laden and al-Qa'ida were planning aircraft hijackings and suicide attacks, according to a new report that the Bush administration has been suppressing.

Critics say the new information undermines the government's claim that intelligence about al-Qa'ida's ambitions was "historical" in nature.

The independent commission investigating the attacks on New York and Washington concluded that while officials at the Federal Aviation Authority (FAA) did receive warnings, they were "lulled into a false sense of security". As a result, "intelligence that indicated a real and growing threat leading up to 9/11 did not stimulate significant increases in security procedures".

The report, withheld from the public for months, says the FAA was primarily focused on the likelihood of an incident overseas. However, in spring 2001, it warned US airports that if "the intent of the hijacker is not to exchange hostages for prisoners but to commit suicide in a spectacular explosion, a domestic hijacking would probably be preferable".

Kristin Bretweiser, whose husband was killed in the World Trade Centre, said yesterday the newly released details undermined testimony from Condoleezza Rice, the former national security adviser, who told the commission that information about al-Qa'ida's threats seen by the administration was "historical in nature".

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/story.jsp?story=609966

[Anarcho-Socialist]

269. The Independent: Bush team tried to suppress pre-9/11 report into al-Qaeda

Bush team tried to suppress pre-9/11 report into al-Qa'ida

By Andrew Buncombe in Washington
11 February 2005

Federal officials were repeatedly warned in the months before the 11 September 2001 terror attacks that Osama bin Laden and al-Qa'ida were planning aircraft hijackings and suicide attacks, according to a new report that the Bush administration has been suppressing.

Critics say the new information undermines the government's claim that intelligence about al-Qa'ida's ambitions was "historical" in nature.

The independent commission investigating the attacks on New York and Washington concluded that while officials at the Federal Aviation Authority (FAA) did receive warnings, they were "lulled into a false sense of security". As a result, "intelligence that indicated a real and growing threat leading up to 9/11 did not stimulate significant increases in security procedures".

The report, withheld from the public for months, says the FAA was primarily focused on the likelihood of an incident overseas. However, in spring 2001, it warned US airports that if "the intent of the hijacker is not to exchange hostages for prisoners but to commit suicide in a spectacular explosion, a domestic hijacking would probably be preferable".

Kristin Bretweiser, whose husband was killed in the World Trade Centre, said yesterday the newly released details undermined testimony from Condoleezza Rice, the former national security adviser, who told the commission that information about al-Qa'ida's threats seen by the administration was "historical in nature".

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=609895

[lovedems]

270. So she either deliberately lied

or is so incompetent she couldn't understand the information that was given to her. Liar or incompetent or incompetent liar?

[HereSince1628]

271. Another GOP success...this is obviously about 5 months too late.

Not that we didn't suspect, not that there weren't suggestions that something like this existed.

Bitter tasting vindication.

[KansDem]

272. Could this be why Bush was given "lying privileges?"

Not required to testify under oath; not required to answer questions in public testimony; and had the luxury of having Dick Cheney there to hold his hand...

Yet, based on that "testimony," millions and billions of dollars will be spent on security...

Impeachment's too good for this lying SOB!!!

[Gingersnapsback]

275. Bush / Cheney did NOT testify under oath...just Condi swore

to tell the truth and nothing but the truth.

[seemslikeadream]

276. is it just me, or has opinion on 911 lihop/mihop changed?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x32905

9-11: Pop goes the Bush mythology bubble-new article by C. Schwarz
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x32211

9/11 was an inside job
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=29793&mesg_id=29793

anyone seen this pentagon 911 stuff?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=31405&mesg_id=31405

Strange seismic activity and molten steel at Ground Zero on 9/11/01
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=29277&mesg_id=29277

9/11 Commission: There Must Be 93 Ways To Blow Your Cover
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=20744&mesg_id=20744

Can I ask a tinfoil hat question re: 9/11
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=7924&mesg_id=7924

[chieftain]

277. NYT adds to the cover up .

I apologize if someone made this point earlier , but I was so enraged to see the headline on the jump page calling this a " new " report .In an accurate " newspaper of record " the headline would have read " Bush Suppressed Report of Warnings " or similar . I know that everyone here knows how the media is failing this country but I get enraged with each new example of perfidy .

[bpilgrim]

282. WTC7 -------------------------------------> mpg & flash

http://news.globalfreepress.com/movs/wtc-7_collapse.mpg
http://news.globalfreepress.com/movs/wtc7.swf

kick

peace

[Name removed]

284. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[aikido15]

288. This is a must see!

Anyone who thinks Bush wasn't behind 9/11 needs to watch this. I have ordered a copy of this documentary. EVERYONE needs to see this. It made me feel angry like I felt after watching Moore's F'9/11.

http://207.44.245.159/article6847.htm

[Name removed]

289. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.