LAT: U.S. Vehicles Are Behind the Curve in Skid Safety (stability control)

[DeepModem Mom]

U.S. Vehicles Are Behind the Curve in Skid Safety
By Ricardo Alonso-Zaldivar, Times Staff Writer


WASHINGTON — Kat Mastrangelo was driving down a curvy mountain road on hard-packed snow last winter when she hit a patch of ice and felt her Volvo sport utility vehicle start to fishtail. Mastrangelo envisioned her brand new XC90 crashing into oncoming traffic or spinning into a ditch.

None of that happened. Instead of becoming involved in a potentially lethal SUV rollover accident, the Oregon mother of three continued on without incident — thanks to a computerized stability control system that automatically put her vehicle back on course in the blink of an eye.

But despite almost universal agreement on the life-saving value of electronic stability control, it is rare on cars and trucks in the United States. And some safety experts and consumer advocates say it may be years before they become common on American roads unless the federal government steps in to set standards.

Such systems, widely used in Europe, are considered the next big step forward in auto safety in the U.S., which has concentrated on the construction of better roads and the development of air bags and more crash-worthy cars. The goal is to create vehicles that prevent accidents from happening in the first place....


http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-rollover28nov28,0,4694824.story?coll=la-home-headlines

[The Zanti Regent]

1. Remember the Pinto?

Ol Lee Iacocca was too cheap to put that fuel tank shield in, woukd have only cost $10, as Mother Jones pointed out. Oh, they figured there would be some deaths, but the lawsuits would be few and far between...

[liberalmuse]

2. My car has one of those.

I had to pick up my daughter clear across town during a snow storm last night and the roads were awful. More than a few times, I felt myself sliding on a patch of ice but the car righted itself because of the AdvanceTrac system. It was pretty gnarly coming back on the street my house is on, because there is a ditch that runs the entire road and I was convinced we were going to end up in it, but the traction system kept coming on.

The traction system comes on as soon as the car starts sliding, soyou don't end up sliding into the intersection or sliding sideways. I have a manual transmission and the traction system will do something weird with the brakes and clutch when I'm on a really slick road and am coming to a stop. It feels like it's dropping an anchor or something.

I think I'm having the sliding problem in the first place because of the crappy Firestone tires that came with the car--Fire Hawks. I've already had a massive blowout on the freeway and was surprised that there hasn't been a recall on these POS tires.

[Kolesar]

3. Buy real snow tires, not "all season" M/S tires

Bridgestone Blizzak tires actually give you traction on ice. Michelin and Dunlop also have good ice tires. These all season tires with "mud and snow" written on the sidewall are unsuitable for winter driving.

A set of those might cost $500 w/ rims, whereas a "traction control system" will cost several times that and break down, leading to the obsolescence of the car eventually.

And slow down, too

[DemoTex]

4. "And slow down, too." Amen! Remember physics 101.

When a wheel rolls along a surface, the resistive force of rolling friction can slow down the motion. Rolling friction is usually much less than sliding or kinetic friction, but it can vary dramatically, depending on the wheel and surface materials. The deformation of the surfaces in contact and adhesive forces between those surfaces combine to create rolling friction. (Snip ...)

The coefficient of rolling friction for a tire or wheel on a hard surface is 100 to 1000 times less than that of sliding or kinetic friction on that same surface. The chart below illustrates that fact.

Coefficients of Friction:

Low-rolling resistance car tire on dry pavement
0.006-0.01 Rolling Friction
0.8 Kinetic Friction

Ordinary car tire on dry pavement
0.015 Rolling Friction
0.8 Kinetic Friction

Truck tire on dry pavement
0.006-0.01 Rolling Friction
0.8 Kinetic Friction

Train wheel on steel track
0.001 Rolling Friction
0.1 Kinetic Friction


You can see that the train wheel has the lowest rolling friction, but it has the poorest stopping ability.

http://www.school-for-champions.com/science/frictionrolling2.htm

Fast-driving fools often end up in a brakes-locked introduction to the perils of kinetic (sliding) friction.

[Paulie]

6. Winter tires are not the be all end all in winter

Winter tires will actually INCREASE your stopping distance on dry pavement, i've seen some articles on the tire sites that it DOUBLES your stopping distance.

Here in the city, at the hint of any snow, they are dropping tons of salt on the road. There really isn't an advantage since the majority of the time the roads are cleared and dry.

And your tires have less to do with skids once you're in a skid. You already have the mass of the car in motion and the tires have already lost adhesion to the road.

Think of Traction Control and Stability Control like insurance. Pay the premium, hope you never need it, but if you do, you'll be glad you paid for it! :)

[Astrochimp]

8. Lost of BS........

"Winter tires will actually INCREASE your stopping distance on dry pavement, i've seen some articles on the tire sites that it DOUBLES your stopping distance. "

Got a post a link with a claim like that. As a owner of Blizzac tires for years I can say with out a doubt it it false.


"Here in the city, at the hint of any snow, they are dropping tons of salt on the road. There really isn't an advantage since the majority of the time the roads are cleared and dry."


Black Ice.
The idea that roads are "clear and dry' IS the cause of many wrecks.

"And your tires have less to do with skids once you're in a skid. You already have the mass of the car in motion and the tires have already lost adhesion to the road."

Not taking into consideration that better traction may keep you from skidding....

As a car skids it scrubs off speed, as it slows it reaches the point where tires can re-gain traction- better the traction on snow/ice the higher speed (or faster) it will re-gain traction. Even while sliding, the more grip the tire has on snow/ice, the quicker it will slow. Think waxing ski's.

"Think of Traction Control and Stability Control like insurance. Pay the premium, hope you never need it, but if you do, you'll be glad you paid for it! "

While very true, also think of all the idiots that will even be more invincible with it- they are bad now with 4 WD. let them think they will not skid, and guess how fast they will drive. Or even make a trip when they normaly would not.


David

[phantom power]

5. Is there anything American cars *aren't* behind the curve on?

I can't think of anything. It pisses me off when people complain about foreign car dominance. The Big Three seem to think that "patriotism" is a business model.

[DELUSIONAL]

7. When we had to replace a vehicle -- we bought a Honda

American cars just don't make the grade. We've had uniformly bad experiences with the quality of American made vehicles.