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Congratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
Democratic Primaries
In reply to the discussion: Bernie Sanders didn't win any larger argument [View all]Gothmog
(145,321 posts)105. Bernie Sanders Didn't Win the Ideas Primary, Either
Link to tweet
To hear Sanders tell it, he lost the battle, but won the larger war. In reality, however, its hard to see Sanders presidential campaign as anything other than a defeat.
His signature Medicare for All proposal was repeatedly bludgeoned in the presidential debates, fatally infected Elizabeth Warrens campaign, and ultimately rejected by most Democratic voters in favor of Joe Bidens proposal of a public health insurance option. More broadly, the Sanders strategy of making big promises with huge price tags, wrapped with the socialist label, sent most Democrats into a panic once he appeared to be nearing the nomination.
He lost. His campaign is over. He will not be the next president. And if his loyalists want to make future gains, they need to learn lessons from that defeat, instead of pretending that they have already won.
In his concession/victory speech, Sanders based his claim on two data points. First, he said, in so-called red states and blue states and purple states, a majority of the American people now understand that we must raise the minimum wage to at least $15 an hour, that we must guarantee health care as a right to all of our people, that we must transform our energy system away from fossil fuel, and that higher education must be available to all regardless of income......
But theres a big difference between superficial support for abstract concepts and devout support for concrete policies. Support for Sanders list of largely simplistic-though-popular principles splinters once respondents have to grapple with policy details, consider counter-arguments or choose from among multiple proposals
Take Sanders advocacy of a free college education for every American. As a principle, it speaks to the idea that everyone should have the ability to go to college, regardless of their origins or economic status. A December New York Times poll of Democrats and Democratic-leaners found broad support for making college affordable to all. But theres a big difference between affordable and free. Just 30.5 percent of respondent agreed that the government should make public colleges free for all Americans, regardless of income, while two-thirds of Democrats believed that either wealthy families or most families should pay tuition....
Has Sanders helped to broaden the political conversation? Has he legitimized proposals once deemed too radical for consideration? Has he galvanized younger voters and helped pull the center of gravity in the Democratic Party further to the left than it was 16 years ago? Yes, yes and yes. But that is well short of having won the ideological struggle.
Democratic voters on Super Tuesday and after vehemently sent a message that there are limits as to how far left their party should go. If another democratic socialist wants to run for the presidency in 2024, she or he (probably she) should understand that the ideological struggle has not been won, and figure out what should be done differently in order to win it.
His signature Medicare for All proposal was repeatedly bludgeoned in the presidential debates, fatally infected Elizabeth Warrens campaign, and ultimately rejected by most Democratic voters in favor of Joe Bidens proposal of a public health insurance option. More broadly, the Sanders strategy of making big promises with huge price tags, wrapped with the socialist label, sent most Democrats into a panic once he appeared to be nearing the nomination.
He lost. His campaign is over. He will not be the next president. And if his loyalists want to make future gains, they need to learn lessons from that defeat, instead of pretending that they have already won.
In his concession/victory speech, Sanders based his claim on two data points. First, he said, in so-called red states and blue states and purple states, a majority of the American people now understand that we must raise the minimum wage to at least $15 an hour, that we must guarantee health care as a right to all of our people, that we must transform our energy system away from fossil fuel, and that higher education must be available to all regardless of income......
But theres a big difference between superficial support for abstract concepts and devout support for concrete policies. Support for Sanders list of largely simplistic-though-popular principles splinters once respondents have to grapple with policy details, consider counter-arguments or choose from among multiple proposals
Take Sanders advocacy of a free college education for every American. As a principle, it speaks to the idea that everyone should have the ability to go to college, regardless of their origins or economic status. A December New York Times poll of Democrats and Democratic-leaners found broad support for making college affordable to all. But theres a big difference between affordable and free. Just 30.5 percent of respondent agreed that the government should make public colleges free for all Americans, regardless of income, while two-thirds of Democrats believed that either wealthy families or most families should pay tuition....
Has Sanders helped to broaden the political conversation? Has he legitimized proposals once deemed too radical for consideration? Has he galvanized younger voters and helped pull the center of gravity in the Democratic Party further to the left than it was 16 years ago? Yes, yes and yes. But that is well short of having won the ideological struggle.
Democratic voters on Super Tuesday and after vehemently sent a message that there are limits as to how far left their party should go. If another democratic socialist wants to run for the presidency in 2024, she or he (probably she) should understand that the ideological struggle has not been won, and figure out what should be done differently in order to win it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
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No he didn't! What are these "issues" that Sander won? The majority of Democrats AND....
George II
Mar 2020
#10
The kind that we can pass quickly...millions of people's lives depend on it...can't have some huge
Demsrule86
Mar 2020
#15
We have the infrastructure of the ACA in place, along with REAL Medicare (not some faux "for all")
George II
Mar 2020
#16
Why do you think that he coudn't inspire them to register and get to a polling place on a Tuesday?
ehrnst
Mar 2020
#72
He won by cleaning up with older voters. Bernie and progressives are the future.
DanTex
Mar 2020
#20
If Sander got younger voters, he could have won...they didn't show up Dan...his base
Demsrule86
Mar 2020
#23
If they didn't vote for him, you can't say that he won them. It's really that simple.
Orrex
Mar 2020
#35
Fight for Fifteen started in 2012 and has raised minimum wages around the country.
betsuni
Mar 2020
#50
LOL. Bernie has been driving the fight for $15. It has everything to do with Bernie.
DanTex
Mar 2020
#55
Again, you ignore the exit poll data, which is understandable because it totally contradicts
DanTex
Mar 2020
#57
It would take years to put every person in the country on Medicare...and the cost would be
Demsrule86
Mar 2020
#24
"Sanders's vision for the party has been soundly and consistently rejected..."
NurseJackie
Mar 2020
#68
Every four years the party platform becomes more progressive. That's how time works.
betsuni
Mar 2020
#84
Why did Bernie Sanders drop out? The progressive majority he needed doesn't exist
Gothmog
Apr 2020
#106