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In reply to the discussion: This message was self-deleted by its author [View all]Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)It was a tragedy that Leave won.
The only point of disagreement you and I have is that I think it's hopeless to try to reverse the EU decision.
Why do you think it's even possible now?
And what good would have come of Labour going all out to reverse it if their doing so ended up giving UKIP 40 seats in the North of England and if it would have required Corbyn to agree to abide by the pointless EU diktat that all EU countries have a balanced budget(a requirement that makes reversing the Tory cuts in the welfare state impossible)?
It's bad that Leave won...it actually sickens me...but I can't see how there was ever any chance of reverse it.
And it's hard to see how punishing Labour for not fighting a hopeless battle can lead to anything good down the road.
If May gets a majority, it won't really matter if the Tories are beaten in any future election. Every right-wing policy will pretty much be carved in stone and social services will just keep shrinking for the rest of eternity if that happens, as far as I can see.
The other problem that always comes up is this:
If Corbyn had been(or somehow still is)forced out as leader, we can assume that the PLO will only allow someone from the extreme right wing of the party, like Liz Kendall, to be elected leader. Labour will still need to hold the votes of everyone who is loyal to Corbyn. How could they possibly obtain the loyalty of that very large group of people when no one who could possibly be imposed as leader now(I'm assuming it would have to go back to the reactionary method of just having the PLP choose somebody)when that person would have to have been part of the anti-Corbyn plotting and would be incapable of saying anything the majority of Corbynites might possibly agree with?
How could there possibly be unity behind a Kendall, or an Yvette Cooper(who was just barely to Kendall's left) or a Chuka Umunna(the guy who thinks you can still be Labour after calling human beings "trash" ?
Doesn't that just drag Labour back into the dead zone politics of 2010 and 2015?