General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: Supporting the values of the Sanders movement is not "refighting the primaries". [View all]Jim Lane
(11,175 posts)Your statement that "many will forever blame Bernie for Trump winning" is certainly true. I was pointing out that this feeling is a mistake.
I'm among those who blame Nader for Bush. Obviously, there were many other factors, but Nader was what lawyers call a "but-for cause": If Nader had not run in the general election, Bush would not have become President. The exit poll data, even the data cited by Nader himself, make that very clear.
No comparable case can be made against Bernie. He did precisely what those of us in the "Fuck Nader" camp have been saying a progressive candidate should do. He ran in the primaries. After the convention, he refused to emulate Nader by running in the general and thus splitting the vote. In fact, he campaigned for Clinton.
What I see in this thread is the speculation that, if Bernie had endorsed Clinton several weeks before he actually did, that would have swung the election to Trump, because people would have had more time to grieve. Come off it. Anyone who wanted to grieve had plenty of time between the convention and the election. The data supporting the Nader --> Bush connection are clear, while Bernie --> Trump is a nonstarter.
One point I made that no one wants to address is that Bernie brought in many people who ended up voting, however reluctantly, for Clinton. Compare that with the number of "Bernie or Busters" who didn't vote for Clinton, because they had only a few months to grieve, but who would have voted for Clinton if they'd had more time. My guess is that that group is tiny. The people who stomped off and voted for Stein were going to do that regardless of what Bernie did.
Another point that no one addresses is the conduct of the Clinton supporters. Even at the convention, there were reports that, when Bernie delegates left their seats temporarily, they returned to find the chairs occupied by nondelegates who were there to cheer on command from the Clinton camp. Stuff like that -- generating fresh grievances -- did more to alienate Bernie supporters than any truncation of this hypothetical grieving period.
BTW, I post on JPR as well as on DU. I can assure you that, although JPR started out as a pro-Bernie site, his endorsement of Clinton, let alone campaigning for her, drove some of the posters to say "Bernie is dead to me" or the like. They would be happy to join you in excoriating Bernie, albeit for different reasons.