General Discussion

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)

226. I totally agree with you on that.

Fri Apr 15, 2016, 08:17 PM

Apr 2016

Our problem is not with the middle class but with the extremely rich. Those very few at the top that most Americans are unaware of.

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273 replies

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What If We Just Gave Poor People a Basic Income for Life? That’s What We’re About to Test. [View all] Recursion Apr 2016 OP

There is a problem with this. Where is the money coming from? If it comes from the rhett o rick Apr 2016 #1

Plenty of money to fund it: Panama is overflowing with cash. Betty Karlson Apr 2016 #17

It's been Hoovered up. Time to claw it back down. nt SusanCalvin Apr 2016 #210

Where is the money coming from? why bernie of course, saturnsring Apr 2016 #28

you know that Canada is trying this, right? nt Javaman Apr 2016 #51

Stop challenging the simple minded. Phlem Apr 2016 #85

simple minded lol name calling is such the mark of a great mind saturnsring Apr 2016 #170

How else would you describe non functioning brain matter? Phlem Apr 2016 #172

This Fall in Ontario. But it was also tried earlier in Manitoba LiberalLovinLug Apr 2016 #148

+1 Thanks for sharing this! Phlem Apr 2016 #177

It's Not All Greed. The Far Left Apr 2016 #246

That's an awesome find bud! Phlem Apr 2016 #247

I am never surprised at the callousness of those that side with the Rich Fat Cats. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #181

Arent you the one who spoke up first about not wanting to contribute? Jackie Wilson Said Apr 2016 #201

Boy can you twist things around. The biggest problem facing us today is the rhett o rick Apr 2016 #206

If spin was a sport, you would have the equivalent of the Heisman. Jackie Wilson Said Apr 2016 #211

Did you notice. Rilesome Apr 2016 #234

great strawman saturnsring Apr 2016 #202

If that's all you have to say, off to ignoresville for you. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #208

run along then -- why do people feel the need to tell you theyre putting you on ignore saturnsring Apr 2016 #213

It gives them the LAST WORD Vincardog Apr 2016 #232

Wow! Fifteen Million!?!? maddiemom Apr 2016 #214

It is simple. Let Trump pay for it. Vincardog Apr 2016 #216

make him pay for it after what he's put us through saturnsring Apr 2016 #222

The other side lifting their dressies and showing their a$$e$ is never a bad thing Vincardog Apr 2016 #233

Basic economics - multiplier effect. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #30

I certainly understand this, however, we must figure in the percentage scraped off the top rhett o rick Apr 2016 #182

Yes absolutely. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #225

There are many possibilities to fund UBI pberq Apr 2016 #43

Yeah Man I like Your Thinking StarzGuy Apr 2016 #66

I support what you wrote. Of course none of the Cinton supporters would be on board. Those rhett o rick Apr 2016 #184

This is why they are so afraid of Bernie Sanders. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #228

Surely, you are not asking that question. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #55

It's a question that will be asked by many, and it's a question that should be discussed PersonNumber503602 Apr 2016 #71

No ... I completely agree. It IS a very pertinent question ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #78

You're right it is a pertinent question, and there are many possible ways to fund it pberq Apr 2016 #81

With all due respect....THAT is the only pertinent question. nt clarice Apr 2016 #126

Again, my comment was directed towards the person ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #128

SOOOOO Sorry..... I miss-read. Peace. nt clarice Apr 2016 #129

No worries ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #134

Agreed.nt clarice Apr 2016 #135

If that question doesn't result in a doable answer ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #140

I know where it should come from, but wanted others to give their opinions. I notice rhett o rick Apr 2016 #230

Haven't you figured out by now ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #231

Well look who showed up in a thread about helping the poor. Rarely find any rhett o rick Apr 2016 #187

I am NOT a HRC supporter ... How many times do you need to tell you before it sinks in? 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #189

Sorry, you must be one of very few non-progressives that doesn't support Clinton. nm rhett o rick Apr 2016 #191

Sorry is correct. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #192

So that's all you have to contribute to this thread? Do you support helping the poor or maybe no? rhett o rick Apr 2016 #193

Yes ... I support helping the poor ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #195

Trickle down is what Clinton proposes. She calls it "grow the economy". That's code for frack rhett o rick Apr 2016 #212

Okay. That's inaccurate ... No, incorrect; but, okay. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #221

Your argument isn't very compelling. By the way, I'd like to respond to your sig. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #224

You mean the expansion based on the law ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #229

He made it very clear that he ruluctantly signed the law while you read what BLM said about rhett o rick Apr 2016 #248

"How many times do you need to tell you"?! whathehell Apr 2016 #254

And no one else? I the interests of civility talk to your boy/girl! 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #257

Riiiiight whathehell Apr 2016 #258

Just curious ... Why did you select me as the person to be told to ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #259

because your anger was spilling over & making your text incomprehensible whathehell Apr 2016 #261

LOL ... BS; but, okay 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #262

LOL..Based on experience, I suspected you'd dismiss any answer I gave you whathehell Apr 2016 #263

Here is a better question for you hollowdweller Apr 2016 #61

I'm not sure this could replace all disability passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #158

"Where is the money coming from?" Spitfire of ATJ Apr 2016 #84

I agree. nm rhett o rick Apr 2016 #188

What's money, after all? malthaussen Apr 2016 #86

I totally agree with you that it cannot come from those who jwirr Apr 2016 #103

The IRS administers it 1939 Apr 2016 #117

Since I have worked for a county agency - you are correct. jwirr Apr 2016 #124

You would be able to dismantle every wasteful government program My Good Babushka Apr 2016 #111

Money comes from existing programs. Cosmic Kitten Apr 2016 #183

I hear you and that would be good, but currently the Rich Fat Cats are scrapping off their rhett o rick Apr 2016 #190

What is money? How do you understand what money is? JDPriestly Apr 2016 #219

I would love to continue this discussion, but my point here is related to wealth and not money. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #223

I totally agree with you on that. JDPriestly Apr 2016 #226

There was a time that wealth could be easily created. It was mainly because of cheap or free rhett o rick Apr 2016 #227

After all that the wealthy stole from our coffers over the last 15 years? I would say track it down silvershadow Apr 2016 #220

The banks fasttense Apr 2016 #252

Yes I agree. I guess my point, that I didn't do a very good job of making, is that any discussion rhett o rick Apr 2016 #255

Check HRC's Banking Regulation platform. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #260

I think part of the point of a UBI is the U part tk2kewl Apr 2016 #2

Yep. ronnie624 Apr 2016 #4

Guaranteed by whom?nt clarice Apr 2016 #59

Government, presumably. malthaussen Apr 2016 #89

Where would the money come from?nt clarice Apr 2016 #92

Money is stored labor. malthaussen Apr 2016 #98

Specifically where? And, I'm afraid that money is ALWAYS the question.nt clarice Apr 2016 #101

Here are some specifics pberq Apr 2016 #102

No, money is a metaphor. malthaussen Apr 2016 #109

Believe me when I say that I mean NO disrespect.....but clarice Apr 2016 #116

Sure, I'll believe you. malthaussen Apr 2016 #137

Very well said..... clarice Apr 2016 #165

Control of the means of production is no part of UPI... malthaussen Apr 2016 #186

The same guarantor of all of our rights, of course: ronnie624 Apr 2016 #200

If I had a UBI NobodyHere Apr 2016 #3

Which means you'd stop competing for wages with people who want to work Recursion Apr 2016 #6

Who will pick up trash and clean toilets for the same $$ as doing nothing ? Bonx Apr 2016 #10

I'd do it for the right amount of money. *that's* literally the point Recursion Apr 2016 #11

Why not $100/hour ? Bonx Apr 2016 #12

Because I'd pick up trash for less than that Recursion Apr 2016 #19

But you wouldn't pick up trash for less than this free basic income. Bonx Apr 2016 #23

I think you're missing the sense of "basic" Recursion Apr 2016 #34

No, my point is that basic would have to be so small Bonx Apr 2016 #76

True...and if you DON"T leave the couch...then you shouldn't expect anyone else to pay you.nt clarice Apr 2016 #122

what abt those who are too sick to leave the couch? redruddyred Apr 2016 #205

Yes.. I have always believed that a nation as fortunate as we are...... clarice Apr 2016 #209

There are not so many able-bodied couch potatos as people imagine... hunter Apr 2016 #238

Yes.. agreed 100%....but clarice Apr 2016 #265

I do not consider most employment "productive." hunter Apr 2016 #268

Either does 50% unemployment. IMHO.nt clarice Apr 2016 #269

It's a myth that people don't want to work gollygee Apr 2016 #256

Wages for work should not be competitive with welfare My Good Babushka Apr 2016 #155

Reductio ad absurdum. ChazInAz Apr 2016 #38

Funny, that's he same argument Republicans use against the minimum wage Lordquinton Apr 2016 #69

If we're talking about a national $15/hr minimum wage, that's not a good idea either. Bonx Apr 2016 #80

Yes... I admire the people who pick up the trash and.... clarice Apr 2016 #121

Nobody. That's literally the point. hunter Apr 2016 #13

So the wealthy will be picking up trash and mopping the public schools and city hall Bonx Apr 2016 #16

You have no idea... hunter Apr 2016 #49

The money earned from those jobs would be additional income. cleanhippie Apr 2016 #20

So poor working people supporting really poor drunk people. Bonx Apr 2016 #24

Only if you dismiss what others have told you already about how this would be paid for. cleanhippie Apr 2016 #26

I'm sorry I don't agree that this laughable idea is viable. Bonx Apr 2016 #27

That's painfully obvious. cleanhippie Apr 2016 #32

obtuse = you don't agree Bonx Apr 2016 #75

Actually in this case tkmorris Apr 2016 #106

Tell yourself whatever you need to feel better about it. cleanhippie Apr 2016 #203

Do some research Lordquinton Apr 2016 #70

Yep, but what works on the micro scale might not work on the macro. malthaussen Apr 2016 #91

Of course not. Phlem Apr 2016 #87

AND THERE IT IS!!! I've been waiting for someone who's out of ammo to play the Republican card. clarice Apr 2016 #132

So that's how your interpreting this. Phlem Apr 2016 #136

So..I guess you are saying "Thank God my Mother married a Republican prick?".... clarice Apr 2016 #168

Yea that's exactly what I'm saying. Phlem Apr 2016 #171

Whatever it takes. nt clarice Apr 2016 #174

To assume otherwise would be naive. Phlem Apr 2016 #175

You know what they say about "assume".nt clarice Apr 2016 #178

Whats laughable .99center Apr 2016 #108

Ironic, given your tag line dreamnightwind Apr 2016 #244

Have you done any research on this matter? happyslug Apr 2016 #185

Everyone will get a UBI under this system (even those who work) - so someone who cleans MillennialDem Apr 2016 #204

Amen..... daleanime Apr 2016 #18

To add to that, JoeyT Apr 2016 #53

Yep. Recursion Apr 2016 #62

Basic Braudel. malthaussen Apr 2016 #104

+1 nt laundry_queen Apr 2016 #241

And Old Codger Apr 2016 #72

Not everyone will behave in the same way Politicub Apr 2016 #15

Yes, but how or why should we fund everyone on the planet? nt clarice Apr 2016 #95

I don't believe the US should fund everyone on the planet Politicub Apr 2016 #96

cool with that...but doesn't UBI stand for UNIVERSAL basic income?nt clarice Apr 2016 #100

How do we prevent non-Americans from taking advantage? Build a wall? jonno99 Apr 2016 #105

Not sure - but I doubt the solution includes building a wall Politicub Apr 2016 #119

A UBI would probably be a crappy amount of money. Oneironaut Apr 2016 #22

Just enough for basic housing... DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #33

Where do you live that $600 a month would provide basic housing? Lydia Leftcoast Apr 2016 #39

You are right. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #45

"special class of housing" - I think we call those "slums". Nope, we've got to do better...nt jonno99 Apr 2016 #107

My low income housing rent is $700/mo.. Wounded Bear Apr 2016 #44

See my answer in post #45. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #46

yup... it's a BAD plan.nt clarice Apr 2016 #94

Interesting premise. Not something I have looked at yet. Xyzse Apr 2016 #5

Oddly enough it was an idea from Nixon Recursion Apr 2016 #7

Nixon was an interesting fellow. Xyzse Apr 2016 #8

The thing with Nixon was that he was still a New Dealer at his core forjusticethunders Apr 2016 #131

I see... Thank you for telling me. Xyzse Apr 2016 #154

UBI is the future EdwardBernays Apr 2016 #9

+1,000,000 daleanime Apr 2016 #37

No worries and... EdwardBernays Apr 2016 #73

Exactly right. - eom dreamnightwind Apr 2016 #245

That is crazy. Poor people have to suffer. Helen Borg Apr 2016 #14

Forced life-skills classes are condescending. Oneironaut Apr 2016 #21

The question becomes..... daleanime Apr 2016 #41

People need jobs the way the economy is currently constructed... malthaussen Apr 2016 #97

I'm not opposed to drug testing for this sort of thing .99center Apr 2016 #133

First, as I asked above, where is this wealth coming from? Serious question. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #25

Soylent green... think Apr 2016 #29

UBI is a way to improve on capitalism and democracy pberq Apr 2016 #31

Paying people NOT to be "consumers," to walk lightly upon the earth, is a great idea. hunter Apr 2016 #35

Right because people are going to magically stop wanting things. EllieBC Apr 2016 #67

Um, what??? hunter Apr 2016 #79

"Paying people not to be consumers". EllieBC Apr 2016 #99

As Napoleon pointed out, with enough medals he could win any war. malthaussen Apr 2016 #114

Some things are worse than others... hunter Apr 2016 #150

You may hate those things but not everyone does. EllieBC Apr 2016 #218

Am I telling you how to live? hunter Apr 2016 #240

I'm reminded of an article from the NY Times in the 1970s Lydia Leftcoast Apr 2016 #36

Isn't it funny... malthaussen Apr 2016 #118

cool we can all quit our jobs -- saturnsring Apr 2016 #40

And?...Does this person not deserve the means to access the basic necessities of life? Marengo Apr 2016 #50

some people choose not to think through their knee jerk replies. Javaman Apr 2016 #60

It truly is! Especially as the UBI/GMI concept is progressive and so desperately needed... Marengo Apr 2016 #65

If he's not willing to life a finger and help other people NobodyHere Apr 2016 #74

nope my point was a response to the article that said saturnsring Apr 2016 #153

But would you? subterranean Apr 2016 #64

Yep, it's funny. malthaussen Apr 2016 #142

no i wouldnt but most people dont make that any more - but if i were working 2-3 jobs saturnsring Apr 2016 #156

Perhaps that would force business into a living wage then Marrah_G Apr 2016 #236

So unemployable homeless people deserve to die. Got it. hunter Apr 2016 #82

no they dont saturnsring Apr 2016 #161

If we don't try it and soon astrophuss42 Apr 2016 #42

A recent report on the increasing interest worldwide in UBI pberq Apr 2016 #47

Sam Seder had a great GBI scientist/advocate interview on awhile back. byronius Apr 2016 #48

I tend to agree. malthaussen Apr 2016 #149

Nixon proposed this concept half a century ago DaveT Apr 2016 #52

This makes particular sense . . . Richard D Apr 2016 #54

We have the resources on this planet to feed, cloth, teach. house every human being Marrah_G Apr 2016 #56

Yep. There are no shortages Recursion Apr 2016 #63

What SHOULD our society be structured on? nt clarice Apr 2016 #123

I'm not sure Marrah_G Apr 2016 #215

So how would you be compensated for your labor? nt clarice Apr 2016 #264

We should definitely study that and see what some of the top minds come up with Marrah_G Apr 2016 #266

Perhaps...but with my natural distrust... clarice Apr 2016 #270

I am not talking about think tanks or politicians Marrah_G Apr 2016 #271

Agreed 1000%.nt clarice Apr 2016 #273

We have to go to this eventually, once the machines make it impossible for many people to find jobs. tclambert Apr 2016 #57

A UBI is the only thing that will save this country zalinda Apr 2016 #58

"but the vast majority will contribute back to society" Do you have statistics?...or clarice Apr 2016 #125

Of course, the reverse question applies. malthaussen Apr 2016 #151

As you mentioned in a previous post... Human nature. nt clarice Apr 2016 #169

Maybe human nature as you've experienced it zalinda Apr 2016 #194

I also step up as often as possible...but I fear that we are in the minority. nt clarice Apr 2016 #196

That's been my thinking for awhile. PersonNumber503602 Apr 2016 #68

Free housing is proven to greatly reduce joblessness, drug abuse, hospital costs, wherever done. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2016 #77

Where is this done? (or did you forget to add the sarcasm thingee?) nt jonno99 Apr 2016 #110

Links. Try to be progressive. There is no sarcasm about this. People's lives are at stake. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2016 #157

Thanks for the info! nt jonno99 Apr 2016 #160

Utah comes to mind: malthaussen Apr 2016 #159

Thanks! nt jonno99 Apr 2016 #162

New York City Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2016 #164

Yeah, I agree this is probably coming........... socialist_n_TN Apr 2016 #83

This is going to play out past the poor. Phlem Apr 2016 #88

I think it will happen later - rather than sooner: jonno99 Apr 2016 #112

Unfortunately I think your right. Phlem Apr 2016 #115

Super idea. Not going to happen in our lifetimes, though. HughBeaumont Apr 2016 #90

The problem with the idea that you just can't give people jwirr Apr 2016 #93

BOOM SoLeftIAmRight Apr 2016 #139

Unfortunately most Americans left that idea back in Europe jwirr Apr 2016 #143

you might wat to get your hands on some of the late 70's early 80;s economist magazines SoLeftIAmRight Apr 2016 #144

I was reading those magazines in those years. Unfortunately jwirr Apr 2016 #146

the "steady state economics" ideas were the ones that i have held close SoLeftIAmRight Apr 2016 #147

Agreed but it is going to take a long time for most of the jwirr Apr 2016 #163

yep - "It means giving things up" SoLeftIAmRight Apr 2016 #166

I was talking with another Bernie delegate at a convention. jwirr Apr 2016 #173

colorado? SoLeftIAmRight Apr 2016 #176

No MN jwirr Apr 2016 #179

Noticing all the usual push backs. Phlem Apr 2016 #113

And, of course, completely give the wealthy a pass who are doing the same system gaming. HughBeaumont Apr 2016 #120

a symptom of what has happened to our society. Phlem Apr 2016 #130

How about guaranteeing a job? HassleCat Apr 2016 #127

So, then the question becomes... malthaussen Apr 2016 #138

Dignity of labor HassleCat Apr 2016 #141

In your opinion. malthaussen Apr 2016 #145

We already did this once. HassleCat Apr 2016 #152

Ah, I see. malthaussen Apr 2016 #167

FDR knew the dangers of having millions of young men out of work so he created jobs. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #197

I don't want them to pay their fair share. malthaussen Apr 2016 #198

A few points you ignore. BainsBane Apr 2016 #242

Du's freepers are outing themselves today Doctor_J Apr 2016 #180

Well... IndyV0te Apr 2016 #199

The problem with guarenteed minimum income is... Odin2005 Apr 2016 #207

In addition to raising my own children and now helping to care for my grandchildren, I took JDPriestly Apr 2016 #217

The fact is that it will have to happen eventually. Bonhomme Richard Apr 2016 #235

I would like to point out something in regards to many of the responses on this thread Marrah_G Apr 2016 #237

Finland OkSustainAg Apr 2016 #239

It Would Change Things For The Better colsohlibgal Apr 2016 #243

I'm all on board with this idea robertgodardfromnj Apr 2016 #249

This is the future paulthompson Apr 2016 #250

What Would Society Look Like with Universal Basic Income? eridani Apr 2016 #251

It does no good to teach people how to fish when there are no fish. raouldukelives Apr 2016 #253

A Basic Income should be reserved for those 45 and older Yavin4 Apr 2016 #267

K&R. An important conversation as we move into an increasingly automated world. Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #272