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RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
13. Welcome to our nightmare
Mon Nov 19, 2012, 04:24 PM
Nov 2012

We have been called names, told we were crazy, etc.

But all along we have recognized that our election systems are open to being hacked. Ever since HAVA in 2002. Ten long years.

We saw evidence of the hacks in 2004, the first Presidential election after HAVA. And since then we have felt our democracy being stolen. We feared it again this time. It appears as though something, somebody, somehow, someway kept a huge hack from occurring. This time.

Anyway, it is good to see people coming around to our realization that it IS possible for elections to be hacked. That is what we have been seeking. From here on, hopefully the name calling will end, and we can all work together to build a system that raises ALL of our confidence levels.

Anonymous and the Supposed Hack. [View all] MineralMan Nov 2012 OP
They would actually be a "fourth party organization," since Rover's Hackers would be the third. villager Nov 2012 #1
Reread my final paragraph. MineralMan Nov 2012 #2
Rather than leap to snark mode (or why bother to reply?) it's not the final paragraph... villager Nov 2012 #5
Yes, I can see that you are glad. MineralMan Nov 2012 #8
But your point is... pointless, had Rove been allowed to hack/steal the actual election villager Nov 2012 #11
It is not established that anyone prevented anything. MineralMan Nov 2012 #14
Exactly. Just claims. Yet the claims seems to have sparked some lively discussion villager Nov 2012 #17
More like a cadre of sceptics who want to see evidence before pouncing on something. randome Nov 2012 #27
So you're saying there was no need for this thread to begin with? villager Nov 2012 #32
Doesn't change the fact that there is still no evidence. randome Nov 2012 #36
Or that you love to comment in threads about the subject! villager Nov 2012 #37
'Love' is perhaps too strong a word. I enjoy debates. randome Nov 2012 #41
Obviously. Whether you allow for the thing being debated to have happened or not. villager Nov 2012 #51
Lively discussion? MineralMan Nov 2012 #49
Well, I guess you are under no obligation to call your OP lively. villager Nov 2012 #52
What they should have done, if this whole thing isn't a made up story (as I think it was) pnwmom Nov 2012 #25
Because democracy in the US has no more vigorous defender than the FBI! villager Nov 2012 #33
The FBI? marions ghost Nov 2012 #38
No problem if anonymous was anonymous. n/t pnwmom Nov 2012 #40
Don't see any reason for them to risk exposure marions ghost Nov 2012 #53
'Risk exposure'? If they can send an anonymous email, they can send a printout of code. randome Nov 2012 #58
If you want literal proof marions ghost Nov 2012 #61
Of course there is a good reason. randome Nov 2012 #76
I don't particularly care marions ghost Nov 2012 #135
That's not what Anon claimed RobertEarl Nov 2012 #39
They should have sent info to the FBI and the White House as to how Rove had access. pnwmom Nov 2012 #42
Whatever RobertEarl Nov 2012 #44
This message was self-deleted by its author 99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #116
I hope you have some evidence for this. cali Nov 2012 #85
Based on OP's speculation that Anonymous would be a "third party" if the claims are true villager Nov 2012 #97
If it did happen, it was a necessary evil at this point. louis-t Nov 2012 #3
If anyone can manipulate elections, we will never have fair elections again. MineralMan Nov 2012 #4
I left off my original point that agrees with the last paragraph of the article. louis-t Nov 2012 #15
and I say, since it could happen, that you are right and we will never have fair elections again librechik Nov 2012 #21
you are assuming that we've had fair elections leftyohiolib Nov 2012 #23
The elections in Minnesota are fair, in the sense that they MineralMan Nov 2012 #43
Then we will never have fair elections. That the machines can be hacked is undeniable. nt Bonobo Nov 2012 #111
+1 villager Nov 2012 #7
Yep. I agree. Taverner Nov 2012 #71
I don't believe they even claimed to be Anonymous. robinlynne Nov 2012 #6
Yeah, actually they did. But anyone can claim to be MineralMan Nov 2012 #10
You could but you didn't... marions ghost Nov 2012 #57
And as a result people are actually talking about election fraud! Rockyj Nov 2012 #75
Exactly marions ghost Nov 2012 #132
The letter is signed "the protectors", not anonymous. robinlynne Nov 2012 #96
There are more communications than that letter. MineralMan Nov 2012 #98
for example? robinlynne Nov 2012 #102
This, for one: MineralMan Nov 2012 #104
Yes, this one really does look like Anonymous. The letter does not. robinlynne Nov 2012 #161
and why would they not call themselves Anonymous, as they always did before? robinlynne Nov 2012 #103
I think merely pointing out how easily these systems can be infiltrated is a great thing. EOTE Nov 2012 #9
+1 villager Nov 2012 #12
Welcome to our nightmare RobertEarl Nov 2012 #13
Apparently Anonymous warned Karl Rove on October 22nd (Video) JaneyVee Nov 2012 #16
Anonymous or anyone with a video camera, a Guy Fawkes mask, and an internet connection. Mr. Mojo Risen Nov 2012 #29
Or that. JaneyVee Nov 2012 #35
GOP was incompetent? brush Nov 2012 #18
That is only your guess at what might have happened. MineralMan Nov 2012 #45
RFK Jr. link brush Nov 2012 #56
Uh, no. It has not "been pretty well proven that they stole the '04 election in Ohio with computer RomneyLies Nov 2012 #150
If you don't think so . . . brush Nov 2012 #157
If true, was it interference with the election, or interference with the manipulators? mainer Nov 2012 #19
I quite agree: "Let's eliminate the possibility altogether" 99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #20
+1 Kingofalldems Nov 2012 #22
I was having very similar thoughts this morning during alarm-clock snoozes arcane1 Nov 2012 #24
+1000. n/t pnwmom Nov 2012 #26
Thank you for a well thought out post. n/t pnwmom Nov 2012 #28
I appreciate your saying that. MineralMan Nov 2012 #47
I have Republican friends who, if shown evidence that ... Whiskeytide Nov 2012 #30
Anonymous is more than welcome to be pissed at me. MineralMan Nov 2012 #46
You're braver than I. Whiskeytide Nov 2012 #78
Just drink more whiskey. randome Nov 2012 #80
It does help! Whiskeytide Nov 2012 #83
Anonymous doesn't give a crap about me or you. MineralMan Nov 2012 #99
I agree with you about the integrity of our election process... chowder66 Nov 2012 #31
Change in Ohio's voting system must be demanded by the MineralMan Nov 2012 #100
If those that ARE... 99Forever Nov 2012 #34
When you have an election system as corrupt and dysfunctional as ours, marions ghost Nov 2012 #48
Is this a joke? It's just...so very...wrong... Zorra Nov 2012 #50
You have missed my point spectacularly. nt MineralMan Nov 2012 #54
Your point....???? CanSocDem Nov 2012 #67
If you even *had* a point, please point it out... thanks in advance... Ghost in the Machine Nov 2012 #93
It's a joke that anyone believes Anonymous's completely self-serving pronouncements pnwmom Nov 2012 #59
Would it totally shake your world to find out that Anon actually saved us from Rmoney? rhett o rick Nov 2012 #68
No. But if they did it, all they have to do is carry out on their promise pnwmom Nov 2012 #70
I honestly dont think it would matter. rhett o rick Nov 2012 #72
Your asking the impossible, for some people here to keep open minds, hence the OP bahrbearian Nov 2012 #86
Open minds require evidence. Otherwise, it's just faith. randome Nov 2012 #89
No an open mind examines all sides of an issue, and this issue has no facts either way. bahrbearian Nov 2012 #92
Actually, there's lots of facts jeff47 Nov 2012 #106
Your calling that a fact? bahrbearian Nov 2012 #109
Yes. That their letter is incoherent is a fact. (nt) jeff47 Nov 2012 #118
Pray tell us the facts. rhett o rick Nov 2012 #128
The point isn't whether Rove might steal an election. Of course he might. pnwmom Nov 2012 #130
You're not interested in any facts. jeff47 Nov 2012 #139
Open minds see that there is no evidence either fucking way. rhett o rick Nov 2012 #126
ahahaha argiel1234 Nov 2012 #110
Come back again, soon... SidDithers Nov 2012 #136
My two cents: rzemanfl Nov 2012 #55
Bingo. Eyes of the World Nov 2012 #133
If that is what it takes Aerows Nov 2012 #60
It smells to me, too. MineralMan Nov 2012 #62
I certainly agree that we need to get the election system into a fair and free mode. rhett o rick Nov 2012 #63
Who said it's "White Hat?" RoccoR5955 Nov 2012 #64
Minnesota's system is proven and has been checked in the last MineralMan Nov 2012 #108
Believe me, I have been RoccoR5955 Nov 2012 #119
If someone is making sure Unknown Beatle Nov 2012 #65
Why would you conceal the evidence of that crime? jeff47 Nov 2012 #77
As you can see from many reactions on this blog supposedly of "liberal minded persons", there are rhett o rick Nov 2012 #82
2000 was the Brooks brothers riot shutting down counting and the SCOTUS. Not hacking. jeff47 Nov 2012 #105
So you think that the DoJ lacks evidence? They cant figure it out by themselves? That they or anyone rhett o rick Nov 2012 #120
Please actually read a post before replying to it. jeff47 Nov 2012 #123
Let me see if I got this right. If Anon publishes the evidence then it would be easy to fix the rhett o rick Nov 2012 #125
You don't have it right. No evidence has been published. jeff47 Nov 2012 #140
Do the rainbow farts smell like regular farts? n/t rzemanfl Nov 2012 #152
Let me say it again. The Republicans have been stealing elections for at least 12 years and rhett o rick Nov 2012 #158
You need evidence to force people to fix the voting machines jeff47 Nov 2012 #159
It that is true, we are in worse shape than I thought. nm rhett o rick Nov 2012 #160
So easy for someone on the right to applegrove Nov 2012 #66
I'm seeing the letter being taken seriously by people close to Anonymous starroute Nov 2012 #79
An excellent OP that highlights the folly of cheering this sort of nonsense msanthrope Nov 2012 #69
Thank you. You get it. MineralMan Nov 2012 #101
I don't think you read correctly what they did. Baitball Blogger Nov 2012 #73
Finally a post from someone who is paying attention. reusrename Nov 2012 #129
I don't think it will matter. Baitball Blogger Nov 2012 #134
I disagree with your basic assessment litlbilly Nov 2012 #74
I think this post is attacking a straw man dreamnightwind Nov 2012 #81
This message was self-deleted by its author cthulu2016 Nov 2012 #84
Good question "Why?" bahrbearian Nov 2012 #88
rec cthulu2016 Nov 2012 #87
Personally I'd rather have Rove hacking the voting machines than Anonymous Fumesucker Nov 2012 #90
After 8+ years of working for free, fair and verifiable elections, I want ... Fly by night Nov 2012 #91
Good for you, Bernie... Panasonic Nov 2012 #94
I think only TN has paper ballots AND and elephant sanctuary! bettyellen Nov 2012 #115
Actually, in 93 of 95 counties, the Rethugs have forced us to use DREs ... Fly by night Nov 2012 #145
Not anytime soon, but believe me, it is an attractive option ... Fly by night Nov 2012 #143
You're welcome Panasonic Nov 2012 #148
horny rogue elephant...LOL EmeraldCityGrl Nov 2012 #95
I aims to please. Fly by night Nov 2012 #146
Anon did not say they hacked the Ohio election Merlot Nov 2012 #107
That was my impression as well TexasBushwhacker Nov 2012 #122
Post removed Post removed Nov 2012 #112
This message was self-deleted by its author MineralMan Nov 2012 #113
Post removed Post removed Nov 2012 #114
All I can say is thank dog for Anonymous Taverner Nov 2012 #117
Good points. Will not be widely accepted here. grantcart Nov 2012 #121
About 8 years ago when I quit the DFL in protest kickysnana Nov 2012 #124
I think you are correct if it is possible to hack our vote counting ThomThom Nov 2012 #127
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah! longship Nov 2012 #131
Like you, I don't believe for a second that Anonymous prevented Ohio from being stolen by Rove. Vattel Nov 2012 #137
No. I can't congratulate anyone who interferes in any way MineralMan Nov 2012 #138
I guess i agree with you. Vattel Nov 2012 #141
Who's doing the hacking? MineralMan Nov 2012 #142
You are avoiding the question. The questions is whether it would be okay to hack Vattel Nov 2012 #162
How would it be the only way? MineralMan Nov 2012 #163
nvm Vattel Nov 2012 #164
I guess you would rather have Romney for President. Got it! Taverner Nov 2012 #149
Uh, no. And we don't have him. MineralMan Nov 2012 #151
No no, you said if you knew about it, you would do nothing to change it Taverner Nov 2012 #153
No, I said that I'd provide the evidence to the authorities. MineralMan Nov 2012 #156
All this to me is hogwash Hutzpa Nov 2012 #144
If you don't believe Anonymous' claims, then your post is moot and pointless. OTH, if Phx_Dem Nov 2012 #147
I love the way posters demand evidence that someone prevented another electoral Vincardog Nov 2012 #154
Yes, we're getting sidetracked from demanding full transparency. Lars39 Nov 2012 #155
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