General Discussion

StarfishSaver

(18,486 posts)

43. The record doesn't show that

Tue Dec 10, 2019, 12:43 PM

Dec 2019

The record shows she was opposed to moving forward prematurely, but carefully laid the groundwork so that when the time was right, she'd have a solid case.

The record also shows that you and others insisted that she would NEVER allow impeachment. So your predictions about what Pelosi will and won't do don't carry much weight.

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Before attacking the Dems for not including an Article of Impeachment on Bribery, consider this: [View all] StarfishSaver Dec 2019 OP

I'd like to see someone look into if Giuliani as a prosecutor ever announced an investigation brewens Dec 2019 #1

I want to know if he ever gave Trump the heads up when he was at SDNY? LiberalFighter Dec 2019 #73

Makes a lot of sense StarfishSaver FakeNoose Dec 2019 #2

Yes, there's a YUGE difference between diplomacy and self-enrichment. forgotmylogin Dec 2019 #90

Exactly! burrowowl Dec 2019 #94

KISS maneuver Historic NY Dec 2019 #3

This is NOT the KISS maneuver. It is the opposite tmaynardr Dec 2019 #7

Dems "chose to screw it up?" StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #8

Yeah, too busy working on the ground in Ohio tmaynardr Dec 2019 #9

So you just pop up from your on-the-ground organizing to attack the Democrats StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #15

I'm not attacking Democrats. I'm attacking their poor messaging. tmaynardr Dec 2019 #21

A whole lot of NW Ohio voters are stupid. brutus smith Dec 2019 #39

Voters aren't stupid tmaynardr Dec 2019 #44

Like I said, stupid. brutus smith Dec 2019 #78

What makes you think you know more about messaging than Pelosi? BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #46

Other than actually talking to real voters for the last 18 months? tmaynardr Dec 2019 #48

So you don't. That's what I thought. Thanks for clarifying. BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #55

I appreciate your contribution to this discussion. ChiTownDenny Dec 2019 #62

Just reading this. Apologize for you being treated so badly - just for expressing Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2019 #84

I wanted to personally thank you for your canvassing. BlueWI Dec 2019 #20

Where did you study constitutional law? BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #45

Messaging is not Constitutional Law tmaynardr Dec 2019 #47

+1 SterlingPound Dec 2019 #51

Messaging isn't ConLaw, but the Dems have given YOU more than enough to use to message on the street StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #54

Well thankfully we have an expert here to set us all straight BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #56

Yes, a local expert tmaynardr Dec 2019 #64

Uh huh BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #66

You just got tag teamed ! Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2019 #86

This message was self-deleted by its author Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2019 #85

+1. Amazing how people don't get this. radius777 Dec 2019 #97

Thanks! Mme. Defarge Dec 2019 #4

This is why Dems lose messaging tmaynardr Dec 2019 #5

Legalize Lonnie Anderson's hair. H2O Man Dec 2019 #10

FTR, nothing is stopping you from describing the impeachment DeminPennswoods Dec 2019 #49

Excellent point! StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #53

Nope, we will be called liars tmaynardr Dec 2019 #68

Do you have any similar local scandals DeminPennswoods Dec 2019 #74

It would have been more accurate to call it extortion than bribery dansolo Dec 2019 #96

You sound quite angry and frustrated. Maybe wnylib Dec 2019 #57

Life-Long Democrat tmaynardr Dec 2019 #67

I was away for a few hours and just read your wnylib Dec 2019 #80

When you read the articles of impeachment, what specifically jumped out at you as far as messaging BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #69

Abuse of Power; Obstruction of Congress tmaynardr Dec 2019 #70

Nothing wrong with either term. You can wnylib Dec 2019 #82

You have to have a good grasp of both the wnylib Dec 2019 #83

It would be different if Ukraine admitted the extortion. C_U_L8R Dec 2019 #6

Articles of Impeachment aren't "evidence" StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #11

Ukraine. Not Democrats. C_U_L8R Dec 2019 #12

This is not a Criminal Matter tmaynardr Dec 2019 #22

I know that. I was presenting an illustration StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #28

Dems aren't holding back evidence, but are giving up evidence that will soon become available Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #32

They're not giving up anything StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #34

Last summer there wasn't even an open inquiry... Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #40

During a Senate trial, if Ds or Rs call witnesses to appear and DeminPennswoods Dec 2019 #50

Good points and explanation. I agree with wnylib Dec 2019 #87

Another point of dissonance is with my own wnylib Dec 2019 #88

Republicans will now argue endless hours on what abuse of power is including false equivalencies. I uponit7771 Dec 2019 #13

Do we even have any messaging people? CrispyQ Dec 2019 #52

IKR !?!?! uponit7771 Dec 2019 #71

What's to stop the House from The Wizard Dec 2019 #14

+1, After McGhan they should impeach Red Don again uponit7771 Dec 2019 #16

What's to stop the House? Nancy Pelosi Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #26

LOL StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #29

You are 100% correct. It was like pulling teeth as it was. Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2019 #38

".. like pulling teeth.. ". That's your view.. Nancy did Cha Dec 2019 #91

Frankly, I think the way this has been laid out has been freaking brilliant! Raster Dec 2019 #17

+1 StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #18

Once articles have been voted on and sent to the Senste for trial, they cannot be amended Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #27

But didn't you think that Pelosi would never allow an impeachment in the first place? StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #35

The record shows that she was firmly against impeachment until the Ukraine events in Aug nt. Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #41

The record doesn't show that StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #43

Totally! But I could think of a hundred charges on which to file impeachment charges. calimary Dec 2019 #19

Yes. They're rolling that into the Abuse of Power Article. MineralMan Dec 2019 #23

I understand their logic, but the GOP are (and did already) accuse Obama-Biden of the same thing! Texin Dec 2019 #24

Why not BOTH bribery and abuse of power? Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #25

Post removed Post removed Dec 2019 #30

If they had included bribery and obstruction of justice, those 4 articles would be appropriate Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #33

If they had included them, you would have found something else to complain about StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #36

With your psychic powers, you should open a mind reading salon nt Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #42

" the abuse of power is the bribery and the bribery is the abuse of power" pangaia Dec 2019 #31

Thanks, Pangaia! StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #37

Swalwell is being quoted saying additional articles will be drafted Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #58

Swalwell's questioning of Dan Goldman was the highlight DeminPennswoods Dec 2019 #75

It was a thing of beauty. Perfectly executed. He nailed the landing. NurseJackie Dec 2019 #95

I hope so. nt ecstatic Dec 2019 #81

dearest starfishsaver bubbazero Dec 2019 #59

I agree with the approach of Speaker Pelosi and the Congressional Democrats Gothmog Dec 2019 #60

Kick mcar Dec 2019 #61

Thank you. CaptainTruth Dec 2019 #63

"Bribery is a very complicated and charged allegation" Azathoth Dec 2019 #65

+1, ICA was written because of Nixon !! The 400 million for Ukraine wasn't for Trump campaign!! uponit7771 Dec 2019 #72

From Prof. Tribe Gothmog Dec 2019 #76

Abuse of Power is a great message! Bluesaph Dec 2019 #77

Bribery is a subset of abuse of power lame54 Dec 2019 #79

It can be seen that way, but that's not the way the framers would have seen it... markpkessinger Dec 2019 #93

Well that lays it out clear AllyCat Dec 2019 #89

Bribery was the strongest legal argument they had . . . markpkessinger Dec 2019 #92

I suspect some of us are average people. JoeDuck Dec 2019 #98

Very Ingersollman Dec 2019 #99