Dear Bernie supporters

[NCProgressive]

What is the deep-seated reason for your fellow supporters acting this way? Does any of you agree with that sentiment?

In my opinion, Bernie's angry rhetoric and ill-advised talk of a revolution coupled with demonizing the Democratic party are directly responsible.

Link to tweet

Christopher Haines @CHaines2015

Meaning this Convention's gonna be filled with so many Molotov cocktails after the Wall Street lobbyists that @TomPerez
put in charge of the convention process nominate Wall Street friend Joe Biden.

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Christopher Haines @CHaines2015

Bruh, by the time we're finished, there'll be no one left to arrest us. I'm surprised as an American that my own country has given up on fighting for what's right.

"Man has the right to deal with his oppressors by devouring their palpitating hearts.” - Jean-Paul Marat

[Thekaspervote]

1. As if there will be anything but a virtual convention. Virtual Molotov cocktails? Right

[Cha]

2. Christopher Haines should be reported for Inciting Violence.

And, Exactly.

[oasis]

41. Domestic terrorism. Our intelligence community needs to take

the appropriate measures long before convention date.

[AtheistCrusader]

4. I don't agree with that sentiment.

Are you suggesting that no Biden supporters have ever said anything stupid?

[sheshe2]

6. Please support your comment that a Biden supporter has done the same.

[AtheistCrusader]

10. Like the exact same words?

What's the point of these games? I don't support what he said, and am concerned that it could even be interpreted as a criminal act.

On a long enough timeline with enough people involved, someone will say something fucking stupid. It happens.
Biden doesn't own this either. Individuals say individual things.

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(Like Linda Sarsour, I will vote for Biden in November if his name is on the ballot.)

[sheshe2]

30. Not sure why you are posting a vid of Linda Sarsour.

I don't do vids, hard to hear them.

However Linda was fired/stepped down from the board of the women's march.

Sarsour stepped down from the Women's March organization in September 2019 along with Bob Bland and Tamika Mallory, following a controversy over the organization's handling of accusations of anti-semitism.[2]

[AtheistCrusader]

43. The relevant participant in the video is Lindy Li, Biden Delegate and

Treasurer of the PA Young Democrats organization. In this video, Sarsour states she will vote for Biden if he is the Democratic Nominee, and Li flat out refuses to pledge to vote for Sanders if Sanders is the Democratic Nominee (A terrible thing to say).

Been a lot of anti-Semitism flying around. Li stepped down as well, after sharing doctored videos that are allegedly anti-Semitic about Sanders.

[sheshe2]

44. Li and Sarsour

Both gave the woman's march a bad name, hate is not what we were about. It was a fight to get rid of them.

As for Li herself, she is wrong not to commit to vote blue no matter who. I always do and would never sit out an election.

Thanks for the synopsis.

[AtheistCrusader]

46. I didn't know much about that specific issue.

I was just addressing the original 'whataboutism' challenge.

It happens. We can acknowledge it and move on (or criticize the people doing it, which is fine) or we can dwell on it and distract from real issues.

[OnDoutside]

8. It's more than that though, considering the show they made of

themselves at the 2016 Convention ?

[AtheistCrusader]

12. I don't think it'll be the same issue at all.

The primary changes since 2016 have ameliorated most of my concerns about the primary process. And this is true of many Bernie supporters that I know.

Worst thing people can be doing right now, is jabbing Bernie supporters about stupid shit like this. Let it go. Condemn Christopher Haines (and maybe investigate it as incitement) and let it go. Don't try to rub it in every Bernie supporter's face, like we all need to answer for stupid shit like that.

[OnDoutside]

19. I'd like to think you are right but I have my doubts and that's what is

making the Biden supporters edgy. There's no trust that Bernie or his supporters will do the right thing, and that is not going to ease after news that he's fighting on.

[AtheistCrusader]

20. I will vote for Biden if he's on the ticket.

I am looking forward to a fair, normal convention, even though, like you I have some concerns about the amount of baggage some people are carrying. (Irrespective of candidate preference)

At this point, I expect Bernie is likely going to lose. I will accept that if it's the outcome.

I make no promises about anyone else, but while there are some vocal people with a lot of outrage, of the Bernie supporters I know, none are expressing crazy shit like that guy. Wow, he's completely lost it.

[OnDoutside]

21. I was hoping that it would be decided by May but if it isn't sorted

until June, it doesn't allow much time for healing and acceptance.

[AtheistCrusader]

22. Then we have further work to do on the primary system.

I think the least painful option is just complete the primary. Go through the motions. Certify the results. Be done with it.

In 2016, of the people I know, ALL outrage was related to primary issues like trying to end it early.

[OnDoutside]

24. It's just the delay because of CV that is the problem, but then would

Bernie have suspended his campaign as he initially intimated he would. It's not my money but continuing to accept campaign donations when he has no path, makes one wonder about his motivation for staying in the race.

[AtheistCrusader]

27. Unfortunately SARS-CoV-2 isn't going anywhere. We're going to have to solve the voting problem on

a much larger scale in November. Assuming 2 million Americans haven't died by then, and the election actually happens. (Not trying to be an ass, that's a very dark possibility we are now facing.)

As for his motives, I don't know. I can only guess, or make assumptions if I was in his position. I choose to assume good intentions in his case.

[NCProgressive]

9. He quotes Marat and a pro-Bernie website is called Jacobin

I think the subtle and insidious violent rhetoric is the hallmark of the "movement"

[AtheistCrusader]

16. Unacceptable.

He certainly doesn't speak for me. A further quote downthread is even more in the 'incitement' category, and warrants possible criminal charges.

[mcar]

13. Links to support your assertion?

Or please stop with the whataboutism.

[AtheistCrusader]

15. Already done.

[SCantiGOP]

5. Wonder if this guy knows how Marat ended up?

and this actually has nothing to do with "Bernie supporters." It was one, lone guy who happens to be incredibly lame and stupid and happens to support Sanders.

[AtheistCrusader]

14. Thank you!

I completely agree.

[Hav]

7. This is an unstable lunatic

who should get banned from Twitter. I think the only reaon it's still there is because it reached so few.

Another one:

Link to tweet

This person has issues. Report him and law enforcement might need to keep an eye on him.

[William769]

11. You have your answer right here in this thread. nt

[showblue22]

17. This guy is unhinged

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Link to tweet

[AtheistCrusader]

18. That dude has lost his shit, and will be receiving a visit from the SS.

They don't have a sense of humor either.

[Gore1FL]

23. One way to get Sanders supporters is to be condescending to them.

Good work!

[showblue22]

25. This appears to be his facebook

https://www.facebook.com/christopher.haines.355

[trueblue2007]

26. I REPORTED HIM.

[jorgevlorgan]

28. I dont think that has anything to do with Bernie

And more to do with the underlying factors behind the impending economic crash that is likely to be worse than the great depression. But shit, that's intense.

[zackymilly]

29. No worries. Bernie supporters won't show up, just like they don't show up to vote. zzzzzzz...n/t

[HarlanPepper]

31. The jokes gonna be on them when it's revealed there's not going to be a traditional convention.

[LostOne4Ever]

32. Those people existed before Bernie became well known

And will still exist long after he is forgotten.

They were the Nader and Stein voters in the past.

And I think they are more the result of a winner take all elections and the two party system that keeps them feeling as if their voice isn't being heard.

And NO I don't feel that way.

[NCProgressive]

33. Why does Bernie's campaign attract them and allow them to foment?

[LostOne4Ever]

34. Probably because he is giving them a voice they never had before

And he doesn't allow them to foment.

It takes time for anything or anyperson to learn to trust again when they feel they have been mistreated. I feel Bernie is pulling some of these people back to voting Democratic. It is going to take time for them to adjust and learn.

Some of them probably never will. But some will. And that means less green party votes. A good thing.

[NCProgressive]

35. He is really not giving them a voice

He is losing. A loss doesn't give any voice. He is creating a false hope that he will give them voice with unicorn policies but it is Bernie who is responsible for their disappointment. He is making the disappointment worse by not admitting that he lost because he was rejected by millions of voters. Bernie needs to drop out now and endorse Biden to minimize those people's disappointment and make them realize that with Biden, they still get 95% of what they want.

[LostOne4Ever]

36. A voice means more than just winning or losing

You can lose and lose and lose but still have a voice.

It is what happens with every major change. People vote one side loses but people see that there are a fair number who disagree. They listen and then more people change their mind. Another vote another loss but with the loss we see even more people now disagree. The process repeats itself until enough people change their minds that you win.

False hope? Do you think we can't see the handwriting on the wall? I don't have any false hope. None of my pro-Sanders friends have false hope. We all know Biden will win the nomination. What we all want is to be heard and acknowledged. That is what Bernie did in 2016. Most people expected him to only get 1-2% of the vote when that Campaign began. He got so much more and stunned the nation! He even got to influence the platform.

That is having a voice. That is why I and others are still supporting him despite the fact we know he won't win. it is what we did on all the causes the democratic party has achieved. How many times did we lose on Marriage Equality before we won?

Bernie isn't doing as well as he did in 2016 but he is still way way above the 1-2% everyone expected at the start of that campaign, and that gives his supporters a voice. That is what we want. That is why we want him to stay in.

But I feel like I and others keep on saying this over and over on here. But no-one listens.

[NCProgressive]

38. 2016 was an aberration because of widespread caucuses

When the caucuses were eliminated, so was Bernie.

He really doesn't have that much of a following and his slogans and platitudes, when seen through realistic lenses, are laughable.

Do you think religious leaders promising heaven give people a voice considering no one has ever seen if heaven exists?

[LostOne4Ever]

40. He still did far better than was ever expected

Even if you eliminate the caucuses. He was 50 points behind when he first ran.

If he doesn't have much of a following he wouldn't have won anything this time around. But he has won more than everyone else running against him except Biden.

Bad analogy aside, Given that religious people are a major voting block...yeah I think they do give people a voice.

EDIT: And I would like to point out this is feeling more like you are trying to convince me of something or debate me rather than trying to understand why Sander Supporters act the way they do.

[showblue22]

37. This guy is a violent nut job.

FBI needs to talk to this guy. Wasn't there a radicalized Bernie supporter that stabbed some people to death in Oregon?

Link to tweet

[dware]

39. Wow!!!!

This guy is fucking nuts!!
Hope he gets a very unpleasant visit from the Secret Service, who aren't known for their sense of humor.

This guy is a mass shooter waiting to happen.

[showblue22]

42. KnR

[Gothmog]

45. Andrew Cuomo is now more likely to be the Democratic nominee than Bernie Sanders,

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[Gothmog]

47. From the Hoarse Whisperer

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[Gothmog]

48. For this thread

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[Gothmog]

49. How 'Never Bernie' Voters Threw In With Biden and Changed the Primary

sanders was appealing only to 30% of the party and after South Carolina the rest of the party moved to Joe Biden to stop sanders.

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Rarely has political momentum flipped as quickly as it did in the first half of March, as Mr. Sanders lost serious ground to Mr. Biden before the coronavirus slowed their race. There are well-known reasons for the shift: Moderate candidates like Mr. Buttigieg and Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota rallied around Mr. Biden. He enjoyed demographic advantages, particularly with black voters. And turnout among young voters and liberal nonvoters did not surge, failing to reshape the electorate as Mr. Sanders had hoped.

But beyond ideology, race and turnout, a chief reason for Mr. Biden’s success has little to do with his candidacy. He became a vehicle for Democrats like Ms. King who were supporting other candidates but found the prospect of Mr. Sanders and his calls for political revolution so distasteful that they put aside misgivings about Mr. Biden and backed him instead.

In phone interviews, dozens of Democrats, mostly aged 50 and over, who live in key March primary states like Massachusetts, Virginia, Michigan and Florida, said that Mr. Biden’s appeal went beyond his case for beating President Trump. It was his chances of overtaking Mr. Sanders, the only candidate in the vast Democratic field they found objectionable for reasons personal and political.....

These voters’ willingness to unite against Mr. Sanders helped Democratic Party leaders stave off his insurgent campaign and has made Mr. Biden the all-but-certain Democratic nominee. The convergence behind Mr. Biden also highlights a critical difference between this year’s primary and what happened to the Republican Party in 2016. Four years ago, establishment Republicans were openly skeptical of Mr. Trump after his victories in early primary states, but a fractured field and split primary vote allowed him to amass an insurmountable delegate lead, reshaping the party in the process.....

Ahead of Mr. Sanders’s presidential run in 2020, his campaign did not concern itself with smoothing tensions among voters who supported Mrs. Clinton in 2016. He did not seek the endorsements of many party leaders, who were always unlikely to back him, but could have been swayed from being openly antagonistic to ambivalent.

As a result, after a strong finish in Iowa and wins in New Hampshire and Nevada, Mr. Sanders did not benefit from an assumed truth of presidential campaigns: that early-state victories help bring in voters from other factions. Instead, people like Lori Boerner of McLean, Va., said Mr. Sanders’s performance sent them searching for a candidate who could stop his rise, and after the South Carolina primary, they landed on Mr. Biden.

The vast bulk of the party does not like sanders which is why Joe Biden is going to the nominee

[Gothmog]

50. The benefit of the Democrats denouncing Sanders's selfishness

I am tired of sanders and his supporters demanding that we bend a knee and anoint sanders as the nominee. It may be better to simply give up on the 15% who will not vote for any real Democrat and move on

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If you are in the search for silver linings, one benefit of Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) pointlessly continuing his losing campaign is the freedom for Democrats to denounce him and his anti-party escapades. After years of humoring him, the vast majority of Democrats, from super-progressives to moderates, can now say out loud what they’ve said quietly: It has always been about Bernie. It’s not a movement, but rather a vanity project. ....

The problem, according to many Democrats, remains that 15 percent of Sanders supporters say in polling that they would vote for President Trump over Biden. This nugget actually makes the opposite argument: There is nothing that would satisfy some faction of the Sanders coalition that would rather blow up our democracy and reelect Trump. With people so irrational, the best response is to ignore them. They, like the MAGA-hat crowd, are unreachable and cannot be bargained with (e.g., more New Green Deal talk!). So do not try. No more outreach to Sanders, no more promised policy modifications, no more speaking slot at the convention. Enough

This would have some salutary effects.

First, it would make perfectly clear that Biden is not Sanders and not a crazy left-winger, as Trump would like to paint him in the campaign. Biden makes a sharp distinction between the “democratic socialist” crowd and his own brand of center-left politics. Since he cannot get the 15 percent of “Bernie or Bust” Democrats (or independents), he might as well make a strong play for moderate independents and disaffected Republicans. Cutting Sanders off effectively allows Biden to pitch to gettable swing voters, not waste time on unattainable Bernie Bros.

Second, freezing out Sanders will make governance in a Biden administration much easier and more cohesive. There will be no debt to be paid to Sanders, no advisers taken on to satisfy Sanders, and no weird and distracting policy initiatives to lead the new administration astray. This would be a center-left administration confident of its own governing agenda — and personally cohesive.

Third, it would free up constructive, smart progressive leaders such as Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) to lead that wing of the party. She has already begun that process, contributing bankruptcy and student loan forgiveness plans to the Biden campaign. With a practical, crafty progressive in the Senate (hopefully in the majority and able to lead on legislation), Biden would be able to broaden his appeal and cultivate allies in the Warren wing of the party.

In other words, shoving Sanders offstage opens up room for party builders and party reformers, putting aside unattainable proposals (e.g., Medicare-for-all) in favor of a smarter, more broadly acceptable agenda. (Biden would not need to fend off a Warren primary challenge, as Barack Obama did with Sanders in 2012.)

The party is never going to make the 15% to 25% of sanders supporters happy. 25% of sanders supporters either voted for trump, voted for a third party candidate like Stein or stayed home

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I am tired of trying to appease sanders supporters who are not going to be happy and there are real benefits in moving on and ignoring these voters.