I really like something Rob Reiner said tonight

[Dem4Life1102]

He brought up the 2000 election and Nader supporters saying Bush and Gore were the same. But if Gore had won then no Iraq war and a 20 year jump on climate change.

[Cha]

1. Thank you for this.. Good on Rob Reiner!

[sweetloukillbot]

2. I've said many times

I learned the price of third-party voting on 9/11, and I can never atone for it.

[rufus dog]

29. That one was understandable

I had rarely voted for a Dem up to that point. Clinton 92 was probably it. In 2000 I decided the risk was too large and voted for Gore. Since then I have never not voted Dem. Hated to vote for anyone who supported the Iraq war but did it.

That being said, the third party votes in 2016, those are really hard to understand.

[CaptYossarian]

42. 9/11 wouldn't have happened either because Gore would've listened

6 weeks earlier to whomever he had in Condi Rice's position.

That catastrophe is all on Cheney/Bush.

[sweetloukillbot]

43. Exactly. nt

[xxqqqzme]

50. Gore chaired the

Terrorist group Clinton put together. Dumbya was warned to keep Bin Laden in their sights. He put darth in charge. They had no meeting between January and September.

SCOTUS carried out the second coup.

I recently watched An Inconvenient Truth on a documentary channel.Ir=t is now 15 years old! Some of the receding glacier pictures and other information need updating but on the whole it holds up. I was incredulous how little has been done in the last 15 years.

It was deeply depressing to realize what was stolen from us and the absolfuckinglutely mess darth, rummy, rice and dumbya made. And we are still paying for it!

[CaptYossarian]

58. Michael Moore had said in one of his books that Shrub and bin Laden

were on the same board of directors for a small oil company. I read the book almost 20 years ago and don't recall the title or the name of the company, but much was said about their relationship. That's why Obama had to finish the job. It's most likely why we attacked the wrong country--on purpose.

[gollygee]

3. People did say that. People also said Hillary and Trump were the same

but imagine how different things would be if she'd been elected.

[Stinky The Clown]

9. Think about WHO said that in 2015.

He's still around.

[FM123]

4. So funny to hear that tonight. My daughter & I were just talking about Al Gore today.

What a different world this would have been (in so many ways) if Al Gore had been president.

[Tucker08087]

10. My son and I

Were talking about it yesterday! These kids are smart, involved, and fierce! I’m glad they are our future!

[FM123]

30. Yes, I agree. I am glad they are our future.

[LisaM]

5. And maybe no 9/11.

Bill Clinton commissioned Gore to do a report on airline security based on terrorist attacks that were beginning to happen around the world, and if Bush had implemented the recommendations in that report, 9/11 could have been averted (in fact, after 9/11, I saw one of the news magazine shows refer to the report, without ever mentioning that Al Gore wrote it and that it was the Gore Commission Report).

I'm guessing Al might have taken his own recommendations.

Of course, if you alter the course of history in one way, other problems happen - it's the nature of history, but I think we can all agree that he would have really made a difference as far as combating climate change (it makes me cross when people say that Democrats don't nominate good candidates, but then gripe about how important climate change is now).

[iscooterliberally]

38. That's the first thing I thought too.

The GWB administration really was incompetent. I would like to think that a Gore administration would have caught on to 9/11 before it happened.

[Woodycall]

51. And no Great Depression #2...

and the National Debt paid off. Elections have consequences. Big ones...

[eleny]

6. That made me pause, too

K&R

[TwilightZone]

7. Well, it was always a ridiculous assertion.

I'm not sure why people can't see the obvious, but one of my best friends used to play the "both sides are bad" game all the time. I have noticed that it tapered off recently. Maybe the obvious finally sunk in.

[The Revolution]

8. That was a good point

Saying that Bush and Gore were the same was always ridiculous.

‐Does anybody think Gore would have ignored intelligence about Bin Laden's plans?
-Would Gore have invaded Iraq?
-Would he have ordered the torture of prisoners of war?
-Would his administration have revealed the identity of a CIA agent for political retribution?
-Would he have botched the response to Katrina?

Plus a thousand other things. People saying the Democratic establishment is as big a problem as the Republicans really need to think about this.

In fact anyone thinking about sitting out the general election or voting third party should really think about how different the world might be if we had had a President Gore.

[oldsoftie]

11. Imagine where the US would be in solar if Reagan had kept Carter's programs going?

I bet we'd be far ahead of where we are now

[Progressive2020]

12. Al Gore

As far as I am concerned, Al Gore WAS elected President. The election was stolen by Republicans in a judicial coup. Gore would have been an extraordinary President. He was so pro-science and is a secular saint, as far as I am concerned, for his early alarm onthe Climate Crisis. As Reiner points out, we would not have gotten into the disasterous Iraq War had Gore been President.

It is also possible that 9/11 would have been thwarted. As a previous poster pointed out, Clinton put Gore in charge of a review of anti-terrorist airline security. One of Gore's recommendations would have made cockpit doors armored, locked, and secured. If that had been done, it is possible that the hijackers never would have gained control of those planes. Gore is a great man, and we were robbed of his Presidency by evil, little men. If we survive Climate Change, Al Gore will go down in history books as a hero.

[BigmanPigman]

13. Rob was the voice of reason on that stage tonight.

[Duppers]

14. Indeed.

I was troubled by the female Sanders' supporter's statements that went unchallenged.

[BigmanPigman]

15. I think Chris may be a Bernie supporter

so that could have something to do with it.

[Duppers]

19. Wasn't going to go there but I agree with you!

Last edited Tue Mar 3, 2020, 12:38 AM - Edit history (1)

I'm sorry but thinking this has made me lose respect for Chris. He did not moderate that discussion fairly.

We all know what Bernie's being the Dem candidate would result in. He will not beat tRump. Polls prove that.

I ghosted FB yrs ago but every blue moon, I read my notifications - one of my DINO friends stuck her toes out & posted just a pic of the Dem debate stage. NO comment, just a pic with candidates at their podiums.
One of her friends' replies to that post: "Socialism???????" That was it! That label is so toxic to the massive numbers of low-info voters in the country.

[Duppers]

36. Great discussion here...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287614065

[yaesu]

16. Gore lost mainly because he chose Lieberman as his running mate, a big mistake. nt

[Dem4Life1102]

23. A contributing factor

but a bigger factor was Nader and the purity left who made the GOP’s theft of that possible.

[rwsanders]

27. Biggest factor, most uninspiring VP selection since James Stockdale

But a centrist will win after all right?

[CaptYossarian]

45. At least Stockdale knew it at the debate.

"What am I doing here?"

[Recursion]

17. It's been a lie for 20 years

There's a lot of difference between the two parties. Any time someone denies that their credibility with me plummets.

[patphil]

21. Sixty years ago, my father told me...

the Republican Party never did a thing for the common man. He was right then, and even more right now.
There is a HUGE difference between the Democrats and the Republicans.

[RANDYWILDMAN]

18. Gore Won !!!!

The supreme court decided to stop counting the votes in Florida, a very anti democratic decision is there ever was one.

Nadar had something to do with it. Bush and the supreme court had more.

Maybe it we had taken to the streets then, we would be in the same place as now.

[Dem4Life1102]

22. Nader and his supporters

made the theft possible.

[Ferrets are Cool]

20. A lot of things would be different if the repugs had not stolen that election. nt

[Sogo]

24. Yes, that jumped out at me, too, when he said it....

[CBHagman]

25. It's high time someone said it.

2000 should really stand as a hideous reminder of what happens when the GOP and their enablers get away with controlling the narrative, policy, and, to some degree, history, because even though Gore won the popular vote, there was no tarnishing of the Bush administration, which was covered, for the most part, not a fluke of the electoral college but as the natural order of things. It was shocking to hear no peep of the word "corruption" in the transition the administration of someone whose legal team included the Scalia sons and whose EC win came through a state where his brother just happened to be governor. Does anyone really think a less well-connected candidate would have gotten away with all of that?

And the narrative they sold about Al Gore was even worse. He became a punchline, especially since it's the American way to love underdogs and hate losers, when the administration he might have had would have surely taken dramatically different approaches to everything from the environment to education to guns. And we'll never know how he might have handled an attack on American soil.

https://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/documents/2000-democratic-party-platform

All that said, I think the Republicans in Congress would have endeavored mightily to make his life a living hell and ensure he was a one-term president. They might even have succeeded. But we'll never know, and we'll also never know what good he might have done.

[zaj]

26. And possibly, no 9/11

... but that's hard to say without people freaking out at you.

[barbtries]

28. no 911.

He would be listening to the intelligence.
it'd be a different world.

[YOHABLO]

32. Not sure about the Nader supporter's impact.

I would say that the SCOTUS decision to not allow the recount in FL.to continue, is what killed Gore's Presidency.

[Dem4Life1102]

37. Nader made the recount possible

[Midnight Writer]

33. And remember, folks. We not only had a balanced budget, we had surpluses to pay down debt.

The first thing Bush did was went straight to the Republican standards; tax cuts and big military spending.

[Gore1FL]

34. Gore's biggest mistake was trying to woo moderates by choosing Lieberman.

Trying to get votes from the Susan-Collins-types of the general electorate has proven to be less-than-fruitful.

[rickyhall]

39. What ifs

What if Bobby had not been assassinated, won the nomination & the election?
No Nixon, the war may have ended sooner.
What if Carter had gotten the hostages released & was re-elected?
No Raygun, Bush, Bush & Trump. We might have missed billionaire oligarchs, 2 recessions & 3 wars.

[Dem4Life1102]

44. So are you comparing the actions of Nader voters

to those of foreign terrorists?

[rickyhall]

49. Not really

But I do believe there's more to Bobby's murder than Sirhan Sirhan acting alone. I'm guessing that's your terrorism angle. As for Nader, I don't think he effected the 2000 election as much Repugs cheating & pulling a Supreme Court Coup. I think every Repug since Nixon got worse (except maybe HW who called Supply Side "Voodoo Economics&quot .

But then again, these are my opinions like everybody else here.

[Dem4Life1102]

55. If it where not for Nader

there would have been no recount or Supreme Court coup.

[rickyhall]

59. I remember watching the state by state results the night of the 2000,

when suddenly Florida, with Jeb Bush governor, flipped from Gore to Bush exposing the Repug's cheating, then there the "hanging chads" and the rest. But it's all Nader's fault.

[Dem4Life1102]

60. Nader gave New Hampshire to Bush

If not for that Florida would have been irrelevant.

[Nitram]

40. Ive always said the same every time Gore's loss came up.

[karin_sj]

41. Wow...

What a monumental difference that one stolen election made. Just sickening to think of the lives lost, the damage done to the environment and the economy, and every other awful thing that has happened (and continues to happen) since that fateful election.

[CaptYossarian]

46. You've described every time a damn Republican enters the WH since Ike.

[OMGWTF]

47. No 9/11/01 Attack, no Afghanistan war, no Great Recession, etc.

[OMGWTF]

48. SCOTUS would be largely liberal justices.

[IndyOp]

52. Yep! Brilliant comment. I also liked...

what he said about Bernie - great ideas, but he doesn't believe that he'll be able to implement them. Reiner's been involved in running organizations and has experience decision-making with others and implementing policies.

[saidsimplesimon]

53. It's never too late?

Giving up hope and what, accepting defeat from the greedy climate deniers? Not talking about anyone reading this, I need frequent breaks. We all do.

[Efilroft Sul]

54. The 2000 election was the difference between the 21st century living up to its promise and...

…the current dystopia in which we currently live. That election marked the beginning of America's Great Leap Backward.

[Prof.Higgins]

56. Rob was advocating unity against Trump, but Bernie Sanders surrogate attacked

Joe Biden as being one of the "billionaire class" trying to stop their revolution. Sadly, the heat of this nomination battle sometimes causes well-intentioned Democrats to be overzealous in their criticism.

Reiner is spot on that a second Trump term will destroy our democracy and make it impossible to prevent global warming destruction of human life on earth.

[warmfeet]

57. He, and his father Carl, are gems.

Gems I say!