Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumWhy I think Sanders has the best chance of beating trump
1] He appeals to the same anti-establishment frustrations that trump does. That is why in 2016 many trump supporters said they would vote for Sanders, even though they had opposite positions on most issues.
2] Trump exploited peoples frustrations by inflaming their fears, anxieties, and prejudices. Sanders addresses peoples frustrations by giving them hope. Unlike the other candidates, except maybe Warren, Sanders has a message that is more than just Im not trump.
3] Sanders cannot be swift-boated like HRC or Biden. In his long career there hs never been a hint of scandal. His honesty and integrity is acknowledged by all.
4] Focus - Nothing distracts Bernie from his message. Trump is a master of distracting the press and public with trivialities and making the election about his opponent. But Bernie is totally focused on his message, and to smart to fall into any trap set for him. No matter what juvenile insults, lies, and accusations trump makes, Sanders will always stick to his message. If Sanders is the nominee I imagine the political conversation will go something like this:
Reporter: Senator, Trump has said you are a crazy old man. Your response?
Bernie: Medical care is a right not a privilege.
Reporter: Senator, Trump called your wife a fatty. What do you say to him?
Bernie: It is time for the top 1 percent to pay their fair share of taxes.
Reporter: Trump claims that your great-grandfather killed Abraham Lincoln.
Bernie: Public college should be tuition free.
5] He has been explaining his brand of socialism for 50 years and is very good at it. We all know that whoever is the nominee, the republicans will say he or she is a socialist. If Biden, Warren, or Buttigige is the nominee they will have to constantly explain why they are not a socialist. This puts them in a defensive position, which is never a good thing. If Sanders is the nominee he will say yes I am a socialist and this is what I believe.... And since Sanders has been explaining democratic socialism for 50 years, this puts him in the very position he wants.
6] The cold war has been over for 30 years. An entire generation has grown up without equating democratic socialism with communism and repressive authoritarian regimes.
7] People dont vote for technocrats like HRC, Gore, and Dukakis. They vote for a person who they believe understands them. Bernie connects with people. People feel that Bernie understands them and wants to help. He gives the impression of a gruff but kind-hearted grandpa who only wants what is best for you.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
evertonfc
(1,713 posts)conservative heads would explode if Sanders was President. lol
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Faux pas
(14,585 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
shenmue
(38,503 posts)What's a "technocrat"?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
jg10003
(974 posts)to reach people on an emotional level. It has been said that a presidential election is like High School. People vote for the charming class president (Bill Clinton), the cool guy who gets along with everyone (Obama), and the party dude (Bush 43). But they dont vote for the smartest kid, the one who reminds the teacher to give homework.
1988 - Dukakis campaigned on policy. Bush Sr. campaigned on the Pledge of Allegiance, the ACLU, and exploiting racism.
1992 - Based on an obscure textbook definition of "recession", Bush said there was no recession. Clinton said "I feel your pain".
2000 - Gore was the ultimate policy wonk. Bush Jr. was the guy you wanted to have a beer with.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Doremus
(7,261 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
cilla4progress
(24,589 posts)the moderates?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)Especially # 1, 4, and 6. I disagree with # 3 though - they find a way to swiftboat everyone. Look at what they are doing to Biden with this stupid Ukraine thing. He's never had a hint of corruption either, but they are making his son serving on the board of Burisma into the new E-mailgate.
I will say that around April 2016, my now husband, who is a right-leaning libertarian, and several of his friends with similar views had a laugh realizing that of the three candidates in the race at that point (Trump, Hillary and Bernie) they all found Bernie Sanders, the self-identified socialist, to be the least offensive of the three.
That said, my concerns about his electability are actually less about his views (although I am concerned about some pretty radical things he said in the past that will be used against him) and more about how many bridges he has burned with the party establishment - not just the last sitting Democratic president and the last Democratic nominee, but the rank and file activists and local party chairs whose support he will need to get elected. I am concerned that if he wins the nomination, especially if he isn't polling well against Trump at some point, TPTB in the Democratic Party go through the motions of supporting him but basically write off the presidential election as a lost cause and focus down-ballot. Bernie has pissed a lot of people off with his relentless attacks on the party, and they won't forget come November. FWIW, I think some of the reforms he pushed for and got in the primary process are a good thing, but he took it too far in 2016, making too many people believe that he earned the nomination and was cheated when that's not what happened.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Doremus
(7,261 posts)I was worried about that too but it seems Bernie has an extensive ground operation so it's less of an issue than it could be.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
scheming daemons
(25,487 posts)Democrats only win when we get wide swaths of the middle.
And Bernie can't get those.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Doremus
(7,261 posts)Plus no matter who if it's blue, right?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
katmondoo
(6,454 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
snowybirdie
(5,191 posts)No swiftboating! Ha tRump is a master of that. I choose my candidate by asking myself who will best right the wrongs of the current President.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
George II
(67,782 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Watchfoxheadexplodes
(3,496 posts)They just won't
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
doc03
(35,151 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)you do realize that, right?
And for FIVE years I've been asking someone, anyone to explain exactly what makes a politician "establishment" and why is Sanders somehow magically better than that?
Not to burst your bubble, but if Sanders had a snowball's chance to actually WIN and not just be a spoiler again, Republicans wouldn't be pimping him as a candidate. Hell, Trump would be asking Moscow for dirt on Sanders instead of Biden.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Mike 03
(16,616 posts)Your attempts to hit this issue head on are appreciated.
#1 and #2 are strong points.
The White House supposedly has a two foot thick opposition file on Bernie Sanders. I think they can Swift Boat him.
#4 Bernie is focused, and Trump has attention deficit disorder. Okay. Maybe there are some possibilities there.
#5 If I were Bernie, I would go with Chris Hedges' argument that our party has moved so far right that we're no longer able to see that what we consider outlandish socialist ideas are really mainstream in most first world countries, rather than wrestle with the word "socialist"
#6 Trump and company will teach an entire new generation to hate socialists.
#7 This one I strongly disagree with because those candidates failed for very different reasons. What those candidates have in common were varying degrees of social awkwardness (in the opinions of others, not really me) I would think a lot of people would put Bernie in the same category. He is standoffish. He's the one candidate I would not feel comfortable approaching in a casual setting.
But your post is a serious effort. It deserved a reply.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
jg10003
(974 posts)Bernie has made the arguement you refer to regarding #5. He often says that his ideas are within the democratic tradition of FDR and LBJ
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Mike 03
(16,616 posts)We're really lost track in this country of what is "far left". It's pretty ridiculous.
Thanks a lot for your post. This question gets asked a lot, but few people tackle it like you did.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DanTex
(20,709 posts)It's ironic, really, that establishment pundits and journalists try to pretend there's no such thing as the "establishment". Reminds me of the MSNBC guy who tried to pretend that Bloomberg is no more of a plutocrat than Bernie because both of them are millionaires.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)I keep going back to that phrase I heard several times from old white folks on a shuttle bus coming back from an LPGA golf tournament in Naples last November. They were willing to consider Democrats above Trump but everyone besides Biden and Bloomberg was dismissed as, "too far out there," meaning too liberal.
Those are the same voters who dismissed Andrew Gillum vs. Ron DeSantis last November, despite a poll lead for Gillum and a massively favorable situational landscape. The specifics were 46% of Floridians in the exit poll deeming Gillum too liberal for the state. I posted a related thread immediately that night because I had never seen anything comparable to that number while following political math since 1992. Then later I noticed that 42% of Georgians dismissed Stacey Abrams as too liberal for the state.
There are always indications in the midterms. I have no idea how we ignore that 46 and 42. It would attach to Sanders and also to Warren. They would be branded the easiest. It would be non-stop Socialist all day long. You would hear that word in coffee shops and bus stops and everywhere internet. I've mentioned many times that the GOP has intentionally back burnered that word for the past 6 months or so since they don't want to wear it out before full unleash during the general election.
It will be used on anyone we nominate but make no mistake it attaches and limits some more than others.
Elections are won based on preference, not turnout. I'll continue to repeat that sentence, as I have here since 2002. Turnout is always laughably overrated compared to raw preference. I don't see how we win the crucial swing voters if Bernie Sanders is the nominee. It would be a prideful loss, just like I remember my civics teacher in 7th grade never regretted his year-long support George McGovern in 1972 and we've still got Floridians insisting that nominating Andrew Gillum above boring moderate Gwen Graham was somehow the proper move.
Gillum motivated us, after all. Yes, I remember. Very rousing articulate speeches as all those scared swing voters calmly waited to vote against him, even if it meant supporting a joke like Ron DeSantis.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
highplainsdem
(48,731 posts)landslide, and the GOP will almost certainly regain control of the House and get a larger majority in the Senate.
And it will probably take the Democratic Party a couple of elections to recover from stumbling over that self-described-socialist cliff.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Gothmog
(144,005 posts)I am very worried about down ballot races. sanders is a very weak candidate and would be easy for trump to destroy. In addition to the well written 101 page memorandum with oppo on sanders with a 1000 pages of backup from the Clinton campaign trump has his own oppo file on sanders that would destroy such a weak and divisive candidate like sanders.
Link to tweet
trump had a two foot thick book of oppo research on Sanders http://www.newsweek.com/myths-cost-democrats-presidential-election-521044
So what would have happened when Sanders hit a real opponent, someone who did not care about alienating the young college voters in his base? I have seen the opposition book assembled by Republicans for Sanders, and it was brutal. The Republicans would have torn him apart. And while Sanders supporters might delude themselves into believing that they could have defended him against all of this, there is a name for politicians who play defense all the time: losers....
The Republicans had at least four other damning Sanders videos (I dont know what they showed), and the opposition research folder was almost 2-feet thick. (The section calling him a communist with connections to Castro alone would have cost him Florida.) In other words, the belief that Sanders would have walked into the White House based on polls taken before anyone really attacked him is a delusion built on a scaffolding of political ignorance.
sanders was such a weak primary candidate that the Clinton campaign did not use its oppo but trump would have fun destroying such a weak candidate like sanders
I will vote for the nominee of the party but I fear that the nomination of sanders will lead to a Speaker Kevin McCarthy
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Zolorp
(1,115 posts)HE was a Communist when I had joined the army to fight the Communists. He sided with Russia when I was willing to put my life on the line to defeat Russia.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
kevink077
(365 posts)I suspect Bernie will struggle with independents in the rust belt in a decent economic time. They will say we dont like trump but Bernie is risky for my 401k. Bernie would win the popular vote but we need to win the Electoral College..
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden