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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:45 PM Jan 2020

New Paul Krugman column: Biden, Sanders, Social Security and Smears

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/20/opinion/biden-sanders-social-security.html


While the news media has been focused on the “spat” between Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, something much more serious has been taking place between the Sanders campaign and Joe Biden. Not to sugarcoat it: The Sanders campaign has flat-out lied about things Biden said in 2018 about Social Security, and it has refused to admit the falsehood.

This is bad; it is, indeed, almost Trumpian. The last thing we need is another president who demonizes and lies about anyone who disagrees with him, and can’t admit ever being wrong. Biden deserves an apology, now, and Sanders probably needs to find better aides.

That said — and this is no excuse for the Sanders camp — it would be good to have Biden explain why, in the more distant past, he went along with the Beltway consensus that Social Security needed to be pared back.

First, about that Biden smear: In 2018 Biden gave a speech attacking Paul Ryan, the then-speaker of the House, for wanting to cut taxes on the rich and pay for those tax cuts by cutting Social Security and Medicare. There was nothing in his remarks that should bother progressives.

However, a Sanders adviser recently circulated a snippet from the video of the event that made it appear that Biden was actually supporting Ryan’s position and calling for Social Security cuts. A few days later a newsletter from the Sanders campaign quoted Biden out of context and made the same claim.

If you want a parallel, it’s as if I were to say, “Some white nationalists claim that Jews are responsible for all our problems,” and a political campaign put out a release saying, “Krugman says ‘Jews are responsible for all our problems.’”

Biden did make a misstep in his counterattack, mislabeling the misrepresented video clip as “doctored,” but that doesn’t mean he’s not still due an abject apology. Instead, however, the Sanders campaign has doubled down. Rather than admitting that it smeared a rival, the campaign is going around claiming that Biden has a long record of trying to cut Social Security. There is, unfortunately, some truth in that claim — but it doesn’t excuse either the original lie or the refusal to admit error.


-snipping paragraphs about how Biden's view that Krugman disagrees with was a consensus view, shared by Barack Obama; Krugman also explains that Biden is calling for an expansion of Social Security benefits now=


None of this, however, justifies the Sanders campaign’s lying about recent statements by a man who, after all, may well be the Democratic presidential nominee — and who would, whatever his centrist history, be infinitely more progressive than the current occupant of the White House. And the smearing of Biden reinforces the concerns some of us have about Sanders.

There has always been an ugly edge to some of Sanders’s support, a faction of followers who denounce anyone raising questions about his positions — even Warren! — as a corrupt capitalist shill. Until now, however, you could argue that Sanders himself wasn’t responsible for the bad behavior of some of his supporters.

You can’t make that argument now. The dishonest smears and the doubling down on those smears are coming from the top of the Sanders campaign; even if they aren’t coming directly out of Sanders’s mouth, he could and should have stopped them. The fact that Sanders isn’t apologizing to Biden and replacing the people responsible says uncomfortable things about his character.

I don’t want to go overboard here. While there is a Trumpian feel to some of what we’re seeing from the Sanders campaign, Bernie Sanders is no Donald Trump. As we’ve just seen, there are some real issues with the people surrounding him, but they’re nothing like Trump’s gang of thugs. And in practice a Sanders presidency, like a Biden presidency, would be a vast improvement, morally as well as substantively, on what we have now.

But right now, Sanders and his campaign are behaving badly, and they need to be called on it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
21 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
New Paul Krugman column: Biden, Sanders, Social Security and Smears (Original Post) highplainsdem Jan 2020 OP
Well there was squirecam Jan 2020 #1
The apology wasn't by the person who made the obnoxious smear. Why not? George II Jan 2020 #3
True squirecam Jan 2020 #5
That's a serious rebuke of Sanders. Hoyt Jan 2020 #2
That's an understatement. Maybe this is why Sanders apologized. highplainsdem Jan 2020 #4
That's what I was thinking.. otherwise.. Cha Jan 2020 #12
And poll numbers?? Thekaspervote Jan 2020 #14
Oh indeed! This followed by the scathing NYT snippet Thekaspervote Jan 2020 #16
Joe Scarborough tweet about this column: Jarring words from ⁦⁦@PaulKrugman ⁩ ⁩regarding Bernie Sande highplainsdem Jan 2020 #6
Krugman's being attacked by Sanders supporters now. Predictable. highplainsdem Jan 2020 #7
Oh, jeez PatSeg Jan 2020 #8
A sampling of the attacks on Krugman: highplainsdem Jan 2020 #9
Okay, that sounds very trollish PatSeg Jan 2020 #13
Of course! peggysue2 Jan 2020 #10
My money is on Paul Krugman! Cha Jan 2020 #15
Mine, too! highplainsdem Jan 2020 #17
Well well well.. 'bout time! And, who knew Cha Jan 2020 #11
I agree, Cha. It was about time. highplainsdem Jan 2020 #20
KICK! Cha Jan 2020 #21
I get it. zipplewrath Jan 2020 #18
K&R Tarheel_Dem Jan 2020 #19
 

squirecam

(2,706 posts)
1. Well there was
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:47 PM
Jan 2020

An apology for the corruption smear.

But Sanders will never replace the responsible staff or surrogates. So this stuff is likely to continue.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
3. The apology wasn't by the person who made the obnoxious smear. Why not?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:52 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

squirecam

(2,706 posts)
5. True
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:54 PM
Jan 2020

But I would rather he apologize then none at all.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
2. That's a serious rebuke of Sanders.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:50 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
4. That's an understatement. Maybe this is why Sanders apologized.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:53 PM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,154 posts)
12. That's what I was thinking.. otherwise..
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:55 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(32,755 posts)
16. Oh indeed! This followed by the scathing NYT snippet
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:59 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
6. Joe Scarborough tweet about this column: Jarring words from ⁦⁦@PaulKrugman ⁩ ⁩regarding Bernie Sande
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:00 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
7. Krugman's being attacked by Sanders supporters now. Predictable.
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:16 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

PatSeg

(47,399 posts)
8. Oh, jeez
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:32 AM
Jan 2020

This is so divisive, a vicious cycle of attacks and counter-attacks. Sometimes feels very cultist.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
9. A sampling of the attacks on Krugman:
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:46 AM
Jan 2020
Um, so Krugman and NYT are straight up saying Bernie is Trumpian now.

One wonders if these folks are on a mission to stop something momentous from happening—say, the presidency of an actual progressive who is unwilling to pander to the liberal elite?


Paul Krugman has finally stopped pretending that he is decent human being. The protection of Biden for the Party is more important than Biden's 40 years of lies, corruption, racism, laziness, and general stupidity. No longer people other than elite matter to Paul.



All of the establishment capitalists that have benefited from the corporate corruption in both parties are deathly afraid of Bernie Sanders and his working class/democratic social mission. Krugman would be at the top of that list.



In 2016, Krugman did the same thing, abandoning economic positions he had held months earlier to criticize Sanders for holding them. Face it, Krugman is angling for a job in a conservative Democrat administration. His columns from here out will be anti-Bernie.



Tone policing and bad takes are pretty much Krugman’s trademarks. Plus, none of these centrist shitheads were for Warren until Bernie was the front runner.



For some inscrutable reason Krugman hates Bernie. That’s been apparent since 2015. Back then I thought maybe Paul wanted to be the Treasury Secretary in the Hillary Administration.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

PatSeg

(47,399 posts)
13. Okay, that sounds very trollish
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:56 AM
Jan 2020

I'm sure there are actual Sanders supporters who are part of the attacks, but much of this reeks of trolls and bots. "Liberal elites"? Meanwhile, you don't get much more liberal than Paul Krugman.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(10,828 posts)
10. Of course!
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:48 AM
Jan 2020

No one dare criticize even when couching it in reasonable terms.

Remind you of anyone else's diehard supporters???

Deja vu all over again!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,154 posts)
15. My money is on Paul Krugman!
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:57 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,154 posts)
11. Well well well.. 'bout time! And, who knew
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:52 AM
Jan 2020

it would be Paul Krugman who called out the BS campaign like this?!!!

TY,hpd

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

highplainsdem

(48,968 posts)
20. I agree, Cha. It was about time.
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 10:10 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

zipplewrath

(16,646 posts)
18. I get it.
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 02:36 AM
Jan 2020

I'm not exactly a Trump supporter. I'm not even a supporter of any particular candidate. . But the last thing am going to get involved is some imaginary discussion about whether people should have access to health care. Lol

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
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