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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:02 AM Mar 2019

I believe that Sanders is not electable. You can argue, but this is true

Last edited Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:10 AM - Edit history (1)

Sanders supporters may think this is not true. But it is. His ideas are ok, but he is not ok. If he were nominated as our candidate, we would have an in fight all over again. He was loyal, he was not loyal..blah, blah, and blah...This in fight is the very last thing we need .

I worked for George McGovern in 1972. (a while ago) His ideas were totally correct. He was almost from the beginning a poor candidate destined to lose. Terrible in fight from the beginning. Bernie is the same. He will lose. It is his stature, it is how he acts, it is offensive to some. He will cause an in fight in our party that will destroy our chances to win.

again...this in fight is the very last thing we need
....again... this in fight is the very last thing we need


We need to be totally united to beat them, complete and total. Sanders is not the person to do this. You may think so, but you are wrong. Sanders has made too many enemies in this party to gain total and complete support. Anybody that will unify our party is the answer..

Sanders is not the answer.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
321 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
I believe that Sanders is not electable. You can argue, but this is true (Original Post) Stuart G Mar 2019 OP
If Sanders is the nominee I will unite behind him 100%. mobeau69 Mar 2019 #1
:) No worry we'd have to gird our loins for that. Hortensis Mar 2019 #72
don't be so sure - it's our nightmare scenario.... getagrip_already Mar 2019 #114
I never vote in a primary with my heart. I have always voted for the primary candidate Autumn Mar 2019 #125
not fear... getagrip_already Mar 2019 #127
I always vote wisely. I vote for the Democratic candidate in the primary who best Autumn Mar 2019 #129
Me too. And then I enthusiastically get behind the eventual nominee emulatorloo Mar 2019 #186
:) Mine either, but they all share my principles Hortensis Mar 2019 #201
Yes that's what we do. The end game is to put the Democrat in office. Autumn Mar 2019 #207
Yes debates are key for me as well emulatorloo Mar 2019 #208
Same to you. Autumn Mar 2019 #212
I'm a head-over-heart kind of gal. ALWAYS. calimary Mar 2019 #221
one question that comes to mind G_j Mar 2019 #236
You have a right to express your opinion but Your stats on how Sanders supporters voted are bizarre. hedda_foil Mar 2019 #131
... lapucelle Mar 2019 #154
... lapucelle Mar 2019 #155
Thank you. I stand corrected. hedda_foil Mar 2019 #161
NP lapucelle Mar 2019 #215
Jill Stein is now officially the Ralph Nader of 2016. Cha Mar 2019 #172
Jill Stein wasn't the only one who tried to convince voters that Trump and HRC were both "evil". N/T lapucelle Mar 2019 #219
Yep. calimary Mar 2019 #224
That's right.. she Cha Mar 2019 #234
BOOM! calimary Mar 2019 #223
Misogyny pure and simple Dream Girl May 2019 #302
Those were the republicans Bernie won over that went back to the repub candidate onit2day Mar 2019 #192
Do you have a link with stats showing that BS to Trump voters were mostly Republicans? lapucelle Mar 2019 #214
That is pure speculation. Bernie has nothing to do with Stein and worked hard to get dems elected onit2day Mar 2019 #187
talk about revisionist history.. getagrip_already Mar 2019 #237
Too bad what it "sounds like" to you.. BS is .. Cha Mar 2019 #250
BS hired 3 stein voters for Cha May 2019 #299
I don't think winning the primary BlueFlorida Mar 2019 #240
Guess that's why he leads in all the polls, why polls showed him beating Trump onit2day Mar 2019 #177
You are relying on polls in a hypothetical matchup TexasTowelie Mar 2019 #200
Hypothetical matchups n/t BlueFlorida Mar 2019 #241
NO he Does NOT. Cha Mar 2019 #251
THIS!!!! +1,000 InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2019 #280
With less than 30% support in the party, sanders is not electable Gothmog Apr 2019 #282
True story musicman65 May 2019 #290
sanders is polling far below 30%now Gothmog May 2019 #291
So what you're saying is Lazy Daisy Mar 2019 #2
I know right? Hassin Bin Sober Mar 2019 #3
I will support the nominee of the party Gothmog Mar 2019 #9
Yes, unlike much of Sanders' top campaign staffers, we'll vote for the DEMOCRATIC nominee. George II Mar 2019 #90
And. sheshe2 Mar 2019 #12
The terms of service for DU members state that they can be banned if they discourage other members TexasTowelie Mar 2019 #24
Exactly this LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #77
Because E. Warren would be vice president and Bernie believes He is best candidate& wants the job onit2day Mar 2019 #191
It's far more likely that a Sanders/Warren would be a disaster. TexasTowelie Mar 2019 #199
Doesn't that appear to be the primary goal BlueFlorida Mar 2019 #242
For the same reason people want Joe Biden. We like the policies!!! vsrazdem Mar 2019 #252
So if Sanders loses Trumpocalypse Apr 2019 #274
How can sanders win key primaries with no support from African American voters? Gothmog Mar 2019 #8
He can't. sheshe2 Mar 2019 #13
Of course he can FBaggins Mar 2019 #61
He did in 2016 onit2day Mar 2019 #193
Which states are those? TexasTowelie Mar 2019 #202
I'd love an expansion on this. Socal31 Mar 2019 #15
Good questions. LuvNewcastle Mar 2019 #132
I wouldn't say no support JonLP24 Mar 2019 #31
Higher than Kamala Harris and Corey Booker? I don't think so. yardwork Mar 2019 #60
Yes higher than Kamala Harris or Booker JonLP24 Mar 2019 #63
The Intercept?! Get that Russian propaganda off DU. yardwork Mar 2019 #113
They quote an actual poll JonLP24 Mar 2019 #122
Linking to the Intercept is an automatic loss of credibility. yardwork Mar 2019 #136
That is funny because Rachel Maddow used the Intercept whenever they break stories JonLP24 Mar 2019 #197
So on that poll, namahage Mar 2019 #143
Don't worry. They do this with every poll that shows Bernie up. vsrazdem Mar 2019 #255
LOL. If he had been anointed last time, he would be president vsrazdem Mar 2019 #253
Where were the African American voters at the recent event in South Carolina? Gothmog Mar 2019 #140
I watched it live JonLP24 Mar 2019 #198
Less than 4% of crowd was African American Gothmog Mar 2019 #209
I'm not sure I trust Washington Post which has a strong anti progressive bias JonLP24 Mar 2019 #211
I like living in the real world and I have a subscription to the Washington Post Gothmog Mar 2019 #213
I live in the real world too and the Washington Post bias is obvious JonLP24 Mar 2019 #220
Where are the non whites at this rally? Gothmog Mar 2019 #222
I'm not into counting people in a crowd JonLP24 Mar 2019 #229
I was a Clinton delegate to the National Convention Gothmog Mar 2019 #232
I didn't know you were a at the National Convention as a delegate. Stuart G Apr 2019 #269
This was not a fun experience Gothmog Apr 2019 #271
Huh? Thekaspervote May 2019 #303
Short answer GWC58 Mar 2019 #45
He's hired nina and briebrie to run cover for him and cornell to Kahuna7 Mar 2019 #62
That's nonsense. He has a great deal of support from A-A voters. He won key primaries last time onit2day Mar 2019 #179
No, sanders got little support from this demographic in the real world Gothmog Mar 2019 #182
Where were these supporters at an event at an African American church??? Gothmog Mar 2019 #246
No. sheshe2 Mar 2019 #10
Funny how his staff couldn't vote for the Democrat, but expect unity now... Kahuna7 Mar 2019 #64
+1 betsuni Mar 2019 #71
+++ sheshe2 Mar 2019 #126
+∞ LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #128
Seriously! Somebody should tell Bernie, who's leading all fellow Democratic candidates who've InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #11
Where in the world did you get that metric? fleabiscuit Mar 2019 #30
Could've sworn I said all fellow Democrats who've declared they're running in 2020... InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #97
Interesting that a guy who hasn't even announced yet is in first place, by a LOT. George II Mar 2019 #99
Joes waiting until april to get in so he doesn't have to show .. aidbo Mar 2019 #119
He will not win the nomination. He'll probably be in the lower tier of candidates delegate-wise... George II Mar 2019 #91
Maybe we should wait to find out! InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #98
We don't need another center right corporate dem with years of baggage that's for sure onit2day Mar 2019 #194
Why not at least nominate a progressive Democrat this time who is more representative of what InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #206
No. But we need more than regular voters coming out to vote. We need passionate, all out, support -- pnwmom Mar 2019 #35
He is saying... bobGandolf Mar 2019 #40
It is possible to support a candidate and work hard for them... brooklynite Mar 2019 #55
I agree that it is pretty basic common knowledge. WeekiWater Mar 2019 #56
Why is that funny? yardwork Mar 2019 #57
+∞ LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #81
No, he's saying that moderate Republicans and Independents will never vote for a socialist LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #79
I don't think anyone said that at all. And you're talking about "making this shit up"? George II Mar 2019 #87
Will they receive a special dispensation because they don't like Bernie? Autumn Mar 2019 #111
No u can't Daisy...these endless Bernie bashin threads are gettin repetitive & frankly a lil boring. InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #152
They bash every post a Bernie supporter puts up and when there aren't any, vsrazdem Mar 2019 #254
Beyond desperate... and mostly just sad. InAbLuEsTaTe Mar 2019 #256
What he's saying.. and it's Cha May 2019 #313
For all candidates we need to think how they can handle the republican attack machine. California_Republic Mar 2019 #4
Mayor Pete has a LOT working for him to offset the attack machine for being gay mr_lebowski Mar 2019 #18
"I have a decent amount of faith he can handle the attack machine ... True Dough Mar 2019 #46
All good points N/T bobGandolf Mar 2019 #41
They'll go right past the socialist label Mr.Bill Mar 2019 #158
I agree-- he seems to be the "Trump of the Left" preferring fighting to governing... TreasonousBastard Mar 2019 #5
I agree, Stuart! Just look at the history. Cha Mar 2019 #6
I also believe that sanders is not electable Gothmog Mar 2019 #7
I know I won't forget GWC58 Mar 2019 #47
I believe Sen. Sanders is electable. You can argue, but this is true Devil Child Mar 2019 #14
Thank you. shanny Mar 2019 #116
It is a bit much and over the top IMO shanny Devil Child Mar 2019 #145
As it stands currently, Biden is the most electable in the GE Socal31 Mar 2019 #16
I don't understand why people think Biden is electable JonLP24 Mar 2019 #29
The numbers suggest otherwise. Socal31 Mar 2019 #32
This is where I based my comment off of JonLP24 Mar 2019 #33
Data is more credible are this juncture than op-eds. Socal31 Mar 2019 #36
The OP is saying Sanders is not electable and not providing any data JonLP24 Mar 2019 #37
Socialism is the biggest gaffe out there. R B Garr Mar 2019 #65
Most people polled equate "socialism" with equality JonLP24 Mar 2019 #69
Democratic Socialism DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2019 #108
Actually, most people equate socialism with government control. R B Garr Mar 2019 #109
Most people according to the poll said equality JonLP24 Mar 2019 #244
A poll, one, doesn't change the government R B Garr Mar 2019 #247
I'm sure that when the Republicans were calling Obama a "socialist," namahage Mar 2019 #243
Me too. shanny Mar 2019 #117
But Bernie isn't the past? TexasTowelie Mar 2019 #203
Bernie has an "Established in 1990" plaque on his office door. betsuni Mar 2019 #204
On DU he is not treestar May 2019 #294
I already went through the "electable" arguments last time JonLP24 May 2019 #296
I also think that Joe Biden is the most electable candidate Gothmog Mar 2019 #141
I agree.....100%! chillfactor Mar 2019 #17
And he thinks the reason Trump won was because Dems ignored the working class. betsuni Mar 2019 #19
Yes, he's dead set on that.. Cha Mar 2019 #21
Keeping a straight face here. sheshe2 Mar 2019 #25
That's because Bernie has a yuuuuuge ego. yardwork Mar 2019 #59
In a nutshell, yep. LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #82
I always liked Bernie but you say you know best. rusty quoin Mar 2019 #20
i hear various... Mike Nelson Mar 2019 #22
I agree with you, but not for the same reasons. RDANGELO Mar 2019 #23
I still haven't figured out which candidate I like most Jarqui Mar 2019 #26
I don't know why this point is always overlooked: shanny Mar 2019 #118
"there is a large and virulent anti-Bernie faction here and I worry about PUMAs." Jarqui Mar 2019 #121
Makes sense. shanny Mar 2019 #134
There are a couple that are very unlikely for me Jarqui Mar 2019 #135
Why does this no infighting privilege other candidates? JonLP24 Mar 2019 #27
Time will tell, however any candidate not releasing their tax returns OnDoutside Mar 2019 #28
Only two Democratic candidates have released them Mr Tibbs Mar 2019 #150
Out of how many who have actually declared? (nt) ehrnst Mar 2019 #257
agree! Thekaspervote Mar 2019 #34
The question for me is vlyons Mar 2019 #38
Yes some assholes will Freddie Mar 2019 #43
Or vote for Jill LIES stein like Cha Mar 2019 #49
Like BS's campaign co-chair, and his speechwriter, and his press secretary, and . . . LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #86
Yeah, like those suckers who encouraged Cha Mar 2019 #89
Since most Sanders supporters voted for Hillary in 2016 I think they will again. We know the Nanjeanne Mar 2019 #73
Did you vote for her? lunamagica Apr 2019 #283
Of course. Dont know anyone of my Bernie supporter friends who didn't. But we are all Nanjeanne Apr 2019 #284
Almost certainly, because they will double down on the "he got robbed" canard LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #84
If you look at some of his top staffers, they won't stay home but they won't vote for the Democrat. George II Mar 2019 #102
My word, never thought I'd see this OP. bobGandolf Mar 2019 #39
Thank you for this Freddie Mar 2019 #42
2016 changed things KayF Mar 2019 #44
You bet 2016 changed things. It's called Cha Mar 2019 #48
The "safe candidate lost", because some self-identified progressives refused to vote for the still_one Mar 2019 #66
Exactly LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #170
She had 3 opposition campaigns working against her. R B Garr Mar 2019 #67
+1. Opponents supercharged by Russian analytics and disinformation dalton99a Mar 2019 #88
Trump/Stein/Sanders/Putin/USM$M******! Cha Mar 2019 #93
Yes, indeed - Fox News and CNN being the most prominent 24/7 megaphones dalton99a Mar 2019 #95
& Andrea Mitchell.. But her emails. Cha Mar 2019 #96
And, as well as those you mentioned Cha Mar 2019 #92
And I believe that Sherman A1 Mar 2019 #50
who thought trump was electable? pick your favorite candidate and Kurt V. Mar 2019 #51
A lot of people thought Trump was electable; that's why we tried to warn Sanders supporters LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #80
Agreed. The past will be the same as the future. democratisphere Mar 2019 #52
+Millions! Cha Mar 2019 #53
If Bernie got the nomination, I have no doubt he'll go toe to toe with Trump. Kanoko Mar 2019 #54
BS is too Divisive.. he's made it clear Cha Mar 2019 #68
He has hired senior staff who are hostile to the Democratic party. ehrnst Mar 2019 #70
+1 dalton99a Mar 2019 #101
Bernie believes if he isn't the democratic nominee njhoneybadger Mar 2019 #58
Exactly. It's why he says in his rally speeches that he will support the Dem nominee and Nanjeanne Mar 2019 #76
A lot of similarities for sure. -NT. Amimnoch Mar 2019 #83
+1 dalton99a Mar 2019 #124
The single most important idea that we have in this forum in this group of people: honesty. Stuart G Mar 2019 #74
Bernie was never vetted in the 2016 primary campaign. kstewart33 Mar 2019 #105
Unelectable AND damaging the chances for the rest imo. Amimnoch Mar 2019 #75
Yes, and there is proof..if you accept it. Stuart G Mar 2019 #85
Amen! Cha Mar 2019 #94
Great post. dalton99a Mar 2019 #104
Sanders is having no friction with the other candidates Mr Tibbs Mar 2019 #151
Google" David Sirota" "journalistic ethics" "political operative." ehrnst Mar 2019 #230
Sanders is wasting people's time and energy. And they will be angry when he goes nowhere. Again. PubliusEnigma Mar 2019 #78
Of course he's not electable. NurseJackie Mar 2019 #100
A guy that ran an extension cord to his basement apartment because he couldn't pay his bills LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #103
Anybody that reads my posts knows I am one of the most sanguine posters on our chances. DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2019 #106
The abomination has the entire GOP apparatus behind him dalton99a Mar 2019 #107
The data suggests Trump is an underdog and I believe he is. DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2019 #112
The idiot is no Superman. But we need a strong turnout driven by a strong ticket. dalton99a Mar 2019 #115
Exactly. You want to get people to vote for him again? Nominate a socialist carreer politician LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #123
Counterpoint: you're wrong. aidbo Mar 2019 #110
OK, I won't argue that you believe Bernie is not electable BobMcWan Mar 2019 #120
Thanks for this reply, Bob. RobertDevereaux Mar 2019 #133
How exactly will any president achieve Medicare for all? yardwork Mar 2019 #138
I will vote for our parties nominee no matter who. Stuart G Mar 2019 #139
I'm in Florida radical noodle Mar 2019 #196
If it's a referendum election Trump is likely done. If he can make it a choice he isn't. DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2019 #130
Thank goodness we have you to tell us what is true. aikoaiko Mar 2019 #137
Opinion: The myth of ideology, and why Democrats' energy isn't all on the left Gothmog Mar 2019 #142
So do you "believe," or is it "true"? Which is it? MadDAsHell Mar 2019 #144
If you say so. dogman Mar 2019 #146
I agree with the OP, to a point, as a Sanders supporter in 2016 BlueWI Mar 2019 #147
I agree. we can do it Mar 2019 #148
Last point - I want to lift up the name of George McGovern. BlueWI Mar 2019 #149
We need a candidate who is a loyal Democrat, who is a member of the Doodley Mar 2019 #153
"believe" being the key word. we have religious freedom, thank God. pdsimdars Mar 2019 #156
I am voting Democrat in November. Male of this what you will robbedvoter Mar 2019 #157
Interesting Freudian slip LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #168
I think that Sanders would take a coast to coast beating... MarianJack Mar 2019 #159
So do I. And then we are truly screwed. We can nominate someone who Demsrule86 Mar 2019 #189
Good Analysis Mjolnir1956 Mar 2019 #160
e: "We need to be totally united to beat them" thesquanderer Mar 2019 #162
Agree with you about Sanders zentrum Mar 2019 #163
It's definitely true that you believe that. No argument there. Gore1FL Mar 2019 #164
You admit that you believe Sanders isn't electable. man4allcats Mar 2019 #165
The OP is right.. BS is too Divisive. Cha Mar 2019 #169
Why not let the OP speak for her/himself? man4allcats Mar 2019 #174
The OP has spoken for hmself.. didn't you Cha Mar 2019 #175
So you admit that you and the OP have nothing more than opinion. man4allcats Mar 2019 #178
BS is too Divisive.. our Dems are more Cha Mar 2019 #181
I appreciate the match-up info. man4allcats Mar 2019 #185
And who is? quakerboy Mar 2019 #166
If BS is the answer ... it must be a terrible question n/t SFnomad Mar 2019 #167
Infight? RadicalProgressive Mar 2019 #171
Um. No. OhZone Mar 2019 #173
Exactly, OhZone! Aravois and Krugman weigh in on that, too.. Cha Mar 2019 #180
NO. BS is too divisive by his own Cha Mar 2019 #176
Last time around, BS supporters tried to blame things on Secretary Clinton SFnomad Mar 2019 #195
Messina Says Sanders Can't Beat Trump Gothmog Apr 2019 #273
Bernie is hoping for a brokered convention. Gothmog Apr 2019 #286
Maybe you are right or maybe you are wrong but regardless if Sanders should win the nomination cstanleytech Mar 2019 #183
You haven't learned yet what a corporate centrist with years of baggage does for the race? onit2day Mar 2019 #184
A Warren Sanders ticket will lose badly in the rustbelt states we must win. Demsrule86 Mar 2019 #190
NO seta1950 Mar 2019 #188
It's way too soon to be having this discussion. Let the process flow first. YOHABLO Mar 2019 #205
Sanders will never be the nominee for two reasons madville Mar 2019 #210
I have removed some language from the original post. Sorry if I offended anyone Stuart G Mar 2019 #216
Didnt see the original post. For me this is simple, I will ONLY vote for a Democrat. Eliot Rosewater Mar 2019 #227
Shocking, another anti-Bernie post. nt USALiberal Mar 2019 #217
I stated an opinion in the original post. Stuart G Mar 2019 #218
I expect this to be the case for supporters of almost every candidate LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #228
Time for Ideas Not a Horserace: Campaign? McKim Mar 2019 #225
I agree customerserviceguy Mar 2019 #226
I agree, and for one primary reason: MineralMan Mar 2019 #231
Complete agreement, on all points LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #233
If he's nominated don't continue infighting. Aaron Pereira Mar 2019 #235
If he is nominated, I will zealously promote him to the very best of my ability. Period. LongtimeAZDem Mar 2019 #238
If he is nominated, I will support him as best I can. With money and work. We must win Stuart G Apr 2019 #265
What "institutional support within the Party" that "went to Nixon" are you talking about? (nt) ehrnst Mar 2019 #239
I don't know about "1972" but funny he didn't bring up 2016.. Cha Mar 2019 #249
You mean like the "mistake" they made Cha Mar 2019 #248
Never heard of Steven Leser before, glad to see him excited about Buttigieg Celerity Mar 2019 #258
The Democrats Trump Fears Most Gothmog Mar 2019 #245
If the economy is strong, trump can win Gothmog Mar 2019 #259
You are correct. He is not the answer. NurseJackie Mar 2019 #260
Bernie Sanders is not electable in this country Awsi Dooger Mar 2019 #261
Unfortunately I think you are correct..Using Florida as an example is perfect. Stuart G Mar 2019 #263
I was all in on Sanders in 2016 Horse with no Name Mar 2019 #262
Washington Post-'Electability' and 'Bernie' don't belong in the same sentence Gothmog Apr 2019 #264
If sanders is the nominee, trump wins Gothmog Apr 2019 #266
According to this study trump could win Gothmog Apr 2019 #267
According to this study trump could win Gothmog Apr 2019 #268
So, I will say again..If Bernie is nominated, he already has divided the Democratic Party.!!! Stuart G Apr 2019 #270
According to Jim Messina, trump will beat sanders easily Gothmog Apr 2019 #272
Why just call out Sanders? artislife Apr 2019 #275
The voters will decide this and they like him across party lines. BeckyDem Apr 2019 #276
This message was self-deleted by its author doompatrol39 Apr 2019 #277
He is unless moderates decide to sit out the election if they don't get their way. doompatrol39 Apr 2019 #278
Agreed 100% NanceGreggs Apr 2019 #279
sanders want to get the nomination with only 30% support Gothmog Apr 2019 #281
Nate Silver- Sanders Can Win, But He Isn't Polling Like A Favorite Gothmog Apr 2019 #285
The choice may be Woke or Win Gothmog Apr 2019 #287
Opinion: If the economy keeps its momentum, 2020 will be Trump's to lose Gothmog May 2019 #288
I saw the light musicman65 May 2019 #289
bernie didn't even vote for mcgovern Otto Lidenbrock May 2019 #292
Get behind the nominee, whoever that is. Iggo May 2019 #293
I worked Beatleman May 2019 #295
can they just stop saying johannsyah May 2019 #297
Yeah, just like the bloated asshole currently sitting in the WH wasn't electable in 2016 either. mtnsnake May 2019 #298
Most Believe Socialism Is Not American Gothmog May 2019 #300
Most Americans don't know what "Socialism" is.. Stuart G May 2019 #301
But then many Americans who say they support Socialism emmaverybo May 2019 #304
This grows more and more true daily nt Celerity May 2019 #305
If Bernie loses support among youth, what is left??? Gothmog May 2019 #306
The message. aikoaiko May 2019 #307
sanders was counting on a brokered convention Gothmog May 2019 #308
I understand what you're saying and if things stay the same, you'll be right. aikoaiko May 2019 #309
Kick because of the ridiculous Biden copycat thread...nt SidDithers May 2019 #310
Agreed Gothmog May 2019 #312
Well said. Kick. WeekiWater May 2019 #311
Gallop-Less Than Half in U.S. Would Vote for a Socialist for President Gothmog May 2019 #314
Who is best musicman65 May 2019 #315
Bernie's mystery Soviet tapes revealed Gothmog May 2019 #316
This is interesting Gothmog May 2019 #317
New CNN poll: A majority of Americans say they think President Trump is going to win a second term Gothmog Jun 2019 #318
Washington Post-Sanders wants Americans to buy into socialism. He's got some convincing to do Gothmog Jun 2019 #319
New poll: Capitalism is more popular than socialism Gothmog Jun 2019 #320
Thanks, Goth.. Cha Jun 2019 #321
 

mobeau69

(11,079 posts)
1. If Sanders is the nominee I will unite behind him 100%.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:06 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
72. :) No worry we'd have to gird our loins for that.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:18 AM
Mar 2019

We do have to be concerned, enough to be sensible and realistic, about a 2016 redux.

But Sanders simply cannot win the primary election, is likely to be out though of course never withdrawing, by Super Tuesday. Surrounding himself with the kind of people who voted for Jill Stein, some of whom have actively worked to defeat Democrats, is pretty good evidence that he realizes it.

Thinking of which, only half of his anti-Democratic primary voters went to Stein or Johnson; the other 12% voted Trump. Makes me wonder how all his former and present staffers voted.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

getagrip_already

(14,250 posts)
114. don't be so sure - it's our nightmare scenario....
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:37 AM
Mar 2019

It goes like this. Bernie keeps a core of his base together, maybe 25% of the primary voter base. The other 75% gets diluted between all the other candidates and none gets to above 25%. BS would pick up some additional just because he would be a front runner, and media, and the russian bots supporting him.

So he could win with just a paultry minority of voters because all the good candidates spread out the remaining votes. It's very possible he could win the nomination with just 35%.

He would then get crushed in the general. A lot of our voters would just yawn and not show up. A lot of trumps 2016 voter base would return. The troll army would turn on him. He would have his political skin stripped from his body piece by piece.

He isn't electable, but could win the primary.

To stop him, people need to rush to the best candidate. Don't vote in your state with your heart. Vote to put a primary candidate in place that isn't a loser. Is mayor pete a great candidate? Possibly, but he isn't going to win the primary. Don't throw your vote away on him. Sorry Pete. My heart is with warren, but I would vote for biden in a second if I diidn't think she could win the primary (and at this point I don't think so).

I'm not going to throw my vote away and let BS get the nomination. He is our trump.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Autumn

(44,762 posts)
125. I never vote in a primary with my heart. I have always voted for the primary candidate
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:28 AM
Mar 2019

who best represents my views and I'm not going to change that now. The primary candidates who best represent me are Bernie, Liz, Pete, and Inslee. One of them will get my vote in the primary and I'm hopeful that I will have the opportunity to vote for them in the GE. I'm not going to throw away my primary vote out of fear.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

getagrip_already

(14,250 posts)
127. not fear...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:36 AM
Mar 2019

The primaries aren't all held on one day. By the time they get to the middle of the pack states, winners and losers are pretty clear. So if inslee is pulling 5% after 1/3 of the states have voted, it would be throwing your vote away to keep voting for him in later states.

Sure, he is your ideal candidate, but if that means your nightmare candidate gets in, pick another "good candidate" who has a shot.

I'm in MA, and that is pretty late in the process. Still, it has a not insignificant number of votes at the convention. I'm going to work to make sure those convention votes go to a non bs candidate.

I'm not going to vote my heart and give warren a vote if she clearly isn't going to make it. She will have other shots. She will still make a good cabinet secretary. Not everyone can be potus. And some absolutely shouldn't be.

Vote wisely.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Autumn

(44,762 posts)
129. I always vote wisely. I vote for the Democratic candidate in the primary who best
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:42 AM
Mar 2019

represents my values. If we have no real choice in a primary then perhaps the primary rules are the problem.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,982 posts)
186. Me too. And then I enthusiastically get behind the eventual nominee
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:29 AM
Mar 2019

Always choose the candidate that is closest to me ideologically.

Rarely has my primary choice gotten the nomination.

I then knock doors, give what money I can, and enthusiastically talk up the nominee!

It is what we do

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
201. :) Mine either, but they all share my principles
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 03:46 AM
Mar 2019

in general, varying mostly just in priorities and methods, and all of today's Republican candidates are inimical to them.

Principle, need, and intellect in alignment, as you say "It's what we do."

For all right reasons.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Autumn

(44,762 posts)
207. Yes that's what we do. The end game is to put the Democrat in office.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 09:20 AM
Mar 2019

The last campaign I knocked on doors for was Clinton in 08. Then I developed mobility issues. I maxed out in 16 to Bernie's campaign. There are four I have donated to this time but after the first debate I'll settle on one.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,982 posts)
208. Yes debates are key for me as well
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 09:29 AM
Mar 2019

See them in an interactive setting will be great. I am still living part time in Iowa, so I am going to try to get off my lazy butt to see as many speak as I can. Hopefully ask some questions too

Sorry to hear about your mobility issues, I wish you all my best. It’s not the same at all but my fibromyalgia came back in late 2018. Treatment is finally starting to help. Good thoughts to you!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Autumn

(44,762 posts)
212. Same to you.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 10:02 AM
Mar 2019
I can't wait to get this clown out of office.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

calimary

(80,699 posts)
221. I'm a head-over-heart kind of gal. ALWAYS.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:49 AM
Mar 2019

I learned the hard way a LOOOOOOOONNNNNG time ago. I learned that my heart will lead me astray. My head, on the other hand, stays un-fogged by emotion, but rather, clear-eyed, practical, and realistic.

I learned this in multiple ways, both personal and professional. It ALWAYS worked out better for me when I ignored what my heart urged me to do, and followed my head. In jobs taken or abandoned, in matters of love, and of money. Emotions do not factor into it. Same thing holds for politics. Last time, for just one example, I loved Hillary alright, but my HEAD said she was objectively the best by far. Maybe it’s different for others, but not for me.

This is what I worry about, politically, though. That old saying that “Democrats fall in love. Republicans fall in line.” Well, in that respect anyway, this Democrat won’t be following her tribe.

For me, it’ll ALWAYS be head-over-heart.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

G_j

(40,366 posts)
236. one question that comes to mind
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 05:44 PM
Mar 2019

will you support him if he is the nominee?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

hedda_foil

(16,368 posts)
131. You have a right to express your opinion but Your stats on how Sanders supporters voted are bizarre.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:53 AM
Mar 2019

Prove your stats or admit that you're wildly exaggerating. Otherwise this is an unfounded smear pure and simple and unworthy of a DUer.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,040 posts)
154. ...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:08 PM
Mar 2019
Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election. That is according to the data from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study — a massive election survey of around 50,000 people. (For perspective, a run-of-the-mill survey measuring Trump's job approval right now has a sample of 800 to 1,500.

Political science professor Brian Schaffner of University of Massachusetts, Amherst tweeted the data on Wednesday.

https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds








If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

hedda_foil

(16,368 posts)
161. Thank you. I stand corrected.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:59 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
172. Jill Stein is now officially the Ralph Nader of 2016.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:40 PM
Mar 2019


The Hatemongering really worked.


Second, a lot of Bernie Sanders supporters weren’t big fans of Clinton. So Stein campaigning on the idea that Clinton and Trump were similar made it harder for Clinton to win over those voters — even if Sanders voters didn’t vote for Stein, they may have stayed home out of disgust.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/jill-stein-democratic-spoiler-or-scapegoat/
Mahalo, lapucelle

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,040 posts)
219. Jill Stein wasn't the only one who tried to convince voters that Trump and HRC were both "evil". N/T
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:33 AM
Mar 2019



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

calimary

(80,699 posts)
224. Yep.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:06 PM
Mar 2019

All I can say about Jill Stein is that she was, and IS, nothing but an opportunistic infection.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
234. That's right.. she
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 05:03 PM
Mar 2019

already had a perfect platform set up for her.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

calimary

(80,699 posts)
223. BOOM!
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:05 PM
Mar 2019

That kind of margin made the difference in enough key districts to push a whole state over into trump’s column in the accursed electoral college.

Was it out of spite? A latter-day “Sore Loserman” effect? A pouting response? “If I don’t get what I want then just screw everybody”?

I swear - I DO NOT understand how a voter who preferred Bernie would switch to voting for donald trump! WTF????? How ON EARTH was trump ever gonna meet a Bernie voter’s expectations or desires or priorities??? HOW in God’s green earth???

I’m gonna need a lot of help understanding that one! And to those who deliberately went that way because they were pissed off that THEIR man didn’t get the nomination, how’s that workin’ out for ya? Please explain.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Dream Girl

(5,111 posts)
302. Misogyny pure and simple
Mon May 6, 2019, 06:30 PM
May 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
192. Those were the republicans Bernie won over that went back to the repub candidate
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:45 AM
Mar 2019

We've been through this before and that stat fails to mention these were mostly republican voters anyway.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,040 posts)
214. Do you have a link with stats showing that BS to Trump voters were mostly Republicans?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:10 AM
Mar 2019

And if what you say is true, then what happens to the claim that BS brought new people into the party?

That assertion is a wonderful argument for closed primaries.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
187. That is pure speculation. Bernie has nothing to do with Stein and worked hard to get dems elected
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:31 AM
Mar 2019

"Anti-democratic voters"? Really? Sounds like Bernie derangement syndrome to me. Sanders/Warren ticket is a real winner...not only for dems but for the country as well. Sanders made more campaign appearances for Clinton than any other legislator working hard to get her elected once she became the nominee encouraging all his supporters to vote for her yet look how you make him sound.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

getagrip_already

(14,250 posts)
237. talk about revisionist history..
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 05:49 PM
Mar 2019

BS did campaign for dems, but mostly dems who supported him in the primaries. He only grudgingly mentioned hillary during his events. He mostly bashed trump.

So yeah, he wasn't really there for her. And as a result, he was complicit in trumps win.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
250. Too bad what it "sounds like" to you.. BS is ..
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 12:57 AM
Mar 2019

being Vetted now.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
299. BS hired 3 stein voters for
Sat May 4, 2019, 08:24 PM
May 2019

his staff.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BlueFlorida

(1,532 posts)
240. I don't think winning the primary
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 11:39 AM
Mar 2019

is their primary goal.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
177. Guess that's why he leads in all the polls, why polls showed him beating Trump
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:03 AM
Mar 2019

By a greater margin than Clinton. Polls also showed him winning over a wide margin of republicans as well as dems and independents. He stands for what voters all claim they want in policy polls taken. Did you see him take on Manuchin in Senate hearings or read his new book "Where We Go From Here". He's the real deal, hell even Trump tried to campaign off Bernie's agenda only with Trump it was all lies to get him elected. Just because you believe it doesn't make it so. Strongest ticket out there would be Sanders/Warren with the 'Now's the Time to Act meme. Seems all other candidates are Bernie lite. He's extremely electable and does not even relate to McGovern or that era

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

TexasTowelie

(111,312 posts)
200. You are relying on polls in a hypothetical matchup
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 03:46 AM
Mar 2019

after the polls in the 2016 election were in error?

Those polls were completely worthless.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BlueFlorida

(1,532 posts)
241. Hypothetical matchups n/t
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 11:44 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
280. THIS!!!! +1,000
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 10:37 PM
Apr 2019

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
282. With less than 30% support in the party, sanders is not electable
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 10:49 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
291. sanders is polling far below 30%now
Sat May 4, 2019, 02:51 PM
May 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Lazy Daisy

(928 posts)
2. So what you're saying is
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:12 AM
Mar 2019

if Bernie wins the primary, some Democrats wouldn't vote for him in the general?

OMG, can't make this shit up.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
9. I will support the nominee of the party
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:45 AM
Mar 2019

I really doubt that sanders will break 15% in any southern primaries due to lack of African American support

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
90. Yes, unlike much of Sanders' top campaign staffers, we'll vote for the DEMOCRATIC nominee.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:40 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

sheshe2

(83,354 posts)
12. And.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:56 AM
Mar 2019

Nina Turner did not. She voted for Jill Stein. Then there is Briahna Joy Gray, Stein voter. Both on his team.

Me, I am a Democrat and will always vote the Democratic winner. Always.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TexasTowelie

(111,312 posts)
24. The terms of service for DU members state that they can be banned if they discourage other members
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:56 AM
Mar 2019

from voting or that they will not vote for the eventual nominee. However, those rules don't apply to the overall electorate and there are no loyalty oaths. There will undoubtedly be a group that either won't vote or who won't vote in the presidential race while marking the rest of the ballot, no matter who wins the nomination.

The election in 2020 is probably the most important since 2000 because in the following year state legislatures will have to redraw districts after the census data is released. While it would be terrible to see Trump reelected, the 2020 race will affect politics not only for the next four years, but the next decade. Democrats need a presidential nominee with long coattails. but the independent senator from Vermont is not that candidate in most regions of the country.

Current speculation is that there are about a half-dozen House of Representative seats in Texas alone that could flip from red to blue if there is a strong ticket and campaign funds are wisely allocated. There are also House and Senate races in other states that can be flipped, but if we pick the wrong candidate then we will lose those so-called "red states" for a decade or more and possibly some of the gains that we made in the mid-term elections.

The question that I have for Bernie's supporters is why they would want to put him in the toughest job in the world that ages the occupant about two years for every one year while in office? It almost seems cruel.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
191. Because E. Warren would be vice president and Bernie believes He is best candidate& wants the job
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:40 AM
Mar 2019

I can't get with any candidate who is against Medicare for all and the Green New Deal. That's like a slap in the face to FDR who got us the 1st NEW Deal Our very survival depends on going green immediately. We need bold action NOW not winners of popularity contests. Republicans flocked to Bernie because he was honest and stood for the people.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

TexasTowelie

(111,312 posts)
199. It's far more likely that a Sanders/Warren would be a disaster.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 03:43 AM
Mar 2019

A ticket with two candidates from two New England states won't fly throughout most of the country. It would likely move Virginia and Nevada back into the Republican column. Colorado and New Mexico would become highly contested. Meanwhile, I doubt that ticket would flip any state from red to blue.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BlueFlorida

(1,532 posts)
242. Doesn't that appear to be the primary goal
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 11:51 AM
Mar 2019

of David Sirota et al as they work in the Sanders campaign? Either way they win.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

vsrazdem

(2,176 posts)
252. For the same reason people want Joe Biden. We like the policies!!!
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 02:03 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Trumpocalypse

(6,143 posts)
274. So if Sanders loses
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 07:41 PM
Apr 2019

will you support and vote for the eventual nominee regardless of who that is?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
8. How can sanders win key primaries with no support from African American voters?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:43 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

sheshe2

(83,354 posts)
13. He can't.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:57 AM
Mar 2019

Period.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

FBaggins

(26,697 posts)
61. Of course he can
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:26 AM
Mar 2019

In a two-way race, no Democrat can win a state with a significant minority population without some support for that community.

But in a four-way or six-way race? Where others are splitting that block of votes? Of course they can.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

TexasTowelie

(111,312 posts)
202. Which states are those?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 03:57 AM
Mar 2019


The only states I see that meet your criteria are Alaska and Hawaii. Hawaii is reliably Democratic while Alaska trends Republican.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Socal31

(2,484 posts)
15. I'd love an expansion on this.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:04 AM
Mar 2019

Not specific to BS, so it should help everyone reading.

-What is the metric to differentiate between no support/support within a given demographic?

-Why is now the best time to determine who supports which candidates?

-Why do we assume the African American voting block votes in unity?

-Why do you feel BS is the current front runner? (Biden not declared?)



Bernie will not be getting my primary vote most likely. But I wouldn't actively work against him with generic statements that could be re-wrapped for almost every candidate.




If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LuvNewcastle

(16,820 posts)
132. Good questions.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:57 AM
Mar 2019

I won’t be supporting Bernie in the primaries, either, and I won’t work against him. I don’t think he’s going to get much traction this time. He doesn’t look good and his age will be a factor along with the socialist philosophy. I could be wrong about that, but that is my intuition.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
31. I wouldn't say no support
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:23 AM
Mar 2019

Biden and Sanders has the highest polling of candidates among African Americans. I remember Biden where he was criticized by African Americans for saying that Obama was clean, articulate African-American.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
60. Higher than Kamala Harris and Corey Booker? I don't think so.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:25 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie isn't going to be anointed this time.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
63. Yes higher than Kamala Harris or Booker
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:31 AM
Mar 2019

BERNIE SANDERS IS BEATING KAMALA HARRIS 2-1 AMONG BLACK DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY VOTERS, NEW POLL FINDS

THREE WEEKS AFTER launching his presidential campaign, Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders is leading all other announced candidates in support from black voters, a new poll finds. The only potential candidate who polled better with African-Americans than Sanders, according to the poll by Morning Consult, is former Vice President Joe Biden, who has not announced a campaign.

Despite a persistent notion that his supporters are disproportionately white male “bros,” the new survey suggests that Sanders is actually slightly more popular among black Democratic voters than white ones, indicating that the narrative that developed during the 2016 campaign may no longer hold, if it ever did.

Sanders’s support among black voters, at 28 percent, puts him in second place among that demographic, behind Biden, at 32 percent. He trailed Biden 31-25 among whites.

There appears to be a strong class element at play in the finding. The same poll found that the demographics Sanders is least popular with — at 19 and 17 percent, respectively — are Democrats who make more than $100,000 per year and Democrats who have post-graduate degrees (two qualities that typically, if not always, overlap). Because of structural wealth and income gaps, that population is heavily white.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/static.theintercept.com/amp/bernie-sanders-black-voters-2020.html

Right now Biden and Bernie are leading the polls it could be either one or someone else but it is misleading to claim Bernie Sanders base isn't diverse.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
113. The Intercept?! Get that Russian propaganda off DU.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:36 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
136. Linking to the Intercept is an automatic loss of credibility.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:55 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
197. That is funny because Rachel Maddow used the Intercept whenever they break stories
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 02:29 AM
Mar 2019

Anyways it wasn't refuted so the credibility problem is on you.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

namahage

(1,157 posts)
143. So on that poll,
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:03 PM
Mar 2019

which of the "key takeaways" was that Sanders beat Harris 2-1 with African Americans?

For that matter, where on that poll does it say anything about how Harris did with African Americans?

Or are we just expected to take the Intercept's word for it?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

vsrazdem

(2,176 posts)
255. Don't worry. They do this with every poll that shows Bernie up.
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 02:11 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

vsrazdem

(2,176 posts)
253. LOL. If he had been anointed last time, he would be president
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 02:05 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
140. Where were the African American voters at the recent event in South Carolina?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:49 PM
Mar 2019



NORTH CHARLESTON, S.C. — The crowd packed into the gym of a century-old black church here cheered every time Sen. Bernie Sanders attacked inequities that hit disadvantaged African Americans especially hard, applauding his ideas to address “the disparity within the disparity.”

But the problem Sanders faces in appealing to black voters was staring at him as he spoke for an hour recently at the gym of the Royal Missionary Baptist Church: Of the more than 1,600 people who came to see the candidate, fewer than 40 were black.....

Black voters played a critical role in picking the last two Democratic nominees, Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, and it’s hard to see a path to the Democratic nomination without significant black support.

About 25 percent of Democratic primary voters in 2016 were African American, and in key states, including South Carolina, the figure was much higher.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
198. I watched it live
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 02:31 AM
Mar 2019

The crowd was very diverse.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
209. Less than 4% of crowd was African American
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 09:53 AM
Mar 2019

Without support from African American voters, sanders will not be the nominee in the real world

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
211. I'm not sure I trust Washington Post which has a strong anti progressive bias
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 09:58 AM
Mar 2019

At any rate he polls better than he does with older white people.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
213. I like living in the real world and I have a subscription to the Washington Post
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 10:22 AM
Mar 2019

I really doubt that booing Congressman John Lewis at the National Convention will help sanders win the support of this Demographic group. I really doubt that sanders will break 15% in the Southern Super Tuesday states but time will tell

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
220. I live in the real world too and the Washington Post bias is obvious
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:34 AM
Mar 2019

It is owned by Jeff Besos after all . They ran like 20 negative stories on Sanders in a 24 hour period before the Michigan primary.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
222. Where are the non whites at this rally?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:59 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
229. I'm not into counting people in a crowd
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:46 PM
Mar 2019

I never been to a Bernie Sanders rally but that doesn't mean I don't support him. A campaign against candidates is fine but I'm not ready for another campaign against supporters especially since Im a people over party type of person so I certainly respect other candidates supporters unless they engage in toxic behavior but I don't hold their candidate responsible for it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
232. I was a Clinton delegate to the National Convention
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 02:45 PM
Mar 2019

I saw extremely toxic behavior. Real campaign carefully vet their delegates because these delegates (a) can change their vote at any time and (b) the delegates represent the candidate. The Clinton campaign vetted me and I helped to vet other delegates. In addition, the Clinton campaign was planning for four or five floor votes on credentials, platform and rules and so had whipping infrastructure in place. I had a whip who kept me informed as to what was going on through out the convention.

At the National convention, sanders sent one very weak text the Sunday night before the convention telling his candidates to behave and then did little or nothing to control his delegates. It was nasty I was there when the sanders delegates booed Congressman John Lewis. I was warned about this stunt 30 minutes before it happened by the Clinton campaign whip. According to my whip, sanders was asked to stop this stunt and declined.

I was at the Texas delegation breakfast when a group of sanders delegates marched in and demanded that we condemn Clinton and change our votes to sanders.




sanders spoke to the Texas delegation the next morning and his speech was again solely about himself. There was a mini-riot due to his delegates the prior morning and the only thing that sanders talked about was himself. sanders did nothing to deal with the fact that his delegates were out of control and did nothing to try to help Hillary Clinton win the general election.

Finally a group of sanders delegates yelled at my daughter and called her the c-Word because she would not try to get me to change my vote. My daughter was my guest at the national convention. Again sanders was asked to tell his delegates to behave during the convention and sanders refused

I saw other toxic behavior directed at myself but yelling at an attorney is a waste of effort. I would define that behavior as toxic

Combined this behavior with the fact that sanders new press secretary attacked John Lewis (see https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=30517 )and his new speechwriter was part of a racist scheme to suppress the vote of African Americans, I would be very surprised to see any significant support for sanders from this demographic group.


Time will tell but I doubt that anyone can win the nomination of the Democratic Party without significant support from African American voters


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
269. I didn't know you were a at the National Convention as a delegate.
Mon Apr 15, 2019, 02:31 PM
Apr 2019

As you say in the above post, Bernie is all about himself. Bernie will not unite the Democratic Party. He will divide the Democratic Party. So PEOPLE YOU want ...proof about this division...OK>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

proof about this division.......not hard to find............. READ ENTIRE THIS POST....THEN READ ENTIRE THIS POST AGAIN..

AND THEN READ THIS POST
ALL 230 COMMENTS

...YES ALL 230 OF THE COMMENTS!!!!!!

...ALL THE COMMENTS...AGAIN...YES ....ALL ......THE COMMENTS...ALL.... THE COMMENTS.

OVER 230 COMMENTS.........................................that is the proof !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Bernie has already divided up the Democratic Party. He has done this about himself..

If Bernie is the nominee, this division has already been set into action...Bernie will not unite us, Bernie is dividing us right now. ............................................................................
We cannot win with Bernie. Read these posts, then decide..

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
271. This was not a fun experience
Mon Apr 15, 2019, 05:34 PM
Apr 2019

This is normally an once in a life time experience. i had been working on voter protection and other issues for a long time including running war rooms and training poll watchers. sanders sent one very weak text the Sunday night before the convention that sort of asked his delegates to behave (it was a weak text and the Clinton campaign was not happy with it) and then did little or nothing to control his delegates. It was nasty I was there when the sanders delegates booed Congressman John Lewis. The Clinton campaign had a great whipping infrastructure in place and my whip kept me informed as to the various stunts being pulled by the sanders campaign/delegates. I was warned about the planned stunt of booing Congressman John Lewis 30 minutes before it happened by the Clinton campaign whip. According to my whip, sanders was asked to stop this event and declined. That incident will be used against sanders if he runs in 2020.

I was at the Texas delegation breakfast when a group of sanders delegates marched in and demanded that we condemn Clinton and change our votes to sanders. There was a mini-riot after this demand




sanders spoke to the Texas delegation the next morning and his speech was again solely about himself. There was a mini-riot due to his delegates the prior morning and the only thing that sanders talked about was himself. sanders did nothing to deal with the fact that his delegates were out of control and did nothing to try to help Hillary Clinton win the general election.

Finally a group of sanders delegates yelled at my daughter and called her the c-Word because she would not try to get me to change my vote. Again sanders was asked to tell his delegates to behave during the convention and sanders refused
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

GWC58

(2,678 posts)
45. Short answer
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 05:48 AM
Mar 2019

He can’t, and won’t.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Kahuna7

(2,531 posts)
62. He's hired nina and briebrie to run cover for him and cornell to
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:29 AM
Mar 2019

blather on about something something.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
179. That's nonsense. He has a great deal of support from A-A voters. He won key primaries last time
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:07 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
182. No, sanders got little support from this demographic in the real world
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:13 AM
Mar 2019

Why did so few African American voters show up at sanders last event?

Hint, booing Congressman John Lewis at the national convention will result in even less support from this demographic group this cycle

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
246. Where were these supporters at an event at an African American church???
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 04:27 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

sheshe2

(83,354 posts)
10. No.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:53 AM
Mar 2019

We are Democrats and we vote for the Democratic winner.

BS's new pick for his campaign manager Nina Turner did not. She voted for Jill Stein. Then there is Briahna Joy Gray to be the national press secretary, she too voted third party. Jill Stein. Oh, and bashed John Lewis the other day as well.

https://www.palmerreport.com/analysis/bernie-sanders-hire-scandalous-two/16837/

Democrats vote for Democrats. I am a Democrat.



Lazy Daisy

2. So what you're saying is

if Bernie wins the primary, some Democrats wouldn't vote for him in the general?

OMG, can't make this shit up.


We can agree on one thing. You can't make this shit up.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kahuna7

(2,531 posts)
64. Funny how his staff couldn't vote for the Democrat, but expect unity now...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:31 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
11. Seriously! Somebody should tell Bernie, who's leading all fellow Democratic candidates who've
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:56 AM
Mar 2019

declared that they're running in 2020, that he needs to get out of the race for the good of his party. Riiiiight... I don't think so. But, thanks to the OP for the input.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

fleabiscuit

(4,542 posts)
30. Where in the world did you get that metric?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:22 AM
Mar 2019

There is only one major market aggregator worth following (IMHO) that is putting up numbers, and it has been currently showing a 3 person race between Biden, Harris, and Sanders; Biden currently top by a small bit. And that changes every day. The remaining "candidates" really haven't pushed the numbers much; yet.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
97. Could've sworn I said all fellow Democrats who've declared they're running in 2020...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:54 AM
Mar 2019

Sorry, I didn't realize Joe announced he's jumped into the race. When did that happen?! Did I miss it?! Bernie clearly leads Harris... and, of course, that could change. But, you missed my point... why should Bernie, the candidate currently leading the pack, withdraw from the race? When has THAT ever been suggested? Never to my knowledge.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
99. Interesting that a guy who hasn't even announced yet is in first place, by a LOT.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:59 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
119. Joes waiting until april to get in so he doesn't have to show ..
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:03 AM
Mar 2019

..his fundraising numbers until July.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
91. He will not win the nomination. He'll probably be in the lower tier of candidates delegate-wise...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:42 AM
Mar 2019

...by midnight on March 3, 2020.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
98. Maybe we should wait to find out!
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:56 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
194. We don't need another center right corporate dem with years of baggage that's for sure
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:49 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
206. Why not at least nominate a progressive Democrat this time who is more representative of what
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 06:11 AM
Mar 2019

people in this country are starving for. Bernie is more than worth a try and I guarantee he will not disappoint... he's someone we can trust to deliver the goods on a truly progressive agenda.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
35. No. But we need more than regular voters coming out to vote. We need passionate, all out, support --
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:50 AM
Mar 2019

not hold-your-nose-and-vote kind of support.

We need all hands on deck, working to get out the vote. It's a lot easier to imagine this with candidates who are not Bernie -- especially since he's been filling his campaign with Hillary-haters like Nina Turner and David Sirota.

You'll notice I'm not suggesting Hillary, either. Neither one should be our nominee.

Bernie lost the primaries by 4 million votes last time -- he wasn't even close. He won't get a majority this time, either, so we'll be facing a brokered convention. The worst way to face Trump in the fall.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

bobGandolf

(871 posts)
40. He is saying...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 04:38 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie has too much negative baggage from 2016.
Which, unfortunately, might very well cause some Dems. not to vote, or not vote for him.

We need some of the new Democrats to take charge.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

brooklynite

(93,873 posts)
55. It is possible to support a candidate and work hard for them...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:05 AM
Mar 2019

...knowing that it was hopeless.

In 1984, I spent a weekend driving a rally truck around NYC encouraging votes for Mondale. If the Mondale campaign couldn't bank the NYC vote, what chance did they have elsewhere?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

WeekiWater

(3,259 posts)
56. I agree that it is pretty basic common knowledge.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:05 AM
Mar 2019

Still a worthwhile point to make.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
57. Why is that funny?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:07 AM
Mar 2019

I'm asking a serious question. Dead serious.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
79. No, he's saying that moderate Republicans and Independents will never vote for a socialist
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:16 AM
Mar 2019

A lot of center-right people want to get rid of Trump, but a Sanders candidacy will guarantee his reelection.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
87. I don't think anyone said that at all. And you're talking about "making this shit up"?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:39 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Autumn

(44,762 posts)
111. Will they receive a special dispensation because they don't like Bernie?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:32 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
152. No u can't Daisy...these endless Bernie bashin threads are gettin repetitive & frankly a lil boring.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:53 PM
Mar 2019

Yawwwwnnnnnnn!!




Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

vsrazdem

(2,176 posts)
254. They bash every post a Bernie supporter puts up and when there aren't any,
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 02:10 AM
Mar 2019

They start posting to bash him some more. It is getting a little sickening. Just look through the threads to see what has the most comments, and almost every time it is something about Bernie. Very telling. I don't see Bernie supporters bashing Kamala Harris or Beto every time someone posts something. Its almost desperate.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
256. Beyond desperate... and mostly just sad.
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 08:18 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
313. What he's saying.. and it's
Thu May 16, 2019, 07:06 PM
May 2019

even more relevant today.. is that "BS is Not electable".

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

California_Republic

(1,826 posts)
4. For all candidates we need to think how they can handle the republican attack machine.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:23 AM
Mar 2019

Such as Mayor Pete and homosexuality.

If Bernie is the nominee the democrats will united but we need independents.

Can he weather the “socialist “ label?

They used John Kerrey’s military service against him. You’ve got to know they will come hard at our candidate.

Stuart is right, for all candidates, we need to think about electability
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
18. Mayor Pete has a LOT working for him to offset the attack machine for being gay
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:28 AM
Mar 2019

He's an Afghanistan Vet, he went to Catholic School as a kid, and is now practicing Episcopal, he likes to talk about his faith (in a very moderate, Christ-like way, which I respect even though I'm atheist), and he's Married.

And he's sharp as a freaking tack.

Also, kinda sucks to say this, so apologies ... but you'd never 'know' he's gay, if you weren't told ... not in the way you 'know' ... with some folks? That works to his advantage as well. He basically is like the MODEL 'gay candidate', sorry to kinda stereotype, but he really is. Not sure we pull off a win with say, Nathan Lane ... in the current climate in the USA. Mayor Pete though? Different deal.

I have a decent amount of faith he can handle the attack machine ... if by no other means, just by emanating brains and goodness, which he seems to do effortlessly.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

True Dough

(17,096 posts)
46. "I have a decent amount of faith he can handle the attack machine ...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 05:48 AM
Mar 2019

if by no other means, just by emanating brains and goodness, which he seems to do effortlessly."


YES!!!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Mr.Bill

(24,104 posts)
158. They'll go right past the socialist label
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:31 PM
Mar 2019

and just flat out call him a Communist. Sure, that won't fool any of us here on DU, but the last election should be a lesson on how uninformed and easily misinformed the electorate can be.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TreasonousBastard

(43,049 posts)
5. I agree-- he seems to be the "Trump of the Left" preferring fighting to governing...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:24 AM
Mar 2019

and proud of being more a source of division than of unity.

Republicans are naturally more vulnerable to Trump's reign of terror than Democrats would be to Bernie's attempts, if any, but it would not be a good time. AOC being an exception, Democrats are not as vulnerable to threats of primaries from the left as Republicans are from the right.

This time we have a large slate of incredibly good candidates. Every one of Bernie's plans, programs, and dreams is available elsewhere, with much less fuss and with even more good stuff he hasn't talked, or thought, about yet.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
6. I agree, Stuart! Just look at the history.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:34 AM
Mar 2019

Thank You!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
7. I also believe that sanders is not electable
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:41 AM
Mar 2019

There are too many real democrats with long memories. We will not forgive or forget

To get the Democratic nomination, one needs the support of African American voters. Booing John Lewis at the national convention is not a good way of getting the support of this key segment of the base

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

GWC58

(2,678 posts)
47. I know I won't forget
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 05:58 AM
Mar 2019

the last presidential primary after it was a known fact Sanders couldn’t get the nomination yet he continued attacking Hillary. I found that to be just a wee bit divisive. 😡

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Devil Child

(2,728 posts)
14. I believe Sen. Sanders is electable. You can argue, but this is true
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:58 AM
Mar 2019

Sanders is one of the possible answers to the trump occupation.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
116. Thank you.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:55 AM
Mar 2019

Sometimes the framing around here is a bit much.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Devil Child

(2,728 posts)
145. It is a bit much and over the top IMO shanny
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:53 PM
Mar 2019

Defeating trump is much more important to me than investing in this "don't vote for this candidate or else" mentality.

Take care shanny!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Socal31

(2,484 posts)
16. As it stands currently, Biden is the most electable in the GE
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:09 AM
Mar 2019

So I am with you there. But Kamala will take that spot after the debates, imo.

I'm debating between Harris and the Mayor, with Harris leading in name recognition and electability.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
29. I don't understand why people think Biden is electable
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:12 AM
Mar 2019

I think he'd be a even worse candidate than Hillary Clinton.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Socal31

(2,484 posts)
32. The numbers suggest otherwise.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:32 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
33. This is where I based my comment off of
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:44 AM
Mar 2019

‘Weaker candidate than Hillary’: Democrats cast deep doubt on Biden’s 2020 value

Joe Biden is everything a Democratic political consultant should love: He’s experienced, well-liked, and his poll numbers look great against Donald Trump.

And yet many party strategists have a bleak assessment of his potential 2020 campaign: It’s a bad, bad idea.

(Snip)

Strikingly, these conversations yielded a similar view: The Democratic political community is more broadly and deeply pessimistic about Biden’s potential candidacy than is commonly known. While these strategists said they respect Biden, they cited significant disadvantages for his campaign — from the increasingly liberal and non-white Democratic electorate to policy baggage from his years in the Senate and a field of rivals that includes new, fresh-faced candidates.

“Among political professionals, there are deep concerns because we know the history,” said a Pennsylvania-based Democratic strategist, granted anonymity to speak candidly about a party elder. “We have reason to be skeptical of the hype.”

“We heard it with Hillary, and we saw it happened,” the source added. “And there’s a lot of reason to think he would wind up a significantly weaker candidate than Hillary.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/campaigns/article226007090.html

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Socal31

(2,484 posts)
36. Data is more credible are this juncture than op-eds.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:50 AM
Mar 2019

Everyone who has chosen a candidate is campaigning, not debating.

I have my own reasons for not leaning Biden, but pretending he wouldn't be the favorite (initially) or couldn't pull it off is silly.

I think most of the field is electable against tramp.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
37. The OP is saying Sanders is not electable and not providing any data
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:56 AM
Mar 2019

He is one of the 2 front runners now and I also think many Democrats can beat Trump which is why so many are running. This wasn't an OP-ed but an article quoting party pollsters, campaign strategists, etc.

I think by the time the general election comes his history of gaffes may come back to bite him as well as his history.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

R B Garr

(16,920 posts)
65. Socialism is the biggest gaffe out there.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:36 AM
Mar 2019

Most of Biden’s “gaffes” lately have been amped up by the usual suspects, and not just here. Much ado about not much.

Socialism, otoh, is a huge gaffe forced on Democrats by those who can’t even agree amongst themselves what it is. It is a huge liability. No wonder Sanders didn’t have the guts to start another party. He’s chosen instead to label Democrats with Establishment smears if they don’t kowtow to his takeover. If you think Democrats want to be taken over by socialists, you are sadly mistaken. Especially “socialists” who voted 3rd party because they hate Democrats so much. Who needs it.

There is plenty of data to corroborate that Sanders is not electable — the last couple elections.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
69. Most people polled equate "socialism" with equality
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:49 AM
Mar 2019

Only 3% polled view socialism as taking away personal freedoms. Democratic Socialism is easy to explain by pointing to Nordic Countries while the party is usually silent while Fox News & Republicans are comparing it to Venezuela which authoritarism isn't associated with Democratic Socialists. I remember people defending socialism over 10 years ago by pointing out tax rates in the early days of Keynesian economics.

I'm not worried about takeover when the third way took over the party ever since then has embraced the philosophy while treating anyone to the left of them like traitors while still expecting their votes. I do everything right this board wants me to do I vote for the more liberal option in a primary then vote for the nominee. I even voted for Krysten Sinema and she is my state's Joe Manchin.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
108. Democratic Socialism
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:30 AM
Mar 2019

Democratic Socialism =/= the Nordic Model

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

R B Garr

(16,920 posts)
109. Actually, most people equate socialism with government control.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:31 AM
Mar 2019

Most people don’t spend much time thinking about Nordic countries. Socialism is a total liability and non-starter. It’s just not helpful to saddle Democrats with that albatross.

More of the the myths about third way that are now decades old. Bill Clinton actually got elected in a time of choking Republican family values, etc. Thanks, Bill. He left a surplus for Al Gore, but Gore wasn’t pure enough either. Al Gore was ahead of his time on climate change, but we got Bush’s war instead. The purity standards are a big gift for the GOP.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
244. Most people according to the poll said equality
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 01:28 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

R B Garr

(16,920 posts)
247. A poll, one, doesn't change the government
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 12:31 AM
Mar 2019

control aspect, which is why it’s demonized. People won’t pay attention to it just because you like one politician.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

namahage

(1,157 posts)
243. I'm sure that when the Republicans were calling Obama a "socialist,"
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 12:24 PM
Mar 2019

And the ACA “socialized medicine,” that what they REALLY meant was Obama was a champion of equality.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
117. Me too.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:57 AM
Mar 2019

I like Joe as a person but look where we are! The past is prologue to the present, and Biden is the past. We have moved on and we can't / shouldn't try to go back.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

TexasTowelie

(111,312 posts)
203. But Bernie isn't the past?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 04:20 AM
Mar 2019

Wasn't there an OP this week about how Bernie hasn't evolved over his lifetime?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

betsuni

(25,135 posts)
204. Bernie has an "Established in 1990" plaque on his office door.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 04:38 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

treestar

(82,383 posts)
294. On DU he is not
Sat May 4, 2019, 05:08 PM
May 2019

but out in the real world, he is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
296. I already went through the "electable" arguments last time
Sat May 4, 2019, 05:20 PM
May 2019

He is too conservative for me. I would prefer Hillary Clinton.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
141. I also think that Joe Biden is the most electable candidate
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:53 PM
Mar 2019

It is telling that trump is very worried about Biden


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

chillfactor

(7,566 posts)
17. I agree.....100%!
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:19 AM
Mar 2019

He is not electable!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

betsuni

(25,135 posts)
19. And he thinks the reason Trump won was because Dems ignored the working class.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:29 AM
Mar 2019

All he has to do is bring his economic equality message to the people and not only will all Democrats vote for him (realizing how foolish they've been paling around with the establishment), but Independents and Republicans (especially in the swing states) will flock to the polls and finally vote in their own best interest. Easy!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
21. Yes, he's dead set on that..
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:52 AM
Mar 2019
The Dangerous Myth That Hillary Clinton Ignored the Working Class

In the days after her shocking loss, Democrats complained that Clinton had no jobs agenda. A widely shared essay in The Nation blamed Clinton's "neoliberalism" for abandoning the voters who swung the election. “I come from the white working class,” Bernie Sanders said on CBS This Morning, “and I am deeply humiliated that the Democratic Party cannot talk to where I came from.”

But here is the troubling reality for civically minded liberals looking to justify their preferred strategies: Hillary Clinton talked about the working class, middle class jobs, and the dignity of work constantly. And she still lost.

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/12/hillary-clinton-working-class/509477/

Yeah, BS "was deeply humiliated".. and he called our party "elite". right after the "rigging in" It was all about sanders.. and he got it wrong.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

sheshe2

(83,354 posts)
25. Keeping a straight face here.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:56 AM
Mar 2019

Oh shit, I lost.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
59. That's because Bernie has a yuuuuuge ego.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:24 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

rusty quoin

(6,133 posts)
20. I always liked Bernie but you say you know best.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:50 AM
Mar 2019

I always like a Democrat to win, and especially now.

His ideas have become mainstream, but he, who always said these things, is not the guy to carry it through.

Maybe that’s true. Another one, Elizabeth Warren, is someone I love. Bernie and her have been fighting for the small guy a long time.

But I expect that if she takes a lead, there will be much talk here on why she cannot win.

I don’t know how you guys know so much so early.

I have known stuff in the past too. I knew that McCain would win the Republican nomination way back, before he had a chance. I knew the Iraq War was a huge mistake. And I knew Coors lite was a shit beer.

But one thing I could not have predicted was that Trump would become ...heh...president.

I cannot predict anymore.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Mike Nelson

(9,903 posts)
22. i hear various...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:55 AM
Mar 2019

… reasons why he and others are not electable. I agree Bernie is probably not the strongest General Election candidate, but I wouldn't call him 100% unelectable. My main concern is that he plays into the Republicans' "Socialism!" scare tactic and he wouldn't be able to get anything done... at least, not as a Progressive. I suppose, like others, he might become a "moderate" President... I don't know how it would work... Elizabeth Warren seems better at explaining how to actually get some progressive things done... however, I'm very interested in hearing the others expand and explain. I am excited by several of the other candidates.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

RDANGELO

(3,430 posts)
23. I agree with you, but not for the same reasons.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:56 AM
Mar 2019

If we have a straight move to medicare for all, a lot of the people getting their health care through the employer are going to realize that they are losing coverage. They are going to get angry, and we will lose the election. His other problem is with all of his new social programs comes the question - how are you going to pay for it. I don't get this Bernie is divisive stuff.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Jarqui

(10,110 posts)
26. I still haven't figured out which candidate I like most
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:03 AM
Mar 2019

I don't know that Bernie is not electable. If he had run against Trump in 2016, he probably would have won - he looked better head to head than Hillary.

But we're talking 2020 now. As much as I like Biden and Sanders, I'm looking for something new. Don't know for sure if I'll find it. But a number of candidates currently appeal. We'll see.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
118. I don't know why this point is always overlooked:
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:02 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie looked better head to head than Hillary (strike that, I DO know why, but that doesn't change it).

That said, I do wonder if Bernie is the best candidate for this election. Maybe this board is not an indicator of the party at large but there is a large and virulent anti-Bernie faction here and I worry about PUMAs.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Jarqui

(10,110 posts)
121. "there is a large and virulent anti-Bernie faction here and I worry about PUMAs."
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:23 AM
Mar 2019

I don't worry or concern myself too much about that.

I have to look inside and decide which candidate seems most right for me. In early 2016, I was partial to Hillary. But as it developed, I liked Bernie's policies more. After I licked my wounds of disappointment, I supported Hillary as the Democrat and because I was so anti-Trump.

This time around, the slate is again clean. I will ultimately support whoever the Democrats select as I have for decades. I have to do a bunch of studying and following the various candidates to determine who I like most. I don't have a preference right now. I'm looking for something newer than Sanders or Biden but may not find it. I doubt I'll have an answer until we get some of the debates done.

In the interim, the anti-Bernie faction or PUMAS or whoever are just noise or distractions I have to cut through. I have to find my own way.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
134. Makes sense.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:17 PM
Mar 2019

I've been culling already though. I have several obvious discards, a few favorites and a bunch of people I don't know well. This is only the beginning.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Jarqui

(10,110 posts)
135. There are a couple that are very unlikely for me
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:42 PM
Mar 2019

A bunch I need to learn about.
There has been lots to like.
I think as a group, it is the strongest field I've ever seen assembled.
We're very lucky that way as long as we pull together when it's over.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JonLP24

(29,322 posts)
27. Why does this no infighting privilege other candidates?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:09 AM
Mar 2019

I disagree about electability he is the most popular politician going up against Trump.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

OnDoutside

(19,908 posts)
28. Time will tell, however any candidate not releasing their tax returns
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:11 AM
Mar 2019

should be relentlessly hammered, and that non release should be disqualifying. Ten years is a minimum. Have we learnt nothing from Trump ?

That said, my gut feeling is that Sanders is in for the Primaries, and is not expecting to get beyond that, and that might explain the non release.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Mr Tibbs

(539 posts)
150. Only two Democratic candidates have released them
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:39 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
257. Out of how many who have actually declared? (nt)
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 08:41 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
38. The question for me is
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:56 AM
Mar 2019

will Bernie supporters stay home in the general if Bernie is NOT the nominee?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Freddie

(9,232 posts)
43. Yes some assholes will
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 04:54 AM
Mar 2019

But the number of people who would vote for any other of the great candidates in the race, but not Bernie, outnumbers them.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
49. Or vote for Jill LIES stein like
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:08 AM
Mar 2019

too many did the last time?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
86. Like BS's campaign co-chair, and his speechwriter, and his press secretary, and . . .
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:33 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
89. Yeah, like those suckers who encouraged
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:39 AM
Mar 2019

others to do the same.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Nanjeanne

(4,878 posts)
73. Since most Sanders supporters voted for Hillary in 2016 I think they will again. We know the
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:24 AM
Mar 2019

facts show more Sanders supporters voted Clinton than Clinton supporters voted for Obama.

I think the young supporters of Sanders who did not vote for Clinton never would have. Those were not regular consistent voters. What gets lost in the narrative is that Sanders engaged a great number of new voters who were excited about his candidacy. Without him in the race, they went back to being nonvoters. If that happens again, and Sanders isn’t the nominee, they may stay for another candidate but I doubt it would be for Biden.

So yes, regular voters who support Sanders will vote for another nominee in General as they did before. But potential voters who are excited about a Sanders platform who do not usually vote will probably stay home if it’s a Biden but would probably vote if it’s one of the other progressive candidates.

IMHO of course.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lunamagica

(9,967 posts)
283. Did you vote for her?
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 11:46 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Nanjeanne

(4,878 posts)
284. Of course. Dont know anyone of my Bernie supporter friends who didn't. But we are all
Thu Apr 18, 2019, 07:16 AM
Apr 2019

life long Democrats. Can’t speak to those who were typically nonvoters who were excited by Bernie and dropped out when he didn’t win the nomination. I’m sure there were many but those people were probably not going to vote anyway if Bernie lost.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
84. Almost certainly, because they will double down on the "he got robbed" canard
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:27 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
102. If you look at some of his top staffers, they won't stay home but they won't vote for the Democrat.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:02 AM
Mar 2019

Nina Turner, David Sirota, and Briahna Gray all voted for Jill Stein.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

bobGandolf

(871 posts)
39. My word, never thought I'd see this OP.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 04:25 AM
Mar 2019

IMO, you are correct. Bernie has championed most Democratic concerns over his years in office but during his long tenure in D.C. he has also rubbed many Democrats the wrong way. This election is too important to take a chance. We need every single vote we can get to beat Trump, and Bernie does not get us the maximum number of voters.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Freddie

(9,232 posts)
42. Thank you for this
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 04:51 AM
Mar 2019

I couldn’t agree more.
Wait til the GOP Slime Machine starts with him. The very term Socialist is simply not popular with Joe Sixpack whose votes we need. And there’s skeletons in the closet. Sorry.
And as others have noted, when people realize they will lose the employer health insurance that they really like, forget it. That’s the reality we have to consider.
The Berniebots are already all over FB. “If it’s not Bernie then forget it”. I responded to him, “so if he’s not the nominee you want 4 more years of Trump, right?” No answer.
WE. HAVE. TO. WIN. Electability is the #1 consideration. Also #s 2, 3, 4, you get the drift.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

KayF

(1,345 posts)
44. 2016 changed things
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 05:43 AM
Mar 2019

after the so-called safe candidate lost to Donald J Trump, it's not as clear who's the "fool," to use your word.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
48. You bet 2016 changed things. It's called
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:06 AM
Mar 2019

the Russian Interference and all the fucking idiot forces who assisted them getting trump rigged in.

I didn't vote for Hillary because she was "safe" .. to use your word.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,965 posts)
66. The "safe candidate lost", because some self-identified progressives refused to vote for the
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:37 AM
Mar 2019

Democratic nominee by voting third party or not voting, and encouraging others to do the same.

In those critical swing states the Democratic nominee lost by less than 1%. In everyone of those swing states Jill Stein received 1% of the vote. It didn't take much either, just enough to sway enough naïve people that the SC didn't matter, and there was no difference between the two parties.

These were people like Nina Turner, David Sirota, Briahna Joy Gray, Cornell West, Susan Sarandon, and others who were able through the public airwaves, newspapers, and social to spread their influence

In addition, every Democrat running for Senate in those critical swing states lost to the incumbent, establishment, republican, and those Democrats were progressive by any standard.

Of course, it wasn't just these self-identified progressives who did their part, Comey, the media, and foreign interference also contributed, but their influence was just enough to push trump into the WH.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

R B Garr

(16,920 posts)
67. She had 3 opposition campaigns working against her.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:41 AM
Mar 2019

Trump/Stein/Sanders. What “changed” was that this was allowed by our party....

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(81,073 posts)
88. +1. Opponents supercharged by Russian analytics and disinformation
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:39 AM
Mar 2019

So it was really Trump/Stein/Sanders/Putin

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
93. Trump/Stein/Sanders/Putin/USM$M******!
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:44 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(81,073 posts)
95. Yes, indeed - Fox News and CNN being the most prominent 24/7 megaphones
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:50 AM
Mar 2019

and of course, National Enquirer at every supermarket checkout

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
96. & Andrea Mitchell.. But her emails.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:53 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
92. And, as well as those you mentioned
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:42 AM
Mar 2019

Hillary had the full force of the US M$M****** working hard against her.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Sherman A1

(38,958 posts)
50. And I believe that
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:24 AM
Mar 2019

you are incorrect in your conclusion.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Kurt V.

(5,624 posts)
51. who thought trump was electable? pick your favorite candidate and
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:39 AM
Mar 2019

be enthusiastic in your support. the one that generates the most enthusiasm wins.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
80. A lot of people thought Trump was electable; that's why we tried to warn Sanders supporters
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:21 AM
Mar 2019

to unite early on.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

democratisphere

(17,235 posts)
52. Agreed. The past will be the same as the future.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:42 AM
Mar 2019

We need a rabid uniter, not a self-serving proven divider.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kanoko

(35 posts)
54. If Bernie got the nomination, I have no doubt he'll go toe to toe with Trump.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:00 AM
Mar 2019

And Democrats will support him.

Bernie's a fighter. He's outspoken.

An example of what lies ahead for Trump if Bernie wins the nomination:


|
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
68. BS is too Divisive.. he's made it clear
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:41 AM
Mar 2019

by his 3rd party hires who hate Democrats.

We have plenty of brilliant Dems who will "go toe to toe" with the fascistrump.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
70. He has hired senior staff who are hostile to the Democratic party.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:58 AM
Mar 2019

How does that predict Democratic support for him?

It appears that he wants a campaign run by those who are not fans of the Democratic party.





If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

njhoneybadger

(3,910 posts)
58. Bernie believes if he isn't the democratic nominee
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:20 AM
Mar 2019

The country should have a Republican president. I guess to punish us for our rejection of him.
It reminds me of someone else we all know.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Nanjeanne

(4,878 posts)
76. Exactly. It's why he says in his rally speeches that he will support the Dem nominee and
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:01 AM
Mar 2019

Last edited Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:06 AM - Edit history (1)

fight to rid the country of Trump.

Yup.

ETÀ. I guess I have to be more specific so not to be understood. I think the post I responded to is full of crap and I was using irony.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Amimnoch

(4,558 posts)
83. A lot of similarities for sure. -NT.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:26 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
74. The single most important idea that we have in this forum in this group of people: honesty.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:48 AM
Mar 2019

Are we going to be honest with ourselves?
What is the truth about Bernie Sanders?
Has he attacked others in ways that do not reflect our values?
Will he unite our party to win the election?
_______________________________________________________________________________

So, what is it going to be? What is the single most important aspect of an election? We got to work together to elect our candidate. The other side will throw everything at us to keep Trump in office, or his replacement. There can be no divisive fighting within our party if we are going to overcome "evil"...and Trump is "evil" as are his supporters..

...So, Bernie has already caused division. He hired someone who has not supported our candidates in the past (I discovered that right here in this forum) That alone should exclude him. Further he divides the party in his manner and stances. It is hard to put a finger on it, but he is divisive. We must win this election to reverse the damage that Trump has done. Again, we must win. Everyone here knows that.
.....The bottom line is very simple. If Bernie runs as our candidate, he will open the gate to attacks that will cause us to lose. You don't have to like that, but I believe it is the truth. That is his character. It is going to be rough enough to beat a sitting president, but Bernie will not win the final presidential election.
....Bernie is a repeat of McGovern. Sure, his ideas are correct and we like them. But in my opinion he will divide us, and we will lose. You can say what you want here, and that is what this is, but Bernie will not bring us together to win.
He already is divisive. Picking someone on staff who did not vote for our candidate?
...Think about that one. Will that bring the ..entire party together? You got your answer if you are honest with us and yourself. His ideas may be good, but he cannot win. It is that simple.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

kstewart33

(6,551 posts)
105. Bernie was never vetted in the 2016 primary campaign.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:20 AM
Mar 2019

The media will vet him this time around.

He is not electable because there is too much "socialist" material to use - speeches, writings, etc.

Trump is very skilled at creating a profile of an opponent and making it stick.

Many Dems are still ticked off because Bernie continued to attack Hillary after his chances of winning were nil.

He's old, he's obstinate (my way or the highway) his key hires to date aren't Dems, he won't release his tax returns, and there is way too much material that Trump will use.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Amimnoch

(4,558 posts)
75. Unelectable AND damaging the chances for the rest imo.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:49 AM
Mar 2019

Let’s see:

16x candidates.. Where’s all the friction? Between BS and everyone else. Some exceptions, but for the most part, just look at the main page.. A few posts of people promoting their choice, even fewer of other candidates posting something opposing another candidate.. The vast majority? People posting against BS, and people supporting BS opposing other candidates.

None that would dare post it here due to ToS, but there’s a growing segment of “anyone but Bernie or bust” er’s out there in places that don’t have such rules.

His regular barrage of purity challenges helps with the primary effort, but damages the GE effort for whomever our ultimate candidate will be. Especially in the states that need to flip to hit that 270 to win point? The purity challenges aren’t so important to them. Especially in the Rust Belt area, the candidate that they feel will help alleviate their economic woes is the candidate they are going to select. Does anyone REALLY think that the Green New Deal is an important issue to Wisconsin, Ohio, and Pennsylvania? To Florida? Especially when, in the GE, Pissolini and the new Razi (Republican + Nazi) party are going to frame the environmental measures as something that will harm jobs and job potentials? Yes, that’s a flat out fucking lie, but it’s a line that all evidence shows works for them.

Speaking of orange Pissolini, there’s also those out there that every time they hear him speak, they blame BS for it. When they see children locked in cages? They blame BS for it. Is that fair? Maybe not, but that doesn’t change the way people feel, or how it may affect their support and ultimately their votes. His campain staff choices this time around, especially with multiple prior Stein supporters certainly isn’t doing anything to alleviate those feelings.

Our chances in the GE would have been so much better had he not chosen to run, but he is, so we’ll just have to deal with it, and hope for better results this time around.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
85. Yes, and there is proof..if you accept it.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:33 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie hired someone, I found that out here, that did not vote for Hilary, but instead voted for an opponent Jill Stein ..

...That is it, and that is all. Will that bring our people together? Those that worked so hard for Hilary, are they going to work for that person who worked and supported someone other than our candidate?

You must understand we do not need in fighting. We need unity to win. As much as I like Bernie's ideas, he really doesn't have a clue. Bernie defines, "in fighting." That is what he does. With a whole lot of "in fighting" we will lose.

Look, I worked for McGovern. I knocked on doors and passed out literature. People brought up his fight with the party. OK..that happened 46 years ago.
... That is the last thing we need now. We need to win. Trump is evil and so is the republican party. Bernie will cause division, and he already has caused division. It is all about "Bernie" Not unity to win. To save this country we must win. Why in the hell has he appointed a "Jill Stein" person?
I know you don't like it, but with Bernie the divider, we will lose. It is that simple. Bernie divides us, and already has done so.

Just so you know, McGovern, the divider, lost 49 out of 50 states in the electoral college. He got one state. That is what this is about. We must win to overturn the evil that Trump has caused. We will not win with Bernie Sanders.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(81,073 posts)
104. Great post.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:07 AM
Mar 2019

Yes, be careful - there is an impulse to hide what must not be seen

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Mr Tibbs

(539 posts)
151. Sanders is having no friction with the other candidates
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:40 PM
Mar 2019

The supporters of the other candidates do seem to be obsessed with him though. But that's on them.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
230. Google" David Sirota" "journalistic ethics" "political operative."
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:48 PM
Mar 2019

Come back after you do that.

K?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

PubliusEnigma

(1,583 posts)
78. Sanders is wasting people's time and energy. And they will be angry when he goes nowhere. Again.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:12 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
100. Of course he's not electable.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:59 AM
Mar 2019

Trump would mop the floor with him. It would be a bloodbath. He'd lose both the popular vote AND the Electoral College vote.

Why risk it? We have so many talented, brilliant, and energetic candidates to choose from. We need someone who has the STAMINA to be the Leader of the Free World. We need someone who can stand up and look our adversaries squarely in the eyes and let them know that it's a Brand New Day!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
103. A guy that ran an extension cord to his basement apartment because he couldn't pay his bills
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:06 AM
Mar 2019

is not going to play in middle America.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
106. Anybody that reads my posts knows I am one of the most sanguine posters on our chances.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:21 AM
Mar 2019

That being said I follow Trump's approval and potential 2020 match ups and am starting to believe Trump could actually get re-elected. He is an underdog, for sure, but a win can not be ruled out and that fills me with an existential dread.

IMO these Democrats have the best chance of defeating him, in order:

Biden
Beto
Booker
Klobuchar
Harris
Warren
Gillibrand
Sanders

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(81,073 posts)
107. The abomination has the entire GOP apparatus behind him
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:27 AM
Mar 2019

United and marching in lockstep like fucking Nazis

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
112. The data suggests Trump is an underdog and I believe he is.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:34 AM
Mar 2019

But he is not such an overwhelming underdog that a win can entirely be ruled out. He's not Herbert Hoover in the Spring of 1930 , just waiting to be defeated.

His chances are anywhere between 1 in 3 and 2 in 5 and that fills me with an existential dread.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dalton99a

(81,073 posts)
115. The idiot is no Superman. But we need a strong turnout driven by a strong ticket.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:43 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
123. Exactly. You want to get people to vote for him again? Nominate a socialist carreer politician
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:27 AM
Mar 2019

that wants to raise taxes and give away all kinds of free stuff, right after everybody just got stung on their own tax returns.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

aidbo

(2,328 posts)
110. Counterpoint: you're wrong.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 10:31 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BobMcWan

(18 posts)
120. OK, I won't argue that you believe Bernie is not electable
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:15 AM
Mar 2019

and I appreciate your working for McGovern. I have a friend who is equally haunted by that event.

I am standing by man. He is the clear choice if, like me, you want someone who will not compromise with Medicare for All. Compromise will not work in this instance because we are addressing a market failure in US healthcare.

For me, anybody WILL unify our party. I'm voting for our nominee. I'm also banking on a lot of independents, young people and folks who have simply given up on politics to take up our cause. I believe Bernie is the reason I see so many younger faces in the various political circles I engage with, and for the time being I am willing to be a fool.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

RobertDevereaux

(1,841 posts)
133. Thanks for this reply, Bob.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:09 PM
Mar 2019

I so appreciate it!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
138. How exactly will any president achieve Medicare for all?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:56 PM
Mar 2019

Please detail the steps. I'm ready to hear.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
139. I will vote for our parties nominee no matter who.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:15 PM
Mar 2019

I believe that my state will vote for a democratic nominee, as it usually does. But what about other states? Those that decide the electoral college vote. Will they come through and vote for Bernie? Yes, there are the Republican States and the Democratic States. What about the others? Will the "if" states vote for Bernie. Or call them the "I don't know states" will they vote for Bernie?

...About compromising Medicare for all, or all social programs that need to be passed, that is not the issue. And it won't be the issue till after the election in 2020.

..The key as far as I see it, is to elect our candidate. Being golden on an issue may be important, but we have not got the issue maker elected yet. Who are we going to elect that will be able to push through an issue in a mixed Congress 18 months from now? If I could be sure that Bernie's drawbacks would not hurt in the regular election, maybe I would be strongly for him.

..My guess is that they will hurt him. These issues have already hurt him in some ways. Where are the tax returns? Ok. What about this person who worked for Jill Stern? Will Bernie be so far off the center that he is not electable? Is there some problem with Bernie not supporting our nominee if it isn't him?

..So we will all see hopefully how and why this turns out. I hope the best for all candidates, and most important that we win in November of 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

radical noodle

(7,990 posts)
196. I'm in Florida
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 02:02 AM
Mar 2019

Bernie would never get the electoral college votes here. Never. I won't say he can't win the primary here (although I doubt it) but I cannot see a way in hell he could win the general election.

I'll say something else at risk of an ageism accusation. When Bill Clinton ran against Dole, a lot of people said Dole was too old for them to vote for him. Dole was 73. Sanders is 77. Joe Biden is 76. It should be someone younger. I'm 71 and I know what aging does.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
130. If it's a referendum election Trump is likely done. If he can make it a choice he isn't.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:45 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
137. Thank goodness we have you to tell us what is true.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 12:55 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
142. Opinion: The myth of ideology, and why Democrats' energy isn't all on the left
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 01:55 PM
Mar 2019



The vast majority of Democratic primary voters then and now do not identify as democratic socialists. Perhaps Sanders capitalized on unaffiliated anti-establishment types and Democrats who preferred him despite his ideology and not because of it. Move forward to the 2020 contests. Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) is providing the most substantive, interesting agenda that committed progressives could hope to see. Yet she is lagging in the polls. If this was all about progressive ideology and policy plans, she’d be running rings around the rest of the field.

As for Sanders, he benefits this time around from 100 percent name identification. However, the flip side of 100 percent name ID is that he’s no longer new, no longer saying things no one else will. He’s just as much of a democratic socialist as he was in 2016, but in the space of a few days we’ve seen that the “energy” isn’t all on the left; it’s drifting toward a centrist, young, optimistic candidate. Voters follow the energy and the ethos. They don’t carry around a thermometer gauging where on the scale of ideological purity each candidate rates.....

All you need to be is progressive enough to win a Democratic primary. Seeming more moderate than the Sanders clan is an advantage in the general election.

Why are pundits, the media and party insiders so convinced that ideological extremism equals energy/success? Part of it may be wishful thinking for progressives. However, part of the difficulty is linguistic. "Moderate” sounds to many ears to mean mild-mannered, prone to compromise and wishy-washy in beliefs. Nonsense. If ever there was a radical moderate, a fervent centrist Democrat, it’s O’Rourke. And gosh, he’s showing that can be exciting.

I doubt that sanders is going to be the nominee
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

MadDAsHell

(2,067 posts)
144. So do you "believe," or is it "true"? Which is it?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 02:46 PM
Mar 2019

This may shock you, but your beliefs are not naturally truth.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

dogman

(6,073 posts)
146. If you say so.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:35 PM
Mar 2019

The tablets have been delivered from the mountain top. I think Biden might win if he could get Anita Hill to be his running mate.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BlueWI

(1,736 posts)
147. I agree with the OP, to a point, as a Sanders supporter in 2016
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 03:54 PM
Mar 2019

but electable is what electable does. No matter who the nominee is, the work has to be put in to actually win. And we don't actually know whose electable until they win - until the candidates and their campaign staff, and grassroots Democrats, and the party infrastructure, all coordinate their efforts and realize that every candidate in double digits in the polling is a potential asset to build a winning coalition.

That being said, I am not supporting Sanders this time because of high negatives within the party, and frankly, that was part of the problem with the eventual nominee last time. Most of us said the high negatives within the party were not important in 2016. I think they were important and are important, and if there are alternative candidates with lower negatives, that's probably a better direction. But everyone has to live with the fact that their preferred candidate may not win, or their least favorite candidate may win. For instance, I'm not a Biden supporter, but I'm not going to harangue his supporters with online harassment, and if Biden wins the nomination, I have an interest in seeing him win the presidency.

I don't get why it's so popular to try and hector people into agreeing fully with one candidate. It's better to have open and respectful discussion and recognize that there are genuine differences on the issues. The disagreements should be focused on the issues, and there's shouldn't be so much slandering the candidates as one-dimensional cartoon figures. That was the problem last time with Clinton, and so far, that is the problem thus far with Sanders. Like him or not, many core supporters of Democrats like Sanders. What will the party as a whole do to recognize why Sanders has support, and leverage this support into an election day win?

Last point - I really am skeptical about the over-focus on 3% third party margins in WI, PA, MI. Third party voters will always exist. Hectoring them into submission isn't going to happen. How do we appeal to the other 97% of voters and the 50% of non-voters - as well as states beyond WI, PA, and MI? So much scapegoating, so little critical thinking and strategy, is the biggest problem that puts 2020 at risk.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BlueWI

(1,736 posts)
149. Last point - I want to lift up the name of George McGovern.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 04:04 PM
Mar 2019

He was a wise man, a patriot, and had a very successful political career.

While he lost big in 1972, so did some other Democratic candidates (Dukakis, Mondale). But we don't hold up their name as mud as often as we do McGovern.

So, I respect your experience of course, but can we not turn an amazing man and leader (McGovern) into the standard reference for all lost campaigns?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Doodley

(8,976 posts)
153. We need a candidate who is a loyal Democrat, who is a member of the
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 06:55 PM
Mar 2019

Democratic Party, and a candidate who represents our values without being seen as so far to the left that he/she will be branded "a socialist," "a communist," "an extremist," or "a risk to everything I have achieved," as Donald Trump would put it.

The election is a binary choice, and as horrendous as Trump is, people will flock to him in fear of seeing "a socialist" elected.

By the way, I am a socialist, but we have to live in the real world. We cannot risk Trump winning a second term. God, I don't know if I could personally survive it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
156. "believe" being the key word. we have religious freedom, thank God.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:18 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

robbedvoter

(28,290 posts)
157. I am voting Democrat in November. Male of this what you will
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:21 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
168. Interesting Freudian slip
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:27 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

MarianJack

(10,237 posts)
159. I think that Sanders would take a coast to coast beating...
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:40 PM
Mar 2019

...that would make 1972 look like 1960. This election is too important to allow that to happen.

RESIST!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,352 posts)
189. So do I. And then we are truly screwed. We can nominate someone who
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:36 AM
Mar 2019

Can win a general. If Sen. Sanders is the nominee I will vote for and work for him. But I think he will lose badly.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Mjolnir1956

(12 posts)
160. Good Analysis
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 07:44 PM
Mar 2019

Good post and well said. Bernie is not the right guy and no matter how his supporters spin it this is a fact. His ideas are OK but he's a terribly divisive candidate…..Bernie is going to be savaged this time….All his past votes for the NRA, His Me Too issues from his last campaign, His taxes, His foundation, His wife's past will all be MRI'd daily and he'll not respond well..I only hope by Super Tuesday he's done and we can get on to picking a nominee who can beat Trump.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

thesquanderer

(11,955 posts)
162. e: "We need to be totally united to beat them"
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:05 PM
Mar 2019

I think Dems will be united behind whoever gets the nomination. The key will be who can win the votes of non-Dems in November (esp. in WI, MI, PA). Remember, about 40% of the electorate is neither Dem or Repub... appealing to them is the key to victory.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

zentrum

(9,865 posts)
163. Agree with you about Sanders
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 08:57 PM
Mar 2019

Loved him last time but his time has passed.

But Biden has some problems as well. Anita Hill. Those videos of him taking her down wefre terrible. Working to delay desegregation by opposing federally mandated busing. I think he even worked with Strom Thurman. Wouldn't it be Joe's 3rd try at the ring? I think his time has passed too.

I'm really ready for some new Democrats.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gore1FL

(21,034 posts)
164. It's definitely true that you believe that. No argument there.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 09:54 PM
Mar 2019

There are much better arguments to make at this stage of the nomination process than this. It's really unclear at this time how the electorate will react to anyone at this early stage, much less calling anyone who might support him a fool.

Sanders may or may not be the answer. Let's start formulating the questions before we decide.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

man4allcats

(4,026 posts)
165. You admit that you believe Sanders isn't electable.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:20 PM
Mar 2019

Therefore you also admit that you don't KNOW Sanders is not electable. You say we can argue, but your premise is right regardless. I don't think it is. Further, I think you should substitute "Hillary" for :"Sanders" in your post and rethink what happened in 2016.

BTW, I voted for Hillary in the general.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
169. The OP is right.. BS is too Divisive.
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:27 PM
Mar 2019

And, the Russians and all the idiots who enabled them happened in 2016.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

man4allcats

(4,026 posts)
174. Why not let the OP speak for her/himself?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:51 PM
Mar 2019

But if you insist, you gotta mouth. Back it up with some facts/statistics. I like numbers.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
175. The OP has spoken for hmself.. didn't you
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:56 PM
Mar 2019

notice?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

man4allcats

(4,026 posts)
178. So you admit that you and the OP have nothing more than opinion.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:03 AM
Mar 2019

I remind you that everyone has one.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
181. BS is too Divisive.. our Dems are more
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:09 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

man4allcats

(4,026 posts)
185. I appreciate the match-up info.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:25 AM
Mar 2019

I wouldn't have predicted the Biden v Trump numbers, but we'll see. Of course in the general, I will vote for our nominee, whether Bernie or otherwise. And for what it's worth, I think your grandma wears Salvation Army combat boots. 😎

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

quakerboy

(13,901 posts)
166. And who is?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:26 PM
Mar 2019

Its not biden.
Its not harris
Its not beto or gabbard or booker or...

There is not currently standing on the field a candidate that meets the criteria you set forward, best I can tell. In the absense of which.. We all fight it out. There is no unity, except perhaps in our defiance of trump.

Even then.. I think that perhaps there are still some among us who are so offended by POC, Women, Elders, progressives, etc that they will work against whoever the party puts forward.

All we can do is do our best to hear the candidates, listen to what they bring to the table, do our best to ignore whatever irrelevancies the press bring us, have a free and fair primary, and hope that everyone sees the light by the time democrats choose a nominee.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

SFnomad

(3,473 posts)
167. If BS is the answer ... it must be a terrible question n/t
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:26 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 
171. Infight?
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:32 PM
Mar 2019

You're right, we should end the infighting. Why not unite behind the clear frontrunner, Senator Sanders, who also polls the best against Drumpf? He has been pushing for progressive values for decades, we know he wont abandon us once elected.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
180. Exactly, OhZone! Aravois and Krugman weigh in on that, too..
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:07 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
176. NO. BS is too divisive by his own
Fri Mar 22, 2019, 11:58 PM
Mar 2019

words.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

SFnomad

(3,473 posts)
195. Last time around, BS supporters tried to blame things on Secretary Clinton
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 01:52 AM
Mar 2019

This time Secretary Clinton isn't around but the same infighting is happening with BS. The common denominator between then and now .... BS.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
273. Messina Says Sanders Can't Beat Trump
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 05:00 PM
Apr 2019

I agree with Jim Messina on this https://politicalwire.com/2019/04/17/messina-says-sanders-cant-beat-trump/

Jim Messina, who managed Barack Obama’s re-election campaign in 2012, told ABC News that Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) cannot beat President Trump in 2020.

Said Messina: “I think if you look at swing voters in this country they are incredibly focused on the economy. I think today you look at it and say that Bernie Sanders is unlikely going to be able to stand up to the constant barrage that is Donald Trump on economic issues.”
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
286. Bernie is hoping for a brokered convention.
Tue Apr 23, 2019, 06:20 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

cstanleytech

(26,080 posts)
183. Maybe you are right or maybe you are wrong but regardless if Sanders should win the nomination
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:20 AM
Mar 2019

I will personally provide him my full support because almost anyone is better than whats now contaminating the Oval Office.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

onit2day

(1,201 posts)
184. You haven't learned yet what a corporate centrist with years of baggage does for the race?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:20 AM
Mar 2019

To me you are out of touch making accusations like this toward our most electable candidate while supporting a very likable but unelectable center right candidate. We'll just have to disagree but your conclusions are just not logical or supported. Would you have said the same about FDR, because to me and many others that is who Bernie reminds us of, and McGovern never did remind me of FDR. A Sanders/Warren ticket is a lock on the presidency. The country demands action not talk.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Demsrule86

(68,352 posts)
190. A Warren Sanders ticket will lose badly in the rustbelt states we must win.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:39 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

seta1950

(932 posts)
188. NO
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:32 AM
Mar 2019

Sanders is not electable, I agree

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

YOHABLO

(7,358 posts)
205. It's way too soon to be having this discussion. Let the process flow first.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 06:04 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

madville

(7,397 posts)
210. Sanders will never be the nominee for two reasons
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 09:56 AM
Mar 2019

1. He can't win a majority of delegates in the first round at the convention

2. In the second round, if it got to that, the super delegates won't support him.

He has no path to the nomination.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
216. I have removed some language from the original post. Sorry if I offended anyone
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:16 AM
Mar 2019

I used some words that could be offensive. About being a.. "fool".
... I am sorry if that offended anyone. I just want to win. My opinions are strong, but using those words was wrong. My apologies to anyone who was offended. I was wrong.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Eliot Rosewater

(31,097 posts)
227. Didnt see the original post. For me this is simple, I will ONLY vote for a Democrat.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:39 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

USALiberal

(10,877 posts)
217. Shocking, another anti-Bernie post. nt
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:17 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
218. I stated an opinion in the original post.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 11:29 AM
Mar 2019

..But I want to clarify one point. I will support whoever our party nominates, and that includes Bernie. If Bernie is the nominee, I will support him in every way that I can. I want our nominee to win over the current idiot who is president. Yes, I will send money if I can, and help in other ways if I can. This op is an opinion in March 2019. Things can change in the course of time. We are 19 months away from the next presidential election. Time will tell, and let's all say will support the nominee no matter who our party nominates. I will no matter who he or she is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
228. I expect this to be the case for supporters of almost every candidate
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:39 PM
Mar 2019

As for myself I will vote for the Democratic nominee, even if it is Sanders.

But, I believe that if he is the candidate, the Republicans will win.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

McKim

(2,412 posts)
225. Time for Ideas Not a Horserace: Campaign?
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:29 PM
Mar 2019

I did read somewhere that there was a giant campaign against Sanders just being rolled out.
Is this part of that? I want all of Sanders and Warren’s ideas out there way before we start talking about who is going to win. I will support their ideas and I will in the end vote for the Democratic Party candidate. Major forces want to kill universal health care for all and free college. Don’t let them win. It is past time for the average person to benefit from their tax dollars invested!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

customerserviceguy

(25,183 posts)
226. I agree
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 12:36 PM
Mar 2019

And your McGovern experience is quite pertinent here. I was still in high school when the 1972 election took place, and I was absolutely convinced that Nixon was politically dead. One of our high school teachers actually took a group of us to a McGovern campaign rally in a nearby large city.

The echo chamber I was surrounded by blinded me to the cruel reality that was about to come in November of that year.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

MineralMan

(146,192 posts)
231. I agree, and for one primary reason:
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 01:47 PM
Mar 2019

If he wins the nomination, which I think is unlikely in the extreme, the Republicans will use Sanders' own words to hang a huge sign around his neck that just reads: "SOCIALIST!"

That single thing would cost him the general election, I guarantee. Not yet is this country, state-by-state, given the electoral college system, ready to elect a self-proclaimed socialist as President. Not a freaking chance, and socialism is my philosphical preference.

It simply will not happen. The GOP will call any Democrat a socialist, but Senator Sanders is proud of the label and has referred to himself using that word again and again. The rest have not.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
233. Complete agreement, on all points
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 02:51 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Aaron Pereira

(383 posts)
235. If he's nominated don't continue infighting.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 05:36 PM
Mar 2019

Back the nominee even if you don't like the nominee. Encourage Democrats not to make the same mistake they made in 1972 when institutional support within the party went to Nixon. They left McGovern twisting in the wind and we all continue to pay the price.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LongtimeAZDem

(4,494 posts)
238. If he is nominated, I will zealously promote him to the very best of my ability. Period.
Sat Mar 23, 2019, 06:00 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
265. If he is nominated, I will support him as best I can. With money and work. We must win
Mon Apr 1, 2019, 06:12 PM
Apr 2019

the next presidential election to save this country. No matter who our party nominates, I will do the very best I can to support our candidate.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
239. What "institutional support within the Party" that "went to Nixon" are you talking about? (nt)
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 11:29 AM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
249. I don't know about "1972" but funny he didn't bring up 2016..
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 12:46 AM
Mar 2019

about "backing the nominee".. something a little bit closer in HISTORY!





The Hatemongering really worked.


Second, a lot of Bernie Sanders supporters weren’t big fans of Clinton. So Stein campaigning on the idea that Clinton and Trump were similar made it harder for Clinton to win over those voters — even if Sanders voters didn’t vote for Stein, they may have stayed home out of disgust.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/jill-stein-democratic-spoiler-or-scapegoat/
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
248. You mean like the "mistake" they made
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 12:42 AM
Mar 2019

in 2016 voting for jill stein's fucking LIES?





The Hatemongering really worked.


Second, a lot of Bernie Sanders supporters weren’t big fans of Clinton. So Stein campaigning on the idea that Clinton and Trump were similar made it harder for Clinton to win over those voters — even if Sanders voters didn’t vote for Stein, they may have stayed home out of disgust.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/jill-stein-democratic-spoiler-or-scapegoat/
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Celerity

(42,666 posts)
258. Never heard of Steven Leser before, glad to see him excited about Buttigieg
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 08:45 AM
Mar 2019

thanks for the tip


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
245. The Democrats Trump Fears Most
Mon Mar 25, 2019, 03:33 PM
Mar 2019

trump is worried about three possible Democratic nominees https://politicalwire.com/2019/03/24/the-democrats-trump-fears-most/

“President Trump has publicly boasted that he could beat any of his 2020 Democratic challengers. But privately, several members of the Trump campaign see a few who could pose a threat to his re-election, and are in the early stages of building out their strategy for attack,” Axios reports.

“The three candidates that seem to concern the Trump campaign most are Joe Biden, Kamala Harris and Beto O’Rourke. That’s in no particular order, and you’ll get a different answer depending on who you talk to.”
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
259. If the economy is strong, trump can win
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 06:09 PM
Mar 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
260. You are correct. He is not the answer.
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 07:31 PM
Mar 2019

I'm tired of people shitting on the Democratic party.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Awsi Dooger

(14,565 posts)
261. Bernie Sanders is not electable in this country
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 11:55 PM
Mar 2019

That opinion has nothing to do with my support of Beto. I did not follow the 2016 primary at all for two reasons: I thought Hillary was a cinch to get the nomination, and I thought a self-avowed socialist was a cinch to be ruthlessly picked apart toward defeat if he somehow managed the nomination.

It would be worse than any projection. So much fear out there. So many old videos. The turnout and passion argument is garbage. We were shoveled the same thing regarding Andrew Gillum here in Florida. Gillum wasn't anywhere close to as vulnerable as Sanders on ideology yet still had 46% of the Florida electorate saying Gillum was too liberal for the state. Translate that to a presidential race and we'll lose states we thought were a cinch.

Elections are won on preference, not turnout. Bernie Sanders would cost us too much in raw preference.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
263. Unfortunately I think you are correct..Using Florida as an example is perfect.
Wed Mar 27, 2019, 12:00 AM
Mar 2019

..It isn't Illinois, or New York, or California...these states will vote for our party.

It is Florida, Pennsylvania, or Wisconsin.. swing states as we call them. You name the rest..Oh I left out Ohio...yes that is one too.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Horse with no Name

(33,956 posts)
262. I was all in on Sanders in 2016
Tue Mar 26, 2019, 11:59 PM
Mar 2019

Unfortunately this time around, I’m all out.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
264. Washington Post-'Electability' and 'Bernie' don't belong in the same sentence
Mon Apr 1, 2019, 05:45 PM
Apr 2019



“A combined 58 percent of voters are either uncomfortable (37 percent) or have reservations about (21 percent) Bernie Sanders’ 2020 bid. For Elizabeth Warren, it’s a combined 53 percent. And for Kamala Harris and Beto O’Rourke, it’s 41 percent of voters expressing either reservations or discomfort.” Given that the overwhelming number of voters know who Sanders is, there is no excuse — as there is for other candidates — that they have insufficient information to decide whether to vote for him. Sanders is about as well known as former vice president Joe Biden, yet the poll shows that Biden’s comfortable/uncomfortable rating (48/48) clearly outpaces Sanders’s (37/58).....

Sanders’s age, the “socialist” moniker he embraces and his 2016 campaign problem with women are not going to change during the race. It’s unlikely his personality or his familiarity with foreign policy will improve, either. (The guy is 77, and if we have learned anything from Trump, it is that septuagenarians don’t change their personalities nor attend to habitual deficits in knowledge.) Oh, and on Sunday he again promised to release his tax returns, which he promised over a month ago would be “soon.”
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
266. If sanders is the nominee, trump wins
Sun Apr 14, 2019, 03:44 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
267. According to this study trump could win
Mon Apr 15, 2019, 01:47 PM
Apr 2019

There are posters who believe that we can nominate the most liberal/socialist nominee as possible and that candidate will easily win because everyone hates trump. It is their position that this is a historic opportunity to nominate someone would otherwise not be electable. This theory is wrong in that most POTUS are re-elected if the economy is good. Here is a scary study that shows this



There are good reasons to doubt this study


I do not believe that trump is assured of winning. If we want to win, Democrats need to nominate a strong nominee who is NOT too far out of the mainstream
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
268. According to this study trump could win
Mon Apr 15, 2019, 01:59 PM
Apr 2019

There are posters who believe that we can nominate the most liberal/socialist nominee as possible and that candidate will easily win because everyone hates trump. It is their position that this is a historic opportunity to nominate someone would otherwise not be electable. This theory is wrong in that most POTUS are re-elected if the economy is good. Here is a scary study that shows this



There are good reasons to doubt this study


I do not believe that trump is assured of winning. If we want to win, Democrats need to nominate a strong nominee who is NOT too far out of the mainstream
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
270. So, I will say again..If Bernie is nominated, he already has divided the Democratic Party.!!!
Mon Apr 15, 2019, 02:41 PM
Apr 2019

Read this entire post. All 230 posts.

Bernie already has divided the Democratic party for/against him..Too late to discuss.."will this happen?"

This division already has taken place around Bernie. Last 3 sentences..

............Take it or leave it. But this is the truth!!!!!!!!!!!!!......................................................

................ see posts 266, 267, and 268

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
272. According to Jim Messina, trump will beat sanders easily
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 03:32 PM
Apr 2019



Political adviser Jim Messina, who managed former President Barack Obama’s re-election campaign in 2012, answered a question Wednesday that has been on the minds of Democrats looking ahead at the 2020 presidential race.

"Can Bernie Sanders beat Donald Trump?" ABC News Chief White House Correspondent Jonathan Karl asked Messina on the Powerhouse Politics podcast on Wednesday.

"No," Messina responded.,,,,

"I think if you look at swing voters in this country they are incredibly focused on the economy," Messina replied. "I think today you look at it and say that Bernie Sanders is unlikely going to be able to stand up to the constant barrage that is Donald Trump on economic issues."
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

artislife

(9,497 posts)
275. Why just call out Sanders?
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 07:56 PM
Apr 2019

There are a lot of candidates who are barely making a splash. Good ones, like Inslee.

In this America, I see a lot of voters who won't vote for a woman or another person of color, because they mistakenly think that they have had their time. Like once was enough.

I find Biden and Sanders having the same problem. Age. Even Liz is getting there, but women do live longer than men on average.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

BeckyDem

(8,361 posts)
276. The voters will decide this and they like him across party lines.
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 08:01 PM
Apr 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to Stuart G (Original post)

 

doompatrol39

(428 posts)
278. He is unless moderates decide to sit out the election if they don't get their way.
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 08:09 PM
Apr 2019

If they don't recognize that Trump is the bigger threat and decide to not support the Democratic nominee despite their misgivings, then yes we will lose. If they see the greater good and unite behind the nominee despite their need to have all their demands met then we will win.


See how that works?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

NanceGreggs

(27,813 posts)
279. Agreed 100%
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 08:16 PM
Apr 2019

Those who love Bernie and those who loathe him surely have to agree on one point: he is an extremely divisive figure. We saw that in 2016, and we're seeing it again now.

Anyone who can't unite the Dem party certainly can't unite the country - which is going to be job one for the next POTUS.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
281. sanders want to get the nomination with only 30% support
Wed Apr 17, 2019, 10:48 PM
Apr 2019

Even Mondale had more support


?s=20
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
285. Nate Silver- Sanders Can Win, But He Isn't Polling Like A Favorite
Tue Apr 23, 2019, 05:36 PM
Apr 2019

Nate thinks that it is possible for sander to win the nomination but this is not likely. sanders is not going to be the nominee of the party. sanders thinks that getting 30% of the primary vote is sufficient which means taking the fight to the contested convention. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bernie-sanders-can-win-but-he-isnt-polling-like-a-favorite/

Historically, though, candidates who are polling at only about 20 percent nationally despite the near-universal name recognition that Sanders enjoys don’t have a great track record. From our research on the history of past primary polls, I found 15 candidates from past nomination processes who, like Sanders, (i) polled at an average of between 15 percent and 25 percent4 in national polls in the first six months of the year before the Iowa caucuses5 and (ii) who had high or very high name recognition.6.....

Achieving a delegate majority could be hard for Sanders
You could also argue that the three winning candidates from the list — Barack Obama and John McCain in 2008 and Mitt Romney in 2012 — aren’t good comparisons for Sanders, especially from a “The Party Decides” standpoint where preferences among party insiders and activists are leading indicators of voter preferences. Romney, for instance, had the backing of the GOP party establishment as a potential consensus choice, whereas Sanders largely lacks it from Democrats. Obama was a rising star, rather than someone left over from a previous cycle, and gained a lot of momentum among party elites as the 2008 cycle wore on, even if they also liked Clinton. McCain, who ran against the party establishment in 2000 but was someone the party could live with in 2008, is in some ways the most favorable comparison for Sanders.

In many respects, however, Sanders is more similar to Jesse Jackson in 1984 and 1988, George Wallace in 1972 and 1976 or Ron Paul in 2012, candidates who represented important constituencies within their respective parties but who didn’t have an obvious way to unite the rest of the party behind them or to win a delegate majority.

At times, Sanders’s strategists actually seem to be leaning into the strategy of being a factional candidate. The Sanders campaign may have all kinds of reasons to feel aggrieved by how the party establishment has treated it, especially when it reads articles like the one in The New York Times that suggest the establishment is out to get it again! Nonetheless, the campaign hasn’t sought to mend fences when conflicts have arisen this year. Instead, Sanders aides told The Atlantic’s Edward-Isaac Dovere that they think they can win the nomination with as little as a 30 percent plurality of delegates. That’s a risky strategy since it would necessarily entail a contested convention, where party insiders would play an outsized role. Nor would Sanders, a 77-year-old white man, reflect the various constituencies of the Democratic Party (and the demographics of the delegates themselves) as well as someone like Harris might.

sanders will not be the nominee if sanders only gets 30% of the primary vote. There are too many real democrats who have long memories and who will not forgive or forget. If this gets to a floor fight, the delegates for the other candidates will not support sanders and the super delegates will get to break any deadlocks after the first ballot.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
288. Opinion: If the economy keeps its momentum, 2020 will be Trump's to lose
Sat May 4, 2019, 01:08 PM
May 2019

2020 will be a very close election if the economy is strong. Democrats have to pick a very strong nominee




One wonders whether, at some point, the economic boom will be so huge that it will drive opinions on its own. Once Democrats settle on a nominee, voters will have to make a choice: Do they stick with the guy they’ve got, warts and all, who has contributed to such good times? Or are they willing to take the risk that the next president, even if he or she is a better person, will screw things up with a new agenda?

One election model from Alan Abramowitz, a political scientist at Emory University, suggests the economy will be the winning factor. His “time for change” model has a solid track record in predicting the outcome and direction of presidential races, and data he published last month show that, so long as the economy continues to grow at a 2 percent clip, Trump should be a favorite for reelection even if his job approval rating is as poor as it is now.

Indeed, it’s even better than that for Trump. The model calculates an average gain of 2.5 electoral votes for every one-point Trump shaves off of his net job disapproval. According to the model, even if gross domestic product growth slumps to 1 percent, Trump could win the minimum 270 electoral votes he needs for reelection by lowering his net job disapproval rating to 7 percent. Right now, that number is around 10 percent.

Media attention is focused on the Mueller report and other congressional investigations. But if the economy keeps its momentum, even that or Trump’s failure to trumpet his success might not prevent him from winning a second term.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

musicman65

(524 posts)
289. I saw the light
Sat May 4, 2019, 02:49 PM
May 2019

I worked for Nixon,this is much worse,,,,gotta' go !! orange one

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Otto Lidenbrock

(581 posts)
292. bernie didn't even vote for mcgovern
Sat May 4, 2019, 04:41 PM
May 2019

In fact he didn't vote in any election until his name was on the ballot. For Mayor of Vermont. In 1981. Age 41.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Iggo

(47,489 posts)
293. Get behind the nominee, whoever that is.
Sat May 4, 2019, 04:45 PM
May 2019

Don't go PUMA on us.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Beatleman

(29 posts)
295. I worked
Sat May 4, 2019, 05:18 PM
May 2019

for Nixon,,,hope we have evolved from that,,I sure did,,,wow !!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

johannsyah

(58 posts)
297. can they just stop saying
Sat May 4, 2019, 07:17 PM
May 2019

that Joe Biden is worse than Hillary Clinton? so many extreme Bernie bros have been posting it on Twitter and Facebook.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

mtnsnake

(22,236 posts)
298. Yeah, just like the bloated asshole currently sitting in the WH wasn't electable in 2016 either.
Sat May 4, 2019, 07:23 PM
May 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
300. Most Believe Socialism Is Not American
Mon May 6, 2019, 05:55 PM
May 2019

Here is some polling that supports the concept that socialism is not in favor with American voters https://politicalwire.com/2019/05/06/most-believe-socialism-is-not-american/

A new Monmouth poll finds 57% of Americans say that socialism is not compatible with American values, while just 29% say it is compatible.

Key finding: 42% have a negative opinion of socialism in general, with another 45% having a neutral opinion and just 10% holding a positive view of socialism.

Meanwhile, 39% of Americans have a positive opinion of capitalism in general, while 40% have a neutral opinion and another 17% hold a negative view of capitalism.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Stuart G

(38,365 posts)
301. Most Americans don't know what "Socialism" is..
Mon May 6, 2019, 06:20 PM
May 2019

In New York City...who runs the subway system?....some private company, or some government agency?
Who owns that subway system? Who owns the airport?..Who owns the water department? Who provides the water?..etc...etc...etc...
......government agency???? is that socialism?? We should go on forever with this..couldn't we?
......There are so many agencies that are kinda socialistic, that there is not enough space for all of them..

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
304. But then many Americans who say they support Socialism
Mon May 6, 2019, 08:41 PM
May 2019

actually support a Social Democracy or elements of one.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Celerity

(42,666 posts)
305. This grows more and more true daily nt
Mon May 6, 2019, 09:36 PM
May 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
306. If Bernie loses support among youth, what is left???
Wed May 15, 2019, 05:11 PM
May 2019

sanders is not trying to win a majority of the party but wants to get to the convention with 30% of the delegates. That is less likely now
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/5/15/1857658/-If-Bernie-loses-support-among-youth-what-s-left

Bernie Sanders’ strategy for victory in 2020 isn’t about winning the majority of delegates to the Democratic Party convention. “Sanders aides believe he’ll easily win enough delegates to put him into contention at the convention,” reported The Atlantic. “They say they don’t need him to get more than 30 percent to make that happen.” Once they’re at the convention with his 30 percent, they presumably figure they can threaten and bully the party to nominate him. This way, he doesn’t have to work to expand support beyond his core group of supporters.

However, what happens if he can’t hold that core? This isn’t 2016, with a binary choice between Bernie and a demonized establishment Democrat. This is a rich field, with credible candidates representing just about every key party constituency. There are candidates just as liberal as Bernie, yet not as polarizing. So would Bernie’s core supporters stick with him as they became better aware of this amazing field? Apparently not, according to the latest Morning Consult primary poll.

“Sanders on the decline with 18-29 year-olds,” reads the polling memo. ”Throughout March, Bernie Sanders had 45% of the first choice vote share among America’s youngest voters. That support has steadily declined and currently sits at 33%.”...

With Bernie Sanders at 19 points in this poll, he’s a far cry from the 30 percent or so he wants for his “force himself upon a brokered convention” scenario (understanding that the popular vote and delegate allocation aren’t a one-to-one calculation, but close enough). It’s been clear he’s been maxed out for a while—both his and his supporters’ ornery approach to politics don’t lend themselves to big-tent embrace of a broader coalition. Quite the opposite, in fact.

He can’t grow, and if he can’t hold his most important supporters? His path to the nomination, already near-zero, becomes effectively zero.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
308. sanders was counting on a brokered convention
Wed May 15, 2019, 07:40 PM
May 2019

sanders official game plan was to get 30% of the primary vote and force a brokered convention. That is not going to happen now



If sanders keeps on losing support, then he should hope that other candidates will carry his "message"
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
309. I understand what you're saying and if things stay the same, you'll be right.
Wed May 15, 2019, 08:14 PM
May 2019

But we have some debates to go. Joe has some splaining to do and anything can happen if Joe drops out.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
310. Kick because of the ridiculous Biden copycat thread...nt
Wed May 15, 2019, 10:54 PM
May 2019

Sid

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

WeekiWater

(3,259 posts)
311. Well said. Kick.
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:06 PM
May 2019

Someone recently linked to your op trying to make the case Biden is unelectable. One of the cornerstones of their argument is that progressives are going to have a hard time choosing between Biden and Trump.

Here is the line:

“progressives would be forced to choose between a corporate owned Democrat and Donald Trump”

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
314. Gallop-Less Than Half in U.S. Would Vote for a Socialist for President
Fri May 17, 2019, 01:47 PM
May 2019

This polling would make it very difficult to win with a socialist candidate on the ballot https://news.gallup.com/poll/254120/less-half-vote-socialist-president.aspx

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Less than half of Americans (47%) say they would vote for a qualified presidential candidate who is a socialist -- the same percentage Gallup found in 2015. A socialist candidate is the only one among a dozen hypothetical candidates about whom a minority of Americans say they are willing to give their vote....

In spite of the expanded tolerance for diversity, candidates labeling themselves as socialists may struggle to gain traction in a presidential race, as Americans have not become more open to such a candidate. Even as political figures advocating socialist ideas have gained popularity in Democratic circles in recent years, less than half of Americans remain willing to give an avowed socialist candidate their vote. This creates a challenge for the Democratic Party, as it seeks to avoid alienating the Democratic socialists within its rank and file, while still aiming to win a national election.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

musicman65

(524 posts)
315. Who is best
Fri May 17, 2019, 01:54 PM
May 2019

being behind the Big desk,,with the RED PHONE ???

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
316. Bernie's mystery Soviet tapes revealed
Fri May 17, 2019, 06:33 PM
May 2019

In addition to the Oppo that the GOP already had accumulated, this comes out with even more material that will show up in ads if sanders is the nominee




Sanders’ opponents, though, will likely find much in the tapes to call outlandish. And in a campaign season in which Democrats are concerned about nothing more than defeating President Donald Trump, there’s plenty of material that Democratic voters might worry the Republican Party could spin into a 30-second negative ad.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
318. New CNN poll: A majority of Americans say they think President Trump is going to win a second term
Wed Jun 5, 2019, 02:08 PM
Jun 2019



A majority of Americans say they think Donald Trump is going to win a second term, according to a CNN Poll conducted by SSRS, even as the President's reviews on issues other than the economy remain largely negative.

The new poll finds 54% say their best guess is that Trump will win the 2020 election, 41% feel he will lose. Americans are slightly more apt to say Trump will win now than they were to say Barack Obama would win a second term in May 2011, in a survey conducted just after the death of Osama bin Laden (50% thought Obama would win in that poll). The new numbers on Trump are a reversal from December, when a narrow majority of 51% said they thought Trump would lose his bid for re-election.

The shift over that time comes mostly among those who disapprove of Trump's handling of the presidency. In December, 81% in that group said they thought the President would lose, and now, that's fallen to 67%. At the same time, the share who approve of the President and think he will win has held mostly steady (88% now vs. 85% in December).

The dislike those disapprovers hold for Trump is palpable in the poll. Asked to explain in their own words why they disapprove of Trump, Trump's behavior is a central reason. The most frequently cited responses are lying (13%), racism (11%), incompetence (11%) and not acting presidential (7%). Immigration, named by 7%, is the only specific issue that merits mention by 5% or more.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
319. Washington Post-Sanders wants Americans to buy into socialism. He's got some convincing to do
Wed Jun 12, 2019, 06:16 PM
Jun 2019

I do not think that the Democratic Party can win with a socialist on the ticket



It’s a risky move, not least because he has some convincing to do — among his 2020 Democratic field and the whole country. “Should the Democratic Party embrace socialism?” is at the heart of its debate about what kind of candidate can beat President Trump.

Let’s start with the whole country. Less than half of Americans say they’d vote for a socialist for president. More say they’d vote for an atheist or Muslim, according to a Gallup survey in May. That’s the same as 2015 when Sanders first launched his presidency, despite his efforts during that campaign to warm Americans up to socialism. A Monmouth University survey in April finds 57 percent of Americans think socialism is not compatible with American values.....

“If we’re not careful, we’re going to end up reelecting the worst president in American history,” said former Colorado governor John Hickenlooper. (He got booed by a gathering of Democrats in San Francisco for saying that.) It’s also notable that the most vocal proponents of dropping socialism from the campaign trail are at the bottom of the polls right now....

Republicans are downright giddy about all this. What’s a scarier term to the American public than “socialist”? And with one of the leaders in the Democratic Party embracing it, their pitch to voters that Democrats want to radically change the country to something unrecognizable just got a lot easier.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(144,005 posts)
320. New poll: Capitalism is more popular than socialism
Tue Jun 25, 2019, 01:57 PM
Jun 2019



A new Pew Research poll finds that “a much larger share of Americans have a positive impression of capitalism (65%) than socialism (42%).” The partisan gap is significant, though: “Nearly eight-in-ten Republicans and Republican leaning independents (78%) express somewhat or very positive reactions to the term, while just over half of Democrats and Democratic leaners (55%) say they have a positive impression.” The intensity of anti-socialism sentiment (63 percent of Republicans have a very negative view) dwarfs that of pro-socialism sentiment (only 14 percent of Democrats have a very positive view).....

First, “socialism” is a red flag for Republicans and Republican-leaners to a degree that “progressive” (which 40 percent of Republicans view favorably) is not. There’s not even all that much payoff among Democrats, since 33 percent of Democrats have a negative view of that term, while only 12 percent have a very positive view of socialism. If you want a Democratic nominee to have the broadest ideological appeal, the most unifying descriptor among Democrats is “progressive” (88 percent), not socialism (65 percent).....

First, “socialism” is a red flag for Republicans and Republican-leaners to a degree that “progressive” (which 40 percent of Republicans view favorably) is not. There’s not even all that much payoff among Democrats, since 33 percent of Democrats have a negative view of that term, while only 12 percent have a very positive view of socialism. If you want a Democratic nominee to have the broadest ideological appeal, the most unifying descriptor among Democrats is “progressive” (88 percent), not socialism (65 percent).
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,926 posts)
321. Thanks, Goth..
Tue Jun 25, 2019, 08:52 PM
Jun 2019

The title of this OP never gets old.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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