Bernie last night...

[garybeck]

I was a Bernie supporter in 2016 but today i'm one of those that would just like to see someone younger. And I think the "socialist" label would not be a help in the general election. I am leaning towards Warren with my vote.

But I would just like to say that after watching the debate last night, i am really glad that Bernie was on the stage and he said the things that he said. Some of those things he said, no one else is saying them and clearly as he is, and they need to be said. I'm glad he's in the race. And I would be fine if he wins the nomination.

[question everything]

1. And you have no problem with him not being a Democrat

refusing to change his affiliation, probably is mocking us for embracing him while he has campaigned against other Democrats.

Frankly, if we don't care about a Democratic nominee, why should the rest of the country take us seriously?

And don't forget, his strength in 2016 led many of his supporters to vote for Trump or to stay home, either way, contributing to our loss.

[HerbChestnut]

2. Some people are not as tribal as others.

[Lucky Luciano]

6. Exactly. I really can't wrap my head around...

...

1) Party first
2) Party first
3) Party first
...
9) Party first
10) policies.

[Hortensis]

9. Maybe wrap your head around the joint Republican/Russian

efforts to destroy our liberal democracy.

For aware liberal progressive Democrats, this is not about tribalism.

It is about whether our vote will be real or pretend in future, about whether progressive liberal government will continue or be replaced by a RW authoritarian government, probably in the form of faux democracy that so many authoritarian states masquerade as.

The Democratic Party is the army battling to save our democracy. We're it. There's no one else.

And the reality is that people like Sanders have always emotionally focused on the Democratic Party as the nation's big problem, almost to the point of being unable to worry about the giant threats growing on the right. Just look at the bizarre concentration on which healthcare system we should have while conservative legislatures strip newly elected liberal governors of power, elections are blatantly stolen across the nation, and the Supreme Court is packed with RW economic, social and religious extremists. The question is whether progressive government itself will survive.

What happens to our civil rights and protections, everyone's but especially of minorities and women, if we no longer can vote to protect ourselves? Gone.

Liberals are the nation's big progressive power, currently organized as the Democratic Party. This nation was founded as a progressive liberal democracy by liberals, and every social and economic progressive advance without exception has been made by liberals, in better times with cooperation from others but none would or could have happened without us.

Every time Sanders tells America Democrats are hardly different from Republicans, he strikes at progressivism itself. The 2016 tragedy was a dreadful blow to progressive government and may still turn out to have been fatal.

Btw, I notice Sanders' followers almost never call themselves Progressives any more, but they should be proudly and determinedly calling themselves progressive. It's way past time to take the fight for everything they believe in to the Republicans.

[Lucky Luciano]

10. Criticizing the republicans is worthless - they cannot be reasoned with and they are a hopeless lot.

The Democrats have morals and should be able to absorb constructive criticism for the better. So, if a progressive without party affiliation has anything to say, I'm always happy to listen.

I like Bernie's policies, so I like him - period.

...and I have no idea what people talk about when they say he trashes the Democrats. I think we are mature enough to listen to honest criticism...if not, that is lame. You don't have to want to implement changes based on that criticism, but if it comes from a sincere progressive place, it is worth listening to.

[Hortensis]

12. "When we're dancing w/the angels the question will be asked,

'in 2019 what did we do to make sure we kept our democracy?"

?

A man who always understood exactly what he was fighting for.

[Lucky Luciano]

14. RIP Good Sir.

I had no idea about his health issues.

I’m voting blue no matter who. That is one thing I’m doing.

[thesquanderer]

11. I agree. Like Bernie or not, IMO, "not a Dem" is about the silliest reason to not like him.

If he's enough of a Dem for the DNC, he's enough of a Dem for me.

He's not my first or second choice, but if primary day comes rolling around and polls show him as being much stronger against Trump than those choices in electoral college projections, he'll get my vote.

[LanternWaste]

16. An ironic allegation to make on "Democratic" underground

(this is where you pretend it's irrelevant in your case...)

[Lucky Luciano]

17. Policies first. Party second.

Bernie’s policies are Democratic in nature. Perhaps a bit more left. If Democrats don’t like his European moderate liberal positions, oh well, but I will vote blue no matter who in the end.

[BlueMississippi]

3. He could have said those things without running for POTUS

and attacking the real Democrats, DNC and the Democratic party as a whole.

[HerbChestnut]

4. The "real" Democrats...lol.

[BlueMississippi]

7. Correct, and it is not a laughing matter

unless one is a green party or Trump voter

[Hoyt]

5. Exactly. No matter what, he is helping to shape the Party's ideology for better.

[NurseJackie]

8. His attacks and smears of the Democratic party cause division and distrust. That weakens us.

No matter what, he is helping to shape the Party's ideology for better.

No he's not. GMAFB, Hoyt!

Honestly, what good purpose does it serve when anyone goes out of their way to smear Democrats and the Democratic party? When anyone goes to such great lengths to denigrate and demonize the Democratic party, it only serves to cause division and distrust. That weakens us.

Oh, I'm sure you've heard all the smears before... the ugly lies...

It's NOT TRUE that Democrats are "ideologically bankrupt". It's NOT TRUE that Democrats are "feeble". It's NOT TRUE that Democrats are "corrupt". It's NOT TRUE that the Democratic party is an "absolute failure". It's NOT TRUE that the Democratic party is "the party of the one-percent". It's NOT TRUE that the Democratic party is the "party of the elite". It's NOT TRUE that there's "no difference between Democrats and Republicans." It's NOT TRUE that Democrats are "do-nothings". It's NOT TRUE that the Democratic party "doesn't care about climate change." It's NOT TRUE that the Democrats "focus too much" on diversity. It's also NOT TRUE that people who the refuse to vote for an African-American because of his skin color "aren't racists". It's also NOT TRUE that the Democrats who "are very big into diversity" aren't "particularly sympathetic" to the working class.

We can't win national elections whenever someone keeps repeating lies about the Democratic party... lies that discourage participation, volunteerism, support of our party's candidates, donating, canvassing, VOTING FOR DEMOCRATS!!!

Here's the bottom line when it comes to things like this: Negativity generates apathy. Apathy discourages voter turnout. Low voter turnout gives Republicans a chance to steal the elections.

[Hoyt]

15. There is that. Believe me, I have little use for Sanders or Warren when it comes to their attacks

on other Democrats.

Personally, I think Sanders and Warren's attack on Obama's TPP -- and Clinton by association -- had as much to do with us getting trump elected as the Ruskies.

But, I do think their positions will help mold a better party. If either one of them is our candidate in general election, I fear we will lose.

[Joe941]

13. Thank you.