Biden: 'It's fascinating that the person who has a plan for everything has no plan for the

[Skya Rhen]

single most consequential issue in this election'...

Link to tweet

[guillaumeb]

1. The US corporate owned media bears much of the blame.

Taxes would rise under Medicare for All, but total per capita spending would fall.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

63. Yes, it's so obvious... if by a miracle Joe wins the nomination, this will come back to haunt him!!

If Joe is smart, and he is, he'll retract his baseless attack on Elizabeth.


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[guillaumeb]

91. Agreed on your initial point.

[Thekaspervote]

2. No wonder she isn't talking about it. Figures out today from the CBO: 34 trillion over next decade

[sop]

41. Many civilized nations throughout the world provide healthcare to their citizens

Here's just a partial list of the many, many countries that offer free or very low cost healthcare to all of their citizens:

Argentina, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, China, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hong Kong, Hungary, Iceland, India, Iran, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Monaco, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Romania, Russia, Saudi Arabia, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Taiwan, Thailand, Turkey, Ukraine, United Arab Emirates and United Kingdom.

How do they do it?

Scare tactics, like the stuff we heard from Biden, Klobuchar and others last night, have prevented the US from implementing a healthcare system that covers everyone. At least Warren and Sanders are willing to address the issue.

[Blistering Sun]

3. Biden (et al) are correct.

I think we've seen "peak Warren."

She had a chance to say there are many paths to universal coverage last night--which is what I expected--but she doubled down on a plan that's unsustainable and that she can't defend.

Surprising for a person who otherwise has run a nearly flawless campaign. But this is the most important issue of the day and Joe Biden has a better vision.

[hurl]

4. Turning on our own

We should focus on Trump and his support in court for removing protections for preexisting conditions. Biden is playing in to RW talking points and supporting Trump by criticizing a fellow Democrat. Not cool.

[DavidDvorkin]

6. It's the primary contest

Of course they criticize each other.

[dem4decades]

8. So there can be no discussion on policy differences?

If Democrats don't bring up weak arguments the Republicans will gladly do it.

[Kahuna7]

9. She has to be vetted. She has a lot of extensive, expensive plans and

doesn't have a very practical way to pay for them all. She hauled off last night and said she would increase social security checks by $200 a month. Not only free college but paying off all current debt. C'mon.

[blm]

32. 2% wealth tax. And most Americans agree with that already.

She isn’t math-challenged, Kahuna, she knows how the financial industry works inside and out, and knows where to find the money based on the historic amount of breaks given to that elite set.

There ARE people who know exactly where she’d get the money and they are Jamie Dimon and his cronies.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

52. BOOOOOM!! Elizabeth is probably the smartest candidate to ever run for President... she's got this!!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[tirebiter]

101. Yang covered that

Seems like a good idea until it’s tried. Wealth taxes were tried and bailed in the 90’s.

[Kahuna7]

71. Is that the plan where she's going to tax the ASSETS over a certain amount...

every year? Excuse me. How would that work? How would that audit be conducted? Who gets to determine what one's assets are? Doesn't sound realistic to me. She may be better at math. But I might be better at common sense.

[highplainsdem]

11. Look, as soon as Biden announced he was running Warren sent out a fundraising letter sniping at

him for a "swanky" fundraiser. Then the news came out that she'd benefited from swanky fundraisers given by the same people just last year.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287110075



Warren has said repeatedly that she supports Sanders' plan for Medicare for All. That it's her plan, too.

But Sanders has been honest enough to admit taxes on the middle class will go up. As he did once again last night.

Warren has been questioned on this again and again, including by other candidates as she was last night, and she just keeps being evasive, as if she's fooling anyone.

I think she's hurting herself. She's making herself look weak and less than candid compared to Sanders.

Her supporters often say she doesn't want to say anything that will give Republicans a sound bite to use against her in the GE.

But most ads these days are longer than 15 or 30 seconds. And you wouldn't need a very long ad to put together video of Warren saying Sanders' plan is hers, Sanders admitted taxes will go up, and Warren trying to evade the question again and again.

[emmaverybo]

28. I notice that a challenge to Warren is met by her and many supporters with the RW talking point

accusation. It was either the first or second debate that EW lodged that go-to accusation when a
competitor asked about her M4All plan. Last night, again.

The fact is that Dems are asking. Dems are challenging. Dems have a right to know about candidates” plans, to challenge candidates without being shamed into silence with the R word.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

44. Seriously! It's gonna backfire on ol' Joe... just like it did on Kamala, as she has steadily faded.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Kahuna7]

74. Nope.Biden didn't attack her. He corrected her. I will concede that like Kamala

she may get a sugar high bump until people really have a chance to actually consider the feasibility of what she's proposing. Smells like smoke to me.

[Demsrule86]

92. Too bad Warren didn't focus on Trump using the power of his office to attack a political rival.

It would have been nice if she had (like other team players in our party) condemned it. Warren has said nothing on this...and Biden has a right to differentiate himself from Warren on matters of policy. She did dance around the question of how much and how do we pay at the debate. MFA is a political loser for us.

[Otto Lidenbrock]

5. Her plan is to defer to Bernie

And given Bernie takes full ownership of M4A and carries strong candour that's the reason - the only reason - this is an issue.

Warren has gone too far in to suddenly reverse if she gets the nomination. There can be no pivoting on M4A for her now so she may as well own it like Bernie.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

45. Why SHOULD Elizabeth pivot on MFA?! She's 100% right on the issue!!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[whathehell]

103. Thank you, Yes.

Warren has plans AND passion, two things Biden seems short on.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

106. Why Biden's campaign is bleeding cash & in a downtrend, while Elizabeth keeps rising in the polls.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[BeckyDem]

7. He is questioning her honesty? wow

Good luck with that match.

[highplainsdem]

12. Klobuchar to Warren last night: "At least Bernie's being honest here."

Biden isn't saying anything other candidates haven't said about this.

There have been LOTS of news stories about Warren's evasiveness.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/15/elizabeth-warren-takes-heat-for-dodging-question-on-medicare-for-all-taxes.html

[BeckyDem]

13. Yea. Let him go there, Amy too.

They will each sink and heavily for it.

[highplainsdem]

15. No, they apparently finally got through to Warren, and they've done her a favor,

since she's finally realized she'd created a problem for herself:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287312677

Now she can try to fix the problem she created.

[BeckyDem]

17. What does she have to fix, in your opinion?

[highplainsdem]

18. Look at the CNN article linked to in that thread.

[BeckyDem]

19. I read it. I am asking you, what do you believe she needs to fix?

Do you believe she is giving up on Medicare for All? What do you think her staff is doing, correcting her?

Last night after debate she said, the price of her plan could “vary by literally trillions and trillions of dollars.” She said “revenue streams” would cover it, but she didn’t explain what they were.

Is she being less evasive now, more honest, according to Joe and Amy?

The bottom line in my view is any candidate who doesn't embrace Medicare for All and isn't honest about who gets left out with this bullshit about "choices" will lose.

[emmaverybo]

29. That millions want choice is not bs. That attitude toward the American public is not a winning one

in my humble opinion. There are other ways to get to universal healthcare than M4All.

[BeckyDem]

30. They want less coverage? That is what they will receive when they get sick.

[emmaverybo]

33. No. Many wanting choice have excellent coverage. It is simply not true that all plans are as

Warren has described—junk plans that refuse to pay for serious illness. It is also not true that single payer will cover any and all drugs, any and all treatments.

Many who want to keep their employer-provided or retirement benefits-provided plans like the care they get and the coverage.

[BeckyDem]

38. She is basing her responses from responsible sources.

David U. HimmelsteinDavid U. Himmelstein is a Distinguished Professor of Public Health at the City University of New York at Hunter College.

Steffie WoolhandlerSteffie Woolhandler is a Distinguished Professor of Public Health at the City University of New York at Hunter College.

https://www.thenation.com/article/insurance-health-care-medicare/

If you can muddy the waters and defeat Medicare for All it will be a benefit only to the for profit system, not the people who they are suppose to serve.

[blm]

40. Please prove your claim that Warren said ALL plans are junk plans.

[emmaverybo]

49. She has said she does not know of anyone who likes her insurance plan. Her only examples are

of those with very bad coverage. I am for universal healthcare, but it is wrong-headed to discount
the millions who have good coverage at affordable rates (or do not pay the premiums, which is true in vested situations).

[blm]

51. You said she said ALL plans are junk plans. Link?

[emmaverybo]

57. No, I used the word junk plans to characterize the plans she has used as examples. If poor

quality is a better word, fine. Plans that refuse to pay to treat cancer or MS are certainly garbage.
But my point is that people who want choice are not trying to hold on to plans that won’t pay
for treating them when they are ill or provide sub-standard healthcare.

[blm]

62. Who gets great plans? Good plans? Junk plans?

IMO, some here are running to the right on this issue because they feel they need to, not because they believe in it. Hating on Warren and single-payer because they want THEIR preferred candidate as nominee. Just last year most of DU was on the single-payer train.

Barely recognize this place now.

[emmaverybo]

69. Certainly could be true that supporters are influenced to embrace a preferred candidate's policy

stance. .

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

54. YOU'RE 100% RIGHT! Attackin Elizabeth is a sure way to end your campaign. Joe's about to learn that

valuable lesson the hard way!!


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[womanofthehills]

70. Agreed, it's not a good look - men explaining things to women

It's going to turn women off big time. I was for Kamala but now I'm for Warren. I didn't like the way Kamala treated Warren at the debate. Seeing dems be mean to each other is a turn of for me.

All the countries in the world can have free health care but not the USA?????

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

79. So many men, including Joe, don't realize this... it was a HUGE turning point.

Joe just doesn't realize it yet... but he soon will!!

Congrats to your new preferred candidate. Elizabeth had one helluva showing in the debate, competently standing up to all those unwarranted attacks... thus marks the end of Joe's campaign, as campaign donations will continue to dry up vs increased campaign spending to remain relevant, soon leading to a deficit, at an accelerated rate.


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[BeckyDem]

88. Those policies Warren and Sanders support is the key.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

89. Agree with you there. Bernie and Elizabeth are perfectly positioned with the VOTERS...

Nothing else really matters when all is said and done.


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

94. No, we will lose the election if we run on MFA.

[Demsrule86]

93. No, MFA is a loser for us this election.

[BeckyDem]

96. Yea, why fight for policy that will elevate millions of Americans?

We should continue to champion leaving people out. Awesome.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

98. Seriously, how many mo innocent victims must suffer, die or go bankrupt 4 peeps 2wake the fuck up?!

Glad at least Bernie & Elizabeth are woke... thankfully, so are most informed voters!!


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

46. Seriously!! Elizabeth will win that match every time... just ask Corn Pop!!

Oh nevermind... he passed.


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Cha]

10. It's Bewildering!

[abqtommy]

14. I'm sure that Elizabeth Warren is due some criticism but not bullying for political gain.

I see Joe Biden as less of a man due to his behavior in this regard.

[highplainsdem]

16. She wasn't being bullied. Other candidates were making the same point, which many in the media have

also made for months.

They were doing her a favor, not bullying her.

Warren finally realized how bad a mistake she's been making:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287312677

[emmaverybo]

35. Is it because he's a man that you see his criticism as bullying? That's my guess. But you certainly

have a right to your perception.I have never seen Biden bully anyone, man or woman.

[abqtommy]

56. I see no reason why criticism cannot be used as a bullying tactic by man,

woman or transgender person. I don't like it. Thank you for helping me choose a candidate.

[emmaverybo]

59. Criticism is not bullying. I am quite sure Warren would not let herself be bullied.

[emmaverybo]

85. I meant because he's a man and she's a woman. You did not see Amy's quite assertive challenge

to Warren as bullying.

[Kahuna7]

72. These are the same people, saying Biden bullied Warren, but boy she's

sure the one to stand up to trump. SMDH.

[emmaverybo]

53. Bullying implies picking on a person's weakness, using threat on a weaker person, using the

leverage of economic, physical, psychological strength over one in a weaker position. Warren is not weak. She is a peer competitor well able to defend her plan as she must if she is to compete. Biden took no unfair advantage of her in challenging her.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

55. THIS!! You naaaiiiiilled it!!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[melman]

20. OMG

What about the PLEDGE?!?!

[George II]

22. What about it?

[melman]

34. It's very important

Or perhaps that changed.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

50. Apparently the pledge only applies to Bernie under the "Bernie Standard."

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[PhoenixDem]

25. Is pledge the keyword? n/t

[melman]

36. You're asking me?

I always thought I could rely on you to know.

[Cha]

26. What about Vetting?

[melman]

37. What about it?

You tell me.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

60. One thing's certain, Joe doesn't want vetting. Imagine if the "Bernie Standard" applied to him!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Cha]

66. VETTING

investigate (someone) thoroughly, especially in order to ensure that they are suitable for a job requiring secrecy, loyalty, or trustworthiness.

[melman]

67. So you're saying Elizabeth Warren is untrustworthy?

Wow. That seems kind of harsh.

[ehrnst]

82. lol

Nice try.

[melman]

83. Hmmm

Attacks on Sen. Warren all up and down this thread and this is your only post?


How interesting.

[ehrnst]

84. lol

[melman]

87. Yeah

Figured you'd have no response for that.

[ehrnst]

90. Rattled, eh?

Hit home?

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

99. Are you surprised?!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[melman]

100. Not a bit

It's funny how certain people don't realize how obvious certain things are.

[Blue_true]

21. Smoking Joe is coming out of his corner.

We are starting to see the guy that kicked Lyin Ryan's ass.

[George II]

23. Don't forget Rudy Giuliani's ass, too! (noun, verb, 9/11)

[Blue_true]

31. Oh yeah, I forgot that one. Classic. nt

[blm]

39. The difference is that Ryan was lying, and Warren is NOT a liar.

I don’t think you should say someone is lying and dishonest when they aren’t.

[Blue_true]

43. I didn't mean Senator Warren in lying, she isn't.

What I was referring to is the newfound feistiness of Biden.

[Cha]

68. I'm "saying" what I wrote.. VETTING..

investigate (someone) thoroughly, especially in order to ensure that they are suitable for a job requiring secrecy, loyalty, or trustworthiness.

[Kahuna7]

73. This is the guy we've been waiting for. Go Joe Go! nt

[PhoenixDem]

24. Biden is correct and Warren is being disingenuous n/t

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

47. You got that reversed.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[PhoenixDem]

77. IdIdNoT

[jcgoldie]

42. Joe Biden is the one being dishonest here

He's grasping for relevance it seems after a night in which he was virtually ignored by most of the candidates on the stage.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

48. Yup, everyone sees it... it's how you know Joe's campaign is coming to an end.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Cha]

58. No, Joe Biden is Not "being dishonest" as

you accuse, jc.

[jcgoldie]

61. His statements in the tweet quoted above are dishonest

Warren does have a plan and if his game is to get her to talk about taxes rather than costs or who gets coverage then that is a very traditional republican game. And no he's not alone, Buttigieg and Klobuchar were playing the same game last night. Its an attempt to score media points by pinning a disingenuous label on Warren. I recall recent times when Democrats were pretty united in their support for universal health care. Now those in the center seem to be repeating republican arguments about people losing their insurance under a single payer plan or accusing fellow Democrats of raising taxes for health care.

[Cha]

64. NO.. Biden is Not being "dishonest". last i heard

it was BS' plan.

[jcgoldie]

65. lol

Fine let it be Bernie Sanders "Damn Bill" or whoever else wants to claim it. WTF does that have to do with the substance of the argument?

[TCJ70]

75. Hmmm...so Joe doesn't understand the extremely simple plan she has?

Trade premiums for a tax increase that’s scaled to income. Easy to understand. Not hard. Unless he’s being disingenuous and outright lying.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

80. No, Joe's not lying... he's an intelligent politician who knows EXACTLY what he was doing

in unfairly attacking Elizabeth in Tuesday's debate. Women voters will not react well to the lecturing she received from Joe, as several of my co-workers made clear yesterday. His campaign just hit a "brick wall" and her name is Elizabeth!!


Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Demsrule86]

95. It is not a plan...and it will never work. Joe is right and Americans agree with him.

[TCJ70]

97. He didn't say it wouldn't work. He said there's no plan.

That’s a lie.

[emmaverybo]

102. Clearly he meant no plan to pay for it.

[TCJ70]

109. Still a lie. N/t

[emmaverybo]

110. She won't disclose her plan. All she says is that "costs" will not go up for the middle class. That

is not true for the millions who have no cost or affordable premiums for good quality healthcare that includes low cost drugs, no deductibles, low co-pays, 100 percent coverage. They will pay
higher taxes and lose their good care for an unknown plan that doesn’t kick in for some years.

[GreenPartyVoter]

76. I'd rather have plans than bland promises and a drum.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

81. You got that right!!

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[OrlandoDem2]

78. Go Joe Go!! Public option is the way to go!!

[Scurrilous]

86. ...

[List left]

104. Joe lost my respect...

If he is the candidate i will vote for him but seeing him once again finger pointing condescending attack brought me right back to the Anita Hill hearings and Warrens early testimony. In both he displayed the same condescending misogynistic attitude. He says we need to reach across the aisle but can not even be civil to a fellow democratic candidate.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

107. Dead balls on!! I think Joe lost a lot of people with that exchange.

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Lordquinton]

105. "single most consequential issue in this election"

Climate Change?

[List left]

108. Spot on, The Elephant in the ...... nt

[Joe941]

111. It is troubljng the way the candidates are attacking each other recently.