History of Feminism
Related: About this forumLet's have a poll!
Last edited Sun May 20, 2012, 10:26 PM - Edit history (1)
[font color="red"]Note: This poll is posted in the History of Feminism group.[/font]
I just read a most interesting OP that speculates that the reason why some people dislike or even oppose porn is because they hate sex. So...
4 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited | |
I don't like porn and I HATE SEX!!!1 | |
0 (0%) |
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I don't like porn and I think sex is great. | |
1 (25%) |
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I love porn and hate sex. | |
0 (0%) |
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I love porn and sex. | |
2 (50%) |
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I am a radical Dworkinite and think that all depictions of sex should be banned and participants be jailed. | |
1 (25%) |
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I am the most prudish of the prudes and think that sex should be outlawed. | |
0 (0%) |
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0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
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Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll |
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)So I passed.
I hate some of the things that go on in the porn industry. I think there is abuse and exploitation.
I think some porn is twisted and dehumanizes and objectifies women *and* men.
But I don't think it should all be wiped off the face of the earth either.
It doesn't interest me anymore (it did at one time and I got over it) but I am not categorically opposed to all of it.
Problem is, I have no idea how/where to draw the line.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)about the same experience. also a difference is, when i played in it, it was not what it is today.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)bet my sex is better than your porn sex
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)claim.
otherwise, no ones damn business, lol. though i am really not shy. i just dont EVER feel the need to validate my sexuality because pro porn people are trying to shame me.
so really this goes against principle.
mzteris
(16,232 posts)I really wanted to respond to that post, but it's the men's group and don't feel I should intrude on their space. Cause I don't want them intruding on ours.
I mean everyone should have a place they can go talk about their thing without others sticking their nose in. Just like I don't want non homeschoolers putting in their two cents in the hs group. Or nts in the aspie group. Or, welL you get my drift.
I am of the opinion that porn is detrimental to society. It dehumanizes men and women, but especially women. It objectifies people as nothing but things to be used. I strongly believe that it is an abusive industry. Yeah you get the occasional I love my job type, but seriously, who wants to grow up to become a porn star. Does anyone normal aspire for their child to be one?
I believe that many of the disappeared wind up being fodder for the sicker side of porn.
I believe it interferes with normal relations and sends the completely wrong message about sex and relationships and roles and worth.
I'm as wild - or wilder- than the next person, but porn? It hurts far far more than any scintilla of possible positives for the few.
Then again, I'm a vegetarian who thinks killing animals for food is when other perfectly good alternatives exist is wrong, too.
laconicsax
(14,860 posts)How do you define "normal" when you say "Does anyone normal aspire for their child to be one?"
There does appear to be a market for aspiring parents of porn actors:
http://www.amazon.com/PORN-STAR-Baby-Ultrasoft-Onesie/dp/B00156QOBC/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
http://www.cafepress.com/+chinese-character-pornstar+baby-bodysuits
http://www.zazzle.com/greek_porn_star_tshirt-235597128658998554
http://www.cafepress.com.au/+porn-star+baby-bodysuits
...and people say that children aren't sexualized.
Now if you excuse me, I'm going to go wash my eyes with a mild acid.
mzteris
(16,232 posts)laconicsax
(14,860 posts)If that's how you meant it, then no, it most certainly is not normal.
The scary thing is that I doubt that parents who buy "porn star" clothes for their infant even think about the pedophilia aspect.
mzteris
(16,232 posts)Is the problem.
I had a discussion probably 8 or so years ago about people who dress their little girls like little hookers. Even just those short shorts with words on the butt... You know the kind.
Wtf would you want people looking at your little girls butt and thinking salacious thoughts? Wtf would you put on make up and clothes to make them look older or "sexy"? They are children. People should look at them and think, " oh a child, I should protect and nurture this little person" not ooooo look how sexxxxayyy that little girl is, boy would I like to do her. . . . Crude, yes, but therein is a truth.
Children have been and are sexulized. Porn contributes to that subculture. Unfortunately so does Disney, tv, advertising, toys, and clothing...
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)i had a pretty long period with my boys where it was tough to find them tshirts. all the things on the tshirts were about being stupid or violent. that was the rule. no stupid, no violent. and we literally coulldnt not find fun, funny tshirts. my oldest was ok because he really liked plain ones. but, it was challenging finding those, too. until he went to hanes white tees. that makes it real easy. my youngest loved things on the tshirts. i had conditioned them so not to want to be one of the stupid boys that i would get desperate and say, really, this will be ok. not so bad. and he refused. i had to go on line to find tshirts for a couple years.
i would get the niece every summer and have to go out for clothes for the summer. i had to approve them all. and yes, was challenging.
here the last couple years it has gotten a little easier with what is out there. for a while though, it was damn near impossible to find clothes that werent about making it sex for the girls and stupid/violence for the boys.
mzteris
(16,232 posts)where I think nearly every single shirt they owned had a dragon of some kind on it! lol . . .
Sometimes I miss those days. My youngest, 13, is taller than I am and has to shop in the men's department.
He thinks stupid is - er - stupid. He has little tolerance for his friends who try to dress/act/talk all "gangsta", too. In truth, he finds it offensive since he's black and some of these friends are white. He tells them - hey - *I* don't sag my pants or talk all ghetto - why do you think all black people do? It gets almost comical sometimes to see him arguing with his red haired blue-eyed friend about it. His friend made the mistake of taking it one step too far once and called him the "n" word - not like an insult but like some AA's use it with each other. My son HATES that word and well, let's just say the little red head will think twice (or three times) before he uses it again. In fact, he's dressed down a number of other AA's for using it as well. But I digress onto another subject entirely . . . (not unusual for me as you probably know. )
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)i am going to take it further, lol
my son, white, has a real issue with the white kids being the faked gangsta.... bugs the crap out of him. but what bothers him more is a lot of the black kids think they have to dress that way out of pressure. son is in all AP courses in a very diverse high school... all minorities together is more than whites. i think whites are at 37% last time i saw the numbers. anyway, he says he has a lot of the black kids in the AP course and helps him with the math. how easy it is for them and he struggles. whereas, he helps in the english that is so easy for him. he hates that these kids have so much academic talent yet feel the need to dumb themselves down to fit in.
but, huge ass yea for your son. every part of your story. especially the red head kid thinking it was ok.
oh, then other son in like 97% upper income white middle school that has those kids actin gangsta... what a fuckin stupid hoot.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)lol. but stuff keeps happening.
in the morning
i loved this post
boston bean
(36,225 posts)We gotta live up to our reputations!
my real vote is for the second option.
iverglas
(38,549 posts)I'm the only one edumacated enough to be a real Dworkinite anyhow.
laconicsax
(14,860 posts)boston bean
(36,225 posts)might be a good idea to let people know they are voting and posting in the History of Feminism Group.
laconicsax
(14,860 posts)boston bean
(36,225 posts)post something offensive, and then claim they didn't know where they were posting the offensive BS. LOL
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)Sex is wonderful.
boston bean
(36,225 posts)I don't like the degrading stuff. Turns my stomach.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)but popcorn in bed during sex ... or during porn ... makes a mess ... particularly if its caramel popcorn, or maybe one of the many cheese covered popcorn flavors.
And as I considered the flavors of popcorn that I might prefer for reading this thread ... it occurred to me that porn is like popcorn, or maybe better, porn is like chocolate.
After all, there are many varieties of porn, many varieties of popcorn, and of chocolate. I like buttered popcorn. But not too much butter. And sometimes, a cheesy popcorn is fun. I also like milk chocolate. But I do not like dark chocolate. I like milk chocolate turtles, with pecans and caramel. But I am allergic to almonds, so I don't like those nuts in my chocolate. Or in the Thanksgiving stuffing. Which my mother-in-law did one year ... nearly killed me.
Anyway ... I guess my point is that all of these things exist in degrees. So asking people if they are "for porn" is like asking them if they are "for popcorn", or "for chocolate" ... without asking about "which kind?"
Personally, I never try to make some one eat popcorn or chocolate that they don't like. And I am fine if they eat varieties that I don't like. As long as they don't break any laws while doing so.
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)PassingFair
(22,434 posts)I don't want to watch anyone else doing it, and
I don't want to be watched by anyone other than
my lover.
It's private.
I only want one lover at a time.
Most women I know feel the same.
Just my observation.
Little Star
(17,055 posts)Hatchling
(2,323 posts)as well as a lack of a partner have lowered my interest in sex, but I certainly didn't hate it, and if the opportunity arises again, I will welcome sex with joy.
But I am anti-porn. Not just for the way women are depicted but because of the way men are depicted as well. Both genders are reduced to their genitalia. It's degrading all around.
There have been many sex scenes in movies that come so close to showing the act that they might be construed as porn, but even if they were to show the complete act, these scenes have socially redeeming value in that they are part of a story showing the intimate relationship of two people.
CrispyQ
(36,557 posts)That's funny & sad at the same time.
My problem with porn is how it has permeated so much of the rest of our culture. Ok, so it's soft porn, but where ever you go, there it is. You can't get away from it. It's on TV, in mags, on billboards, & even in the little girls clothing & toy sections of department stores. Thongs & poll dolls for little girls. Advertising wasn't always just tits & ass trying to make a buck. If they were selling something sexy, the ad might be a little more risque, but not this crap they call advertising today.
Case in point, commercials like this & some of the responses in the thread. People have become so conditioned that they don't see a problem using soft porn to sell drain cleaner. Drain cleaner! http://www.democraticunderground.com/12551235
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)you didnt click it though, and decided it wasnt.
ya, i know
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)"No sense of humor"
"Lighten up"
"It's *empowering* for the woman"
Fuck that noise.
It is DRAIN CLEANER, which has precisely nothing to do with sex.
Edit to add that old favorite: "it must suck to hate sex as much as you do!"
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)and the first OP i see is a female pilot kicked a man off the plane for sexist comments. lol.
i wanted to say.... fire her. how dare she have a problem with a sexist comment being made to her
you are right
lighten up francis. no sense of humor.
Good for her. I would love to be a pilot. Seems like you can basically kick any asshole off the plane you want.
But really. Shouldn't she have just sucked it up and "reclaimed" the words he was using? She is a pilot right? She is empowered!!! Words don't matter!!!
I am fucking sick of misogyny apologists.
redqueen
(115,108 posts)If they can successfully distract people from the fact that the abuses in porn are rampant and severe, and deflect attention instead onto the person attempting to raise awareness of things like rape and other abuses, they can continue to enjoy their entitlement.
It's pathetic, really. But failing any logical argument, it's all the most weak-minded, self-interested people have to protect themselves from any self-reflection or serious consideration of what they're contributing to, at all.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)into submission one way or another. the porn makers know this and that is what they feed the watchers.