Just a question. (Update: Origin) Where did the idea originate that Bernie Sanders

[mmonk]

Last edited Tue Jul 21, 2015, 07:38 AM - Edit history (3)

and all his supporters do not care about AA issues or BLM? To say the event in Phoenix I believe to be dishonest since it started before that. If you think my question inappropriate, explain why.





Attention: I want to thank everyone for their answers but I think I found the origin thanks to leveymg (my appreciation).

Here is a write up by rightwing columnist Byron York right after Bernie announced his candidacy in Vermont.

It is titled, Bernie Sanders' progressive Whitopia

Sanders' error was even more striking because of the setting. Vermont is a tiny, extremely white place, a kind of statewide version of what the writer Rich Benjamin dubbed "Whitopias." According to 2010 census figures, whites make up 95.3 percent of Vermont's population, while blacks are 1.0 percent. The percentage of black-owned businesses in Vermont is too small for the Census Bureau to calculate.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/bernie-sanders-progressive-whitopia/article/2565077

Again, I would like to thank everyone for their input and especially leveymg.

[Exilednight]

1. It started when he announced in Vermont that is

Whiter than my tube of toothpaste and no persons of color were in the crowd.

[mmonk]

5. Maybe so but one cannot help about the demographcs of Vermont.

My question was who, not when.

[Exilednight]

9. It was a Clinton surrogate.

[mmonk]

11. Who and where?

[JaneyVee]

19. You won't get an answer, that poster likes making unsubstantiated claims.

[cascadiance]

87. You know if he had a lot of black people come in from outside the area...

... then he'd have been criticized for trying to distort the fact that Vermont has more of a white population. He was probably damned if he did that or damned that he didn't. And why shouldn't he do an announcement in Vermont where he's the senator? I'm sure that Clinton campaign people had planned this critique for a long time and had an answer for whatever happened. If he hadn't announced it in Vermont, then they would have called him a sleezy politician for abandoning his Vermont announcing his candidacy elsewhere.

It's really a shame that people can't just look at him as a man of deeds and measure those deeds for so many years that have been good for Vermonters and so many others in this country including minorities of many stripes. I'd expect these operatatives to function this way, but those outside the Clinton campaign shouldn't be so eager to swallow this kind of crap. Unfortunately it has happened, just like the corporate media for so many years has pushed us in to divisive debates on social issues instead of public outcries for fixing a broken 1% favored over the 99% system we have now. Occupy Wall Street tried to deal with that too, and had many acts of violence directed towards it too.

[Fred Sanders]

94. If more than a handful of not white folks showed up at any meeting in Vermont, you are not in Vermont.

Anyone claiming counting white and dark faces in a campaign crowd means much of anything, without reference to the demographics of the area from which the crowd came from, is anyone I will not care much for.
Like this guy in Arizona:

[gollygee]

102. If he would have talked about racism and protests and police killings

or at least touched on them during his speech, it would have helped. People were watching that speech trying to decide whether they would vote for him and listening for some kind of acknowledgment of these issues and he didn't say anything about them. The announcement speech is where you talk about why you're running and what your priorities are, and some mention of racism, with all that's been going on in this country, should have been a part of it.

[2banon]

133. seems from what I've read, that Sanders actually was talking about all of this however..

it could not be heard through the din of shouts . if that is accurate, , I'd say it's kinda of hard to have a "discussion" and answer questions in light of that kind of dynamics, imo.or to even hear what was actually being said.

[gollygee]

136. I'm talking about the Vermont announcement speech

If you follow this subthread, it's asking when talk of him not appealing to black voters started.

[2banon]

137. I see. My apologies for not following the thread correctly.

[gollygee]

138. That's OK

There get to be so many side things talked about that it can get confusing.

[RobertEarl]

2. Reminds me of 'swiftboating'

The republicans just love attacks like that.

[CharlotteVale]

80. +1

[leveymg]

112. You're close. See 105 below.

[Cleita]

3. I believe it's the start of the swift boating of Bernie.

The anti-Bernie forces will fling anything at him that they can to see what will stick.

[moobu2]

91. Not really.

Bernie has gotten a free ride so far and glowing praise from the MS media with almost zero criticisms. If you think this was bad what do you think will happen in the general if Bernie wins the primary?

[mmonk]

122. Yes.

[whatchamacallit]

4. Where do you think it originated?

That trial balloon was floated here right after he announced. We've been getting glimpses of the playbook for months.

[mmonk]

7. Do you mean the HRC campaign?

[whatchamacallit]

10. Speculation of course n/t

[Scootaloo]

6. From people who want to shut down the topic of economic equality

The entire argument is thus: it's taboo to talk about economic equality until racism is completely removed from everywhere.

Which, to shorten it, means it's taboo to talk about economic equality.

Interestingly promoted mostly by rich DU'ers who support a candidate who is notoriously bad at issues of economic equality.

[mmonk]

8. But it's beyond DU.

[Scootaloo]

12. The answer is still the same

The agenda is to silence a topic that one of the candidates is seriously bad at.

We're not likely to ever have a name to go with the meme, sort of like how we'll never know which Camp Windsock person started Birtherism. All we know is a general point of origin.

[leveymg]

111. Byron York, a RW columnist, see 105 below

Please confirm for yourself and let others know.

[KittyWampus]

17. Or maybe it's from people who recognize Bernie's speech from 50 years ago is out of date-

and doesn't fit today's reality or the Democratic party BASE or even the majority of Progressive voters.

[mmonk]

27. Pretty weak.

[frylock]

28. How about his speeech the day before NN?

And this is taken directly from the #blacklivesmatter website (which REALLY needs to be updated):

And we will advocate for a decrease in law-enforcement spending at the local, state and federal levels and a reinvestment of that budgeted money into the black communities most devastated by poverty in order to create jobs, housing and schools. This money should be redirected to those federal departments charged with providing employment, housing and educational services.

Has Sanders NOT been saying pretty much the same thing?

[arcane1]

29. He gave one speech 50 years ago and done nothing since?

You're perpetuating the lie right now.

[HooptieWagon]

54. Perpetuating lies is how they roll.

And the ONLY groups who benefit from a wedge being driven between Blacks and Progressives is the Clinton campaign and Republicans... but there's little difference between the two.

[Scootaloo]

31. Don't hold back. Tell us how we really feel. n/t

[beam me up scottie]

68. So now O'Malley supporters are pushing the same meme?

Way to keep it classy, Kitty.

[daleanime]

93. ........

[Fred Sanders]

79. Racial inequality is more than just economic inequality and they can be discussed together.

That is the only outrageous claim being made. Not as outrageous as a claim that some want racial inequality eliminated before economic inequality is fixed. No one is saying that!

Racial inequality is not a symptom of economic inequality, it is mostly the other way round. Racial inequality all on it's own and is not just economic. Just ask any black parent who has had to have The Talk that white folk are privileged not to have to do.

Just ask anyone thrown into a slave ship in the Gold Coast.

I say without a shadow of personal doubt or hesitation that the issues must be discussed together. Not only that, if they are discussed together it will only strengthen the overall argument for both!

Separating the issues is a great disservice to people of color and not of color.

Having to shout it out in protest is how folks without the money to buy free speech, coincidentally the same folks doing the shouting and subject to racial and economic inequality, have to do it to get any attention these days.

[Scootaloo]

90. Of course they can be discussed together

The point is the people behind this meme do not want economics discussed period. They are exploiting language of social justice to do so.

They are of course valid issues. But these issues are being cynically wielded to silence equally valid and interrelated issues, that one particular candidate happens to be really bad at.

Sorry if I don't believe people I have seen carrying water for George fucking Zimmerman are really the voices of Black Lives Matter, Fred. I don't buy that the persons who were the loudest and angriest at Ferguson protestors blocking traffic are now the vanguard of the movement. I have trouble seeing people who sneered and spit at a transgendered activist for heckling Obama very suddenly support activists heckling politicians (especially when I remember several of those same people calling Chelsea Manning "it" and arguing that transgender people are sexual predators.)

[Fred Sanders]

92. I think I can agree with you that BLM may not be the best messengers. We are on the same page,

and same message, maybe just different paragraphs.

On the other hand - always looking for the silver lining - there is no such thing as bad publicity, as Trump has proven again.

As to your last paragraph I am not convinced that BLM ideology is represented be a few nuts in the field in isolated incidents, but I get your point.

My other point is than one can disagree with BLM methodology, which I think was unnecessary, still on the fence on that, (I have partially evolved on that, took me 3 days, lot of stuff going on) but still agree with their message, however inelegantly presented.

P.S. Neither a big Hillary fan or Bernie fan because I love them both- the fence is not as uncomfortable as some think on comment boards - but I am a fanatic for keeping the paws of the fascists off the W.H. lawn big time and at all costs.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

126. Bullshit! This is about white people not wanting to discuss racism; instead using class/economic

inequality as a proxy so that they don't have to confront the REAL issues.

Until we confront the real problems, things will never change.

Until Bernie supporters stop with this class over race nonsense, he will not garner black support.

I have a Ph.D. and two Masters degrees. I am still followed around stores. Still mistreated and disrespect. Still face racism each and every day. Still paid far lower than my counterparts due to my race and gender alone.

Let's confront the issues and stop bullshitting!

All of the Democratic Party nominees are full of shit as long as they continue to take black voters for granted--their most loyal and faithful constituency. Why? Because they don't want to come to terms with racism--perhaps their OWN racism.

The only candidate who has tried to honest make amends right now has been O'Malley. Even though he made mistakes, at the very least, he's doing everything in his power to acknowledge that mistake and reach out to black folk.

Bernie hasn't done or said anything to even repair this mistake. All I'm hearing right now is bullshit coming from him and his fans.

Hillary is far worse.

[KittyWampus]

13. Classic Strawman. CLASSIC. No one on DU or elsewhere have said or implied

Bernie Sanders does not care about minority issues or B.L.M.

The valid criticism that Sanders has received gets turned into this bogus strawman so his supporters on DU and elsewhere can keep sticking their fingers in their ears and pretending his message and campaign are perfect.

The responses so far in this thread prove this.

Your attitude, your need to build this stupid strawman show an extreme weakness. A very thin skin.

It's ironic that those on DU who spent the most time criticizing every damned thing Obama has done since before he was even in the White House are LEAST able to deal with any criticism of Sanders at all.

Build strawmen, invent conspiracy theories do everything but STFU and listen to what people in the African American goup and their allies are telling you.

In the end, if you really support Sanders, you better hope he hears what's being expressed and changes tactics/message. You better hope he hires some minority outreach people. Cause minorities are now the CENTER of the Progressive movement. And if he can't get minorities and women out to vote, he'll lose.

[mmonk]

15. Might be believable except for us that know it is false.

[JoePhilly]

16. Well said.

And as I suggest below ... and as some of the responses above demonstrate, the loudest of Bernie's supporters on DU won't figure it out.

[mmonk]

25. I know the reasoning from that perspective

but to say it was just organic seems a stretch.

[beam me up scottie]

22. Wtf? So these threads didn't happen?:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026737025

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251461135

There were others but those two are the worst.

[KittyWampus]

30. Two threads by ONE DU'er. That is ONE DU'er. ONE.

And one of those two threads by Sheshe got hidden.

One DU'er goes with that type of message and all other valid criticism gets brushed off as being that extreme.

That's what is happening.

Lump the overwhelming preponderance of messages in with one extreme example.

Like I said, Classic Strawman.

[beam me up scottie]

37. No, two EXAMPLES. There have been many others.

HC supporters have been making these claims for weeks.

If you can't see that you're not paying attention.

[PowerToThePeople]

75. She knows

Divert, deflect, distract. That is third way dems (ie Replublican) standard mode of operation. These issues with Democratic right wingers have just as much chance of resolution as congress comming together for a progressive agenda.

[beam me up scottie]

78. Selective recollection is the only way she can defend her claim.

I posted two examples and she dismissed them.

[PowerToThePeople]

85. It is deliberate

Bernie is light years ahead of HRC in regards to addressing the issues of #blacklivesmatter. Third wayers are in a continuous divert, deflect, distract mode. They want their Goldman Sachs POTUS while desperately needing to stop short the movement #Bernie2016 is trying to help spawn.

[Scootaloo]

77. You had said "NO ONE" - Now you're discounting examples.

You were wrong. Which really shouldn't be a new experience for you.

[MerryBlooms]

48. The first one was bad, but that second OP is absolutely vile, I'm glad it was hidden.

How did that not earn a tombstone?
Wow.

It wasn't that long ago that I enjoyed that person's posts and looked forward to them. I can't believe what I just read. I actually feel a little stunned.

You know, there are some people here on DU, I just expect really ugly stuff from and I'm not shocked by anything they post. I don't rec their OP's, I don't participate in their threads. This one is not that way for me. I'm so disappointed... I guess that's a sign I've been on DU too long. Dang.

[beam me up scottie]

56. There were others too.

Not going to link to any more now because I proved my point, but yeah.

I have lost all respect for that person and the posters who not only defended that behaviour but cheered her on.

[MerryBlooms]

64. Again, I am just so disappointed... lesson learned.

[arcane1]

58. That second post proved to me that Sanders is doing better than we think.

That was some serious slander!

[MerryBlooms]

69. I think there's more to it-- maybe grievances with some Bernie supporters underneath.

Whatever the case, it's very sad to read.

[arcane1]

70. That is most likely true as well :( n/t

[beam me up scottie]

71. Yes, some are using the primaries to continue personal feuds.

Others are trying to get even for what happened in 2008.

[neverforget]

83. I was traveling yesterday so I missed that second thread.

That one is vile.

ThePeoplesView was promoted a lot by a former DUer who was tombstoned.

[beam me up scottie]

86. I didn't know they were banned until someone pointed that out.

She thought she would get away with posting it, too bad folks are on to her.

[artislife]

50. This is on point nt

[whatchamacallit]

65. Changes his tactics to empty pander?

[bettyellen]

82. So you think Bernie would be Bsing POC of he reached out? Or he is somehow above it all?

What?

[whatchamacallit]

95. If BLM are down with Hillary

then they're down with pander, because that's all she's really offered compared to Bernie's lifelong civil rights record. Ergo that must be what they want from Bernie.

[bettyellen]

119. I think they said they we're going after all the candidates?

[whatchamacallit]

121. Good

I'm glad to hear it.

[eridani]

123. But they won't. Clinton events (like Republican events) are far too tightly controlled n/t

[Andy823]

96. Exactly

"It's ironic that those on DU who spent the most time criticizing every damned thing Obama has done since before he was even in the White House are LEAST able to deal with any criticism of Sanders"

What can I say you nailed it!

[Cha]

108. Yeah, their big mistake was dismissing valid questions from our Black Community on DU..

Trying to shut them down.. notably 1StrongBlackMan.. but, it didn't work.

Claiming those who had questions about Bernie's strategy were calling him a "racist".. that didn't work. So here we are.. The Black Community on Black Twitter wasn't impressed, either.. and #berniesoblack was born.

Thanks Kitty, well done.

[MADem]

127. That's it, right there. Easier to ascribe rightwing "blame" rather than sit down, be silent, and

LISTEN.

Interesting article from a white guy on this topic: http://www.eclectablog.com/2015/07/white-progressives-get-a-taste-of-anger-frustration-as-blacklivesmatter-activists-upstage-bernie-sanders.html

For just that moment, even progressives, sympathetic allies to the Black Lives Matter movement, got a tiny taste of what the movement is REALLY about. It’s about having your voice heard and taken seriously. It’s about, just for a while, having to shut the fuck up and actually LISTEN to someone else. About this not being about THEM but something outside of them, something they really have very little personal experience or first-hand knowledge of.

[JoePhilly]

14. Actually, I think the view is different for Bernie, versus his DU supporters.

Having read most of the threads on DU about this topic, without saying much ... what I see is this ...

Bernie wasn't really ready for the BLM protesters, and its possible may not fully grasp the difference between social justice issues and economic inequality issues. Maybe he does. But from what I'm reading, BLM folks aren't hearing it in his speeches since his announcement. So in that respect, Bernie could possibly do better. And if he makes this distinction clearly, going forward, he's probably fine.

Then however, there are some of his supporters here on DU. The most vocal responses from some Bernie supporters is to tell DU's African American members that they need to be quiet and leave Bernie alone. How dare they, or BLM question Bernie on this topic. This kind of response from some of Bernie's louder supporters on DU, comes across as condescending "white-splaining".

And so ... while I suspect that Bernie does care about those issues, and he'll adjust, and move on ... but I also suspect that some of his loudest DU supporters will continue to take a condescending stance towards DU's AA folks and the BLM protesters.

Which does nothing to help Bernie in this regard.

[mmonk]

18. Doesn't explain the same theme that preceded the protestors.

[KittyWampus]

20. The "Theme" as it was presented is that redistributing the wealth won't save black lives.

Is that simple enough for you?

The "theme" wasn't Bernie Sanders doesn't care about black people.

[mmonk]

21. It will save lives, but not stop racism or police brutality or institutional racism.

I haven't heard Bernie is for any of those things.

[JoePhilly]

23. You mean African Americans needed BLM protests to become aware of the ...

... distinction I mentioned??

Or, maybe ... African Americans know about that distinction, and given Bernie is relatively unknown, they have little idea where he stands on it ... and so questions about it came up before the BLM protests.

Naaaa ... can't be that.

BTW ... why haven't martin O'Mally's DU supporters not totally freaked out over these protests? I mean, the BLM folks went after him too .... right?

[mmonk]

33. Your take. I'm just asking questions.

[JoePhilly]

41. isn't that what ...

... Glenn Beck and Fox news like to say.

"We're just asking questions."

btw ... I read up thread that this was all set up by the DNC apparently.

So nothing to worry about for Bernie or his supporters I guess. No reason to worry about the distinction I mentioned. Stay the course.

[mmonk]

46. Personal attacks get us no closer to what I'm asking.

[JoePhilly]

63. I did not make a personal attack.

I stated a fact.

[mmonk]

67. I understand.

[mmonk]

104. Also, my apologies and I appreciate your answers.

You're a good DU'er.

[bettyellen]

35. It's so odd that people want to believe BLM is somehow manufactured or controlled

It's pretty bizarre.

[JoePhilly]

44. Especially since its existed for a while now.

[bettyellen]

81. I'm starting to think some prefer conspiracy theories more than they do actually listening to people

[zappaman]

134. Ain't that the truth!

[mmonk]

55. I did not say that.

Others may have but not me. I'm asking a question in search of an answer. Maybe there is no one answer. But seems strange some say it was just organic in nature.

[bettyellen]

74. I think initially it was a combo of his website and his stump speech both being laser focused on the

Economy. Plus global warming.
As a woman, I felt pretty left out. When other people pointed to his demographics my reaction was like Wow- does he not realize he has work to do to fire up the base? Those things combined started thousands of similar conversations among people who have too long been marginalized- and who are the base.
The base are flexing their muscles, and will not be dictated to.

When you talk to women and POC about lifting all boats and don't realize that means- you guys come last again- it's kind of sad. When he talks about free college before he talks about women's salaries,
day care and improving underfunded elementary schools you start to wonder how much thought he has given our issues.

I'd have to believe the playing field was already level to get excited. If he won't talk about strongly protecting our reproductive rights, I'm not supporting him. If it's only economics and global warming and soft on supporting those who have been overlooked every other prosperous period in our history, I can see how he won't gain of much support.
But to answer your question I think the judgement started the moment he announced and put that web site up. Like it or not its about the campaign he is running now. Lots of people want to talk about his college years or MLK and how he is smarter than the voters and doesn't need to reach out. That's not helping.

[MADem]

128. It's easier than having to face the alternative, which is the reality that they can't

count on black votes anymore. They'll have to be earned.

[Zorra]

24. The 1% controlled Third Way think tank would be the most logical source.

Seeing as how they are attacking Hillary's only serious competition, and this competition is gaining more supporters every day.

[mmonk]

26. The most logical answer I have received in my judgment.

Last edited Mon Jul 20, 2015, 08:29 PM - Edit history (1)

[KittyWampus]

34. So it's back to conspiracy theory now and using Malcolm X to cover

for the Groupthink amongst Bernie Sanders supporters?

[sabrina 1]

45. It's a Rovian talking point and they generally come from expensive Think Tanks

that conjure up nasty, vile lies, see the Swift Boat garbage, same thing, about a candidate that is a threat to a particular candidate.

The reason it isn't working here, in fact it's working against Hillary, is because we all know about these dirty tricks now, so they have very little effect on their targets, and tend to backfire on the candidate who becomes associated with them.

[Zorra]

61. We've seen Third Way posters here lie shamelessly and repeatedly on DU, so

why wouldn't Democrats believe the Third Way would be behind an organized swiftboating of Bernie, when their chosen candidate Hillary Clinton's chief rival just happens to be a champion of the American worker, and the embodiment of everything the 1% Third Way despises about democracy and everyone but the wealthy?

Why the Third Way hates Sen. Elizabeth Warren

It is not all that shocking that the Wall Street Way put out an editorial in the Wall Street Journal condemning attempts to point out that Wall Street has, long before the economic crisis and now long after, taken the lion's share of America's economic wealth and left the rest of the nation's citizens to eek by on the increasingly meager crumbs. You form an organization made up almost entirely from wealthy Wall Street partners, ex-partners and other equity managers who don't like the notions of regulation or taxes, that's pretty much what you're going to get.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/12/03/1259899/-Why-the-Third-Way-hates-Sen-Elizabeth-nbsp-Warren

[haikugal]

72. Bingo! nt

Makes sense Zorra.

[arcane1]

32. One of the first places I saw it here was back in May

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026737025

[KittyWampus]

38. Keep clutching at that thread. It's all there is to brush away the mountain of valid criticism.

[arcane1]

40. How am I "clutching" it? I answered the OP's question.

Maybe you need to stop clutching the lies?

[mmonk]

39. Interesting.

[sabrina 1]

36. In a very expensive Think Tank paid to come up with TALKING POINTS

to try to undermine an opponent who looks like they are going to BEAT you.

It's called 'dirty tricks' and is based on vile Rovian tactics.

The reason it isn't working is that people are very familiar with the tactics, where they come from, think tanks etc,

[mmonk]

42. It may work with some though.

[sabrina 1]

51. Whoever it might work with wasn't going to be supporting the candidate anyhow. It probably is

the most failed tactic in politics these days due to the easy access of the internet, Social Media, an virtual army of people to slap down such lies instantly, and then push it back on the perps who tried it.

Back in Kerry's time, there were no tools to deal with it. It's old, it's from the dinosaur era, has it effected Bernie even one iota?? No, he is soaring, and AAs are working to get him elected, while the perps are left scrambling with their lies and deceptions and only end up hurting their own candidates.

[MisterP]

120. problem for them it's not convincing but they don't have any other option

I've already seen a lot of YouTube videos of Sanders ripping apart several "get tough" bills or discussing race (and income, of course) on FB/Twitter--all spiking this weekend for some reason! problem is all his stuff has been recorded

[dsc]

43. You ask two things

I will address the question about his supporters. It might date from the day of his announcement speech when in response to very fair criticism of Sanders not mentioning the fact black people are getting mowed down by police at an alarming rate one of his most well known supporters here literally compared that to complaining that Sanders didn't mention flat landers. No really, that happened. What likely solidified this impression is the post where a poster was told blm should care more about black on black crime. No really, that happened. Or it might have been the poster who called blm rat fuckers. No really that happened. I could go on for quite some time.

[mmonk]

49. That explains here. I think it goes beyond here and a few supporters.

[MerryBlooms]

53. None of those posts should have been allowed to stand. Shameful!

[demmiblue]

47. Follow the money is always a safe bet.

Especially when the message divides dems.

I also believe that PoC have issues that are not acknowledged by mainstream pols, such as Sec. Clinton. Their voices need to be heard (as well as other disenfranchised minorities).

Big message machines have a way of using and dividing the very people who should be uniting. They are clever, though.

[mmonk]

52. True that.

[brewens]

57. I'm a white guy that does not lay awake at night worrying about minority, LGBT or

women's issues. I would vote in favor of all civil rights issues concerning any of those groups given the opportunity though. Good luck with most of that if you put another corporate/Wall Street whore in The Whitehouse.

In any case, I can promise you that you won't want guys like me thinking you set us back again.

[billymayshere]

88. You've embodied my opinion on this subject.

+1

[Fred Sanders]

89. Black parents do lie awake at night more than some more privileged folks when their minority teenagers are late coming home.

God bless for you that you do not have to. Black parents only want the same.

[NCTraveler]

124. +1 nt.

[Kalidurga]

59. Liberal white women.

One wrote an opt ed or blog or something she is from Minnesota and very very white. Another is very active on twitter and she shouts down POC that are pro Bernie.

[mmonk]

60. Hhhhmm. That's an interesting answer but would have to know more.

[Kalidurga]

66. There are some on DU

I don't remember specific names so even if I was tortured I couldn't say. But, if I did remember I wouldn't just blurt names out anyway, cuz that seems like tattle tales and finger pointing.

[bettyellen]

76. LOL

Some liberal white woman from Minnesota is influencing the black vote. That's as funny as all the low info crap I've read here.

[Kalidurga]

97. No one has voted yet.

And yes that stuff does trickle down. And it does pretty quickly.

[MerryBlooms]

62. I think mostly out of frustration.

Social media lights fires.

I have every confidence Bernie will learn from this experience with BLM, and I think he will be an even better man and President for it!

[mmonk]

73. Thanks everyone for your input.

[HassleCat]

84. it's an assumption

All assumptions are unfair, but this one is appealing for several reasons. Sanders represents a very white state, and many people assume (there's that word again) this makes him less able to relate to the concerns of black people. He's not part of the mainstream Democratic Party, which has a long association with the black civil rights movement, and people assume (again!) this distances him from civil rights issues. We all know Sanders was the only presidential candidate who participated in actual civil rights activities before he became a politician, but it's assumed (again? really!) he left all that behind as he aged and became a democratic socialist and a progressive. Now he places more emphasis on economic justice, and likes to talk about economic justice propelling social justice, which puts him at odds with people who believe the opposite, so it's assumed (sigh!) he's dodging the question of social justice. Yes, all these assumptions fly directly in the face of the actual evidence. What can I say?

[90-percent]

98. Bernie's civil rights activities in his life are astounding

I'm not an expert, but the more I read about Bernie, the more I learn he has walked the walk of a progressive liberal almost his entire life!

http://mic.com/articles/118212/the-story-of-how-bernie-sanders-became-famous-will-make-you-love-him-even-more

While at the University of Chicago, he attended the ML King I have a Dream speech in DC in 1963! Now how many other politicians or ublic figures can make that claim!

In Bernie's heart, I think he has a deep love of basic FAIRNESS and the plight of struggling people everywhere being treated unfairly and getting a raw deal from "the establishment", regardless of race or national origin.

-90% Jimmy

[kwassa]

100. That was 53 years ago.

What has he done for them in the past four years?

[90-percent]

132. http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251465846

n/t

[kwassa]

99. Bernie doesn't care about BLM

He has said nothing about racial justice concerns. He sees that as a subset of economic equality arguments, rather than an important equity concern in its own right.

Which is why he doesn't click with minority voters.

[mmonk]

103. Actually I have heard him talk about it.

[kwassa]

114. News to me. What did he say?

[Bobbie Jo]

101. The dismissive attitude of his supporters

over the past few days have cemented the idea in my mind.

I'm still reading these posts in disbelief.

[leveymg]

105. Byron York, a RW columnist just after Bernie announced

GOOGLE it. In the Washington Examiner, a Moonie Times spinoff, he laid out the whole hateful meme about how a socialist Senator from a predominantly white state was vulnerable to accusations that he couldn't reach minorities. It's all there.

This is a RW meme that someone picked up and ran with.

[mmonk]

106. Thanks. You are always on the ball.

[leveymg]

107. Confirm and go ahead and tell the others. Good post.

Thanks.

[mmonk]

115. Wow. Eye opening.

Bernie represents or comes from "Whitopias" as he calls it. I can see where all our enemies from corporate America and the two parties they feed could run with that. Seems almost too obvious. Anyway, thank you. I have become further enlightened.

[leveymg]

116. Isn't it amazing how we're being played?

I'll post on this tomorrow, but feel free to link and excerpt York's column in your OP as an addendum or close to the top of the thread. This is too important to keep to ourselves. You asked an important question - now go ahead and report the answer.

[mmonk]

118. Done.

And thanks.

[bettyellen]

135. Except it doesn't preclude anyone noticing both his website and his stump apwwches were lacking....

[bigtree]

109. Chris Hayes mentioned the cursory mention of blacks, Latinos, LGBT and others on his show

...in response to Sanders' announcement speech. Others, including myself, questioned the scant presence of minority individuals even on stage with him (notwithstanding the one singing the national anthem).

Others here echoed those concerns. In defenses of Sanders here, the meme was born that questioners were saying or implying Sanders didn't care about black people. This has been a standard go to defense for defenders of almost every question of his statements or his earlier neglect in making black issues a part of his stump speeches, and questions of his concern and interest in highlighting issues in this campaign beyond his economic appeal related to blacks.

He's done much better in recent weeks, but make no mistake, that improvement is a substantial shift from his earlier failure to include more than a cursory mention these issues in his campaign address.

The vast majority of critics were not saying Sanders didn't care about black people. Most posters, including myself, were arguing that he should speak more to current issues in his campaign appeal; say more in this campaign than just his appeal for jobs for black youth, for example. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find ANYONE here who actually said 'Sanders doesn't care about black people.'

[mmonk]

110. I've run into a few but it doesn't matter. Thanks bigtree for your input.

[seveneyes]

113. Very good question. The answer is in the Human Equation

It comes from Isolation ...

[ecstatic]

117. By listening and common sense? I noticed his one track

theme long before he even announced. When you're among the groups being ignored, it's not hard to notice the omission. Just saying.

[NCTraveler]

125. Knee jerk reaction to very few internet postings has blown this up.

It is a very small group but it aids in the persecution process. It really has been kept alive in huge part by his own supporters. We are witnessing a self-fulfilling prophecy here. They are laying the table with excuses, all at the hands of Hillary. Even in replies here it has been attached to Hillary. Sanders is a damn good egg. He has some issues with respect to race he is tone-deaf on but that is in large part due to the constituency he has served extremely well. Overall, his message is extremely sound in this area outside of one or two issues. This is an issue being promoted and kept alive by his supporters and a very small group of Sanders haters. I think it will help Sanders in the long run. Earlier it was abundantly clear he changed some words in his speeches to reflect this issue. Keep an eye on Sanders and his words. Don't worry about those who hate Sanders or those with a persecution complex. They will just leave you with their head spinning.

[mmonk]

129. I was just searching for the origins. It all stems from having his announcement

in his home state of Vermont and not specifically mentioning the institutional racism that has led to the deaths of many PoC at the time of his announcement. However, I am white if one is to see only skin pigment in a person and I grew up in a sundown town during the civil rights era in our state you may be familiar with, Zebulon NC. We may be white and support Bernie Sanders, but that doesn't mean we can't empathize with our brothers and sisters of color nor are aloof to the suffering we witness around us. I hate that our message now will have all sorts of difficulty that if we build a movement, we can change America that works for everyone. If we are to be stifled by Bernie's misstep of not mentioning it to a predominately white crowd in predominately white state of Vermont, I deem that a tragedy. In light of that, the racism that started it all in a country that hasn't come to grips with it, wins again. I wish you the best and thanks for posting.

[NCTraveler]

130. I truly like every word of your reply and thank you for it.

I do think what you mention as difficulties will turn into a positive for him. The rest of the country isn't reading this stuff non-stop on du. That is something all of us here need to realize. This is a bubble in itself and not representative of the country as a whole. That includes what is written about and discussed to no end here. Overall, his supporters shouldn't have to deal with this. Yet, it is absolute truth that his supporters here on du are one of its biggest promoters. Very few but very loud. Same with those who hate him here, mostly Hillary supporters. This is really giving Sanders, and his more intellectual supporters, an opportunity to highlight who he has stood with his whole life. That is a good thing and I do believe it will be a positive in the end. I imagine it is frustrating as hell now. Admitted or not, this is personal. Politics always is. You shouldn't have to answer the direction of these questions. When they are presented in the manner they are, it is as if they are being placed on you and other Sanders supporters directly. That is as personal as it gets.

I do think what you are calling difficulty is actually a great opportunity. It's kind of hard to see it after all of the discussion of BLM, but Sanders is really doing well in this area. Really well. Take out this last event, which Sanders campaign should have never had him at in the first place, and his message is one of equality.

I wish O'Malley were in this little dustup as Sanders is. I would love to put his record on display in all of these threads. Feel good about this. As an O'Malley supporter, I feel like I'm supporting most experience, best record of progressive accomplishments, yet am riding the pine.

[mmonk]

131. I think O'Malley will gain some momentum once he gets a little more press.

I also think the debates will help him a lot. Hang in there and it will happen.

[Zorra]

139. ^