2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumI am warming up to a civil split in our country.
Lets put it to referndum. I am thiking a geogrsphic divide, based on confederate lines would be reasonable....but maybe we should just split on red/blue results over the last 4 elections. Think of the benefits.
1 -less tax dollars to the red states.
2- no one will care about your sexuality (in the blue states)
3 -we can get our kids educated properly without idiots in small population southern states telling us what God thinks.
4-we wont freak out in the Northern Stztes if you look different than us.
5- we will be allowed to let our visions happen, both North and South. Let social evolution dictate.
Sounds good to me. Give this country 6 months to relocate (Craigs List) and we are good to go. Lets do this bloodless, social experiment Begin!
Xipe Totec
(43,892 posts)Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)I guess we have t o split 5hem 50/50. Will need to operate under a MAD construct, I guess.
Xipe Totec
(43,892 posts)Who keeps the dollar as currency? Who keeps the Federal Reserve?
It gets messy really quick.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)as per 1977 treaty and 1999 final handover.
Xipe Totec
(43,892 posts)And I say that sincerely.
One less thing.
RKP5637
(67,112 posts)US. Far too many damn fools have too much to say and offer little value to the future of the US. Their primary objective is to sow discontent and trash from the past. And, I am totally fed up with the god stuff. They really need to get over the fact that magic, superstitions and god beings belong in history. If they want to believe in that stuff, fine, but get out of the way of the future of the US and mankind.
villager
(26,001 posts)the inability to keep funding global overreach, etc.
It will be interesting, to say the least, to see what smaller polities develop....
PatrickforO
(14,604 posts)I'll be dead by then. I am, however, sick with worry about the shitty world my kids and grandkids will inherit.
Yep. Capitalism at its best - like a GIANT tapeworm tearing at our guts.
Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)Florida and every di density coast line will suffer, but climate change is not an acceptable topic in the South, so enjoy the new coastline south usa friends!
Cal33
(7,018 posts)RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)I mean fix them so they count our votes as cast and make elections publicly financed by taking all campaign donations and put that cash in one account that all candidates share equally.
marlakay
(11,531 posts)But thats the point, keep cash out of it!
jtuck004
(15,882 posts)can just die. And it can keep going until you do, or until they all do.
Frankly, they see either victory for them or death for everyone as a very workable solution.
That is your opponent. They don't really want a split - they want a place to gather and then attack. See "Hitler" and/or "Mussolini" in the wiki pages for material which might be relevant.
appalachiablue
(41,197 posts)dangerous to be on the same land mass, continent with them. They will try to export evils like slavery and reactionary religion. Where to go is one of the issues, like dividing above mentioned resources and assets. Nothing is easy, better to expend energy working toward a better existence and future than to stay in a quagmire. The place is declining fast it seems, short of a miracle sorry to say. Relocation for survival has happened throughout history and still does. (Splitting up, separation and divorce are hard but far better than wasting time and effort trying or hoping things will improve in a clearly hopeless case. Not a quitter but it's bad).
stage left
(2,967 posts)What do we do with Oklahoma, for instance? It's not a small southern state.
Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)But it depends on the States, I guess. Do you want the Republican uptopia Imhofe and Ted Cruz want? Head South. If enough Okies want alignment with the new North...great. If the majority wants to join the climate, denying anti-science South, enjoy. They can always ask for reinstatement if things don't turn out like they thought they would.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)Red states aren't always red.
Many states that voted for Obama also voted for Nixon and Reagan.
Some states that voted for Obama have also elected red or purple state governments. like Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Massachusetts and New Jersey.
It's a lot more complex than just waving good-bye to "red" states.
tridim
(45,358 posts)napi21
(45,806 posts)appalachiablue
(41,197 posts)Unpleasant but for a better life worth it, it certainly has happened many times before. I would do it.
A year or so ago an article, NYT I think covered blue state people moving to red states ie- NE folks to FL, VA, some upper Midwesterners to TX and people from CA to Nevada. Most of it was for employment. Not an in depth article but the implication was that this would bring Dem. voters into those areas. I've also heard a few media insiders mention this.
Yet as messed up as the US is lately, and as matters are becoming more extreme I wonder how much of an impact this trend will have on changing voting patterns. The pols stats mgrs. know what's going on for sure.
Scruffy Rumbler
(961 posts)It will be bad enough driving across country with all the hate out there!
Aristus
(66,520 posts)(But what the hell is Idaho doing in there?)
Scruffy Rumbler
(961 posts)Arthur_Frain
(1,872 posts)Response to Old and In the Way (Original post)
Corruption Inc This message was self-deleted by its author.
kairos12
(12,895 posts)brooklynite
(94,934 posts)Ohio and Michigan come to mind.
Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)When the great divide happens, IMHO, and is announced, there will be a great exodus. The dumb, stupid morons living in the North will gravitate to the South. We will see an Influx of minorities and white liberals to the North. A grand realignment, maybe Let us be governed by science and common sense. Let the South be governed by G o d and the Koch brothers. Let us see who survives into tne 22nd century.
Paladin
(28,282 posts)Give it a rest.
Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)When a distinct majority of the population is governed at the Federal Level by the minority, it is time to call bullshit. Republicans win because they openly gerrymander voting...when they aren't subverting the Democratic vote. You are naive or in support of Republican efforts to make themselves a 1 Party rule. OK, for the South, not OK for Democracy.
Paladin
(28,282 posts)You propose to give us 6 months to abandon everything and migrate to an uncertain future? Call me naïve (I see you already have), but I'll have to pass on this one. If that means I have to put up with insults from you about supporting Republicans, so be it.
Regional bigotry. Really.
Old and In the Way
(37,540 posts)Unless you like Republicanism. Sucks if you do.
GGJohn
(9,951 posts)Not very progressive of you. I live in the very red state of AZ, I love living her in Flagstaff and I don't plan to move anytime soon, so take your regional bias and ................., figure it out.
QuestionAlways
(259 posts)Special Prosciuto
(731 posts)and their counties, and their towns.
North, South, Blue, Red, Dem, Rep means jackshit anymore today. If a state secedes, it would have to seize or render useless federal property including interstate highways, military bases, nuclear ICBMs.
Charleston tried that at their Fort. Good luck with that.
Springslips
(533 posts)But we break it up at the federal level; we only use State borders to delineate where the national break up is. ( This is all a dream of course; it would take a masses percentage of the population to agree. But it is doable.)
napi21
(45,806 posts)I'm a Yankee (from Pa.) transplant living now in Ga. I DETEST the righties who live here, and they hate me too, and I sure DON'T want to LIVE in a confederacy! Yes, I know I could move, but we're retired now and our son & grandkids lkive here in Ga, so we don't want to leave them. Plus, our house is paid off and we qualify for low real estate taxes. If we moved back to the north, we wouldn't be able to afford to buy a house because the market is much higher there, and the taxes are a lot higher too.
I understand why you want to just let them go back to their own "southern ways", but I can't let you do that to ME!
DFW
(54,498 posts)Even poor taker states eventually will have a majority of people who want more inspiring lives.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)because some of us red states are suprisingly liberal in some areas - see, for example, Alaska's socialist permanent fund and our recent vote to legalize marijuana. We have no death penalty, and have been at the bottom of "religiosity" lists forever. We still have legal and accessible abortion and no death penalty.
It really isn't as simple as red and blue.
WhoWoodaKnew
(847 posts)Chan790
(20,176 posts)You also have to bar them entry to Blue America for life.
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)The divide is rural/urban, not North/South.
Why is this hard to understand? Honest question.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)I will repeat that because it is TRUE.
That's the way Texas is. Urban is pretty liberal, and real liberal in some places (Houston and Austin); rural is conservative, right-wing Christian and highly religious, conformist, disapproving of people that are different from themselves. Hell, I painted my house BLUE and heard about shit talk about it down at the hardware store.
Everyone else in this town has a house that is a neutral color. No imagination whatever.
Telcontar
(660 posts)Things don't for well for that sort
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Lately I've wished this could be a possible solution.
Amishman
(5,559 posts)Just look at any recent presidential election map, in almost every state the metro areas are blue islands in a sea of red.
population/area density.... to explain the red.
RJMacReady
(14 posts)Hey DUers, Let us face it, it is not red vs. blue, conservative vs. liberal, sectarian,racial or other make or break divisions. It is the power of the 1%, under Citizen's United, that has robbed us of any real political progress. We are being marginalized and trod upon by the richest 1%, and guess whose fault it is? OURS, that's who. I donate to my fave liberals/media outlets, write for progressive local candidates, but I have no real power. I vote in every election, but when the turn out for last year's mid terms was about 34%, we have allowed ourselves to be subjugated. Until elections are publicly funded, the lobbyists are kicked out, term limits imposed, we will continue on our slide to total oligarchic rule. The stolen elections of 2000 and 2004 would have sent our fathers and grandfathers into the streets with torches and pitchforks. Now 1/2 of the moronic public turns on the Faux News, and is told how Obama hates Christians, by two nauseating, hate filled, pathological liars and sociopathic miscreants like Kelly and Perkins. That organization, along with 'One America", should have their licenses to broadcast revoked until they change their titles to "Right Wing Opinions", and not be allowed to label themselves as news outlets. If you want the truth, watch AlJazeera and NPR. 60 minutes of AlJazeeraAmerica will give you the latest news from all the hot spots on the globe, like the disintegration of Yemen, the Iran nuclear deal, etc... Splitting the country after Lincoln and his generation sacrificed so much to keep it together would be giving Nixon's "Southern Strategy" its' ultimate vindication. Fuck Nixon, and fuck these hate filled gas bags on Fox/OAN, and let's band together and fight to get our country back. RJM
musicblind
(4,486 posts)I would hate to see places like Asheville, Chapel Hill, Charlotte, Raleigh, and Greensboro with all of their colleges get cut off from the real world because of places like Bakersville, NC, and Randolph County.......