21 year old kid just told me he thinks HRC will win.He was almost crying.

[jodymarie aimee]

My young Christian neighbor is a bright kid, but politically braindead. Cruz guy, then quickly shifted to Cheeto. Came up to me Sunday and signed "I think Hillary will win.... can you tell me if she will let Syrian refugees into our country?" I said "That's what your party gets for picking a dud of a candidate. And if you think fertilized eggs are people but refugee kids aren't, you're going to have to stop pretending your concerns are religious."

[BSdetect]

1. Smack retort

Well played, friend!

[Ligyron]

2. Now that's a great line

"... if you think fertilized eggs are people but refugee kids aren't, you're going to have to stop pretending your concerns are religious."

[niyad]

3. a great line indeed.

[silverweb]

52. Quoted from the best authority.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]God - in 2014:

[A-Schwarzenegger]

53. Maybe jodymarie is God, quoting Herself.

[silverweb]

56. Maybe!

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]It's been repeated often by many others and become part of the lexicon, so to speak. God didn't bother to copyright it, but he did repeat himself within the last couple of days.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

74. When God tweets, people listen & listen good.

The OP remembered it word for word.

[silverweb]

84. Being God has definite advantages.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

88. Such as... He cannot plagiarize.

Well, He can, but we don't call it plagiarism, we call it a good story.

[silverweb]

90. True.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]For us mere mortals, it's sometimes hard to call a turn of phrase "plagarism" when it's become widely known without attribution.

For example, knew I'd read this wonderful sentence before, but had to search a to find the original source, as it had been widely repeated without credit since God first tweeted it 2 years ago (A god who tweets! Imagine that!)

[A-Schwarzenegger]

91. More than a phrase, though not quite the Gettysburg Address.

Unattributed borrowing of memorable words has always intrigued me, the psychology of it. I did think it pretty funny when i googled and like you found God tweeting at the other end.

[silverweb]

92. Perhaps God intended it that way.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]He probably smiles whenever he sees this quote in use, whether he's given credit for the words or not.

The *idea* has taken hold and started going viral, and I'm pretty sure he's pleased with that. I know I would be.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

93. Your goodwill & kindness have persuaded me.

As I like to often say, What do I snare in my web, you inquire? All sweet things to savor, to hold close and dear; Moonbeams and laughter and lovers' sighs, Sunbeams and daisies and children's smiles. The holes in my web allow the escape Of fears and hurts, jealousies, hate; All loneliness, prejudice, anger, and pain, These pass through, transformed, to the ether again.

[silverweb]

95. Well done, sir.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

98. Thanks for the exchange.

[silverweb]

99. Always a pleasure.

[Pachamama]

86. Best answer ever....

Bookmarking

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

5. That was kind of harsh and probably a missed opportunity

Someone that young who comes from a very religious family just believes what they were raised to believe. You can't really fault them for that...BUT you can provide alternative information and facts in a KIND and caring way. By being mean to him...and you were mean...you showed him that people on the other side politically are mean and judgmental. You should have taken time to tell him more about Clinton and other issues. Not all Christians are radical right to lifers. There should be plenty of room for Christians in the Democratic party.

[TygrBright]

14. There IS plenty of room for Christians in the Democratic party. We're already here.

I'm one.

Hillary is one.

Without getting into "no true Scotsman" territory, the OP had a very good point and made it well: If you think blastocysts are human but not Syrian refugee children, stop pretending it's about religion for you.

It wasn't a personal attack, but it was a good sharp reality check.

And sometimes that's what it takes.

affirmatively,
Bright

[arthritisR_US]

78. Well said!

[SleeplessinSoCal]

15. Being 21 isn't being a kid. There are 51 year olds who never matured.

Maybe tough love isn't for everyone. Saying those words with a show of compassion might be the cold water he requires to wake up from the cult-like state of the GOP.

I think the "dud" comment probably hurt the most. And the dud himself can't handle mild insults or challenges to his bravado. One day it's "Makes me smart" the next "Such a nasty woman" to the same issue of not paying any federal income tax while claiming to be "very, very rich".

We are dealing with children. Somebody over there needs to grow up. Coddling probably won't work.

[Moonwalk]

17. 21 is not a kid, but young adults are still forming themselves into themselves...

...at that age. It's why you get college kids out doing all kinds of crazy things, experimenting, traveling. They haven't found "themselves" yet. 25 is about when people know who they are, what they want, etc. So, unlike with a 51 year old (who is not beyond change either), I agree, that this was a chance to give this kid other ways of looking at the world, at his country and president and yes, what he thinks Is true and right.

And no, I'm not saying to coddle the kid. Sometimes tough love works better. A wake-up splash of ice water. But few people like to be laughed at, disrespected or slapped down. It can make them intractable, angry, and more determined to take you down rather than wake up. Whatever way works best, that's what you do. Because changing minds--or getting them on the slow road to change, is what matters.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

19. Pointing out refugee children and fertilized eggs may be the ice water to the face.

Our culture is being kept juvenile via many methods. Religion, video games, movies, television, etc. As a person who was born old, I was helping to support my family at 21. Very saddened seeing the love of "The Walking Dead", nearly all studio made moves, and our level of discourse and politics today.

It is truly hard being an adult your entire life and watching Donald Duck destroy our electoral process. The religious right have only enabled that.

Sorry. Feeling sickened today by our idiotic & juvenile behavior.

[nolabels]

33. Religion is a cop out for people too lazy to think

It's easy way for letting someone else connect the dots. It doesn't matter the age, my mother has been brainwashed by this stuff since i could remember and she is 87. The only real thing she has accomplished (that i can see) is a distrust by all of her offspring when she tries little tricks trying to involve them within it (they all run and get away anyway possible).

As far as i can see, if you want to understand something letting religious dogma guide your looking will only lead to futility in your efforts of that understanding. Just let go, don't be judgemental and the understanding you are looking for will come knocking somehow.

If you focus on the things you don't want then it will be hard for them to take a smaller place in your life

[SleeplessinSoCal]

38. BBC report on Syrian refugees could seriously feed Islamophobia.

Heard about these stranded souls an hour ago. And the idea that "Obama is intentionally causing a refugee crisis" probably fills that need to counter him and all Dems by those only getting news via Christian "news" source on public access tv.

Today Evangelicalism is exposed as the hate group it has been becoming for decades. It's bad enough that they only care about Israel in order to have The Rapture. Jews are their enablers to that "ascension".

What does that 21 year old think about The Book of Revelation? Same as his parents? I went on my own spiritual journey at that age. Never were these beliefs an option or even considered mainstream. Evangelicals have taken that road intentionally and drastically. We don't want any more going that nihilistic route.

[nolabels]

54. I have a good friend who immigrated from Syria about sixteen years ago

Speaks good English, has his citizenship, runs a business and has two employees working for him. He is smart, has good moral sense, would always lend a hand to me when needed but is still very self-sufficient. He often sends money back to his family in Syria and every year he gets together with his Syrian friends in November to organize a big care package to send to the people back in their home country.

I really only have fear of people too ignorant to get out of their own way, mostly everything else i have seen has a way of working itself out.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

77. BBC report tells of similar stories.

One refugee from Afghanistan told how his family made it only to Pakistan and he to the UK 20 years ago - escaping the Taliban. He feels isolated though loves being there. Then Brexit.

[nolabels]

80. We have only ONE world and it's a paradigm and a paradox

It is vast, hospitable or even sometimes merciless and yet the only way we will get to keep it is if we learn to live within it

I have lived here in SoCal for most of my fifty-eight years and still love it here and partly because of all the interesting and unique people that sometimes come from all around world.

Then lastly, i would just like to add we should not be like our British counterparts trying to keep out those with ideals of the other and of them not belonging, for the only way those who wish to have power over us can win is if they can figure out ways to divide us against one another

[SleeplessinSoCal]

83. Grew uo in SoCal, lived in London 3 years, 22 years in NYC

Last edited Tue Oct 25, 2016, 02:56 PM - Edit history (1)

and back home to SoCal - the only place that doesn't feel like home. NYC has the melting pot all around you all the time. They are open. In my experience the Brits have so much pride in their own history on the island, that even a WASP like myself woukd never completely belong. Brexit didn't surprise me.

SoCal gives me almost too much breathing room and not enough face to face contact. Not enough connection to others accept through music & sporting events. And I feel somewhat trapped behind the Orange Curtain. Yup. It's still here. And getting uglier all the time. At one with Trump's orange complexion.

[hatrack]

62. Many years ago, St. John ate the wrong mushrooms for dinner while living in Greece . . .

He then put down his experience on parchment and (sadly for the rest of us) it escaped the cutting-room floor at the Council of Nicea many years later.

Anybody who can base their view of reality on that steaming mass of confabulated bullshit is in dire need of help - maybe even a little tough love, as evinced in the OP here.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

75. Thank you for your response. Starts the day off on the right foot.

[homegirl]

82. Patmos

is the island in Greece where St. John lived in a cave, as you say he ate the mushrooms, had his vision and wrote the Book of Revelation. This all took place sometime between 100 A.D. -200 A.D.

And you are completely correct-it should have landed on the cutting room floor, but what power it had to terrify the peasants and serfs.

I have visited Patmos and the cave.

[hatrack]

87. Seriously, it's like using "Easy Rider" as a model for representative government . . . .

Or "The Garden of Earthly Delights" as a blueprint for your house.

Countless whackdoodles thrive in the Garden of Revelations, and I no longer cut them any slack. Grew up surrounded by Rapture morons, and I have just plain had enough.

[Duppers]

57. As NdT said...

"The day you stop looking because you are content god did it, I don't need you in the lab. You're useless on the frontier of understanding the nature of the world."

- Neil DeGrasse Tyson

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

41. I'll say the same thing I say to my 6 year old grandson when he's being foolish and stubborn...

What is the goal of the Democratic Party? Is it to offend and push people away by trying to make them feel personally guilty and to blame for an attitude or beliefs that you don't even know for sure if he has or not? If so, congratulations...that's exactly what the behavior of the original poster accomplished. And here I was under the impression that the Democratic Party was all about inclusion and fairness and educating/helping people. That 21 year old most likely still lives at home and had very little, if any, interactions with kids outside of his church. All young people like that know is what they were taught because that is how they were raised. You don't teach them different by behaving in a way that pushes them away and offends them.

Not sure why that point seems to have been lost on people.

That 21 year old did NOT cause the Syrian refugee crisis. How do you know he would not want to help refugee children? We also don't know if he's even pro-life or just doesn't like abortion. I don't know anyone who LIKES abortion. I don't and hate the fact they happen. However, I support them being legal because that is the only way they can be regulated and they would happen either way. I'm 500% supportive of education, prevention, adoption and support to make it easier for people to keep their babies. Some churches are similar in their official views. Being tolerant does include being tolerant of Christians just like freedom of religion includes freedom FROM religion. It's a two way street.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

45. "Ripping babies from the womb" and "banning Muslims from America"

is topped by this. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2015/12/05/liberty-university-president-if-more-good-people-had-concealed-guns-we-could-end-those-muslims/

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

58. I know a current student at Liberty whose father is a minister

Their church is next door to a mosque. The worshipers of the church went to an open house at the mosque and the worshipers of the mosque went to an open house at the church. They are very friendly neighbors.

Just because Falwell is an idiot doesn't mean he represents all Christians or even all Liberty students.

Saying that Falwell's views match those of all Christians is no damn different than saying all Muslims views match those of Osama bin Laden. You are doing EXACTLY what you are bashing others for doing.

[Moonwalk]

49. Give the O.P. credit. Why would they have said such things to this kid...

...if they were not his well known opinions? WE may not know this kid or what views he holds, but the O.P. does, and clearly has heard him pontificate, at length, on those subjects. Hence, their response. I think we can take them at their word on this, and accept as a given that we DO know the opinion this kid had about abortion and Syrian refugee children.

THAT said, I agree that it may not always be best to go off on such people rather than trying to open their eyes. But, as I said, WE don't know this kid. The O.P. does and might have known the best response to open his eyes was this one.

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

61. She said he is bright but she thinks he is braindead politically

He is a 21 year old who was 6 years old on 9/11. He's at the age where he has grown up where terrorism fears is really all he knows. He most likely was raised in a pretty sheltered environment, so it's not abnormal for him to be fearful of ISIS members getting into the US. He could have anxiety or OCD or something for all anyone knows. He was almost certainly raised to think abortion is wrong. Hell, I think abortion is wrong too. That doesn't mean I don't support it being legal. It's a very complicated issue with many facets and there are many people who hate abortion with a passion but who also support Roe v Wade and I'm one of them.

It sounds like this kid was open to discussion and hearing other views and the OP completely blew it not based on the biases and prejudices of this kid, but because of her own biases. For some reason people are missing this point. Maybe it's easier for me to see because I am a true middle of the road unaffiliated moderate swing voter. I can see both sides of a political issue. From where I stand, there is little difference between the far right and the far left...both extremes are intolerant of the other and seemingly unable to recognize their own flawed thinking.

[barbtries]

64. How do you know he would not want to help refugee children?

because of all the issues he focused on while speaking to his neighbor, what he came up with was, "Will Hillary let Syrians into the country?"

that's how i know he does not want to help Syrian children.

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

66. That's quite a stretch and involves making an awful lot of assumptions

"Will Hillary let Syrians into the country?" does NOT equal "I don't want to help Syrian children."
In that kid's mind it most likely means "I'm afraid of ISIS members sneaking into the US."

Trump is exploiting FEARS. So common sense would lead a rational person to understand that when that kid asked about Syrian refugees he was saying, "I'm scared that if we take Syrian refugees that ISIS memebers will sneak in." If it were me talking to that kid I would have recognized his fear shown empathy while educating him about the process of letting Syrians in. I would say something like, "Are you afraid of ISIS getting into the US? Did you know how long of a process it is for Syrian refugees to get into the US? It takes about 2 years from the time they apply for them to be vetted."

That kid could have easily turned into a silent Clinton voter. He was fishing for his neighbor to share information with him and she just tried to make him feel bad and treated him like a "deplorable." Lost opportunity.

[barbtries]

70. it adds up to the same thing.

i'm afraid of ISIS so let the children die.

anyway if you read through the thread you will see that the OP writer has an ongoing relationship with the kid. so I am confident that the response was the right one for these 2 people during this particular exchange.

[radius777]

47. Agree. 21 is a kid in many ways in the modern era,

where 'real' adulthood really begins in the late 20's and early 30's.

There's still hope for young people like this whose political views are mostly the result of their upbringing, and who usually don't understand politics but simply cheer for the political 'team' their family does.

I also agree with other commenters that writing off Christians (or other people of faith) is foolish, as most people (including most regular rank-and-file Dems) hold some type of religous belief, to varying degrees.

Moderate positions/language on hot-button issues is highly effective in expanding the pool of potential voters, as it has for Dems since '92, where before this the GOP would simply bludgeon Dems with such issues in election after election.

For example, Bill Clinton stressed that he was pro-choice not pro-abortion, and believed it should be 'safe, legal and rare'. Such moderate framing is what allowed many people of faith to vote Dem.

[Glorfindel]

26. You're right. 21 isn't a "kid." I turned 21 in the US Army and was in Vietnam four months later

We certainly weren't allowed to think of ourselves as kids.

[pangaia]

46. I was playing Beethoven and Mahler symphonies

when I was 19. I certainly wasn't a kid either.

[Moonwalk]

50. And back in the middle ages a 7 year old was given a job and was no longer a kid....

No "kid" is a kid when they're thrown into an adult situation or lifestyle where it's do or die. Childhood goes away quick, whether you're forced to take care of younger siblings at age ten or live on the streets or fight in a war or work at a job.

But that doesn't negate the fact that if you are NOT required to do any of that or live that way, then you may take your time maturing. That's probably not a good thing and we should get back to making young people go into jobs or deal with harsh realities easier, so they to mature before 21. On the other hand, we don't want to go back to where a 10 year old must be the adult and never have a childhood. That's equally wrong.

But that's neither here nor there in this instance. Fact is, 21 CAN be a kid, if that 21 year old doesn't have to fight in a war, or get a life-or-death-job, or feed a family, or live on the streets, or do any of those other harsh things that makes anyone of any age grow up real fast. At 21, the mind, emotions, etc. are still growing. Experience and circumstance decides if that's going to happen fast or slow.

[Lucky Luciano]

39. I call 31 year olds kids all the time!

I think I refer to them as men or women when they look like/behave like they might have kids - they may not have kids, but there is a certain kind of maturity there. Or the gray hair is just too obvious! One or the other!

[SleeplessinSoCal]

40. There is an odd distinction between who is considered adults in our system.

If you commit a crime at 16 you can be charged and punished as an adult. You can go to war at 18 and be considered an adult. Yet if you have hardline, religious views which are confronted with the hypocrisy of them, we must gingerly point it out. It may be productive to do this, but you gain little in terms of becoming an educated and informed electorate.

[Hortensis]

16. Not necessarily. She spoke truth to him, which is

something desperately lacking in his life. Especially that last. The far right have gone so far away from reality that every single political argument these days is made up of a foundation and structure of lies. And too many of the Christian right define themselves as The Good People, God's Special People, and therefore never examine their own behavior to see if it fits the label.

This boy-man will get to watch Democrats in office and make of it what he will--depending on his own personal wiring and preferences.

People who live their lives gorging themselves on lies don't do it because they can't find truth, but because they prefer the lies. Lincoln's "people who can be fooled all the time."

[aggiesal]

23. 21 year old is an ADULT ...

He deserved to smacked (politically speaking).

He's old enough to have is own beliefs, so yes I believe you can fault a 21 year old.

[treestar]

32. People on his side are mean and judgmental

You are kidding yourself. They actively spurn "kumbaya" as they call it. They think we are weak and soft and all the other macho garbage they spill out daily.

[gopiscrap]

48. Bullshit fuck anyone who is a republican

that's the way it's played...this kid's mind is spoiled for life...you can make sense from mental political rot

[Hortensis]

96. No. And anyway, half of all of us are conservatives.

Our democratic republican form of government is based on populations who are capable of respecting each other enough to work together.

Extreme intolerance of each other is a huge problem for democracy, and if our great experiment ultimately fails it will be because of that. Not ignorance. Refusal to accept that we have to work together.

[mdbl]

59. 21 isn't that young

He needs to be awakened somehow.

[barbtries]

63. yeah.

after all, trump has shown such kindness.
your post does illustrate how harmful a religious upbringing can be when it prevents people from being able to think for themselves.
maybe the verbal equivalent of a slap upside the head will make that kid think.

[MisterFred]

72. Plenty of room?

Christians dominate the Democratic party. Most are Christians. Prayers are not uncommon at state party meetings. Democratic candidates frequently cite their faith as being behind their policy reasoning and ask God to bless America.

How on earth would you think that the Democratic party isn't dominated by Christians?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

7. Oldie but goodie.

[GreenPartyVoter]

8. Any chance you can reach this kid?

[NoGoodNamesLeft]

43. I think she blew any chance of that by being rather mean to him

He may have been trying to reach out, too. It really makes me sad to see some of the responses on this tread. Most Christians are not hateful idiots or radical and hateful people. Most I know are actually very good people. There are a few nasty pieces of work, yes, but people on the left hating on Christians is no different then people on the right hating on Muslims. It's wrong. All religious groups have radicals...but most people of a religion are NOT radicals. I really wish more people would see that.

[GreenPartyVoter]

44. That was my first thought, too! It might have been a chance for a dialog.

[oasis]

9. Zing

[Roland99]

10. Not to mention the vetting process for Syrian refugees to be able to make it here lasts ~2yrs!!

[Monk06]

11. Oh snap ! I felt that boot up my ass and I am in Canada !!

[Perseus]

18. What a great quote

"If you think fertilized eggs are people but refugee kids aren't, you're going to have to stop pretending your concerns are religious."

You hit the mark with that one. With your permission, I will use it whenever the opportunity comes along.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

21. It's been around for at least a couple years.

Probably ok to use as you wish.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

20. Good response---I especially love "fertilized eggs=a Syrian refugee "

He came up to you and signed....
He's Deaf? You're an interpreter? Or teacher of the Deaf?

The baptists like to haul them in.

[ffr]

22. Ouch! I think he's done asking you any more questions.

[Hayduke Bomgarte]

24. Amen

"if you think fertilized eggs are people but refugee kids aren't, you're going to have to stop pretending your concerns are religious."

[Ilsa]

25. I hope you were speaking s__l__o__w__l__y.

Her plan is to allow about 65,000 refugees, but it'll take a year and a half to vet each one. I'm not sure how many they can handle at once.

[YOHABLO]

27. Well he's probably been brainwashed by his church and parents. They isolate themselves from reality.

[HeartlandDem]

28. Good on you...

That may have been the wakeup call this young person needed! There are times in life when the words or actions of one person can leave a lasting impression and in some cases change minds. Hopefully, this will be one of them. I am a Christian, but this brainwashing of young minds makes me crazy, the hypocrisy of it all would have Jesus shaking his head.

[benld74]

29. Give him some history books on the Dems, tell him they're light reading

while his man goes down in flames in November

[boomer55]

30. Print this out and give it to him.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/mind-in-the-machine/201609/the-psychology-behind-donald-trumps-unwavering-support

[steve2470]

34. great article ty nt

[treestar]

31. Could not agree more

They are all liars about Family Values and all that crap. Every last one of them. If they support Deplorable it's all a show to hide their racism.

[Txbluedog]

35. Can you tell me if she will let Syrian refugees into our country?

You should have told his lazy a## to get an education and some skills and not worry about Syrian refugees coming in and taking his Wallmart job

[doc03]

36. A women today told me she heard the election was rigged? I wonder where she heard that? nt

[Iggo]

37. Ouch!

[RandySF]

51. I will feast on their sorrow on November 8.

[underpants]

55. Kick and rec

[IronLionZion]

60. Most Americans are refugees, going back to the pilgrims

Florida is full of Cuban refugees. NY will still have many Holocaust survivors. If people were trying to kill you, you might want to seek refuge somewhere else with less killing. It's normal human nature.

Many Trumpers are open to leaving Trump. It's not too late to gently persuade them. I've had civil patient conversations with many conservative folks. They don't have to vote for Hillary. I just don't want them to vote for Trump!


How to Build an Exit Ramp for Trump Supporters
https://hbr.org/2016/10/how-to-build-an-exit-ramp-for-trump-supporters

[PunksMom]

67. That last line is reality folks

...and, you can vote, join the military, and drink legally, 21 is not a kid. Jmo

[MissMillie]

69. I'm curious to how he responded.

I'm always curious to know how the religious right justifies it's protection of the unborn versus standing up for people who are already breathing on this earth.

[Orsino]

73. Our text for today:

http://www.ucc.org/justice_immigration_worship_biblical-references-to

[Dawson Leery]

81. Since when did Evangelicals give a damn about humanity.

[Hortensis]

97. Imo, that's like a conservative asking since when

did Democrats care about morality?

There are many different kinds of evangelicals. Plenty of them are good people in important ways, and some are very good people period. We might ask why too many of "us" deny that some evangelicals have opposed trumpism from the very beginning. Could it be that sometimes we are too much like what we despise?

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

89. Does he realize many of those Syrians are Christian?

Or does them being brown trump that?

[AngryAmish]

100. ...and then the entire restaurant stood up and applauded.