2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumWhy Hillary Won't Be POTUS (Sec. Def. Gates: Hillary email server "REALLY A CONCERN")
Gates, as you know was Sec. of Defense under Obama and worked with Hillary.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/05/19/robert-gates-clintons-email-server/84591306/
The former secretary of defense was asked about the temperaments of Donald Trump and Clinton and which one would be better fit to be president, in an interview with Yahoo News on Wednesday,
Gates who worked in both the Bush and Obama administrations and worked closely with Clinton declined to weigh in. He said that while he had worked closely with the former secretary of state he didnt know what Trump was like beyond his public persona.
But when pressed further on what he thought about Clinton, Gates brought up the investigation over her private email server.
Theres the whole email thing, which I think is really a concern in terms of judgement, Gates said. I dont know what originally prompted her to think that was a good idea.
Using an offline server I think was an error, he added.
If she is the nominee, she will lose for this reason alone.
riversedge
(70,442 posts)dchill
(38,610 posts)NWCorona
(8,541 posts)The fact that Dianne Feinstein has brought this up must be worrying. She knows intelligence matters and probably has the clearance to see those sap emails.
mindwalker_i
(4,407 posts)Used just the same way she does.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)to sound just like rush limbaugh? I wouldn't know.
mindwalker_i
(4,407 posts)Come on, they pay you better than that!
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)Yes - a measly $1 million would cover the MILLIONS of voters that chose a candidate other than yours. He'll be dropping out soon enough - just a matter of time. I can wait. But you continue to mimic rush's language about our next President. You're too good at it to stop now.
mindwalker_i
(4,407 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)I don't think there is anything in Washington related to spooks, bombers, and skeletons in the closet on Capitol Hill he doesn't know about ten steps before the public first becomes aware. He's been on the bigot list (routing list for classified documents) of more compartmentalized classified programs than anyone else in history. He has two polished black wingtips in both parties, and fourteen more in the permanent government in the Pentagon, CIA, and NSA.
You are a fool to LOL on this topic, and ten times more to laugh about what this guy just said about Hillary's lack of judgement. If he thinks she's unfit, she's not going to become President.
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)as you can imagine (in real life, outside these pages), I take rather personally. Most arrogant candidate ever.
DURHAM D
(32,617 posts)There is also the problem of State Department top secret cables that run through the DOD system but yet Chelsea Manning was able to download more than a quarter million of them while pretending he was listening to Lady Gaga.
B2G
(9,766 posts)There is no 'but yet' in that.
DURHAM D
(32,617 posts)You really want to defend that?
B2G
(9,766 posts)I'm simply pointing out you can't compare a rogue SA using their legitimate system access for nefarious ends to a purposeful bypass of government servers for THEIR ends.
Ash_F
(5,861 posts)...and the State Department's subsequent cover-up of the story.
That contractor, Dyncorp, has ties to Clinton by the way, through Jack Keane. One of their lobbyists.
Private Manning exposed many crimes. That is just one.
I am not sure what crimes Clinton has exposed with the server. Except possibly her own.
Not even close to comparable.
berni_mccoy
(23,018 posts)Don't let them bog you down
Android3.14
(5,402 posts)After all, if a person can hack another computer, then Hillary is qualified to be President.
DURHAM D
(32,617 posts)cheering Sec. Gates. Everything up is down.
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Oh, I see, he told the truth about Hillary. It all makes sense.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)sure you can......
The shit will hit the fan AFTER it's too late.
Gomez163
(2,039 posts)libdem4life
(13,877 posts)both the information and the media source.
And she's running out of money ... her running to the Republicans says it all. The Democrats who thought it was "her turn" and were planning the coronation are not quite so sure these days.
You know she had to be desperate to go to the Bush Cabal's financiers. I just hope she doesn't ask the Party to pay her campaign debts this time around. Maybe some of those 6 figure speeches could at least make a dent.
gordianot
(15,253 posts)So others can see what comes in but cannot send out. Gee that sounds friendly.
FlatBaroque
(3,160 posts)it is probable that she revealed everything on her computer to hackers and spies, and this alone makes her ineligible to ever have a security clearance or hold a high office.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)for the first 3 months it had no security. That was while she was traveling to China and the east, using her non-secure blackberry to check her emails.
To anyone who knows anything about it, they also had a remote login to that server so people could log in to check their emails. An open door for hackers.
They did STUPID things, amateur things, WITH OUR NATIONAL SECURITY.
J U D G E M E N T !!!
Not the judgement of a leader of the free world.
FlatBaroque
(3,160 posts)just how much of a national security breach Secretary Clouseau caused.
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)That's funny.
ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)NWCorona
(8,541 posts)Mike Nelson
(9,984 posts)...he really doesn't know about Trump's judgement, but is concerned about Hillary's? Those around Gates need to allow him to decline more privately. Elder abuse not to...
frylock
(34,825 posts)madokie
(51,076 posts)it's hello president tRump
simple as that.
You'd think that a person who has been going after this office all of her adult life, it seems, would know better than to shoot herself in the foot.
She is not presidential material
tonyt53
(5,737 posts)BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Obama trusted him. Why don't you? Oh, that's right--he told the truth about Hillary!
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)So no Obama didn't....he made nice with gates when he thought he could 'reach' out but it didn't work out...Gates is tool and has a long history of warmongering.
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Hillary has an equally long history of war mongering. That hasn't stopped you from backing her.
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)He tried to make nice with the Republicans...and Gates stabbed both Obama and Biden in the back...he was a big player in Iraq...you guys post stuff from total Republican losers.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Go ahead, try to laugh it off.
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)Like they all are...so spare me.
Zambero
(8,979 posts)He stopped just short of declaring that Trump would be a danger as POTUS, and questioned his temperament and tendency to over react at the slightest provocation. Also interesting to note was that Gates referred to climate change as very real, and among other things a threat to national security. As a matter of fact, I for one don't envision existing U.S. naval facilities as automatically relocating themselves further inland as sea levels rise.
apnu
(8,759 posts)The Email server was a stupid thing to do. No question. But will it sink Hillary on its own? Certainly not.
840high
(17,196 posts)BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Had he, when he found out about the server, publicly stated how disappointed he was that the SoS would do something like that, he would be in great shape. Instead he has been downplaying the significance. Big mistake! He was clean as whistle until then.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)...and I'm not sure how he is going to wiggle out of the fact that oversight of HRC was nonexistant. He should have known better than to trust her.
840high
(17,196 posts)behind his back not only with the server but with Sid, too.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)not at any level that involves classified materials. We need to be talking about who replaces her, or someone will make that decision entirely for you.
apnu
(8,759 posts)Especially when the FBI investigation is under way. Let's presume innocence before guilt as is the tradition and law in America, okay?
When the FBI comes out with their findings and she's indicted, then maybe your statement will be accurate. Until then, let the organs of law perform their function.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)We are now closing on release of the FBI findings into the Clinton email server. The next to last step, we are told, within a week or two the Bureau and Justice Department will interview Hillary Clinton, and then Director Comey will release his report.
That leads to the question on everyones mind: what will that report find? If the FBIs findings reflect the steady stream of events described in credible media, the one thing we can be nearly certain of is that she will not be exonerated by the facts and a review of applicable federal law and regulation. She is not likely to emerge clean of the taint of violation of law.
We know with a near-certainty, based upon a review of known events and the language of the Classified Information Nondisclosure Agreement that Hillary Clinton signed the day she assumed office that she did, in fact, violate her security agreement. That words in that document reveals the laws that apply and, in the first paragraph, it states:
"As used in this Agreement, classified Information is marked or unmarked classified Information"
The Bureau may, nonetheless, decline to make a definitive finding of whether Mrs. Clinton should be indicted. In an awareness of its own institutional credibility and its subordinate role to the Justice Department, the FBI may well report on the facts and summarize applicable law, and simply conclude that the question whether to convene a federal Grand Jury and indict is one that must be made by the Attorney General. That may, under the extraordinary circumstances of this investigation, be the only conclusion the Bureau can draw.
That outcome will leave the question of HRCs continued viability as the presumptive candidate for President open to interpretation by the Democratic Party, and perhaps ultimately, the American people. Since HRC unquestionably has the backing of the party mainstream and virtually all Convention superdelegates, does that mean that Hillary Clinton will nonetheless, regardless of what is found in the Comey Report, emerge from Philadelphia as the Democratic candidate for President?
That is the question that all Democrats should now be asking themselves. The answer should not be left entirely to decisions that may have already been made behind closed doors at the DNC and the White House. Although the outcome will largely be conveyed as a fait accomplish, handed down from Party Elders like clay tablets descended down from the mountain top, the Democratic base had a right to weigh in on the outcome.
She is not the nominee until and unless the FBI exonerates her. Which it won't.
The FBI may not recommend indictment, but will find she violated her signed classified information nondisclosure agreement, which is essentially the same thing as a violation of one or more federal criminal statutes.
Without a clean bill of legal health, politically, she might as well have Stage 4 cancer. Time to find a new candidate. She isn't viable, and the Democratic Party, Clinton supporters as well as Sanders supporters, should be prepared for that eventuality.
apnu
(8,759 posts)It is a problem, and it will damage her. Regardless of what the FBI says, the Republicans will smear her with it. And if she does receive a "clean bill of health" the Republicans will make stuff up and smear her anyway, its what they do.
But before we rush off and use absolutist language like "100%" and "highest level", we on the left, the not crazy ones, should operate from the facts. Let's find out what the damage is before we declare anything. Otherwise we look like hyperactive kids, and nobody will take us seriously.
As for viability, I don't think it will harm her against Trump. Democrats will go for Hillary, Republicans Trump, and the Indies will have to sort the rest out themselves. If they bother to get off the couch. Trump has shown no signs of toning down the crazy, and by virtue of the diarrhea coming out of his mouth. Already we see a parade of various people coming out and stating Trump is not fit to lead. People who normally keep quite in Presidential contests such as generals. People are coming out of the woodwork to denounce Trump and the usual crowd that reliably votes Republican show signs they are very soft on Trump. Such as the religious right and a good portion of Wall Street and corporate types.
Because of Trump, Hillary will be viable. Unless she's in jail that is.
Many people presume she will be. For my part, I'm taking a wait-and-see approach.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)fatal to her possibility of being President. The well-sourced facts have been compiled and sorted out here: http://www.thompsontimeline.com/The_Clinton_Email_Scandal_Timeline
I know it's a lot to absorb, but you have to be aware of the facts before you can condemn others for drawing conclusions. Hillary has violated the law. The specifics of the law the FBI will apply have been posted here and in the links: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511898037
BTW: I think she will never spend a day in jail, she will be pardoned as an unindicted co-conspirator before Obama leaves office. But, she will never sleep in the White House again, either.
apnu
(8,759 posts)Allow me to explain. I work in computer security and deal with regulatory bodies. This is familiar territory for me. I know what its like to operate under government regulations and the penalties they face.
The more important issue is, as I see it, is why was Hillary allowed to do this for so long? Forget what she did for a second, and consider that at no time, in the State Department or levels above or along side, did anybody raise a flag about this and correct the obvious policy violation. I find it impossible to believe Hillary or anybody else at the State Department was unaware of these regulations. I also find it impossible that all staff at the State Department were Hillary appointed people built to protect here. No way the IT department were Hillary political operatives.
This whole thing shows a systemic breakdown of basic security and few in the government seemed to care, because Hillary was communicating with both journalists and generals from her private server and the Pentagon was OK with this? The Pentagon has its own regulations and surely they should have seen the insecure, foreign domain name in the emails and could have blocked them at any time, or raised a flag and said "hey you can't do that" or "hey, we won't talk to you on insecure channels, talk to us on your .gov address"
Yet that didn't happen. Nor did the CIA kick a fuss, the NSA, or Homeland Security. Nobody in our government cared.
Add to that, the fact that both Condi Rice and Colin Powell have both admitted to using private email for state business and both shrugged and said "so what?". This shows a pattern of lazy security in two successive and opposed administrations. Thus, we can conclude the problem extends beyond partisan politics. There is a deep security flaw in our Federal government and its been going on for at least 16 years. (I've not looked at Bill Clinton's administration much, technology back then was rudimentary and the security landscape then was very different from today)
However, the only and sole focus in this is Hillary Clinton, despite the systemic regulatory violations multiple levels of the Federal Government have violated. Not one person is investigating the Bush Administration or SoS Rice or Powell for the same thing. Nor is anybody calling for the heads of all the other government bodies the SoS communicates with daily. All of them have probably violated the cited regulation in your second link or their own which are probably similar.
Which is why I've said on this board several times, and will say it again: Yes this is a serious problem but also, yes this is a witch hunt against Hillary Clinton.
If we (the general we) are to truly respect the rule of law and fairness, we must address, investigate, and indict, many others beyond Hillary's State Department and Hillary herself. Until that happens, this will be a brazen witch hunt.
antigop
(12,778 posts)Got it?
CONDI.RICE. AND. COLIN. POWELL. DID. NOT. HAVE. A.PRIVATE. SERVER.
One more time,
CONDI.RICE. AND. COLIN. POWELL. DID. NOT. HAVE. A.PRIVATE. SERVER.
How many times does this have to be pointed out?
apnu
(8,759 posts)Makes no difference in this case. And maybe worse since the email servers for those accounts would jot have been in their control.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/rice-aides-powell-also-got-classified-info-personal-emails-n511181
antigop
(12,778 posts)apnu
(8,759 posts)You got nothing else to say but shouting. So NBC is lying about private email accounts if former SOS?
Jitter65
(3,089 posts)He is out to do another hit job on Hillary. Nothing hurt our security more than Snowden's revelations. Why doesn't he talk about that. Bad error in judgement by Hillary...so she is fallible, who isn't. She still is best for the job. Neither Bernie or Trump is.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)was part of The Club. She's about to be expelled, quite literally.
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)trashing Joe Biden...he is a piss of shite. Surely you can do better than a guy who lives on Fox?
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)He worked for Bush for two terms. And he is a backstabber too.
cali
(114,904 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)Care to clarify that comment?
Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)The only questions are when, and by whom, the lid gets blown on it.
Shortly after this hits the headlines, she is DONE as far as being President is concerned. Anybody who looks into the facts knows this.
She is running under false pretenses by continuing to lie about this.
Actor
(626 posts)terrible mistake for Obama to hire any right winger, ever.
And he doesnt say concern as in her being indicted or losing the election, either.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)It's gonna get real ugly real soon.
antigop
(12,778 posts)there's a whole thread on it there, too
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512001766
antigop
(12,778 posts)Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)At the beginning...she wanted more info...kind of misleading.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/08/dianne-feinstein-hillary-clinton_n_6826790.html
amborin
(16,631 posts)Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)and no matter what GOP slime like Gates say...she will be the president. Madam President.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)I guarantee you that nothing will come of this
Demsrule86
(68,788 posts)He stayed on after Obama was elected for a time and was forced out. He was one of the architects of the failed invasion of Iraq...why do you people love the GOP as supposedly unbiased sources.
"The former defense secretary, who served under both previous Bush presidencies, was critical that likely GOP presidential candidate Jeb Bush stumbled last week when asked whether he would have invaded Iraq in 2003, knowing what we know now about the war."
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/robert-gates-not-impressed-by-any-2016-candidates/