Grifter? Scammer? Con man?

[kiva]

I've seen a multitude of posts that lambast Bernie for continuing to seek and accept contributions from his supporters, as though we are somehow giving money to a liar.

So I'm wondering why all of the concern for those of us who choose to contribute to Bernie's campaign. Do Clinton supporters really think that if we stopped sending Bernie money that we would send that money to Clinton's campaign?

If so....




oh, and

[phleshdef]

1. I'm still donating monthly to Bernie and fully aware of his chances at this stage.

[kiva]

3. Me too!

[Fast Walker 52]

70. me three!

[Merryland]

76. me four!

[Duckhunter935]

83. Me five

I know he has expenses to pay.

[Logical]

91. Me Six, and $20 a week

[Baobab]

94. Does this bother anybody knowing Hillary Clinton was involved in hiding this global block in the US?

https://www.policyalternatives.ca/publications/reports/gats-and-south-africas-national-health-act

[onehandle]

2. Every dollar sent to the Sanders campaign at this point is funding the Trump campaign. nt

[kiva]

4. Funny, Act Blue always says I'm donating to Bernie.

[NurseJackie]

11. Failure to anticipate unintended consequences ...

... and to see beyond what's immediately in front of them has always been something that Bernie's campaign has struggled with. I assume that this may also apply to some of his faithful followers. (This is my opinion. Others may have different opinions, but this one is mine.)

[NWCorona]

16. Sounds like you are talking about Hillary.

[PufPuf23]

10. In your imagination. eom

[senz]

31. No, every dollar sent to Hill funds Trump. Hill loses to Trump. Bernie beats trump.

For months, polls have showed Bernie winning out over Trump by far wider margins than Hillary, and now polls are showing Hillary and Trump neck and neck because Trump is going to beat her if she's our nominee.

Don't want Trump? Nominate Bernie.

[CharlotteVale]

48. If Hill can't beat Trump, that's on her.

[frylock]

67. Every dollar spent on Pepsi is funding Coors.

[Mnpaul]

82. You are either with us

or with the terrorists

nice conservative mindset there

[Logical]

92. Lol, I sometimes cannot tell if your post are serious or just BS

[jberryhill]

5. Campaigns continue to take contributions after losing elections, too

As I recall, Hillary's 2008 campaign ended up with a lot of debt, and continued to solicit contributions to pay off that debt.

I really don't see what the problem is here.

[djean111]

15. Hillary's supporters really do think that Bernie's supporters' fervor for Bernie is personality-

based, not based on the issues and past deeds. IMO Bernie was only asked to run as a Democrat so he could fizzle out a year ago, and hand over his supporters, organization, and money to Hillary and the DNC. That did not happen, and thus the pathetic hissy fits.

Hillary ended her campaign $22 million dollars in debt, and Obama, and the rest of us, paid that debt. Talk about grifting, indeed.

[lagomorph777]

63. For a long time it looked like Trump was keeping up his bargain with buddy Hillary too.

But now...looks like maybe he is actually planning to win this thing.

Like a dog finally catching the car, what is he going to do with it?

[Sheepshank]

21. yup, Bernie needs to keep running and piling up those invoices...people need to donate to pay it off

perfect symbiosis

[jberryhill]

22. Did you say that in 2008?

[Sheepshank]

33. I supported Obama in 2008

I rarely ever posted anything against the opponent. I generally was supporting my candidate. Why do you ask?

[Bluenorthwest]

52. Hillary's losing 08 campaign ended with millions of dollars of debt, mostly to Mark Penn. After

she was named Sec of State, other people raised money on her behalf to pay off those debts long after the election was over and in spite of her own ability to pay those debts many times over from her personal accounts. Barack Obama, your 08 candidate, helped your 2016 candidate raise money to pay her debts incurred by staying in the race until the very end.
I'm sure you know all of that.

[jberryhill]

60. Well that's neither here nor there

If you are speaking about some general principle - "political campaigns should not take contributions unless they have a chance of winning" - then what was your position in 2008, when the Clinton campaign like many others continued to take contributions even after conceding?

[Old Codger]

56. I do

The problem is it is Bernie and not her highup..

[Jitter65]

6. No the money is going to Devine and Weaver. nt

[kiva]

9. Really? Not what Act Blue says when I contribute.

[LonePirate]

24. The expense reports on the FEC site are a better source than Act Blue to see where the money goes.

[Segami]

18. I guess its OK that all of Clinton's women contributions

are going towards paying for Hillary's BFF smear-rodent misogynist slimy sh*t-stain David Brock............oh,...I guess that doesn't count?

[Armstead]

30. Just as a big chunk of money to Clinton goes to pay off political professionals

I think people are aware of that.

Thanks for pointing it out though. Most of us are too dumb to figure out that political campaigns pay people for services.

[frylock]

75. TDS + WDS

[djean111]

7. I really think they do expect that.

As a matter of fact, seeing as how money given to the states gets laundered right back to Hillary (talk about grifting!) and seeing how DWS actively discourages liberals and Progressives, and openly supports her GOP cronies down here in Florida - I will only donate directly to liberal/Progressive politicians.

[Fawke Em]

14. They also think our votes will automatically transfer to her, too.

Which, as we've seen with the Bernie or Bust movement, the still massive crowds and the uptick in fund-raising since the West Virginia win, isn't the case, either.

[myrna minx]

8. Accepting Super pac money and soliciting Bush donors is pragmatic, but my $27 donation really

Sinister. Who knew?

[senz]

34. Perfect summation.

[GreatGazoo]

12. they are still working on trying to pull Bernie's favorables down into her range

for months they have had to deal with not being able to attack Bernie on honesty and integrity.

They freaked out completely when Bernie ran this ad (Two Visions) back in February, calling it "going negative" but they NEVER debunked any of it, never released Wall Street transcripts and never engaged in any discussion of why they thought the ad was unfair to her (if they even believe that it is).

[pdsimdars]

62. OMG! I can't believe that he has such great simplicity, strength and integrity. . not to mention

the JUDGEMENT.

Every time I see one of the ads or the lectures, I am amazed how we got such a treasure as a candidate.

[GreatGazoo]

69. Does anyone know what agency does his ads?

I looked months ago and only turned up stuff like this (praise):

Bernie Sanders has the most effective political ads of the 2016 presidential race

http://www.campaignlive.com/article/bernie-sanders-effective-political-ads-2016-presidential-race/1379312

[apnu]

13. The FEC is looking into Bernie's fund raising. Seems there's a lot of people who've gone over...

...the max donation amount and the campaign is slow to refund as it much by law.

[Hiraeth]

20. link. please.

[Sancho]

29. Try this one...

http://fecthebern.org/

[Hiraeth]

35. how about

#fecu

[Sancho]

51. 1867 posts in 90 days...new in 2015?

What motivates you? Such a mystery.

Just try not to donate more than $2700 under the same name.

[Hiraeth]

55. I used to have a life. what's your excuse?

[apnu]

32. Here let me google that for you

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=http%3A%2F%2Fdocquery.fec.gov%2Fpdf%2F847%2F201605100300045847%2F201605100300045847.pdf

Thanks for letting me do the great and wonderful service of your research.

[Hiraeth]

36. and

#fecu2

[apnu]

43. Federal Employee Credit Union?

Huh?

[Maedhros]

44. It's common courtesy on many forums, not just this one, for posters to provide links

supporting allegations they make. Simply telling people to "google it" is generally considered arrogant.

/ignore list.

[Hiraeth]

47. good idea, thanks

[Maedhros]

49. You're welcome!

Cheers!

[Hiraeth]

54. fresh air!

[apnu]

58. Bullshit

Its common on many forums, not just this one, to call out someone for making a wild accusation by asking for sources.

In this case the person didn't do that. They simply, lazily, asked me to do their research. I provided a direct link to the FEC's letter.

Go cry me a river.

[Number23]

88. Good Lord, the WHINING in this forum today. And that poster is stupidly attempting to castigate you

even after you clearly provided a link as per the request from the person you were actually responding to.

So obvious that was just an attempt to be nasty and announce to everyone that s/he was putting you on ignore. Because some people really think that not having to receive utterly pointless and nasty responses from people is some sort of punishment, you know.

[kiva]

23. Thank goodness someone is checking out all of those

individual donors and their $27 contributions, takes the stress away from the $$$$ corporate donors who support Clinton.

[bunnies]

28. Are they also looking into camp Clintons collusion with Brocks super-pac?

[apnu]

37. Dunno, they haven't released an official letter to the Clinton campaign

But they have for Bernie, see my post above.

And before anybody puts a tinfoil hat on and says this is some kind of establishment conspiracy to keep Bernie down, allow me to remind everybody that the Obama campaign fell into hot water with the FEC in 2008 and was fined.

http://www.fec.gov/press/bkgnd/history.shtml

$183,865 in fines in fact.

So let's not pretend the FEC is in the tank OK?

[bunnies]

39. I didnt say anything about the FEC being in the tank.

I remember reading an article at the beginning of the primary about how under-staffed and inept the agency had become. I'm surprised they're doing anything, actually. If the Bernie camp did wrong, he should face the music. I have no issue with that.

[apnu]

41. Oh, not you. I was speaking in general.

sorry if that's not clear.

[bunnies]

45. Sorry. I misunderstood. nt

[dana_b]

17. she is the PROVEN liar and cheat

we are not stupid and know who we are supporting. Hillary's supporters don't seem to care who/what she is.

[Ferd Berfel]

19. Clinton dosen't need us - She has Wall Street

[reddread]

25. Bernie?

I thought this was about David Brock.

[QC]

26. I think it's interesting that the Jewish candidate

is the one who's constantly being accused of being "in it for the money" and "ripping off naive college kids" and "grifting" and being a "con artist" and all that.

Given how the mascot of the HRC Fan Club outed herself as a nasty anti-Semite on another site a few weeks back, it's hard not to see a connection in all this.

[Hiraeth]

38. connect.the.dots.

[Bluenorthwest]

50. DU allowed a bigot to attack a minority candidate endlessly here, even with the bigotry now

public knowledge there has been no remorse expressed by that person's supporting cast on DU over the fact that they picked on a minority for being a minority for months and months on DU.

[QC]

57. Yep, the reaction was to hide the posts that pointed out the bigotry,

rather than to do anything about the bigotry.

[riderinthestorm]

71. Yes, there's been a lot of unsubtle anti-semitism aimed at Bernie

[Orsino]

27. They probably believe that Trump is a billionaire.

[senz]

40. One of the two Dem candidates is dishonest and greedy, and it's not Bernie.

[Waiting For Everyman]

42. Projection. Sad, really. It's all they've got.

They get all overcome with jealousy just thinking about all that money we send Bernie. SHE'S the one who's supposed to have all the money!

[pdsimdars]

64. and thought it'd be a walk in the park, but she had to fight and tapped out her big donors

[Ken Burch]

46. The people doing those slams are basically the ones who thought Bernie had no right to run

They all think we should have been contented with HRC running on Bill's 1996 platform(as we all know she would have done without anyone challenging her from her left).

[felix_numinous]

53. The insults are an attempt to demoralize

a huuuuuge movement in this country. Any candidate or leader who preys upon the weak inspires all the sociopathic predatory behavior to come out of the woodwork--they are totally outing themselves.

[litlbilly]

59. All they are doing is proving to all the buckets of shit they really are. They just dont see it.

[pdsimdars]

65. The cure for demoralization is just to see a photo of one of those Bernie rallies. WOW!

They can't talk that away. The contrast between Bernie's tens of thousands and Hillary's tens of dozens, is STARK!

[felix_numinous]

68. Yes, thank you!!

I have to remind myself millions of dollars went into this manufactured consent--and that we all might be surprised if we could see the actual numbers of supporters on each side, and what they do for a living.

[pdsimdars]

61. I think they have to come up with something to make them feel OK that Hillary tapped out all of her

donors and now has to beg from Republicans. Whereas Bernie has a virtual never-ending supply of cash.

Begging for Republican money. That's low. Imagine what you have to give up for that.

[MisterP]

89. AND stealing from the state parties' downticket money, don't forget!

[frylock]

66. These assholes probably berate SNAP recipients for buying a fucking candy bar.

Fucking conservative busybodies.

[Marrah_G]

72. Every time they do this I like Bernie more and lose more respect for them

[rock]

73. You have it exactly backward

I for one insist that Bernie finish the job he started: running for president. And that he continue to fleece his supporters for all the donation that they're worth. As for him being a liar, that's another can of worms. He either is infantile in his political thinking or he knows better and it's a scam. His method is to take political ideas from small, Scandinavian governments that are socialistic and apply them to the largest economy on earth with no concept about how to scale up. This is as big a mistake as taking the beavers' plan for dams and building the Grand Coolidge based on it. There are many issues with his issues. But I'll not bore you (if I haven't already).

[kiva]

74. Sorry that you are sad.

Just think of all the banksters and Wall Street moguls smiling at your obsequious post and be happy.

[cali]

80. No, the op is spot on and you did a great, albeit, unintentional, job of illustrating that

with your transparently spiteful and petty post.

First of all, no matter what you think of him, he's obviously not fleecing his donors. And as a longtime constituent and someone who has engaged with him quite a few times, I assure you he's not remotely naive in his political thinking or scamming anyone. He is trying to reframe political debate and the problem priorities of the party. You don't agree with that? Fine, but it's just rather dim to contort reality in an attempt to denigrate him.

Furthermore, Bernie has succeeded at the above in a resounding way.

[rock]

84. I can completely believe what you say

But I then have to assume that Bernie does not understand Politics with any real depth. In fact I find him idealistic and not realistic at all. In short if he isn't a scam artist, he's too deluded about his grandiose plans. In any case he has deluded his supporters.

[kiva]

85. Hmmm, who do I think has more political knowledge,

a sitting US Senator who has been involved in politics for over 40 years or an anonymous internet poster who trades in insults and undocumented assertions?

I think I'll go with Bernie on this one.

[SpareribSP]

93. Today I learned

That someone who has been in politics since 1981, beloved by his home state who he represents, and who has won multiple hard fought elections does not understand politics and has no idea what he's doing

You are unbelievably condescending. We aren't idiots, and neither is Bernie. I guess him being rated one of the best mayors and most popular senator is because he tripped and accidentally fell into a pile of good policies

[Thinkingabout]

77. Did you read any post by a Hillary which stated we expect those giving to Sanders to in turn

Give to Hillary? My point if the average donation is $27 dollars there just may be lots of donors who can not afford to donate any more and are still ask to give.

[silvershadow]

78. oh because they are suddenly so concerned about our financial health

that they forgot about the "supporting actual democracy" part. (as opposed to Plutocracy)

[abakan]

81. I will continue to support

Bernie Sanders, until he is no longer running. I don't think he will need my money once elected.

[NCTraveler]

86. Damn near gave it a rec and then I read the body.

Just playing around.

[nc4bo]

87. They are accusing Sanders' campaign of everything they are and everything they've done.

If you begin to look at their garbage talking through THAT lens, it explains everything.

Fuck them with their lies, deceptions and projection of self onto others. We see them for what they and their candidate stand for.

[Codeine]

90. Tinker? Tailor? Soldier? Spy?

Sorry, first stupid thing to spring to mind.