Let's be clear: You are no longer a progressive if you are supporting Trump in the General

[moriah]

Last edited Fri May 6, 2016, 02:05 AM - Edit history (1)

And also, clearer: not having a good enough clothespin, sufficient antiemetics, a barf bag, and enough intoxicants available after to be able to vote for Hillary in the General does not make you "not a Progressive", "not a Democrat" or "supporting Trump".

Edit to add: I was trying to say that even if people couldn't manage to vote for Hillary in the GE, they were still Democrats, Progressives, and not supporting Trump unless they were casting a vote for him.

Maybe I should have worded it that way.

[bobbobbins01]

1. Show of hands. Who's supporting Trump in the general?

::crickets::

Exactly.

[dlwickham]

2. all I hear is bernie or bust

[bobbobbins01]

4. That doesn't imply support for Trump at all.

But thanks for trying.

[iandhr]

13. Yes it does.

Not voting only helps him.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

15. In Texas my vote means nothing. So how am I supporting tRump if I don't vote? nt

[bobbobbins01]

16. Voter suppression is Clintons thing.

And not voting doesn't help him, much like being an atheist doesn't help Christianity.

[bettyellen]

17. she has been fighting voter suppression for years. are you guys proud of the bullshit or what?

I have never seen so many totally fabricated allegations against a Republican here. It is sickening.

[Hortensis]

33. The far right behaves exactly the same way, Bettyellen.

These common characteristics are defining of people on the extremes. You might as well try to convince the hard-cores in the GOP base to be honest about people they've identified as opponents. They won't change. It's a personality thing, and it's wired in.

[Joe the Revelator]

6. Which part of that includes voting for Trump?

[Duckhunter935]

8. I do not support that idiot

[Silver_Witch]

18. Voting for Bernie is not supporting Trump....

....Not voting for Hillary is NOT voting for Trump.

It is easy.

[dlwickham]

20. and that's the attitude that gave us Dubya

[HooptieWagon]

28. DLC must be slow learners then.

They have no interest in getting votes from the left.
Hillary to Bush donors: "I share your values".

[moriah]

12. Exactly. Unless people go PUMA, your vote is your own.

Would it be called being "Bern-Outs", people switching to Trump instead of leaving the top of the ticket blank or for neither party?

I can't advocate for people voting another way than Democratic, but unless you're going to vote for Trump in the GE, I say you still keep all progressive cred.

(I was also mocking another thread).

[Silver_Witch]

19. I saw what you were doing.

It was clever and well played.

Until Bernie quits I will not quit.

[Thinkingabout]

3. When is Sanders going to become a progressive?

[Joe the Revelator]

7. You're shitting me. nt

[moriah]

10. He said, even in his Contested Convention speech, that he would work to defeat Trump. Nt

[runaway hero]

5. You can't be so hardline.

People are upset and want change. Hillary is not that.

[moriah]

9. Did I sound hardline?

I was saying that even if people couldn't manage to vote for Hillary in the GE, they were still Democrats, Progressives, and not supporting Trump.

Maybe I should have worded it that way instead of the opposite.

[runaway hero]

14. This is better.

Personally if I was in the country right I would vote Hillary. I understand why people are upset. If not for Obama, we would have had a Bush or Clinton in power since 1988.

[dgauss]

11. The progressive question was answered in the primary vote.

With the general election it's the pragmatism angle.

[moriah]

22. Have no idea what you are talking about, but this was a copycat.

And he will lose.

[Hydra]

23. Sorry, wording in OP was a bit hard to follow.

[joshcryer]

24. But he said he's open to raising the minimum wage!*

*oops he said that raising the minimum wage, in that same interview, would hurt competition.

But he said he wants to make the other countries pay for their own wars or we'll leave!*

*oops he said that it'd be the ideal outcome but if we had interests we'd have to stay.

[Joob]

25. Yeah, not voting for him. Don't trust him

[Tiggeroshii]

26. Again, "progressive" is a set of actions and principles taken to address a cause. Yes supporting

Trump is counter intuitive to what a progressive has stood for. Yet so is supporting Clinton, as she has taken a stand against everything that progressives have attempted. Against higher wages, serving on the board of wal mart, accepting money from Republicans, support for and from the oil and gas industry, etc. Progressivism was founded to fight against the powerful and wealthy that pollute our air, taint our water and harm the fabrics of society. To accept money and support to and from those who perpetuate those issues is the opposite of progressive. Which isn't bad, necessarily -since it is simply taking a different, more corporate inclusive approach to the problem. But it is far from the historical and current definition of what "progressive" means. Nothing wrong with not being progressive.

Historical example -Liberal: Woodrow Wilson
Progressive: Theodore Roosovelt

Modern example -Liberal: Hillary Clinton
Progressive: Bernie Sanders


It's just a difference in creed and approach. While I think the progressive approach is better, it's okay to differ and say a liberal economic approach with less oversight is best.

It's okay for us to be different, I just think we should be more open and honest about what those differences are =)

[HooptieWagon]

27. Hillary to Bush donors:"I share your values"

So the major party ballot choices are a Bush-Republican and a madman. Looks to me like the third parties are going to have a banner year.

[kiva]

29. I live in a state that has

"none of the above" as a ballot choice.

I will never vote Trump.

[JPnoodleman]

30. I worry that being a progressive by the Hillerite standards is off limits to some...

It seems its solely about ethnic groups stabbing at one another.

[jeff47]

31. Yes, DU has not had enough loyalty oath threads. (nt)

[moriah]

34. And perhaps some DUers had a little too little coffee?

I'll let you re-read, but tell me where on earth there's a request for a loyalty oath from me. (The thread was also a copycat, but the original ended up getting hidden.)

Unless you count criticism of anyone stupid enough to actually vote FOR Trump in the GE, and then hell yeah, I'll gladly say everyone should take that loyalty oath. If anyone on DU plans to vote for Trump jn the GE, they don't belong here, need immediate mental health care, or both.

Edit because I thought the post was at 12:48 AM, this was a last night thread)

[jeff47]

40. You're calling everyone who does not like Clinton a Trump supporter.

You don't have to actually include an oath to make a loyalty oath thread.

Just insinuating that people have no other choice is enough. Which you do plenty in your op.

Btw, Trump is to the left of Clinton on a few issues. Such as not being enthusiastic about military adventures in the middle east, and not fond of trade agreements. Does that mean everyone voting for Clinton is "not a progressive" on those issues? Or can we stop this childish bullshit and realize life has complexity?

[moriah]

41. Where do you get that?

Please?

Because I thought I said explicitly that even if you couldn't make yourself vote for Hillary, unless you ARE voting for Trump, you are not his supporter.

The thread I was mocking was entitled " Let's be clear: You are no longer a progressive if you are supporting Hillary in the Primary".

I was defending my candidate, but attempting to make it clear that not embracing Hillary with open arms did NOT equal Trump-humping, just in case anyone thought that was my point, and DEFENDING the Bernie supporters who have been accused of working for Trump by still supporting Bernie.

Maybe if you'd seen the original you would have understood.

[VulgarPoet]

32. Anyone who supports Trump in the GE is a fucking moron.

Not sure who keeps floating the idea that Bernie supporters would really be willing to support him when there's a viable second option.

[moriah]

35. It was a copycat thread...

... of someone applying some "no longer a Progressive" purity test to people on DU.

My point was the only purity test I cared about was not going total PUMA and voting for the Hair.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

36. I'm not voting for either of them.

Trump is a lunatic and Hillary is just another ambitious centrist politician without ethics.

[moriah]

37. That's your choice and your vote. :)

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

38. Votes belong to individuals. Not to any party, candidate, or company.

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. Friedrich Nietzsche

[Demsrule86]

39. Sorry

It makes you all of those things and more.