Has anyone here heard of Better World Books?

[anti-alec]

I just ordered 5 books (John Nance) from there.. 5 for $15 (plus .25c for carbon offset) - and the money you pay goes to a charity.

All the books I bought were used, not new. I have no need to destroy more dead trees that it's already now.

[The Philosopher]

1. I've never investigated them

But (through Amazon) I've ordered several books from them and I've been satisfied enough that I will try and buy the used book I want from them, even if they're a penny more (or roundabouts). Each book I've gotten was in a used state, but nothing that wouldn't look like I've owned it myself. I think each description of the state of the book was less than what I actually got. I'm always happy about that.

But that's just me. Hopefully other people have had good experiences with them.

[Viva]

2. Sometimes it is in the fine print

From their website.

"And we give a portion of every sale to our non-profit literacy partners. "

[JitterbugPerfume]

3. do they have a website?

it sounds interesting

[anti-alec]

4. Yes they do.

They delivered my books last week - fast shipping.

3 hardcovers and 2 paperbacks, all at the same price.

http://www.betterworldbooks.com/

[JitterbugPerfume]

5. thanks

They sould like my kind of people!!

[MRuby99]

6. They are a FOR PROFIT Used Book Company that ReSells Donated "Charity" Books for Profit 4 Themselves

There are two HUGE Book companies ( THRIFT BOOKS and BETTER WORLD BOOKS )
who continue to expand and are setting up book collection bins across the country. Better World Books has expanded across the globe, with book drives now in the UK and Australia, all under the false pretense of "fighting world illiteracy" to get people to help Better World Books volunteer and hold book drives to collect books so Better World Books can sell these used textbooks for a profit... only 5-10% actually goes to charity.

Both Thrift Books and Better World Books have deceptivley gained a monopoly on access to used books to resell by providing misleading information to people under the pretense of helping "fight world illiteracy". Thrift Books has placed collection bins across the country and is planning to expand these bins on the Eastern Seaboard from Boston to Washington DC. Their bins have signs on them claiming "BOOKS FOR CHARITY" and shopping centers provide room for these "donation bins".

They also sell under different names such as
Green Earth Books,
Motor City Books, the
Atlanta Book Company LLC,
Blue Cloud Books LLC, and
Yankee , etc...

People don't realize that this is a FOR Profit company who want to gain sole access to the supply of used books. They even have contracts with some Goodwills and libraries, however, some libraries have complained of their dishonesty and the fact that the donations to the library book sales have decreased dramatically.

Better World Books has deceptively presented themselves as a business who fights world illiteracy by providing donated books to underdeveloped countries. They send pamphlets to schools and universities and colleges asking for donations of used textbooks and the bins they provide have a sign on them about charity and helping countries in need, when in fact, compared to the value of the donated books and the profits they are making from selling these free books they get from donations, very little is really being done to the cause they claim. They are a FOR Profit business with "charity" attached to their name to get people to cooperate with them.

Universities and College honor societies are working to collect and package the books to send to Better World Books all the while thinking those books are going to a third world country, when in fact, most are being sold online FOR PROFIT.

HERE ARE SOME LINKS BELOW to read more and some quotes from the articles:


According to one of the articles I have listed below, Thrift Books owner has claimed

" We are going to take over the world!"



These companies are even contracting with libraries and school to collect their books and are presenting themselves in such a misleading way so that schools and colleges and libraries are helping them with book drives, because they make people think that the donated books are going to a charitable cause.

Some libraries are complaining that they lack book donations because of the book bins with "charity" signs on them that Thrift Books has across the country and plans to put even more on the Eastern Seaboard, from Boston to the DC area.

Some libraries have somehow bought into Thrift Books and are letting Thrift Books exclusively buy off their books.

Both Thrift Books and Better World Books brag about how affordable their books are, but not after paying for shipping and handling and comparing those prices to the prices found at library sales.
(see articles below and the youtube videos for these book sellers)


HERE IS MORE INFO On these two deceptive book dealers and how they collect their books. One news video explained how the ReadingTree.org "charity", (which the owner of Thrift Books had at least one family member as president ),
reported obviously inaccurate tax reports on the value of the books that they actually received, listing each book received as a $3.00 value).

It is also hard to prove how many books are actually received from these "charity" bins, and how many go to be distributed to other book dealers such as Motor City or others listed above so hide how many books and the profits from them these companies actually make. One news article lists Thrift Books owner as making around $200,000 per year, but if you look at their warehouses on youtube, you know its a LOT more than that!!

Also,
Thrift Books deceptively claims that "for every book sold, we donate a book"..
That could mean they sell a signed copy of a valuable book or valuable out of print book and donate a coloring book. Very deceptive. They may not even report that the valuable books were ever received from the bins.
HERE IS MORE INFO:




"NONPROFIT BOOK COLLECTION GROUPS CLASH WITH UPSTART FOR -PROFIT RIVAL"

http://blog.thenewstribune.com/business/2011/04/14/thrift-recycling-management-of-lakewood-placing-book-bins-in-california-further-expansion-in-the-wings/

"Bins are now located in 14 states.
New locations include Indianapolis, Milwaukee and Portland, with a
FURTHER EXPANSION PLANNED FOR the Eastern Seaboard, especially between Boston and Washington, D.C.

http://blog.betterworldbooks.com/2009/01/23/letter-to-the-stakeholders-of-better-world-books/

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/worklife/07/01/mainstreet.books/

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2011/05/book_bins_for_charity_open_up_a_story_of_blurry_relationships_between.html

http://alibrisdealersforum.yuku.com/topic/2083/Better-World-Books?page=4#.T-yBa5HNnhx


http://alibrisdealersforum.yuku.com/search/topic/topic/2083#.T-yCmZHNnhw

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/worklife/07/01/mainstreet.books/

http://www.amazonsellercommunity.com/forums/message.jspa?messageID=2294654

“Better World Books hires sales representatives to work colleges to collect donations for them. They offer cash incentives to student groups to sponsor collections. The print material they use in the campus efforts states nothing about them being for profit. No doubt in my mind that they are a for profit company that hides behind giving the impression they are a charity.”

http://www.amazonsellercommunity.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=182770&start=15&tstart=0

“What they do is get charities to scout for places to put a bin and get permission of the site owner. For each bin that is placed the charity receives an undisclosed amount of money. It's a whole slimy circle and the more I research things of that nature the less inclined I am to give to any organization that I don't know for certain is completely legit and it's sad because it hurts the real charities who are actually trying to do some good.”

http://www.amazonsellercommunity.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=182770&start=15&tstart=0

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/worklife/07/01/mainstreet.books/

Quote from the above:
“They used the funding to build up their Web site and the Better World Books brand. As other small businesses have struggled, Helgesen and his partners have seen their revenues grow, from $4 million a year in 2005 to a projected $31 million in 2009. And all the time they are helping others buy books they might not ordinarily be able to afford.”

“So, $4 million in 2005 to $31 million in 2009. Yet during the whole time they have been operating only $7 mil has been donated? Not a very large percentage. If you only consider the years 2005 and 2009 that only equals 20% so the actual amount donated would be far less because the totals of 2006, 2007, and 2008 are unlisted.”

“I gotta say I was reading some articles about them and I am both irritated and impressed by their business. On one hand, they clearly state they are a For-Profit venture. However, they have succeeded in cultivating an image of "do-gooders" when the actual amount of charity they do is incredibly small. Yet they have lots of positive press from the media.”

“So, you buy books from libraries at 15 cents on the dollar of value. This has been verified by a library employee in my area who was contacted by BWB. Then they ship their penny books to third world contries and most likely write off the donation. It's genius but also pretty slimy.

I tested a few books on their website. One $15.00 book at ~300k sales rank they would agree to pay shipping to them but would not buy it at all. I tried a few others and found a $25.00 book that they would pay me $5.65.

This really has no point except thinking out loud but I have to be impressed at how they have done such a monumental job of spinning themselves as a charity without actually being one.”

"The cheapest books sell for about $3.50 each, and all of the books are shipped at no cost to customers -- whether they buy 5 or 500 books at a time. The average order is for three or four books. But textbook deals remain at the heart of the Better World Books business.

"We've gone through great lengths to build a business where we bring in tons and tons of college textbooks," Helgesen said.

"What's cool about us is we post them at about market level, so some of the books will only be about 20 or 30 percent off, so they may still be $80 to $90. Some other ones are 90 percent off, so you may be getting a $100 book for $10, and that happens every day here."

For Helgesen, Fuchs and Kurtzman, giving back is a vital part of the operation. Better World Books donates 5 to 10 percent of its revenue back into the hands of libraries and literacy programs around the world.

And what about the books that still don't sell even at Better World Books? If a book doesn't sell and isn't fit for donation, the company will ship it off for recycling.
“Maintaining a successful small business, one that continues to grow in a recession, is no easy feat.”

After funding the business themselves for the first five years, the founders got a Small Business Administration-backed credit line in 2004, followed by a $2.4 million venture capital investment in 2008. “

They used the funding to build up their Web site and the Better World Books brand.
As other small businesses have struggled, Helgesen and his partners have seen their revenues grow, from $4 million a year in 2005 to a projected $31 million in 2009. And all the time they are helping others buy books they might not ordinarily be able to afford.”
"We actually audit our recycler," Helgesen said. "We go there and see what they do, we check who they sell to and try to make sure they're being ethical and not just lighting a big bonfire with the books."

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2011/05/books_for_charity_bin_in_hillsdale_comes_down_after_oregonian_story.html

"Books for charity' bin in Hillsdale comes down after story in The Oregonian"

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2011/05/book_bins_for_charity_open_up_a_story_of_blurry_relationships_between.html

"Books for charity' bins around Oregon reveal blurry relationship between nonprofit and for-profit businesses"

http://blog.betterworldbooks.com/2009/01/23/letter-to-the-stakeholders-of-better-world-books/



http://alibrisdealersforum.yuku.com/topic/2083/Better-World-Books?page=4#.T-yBa5HNnhw


http://alibrisdealersforum.yuku.com/search/topic/topic/2083#.T-yCmZHNnhw

http://alibrisdealersforum.yuku.com/topic/2083/Better-World-Books?page=4#.T-yBa5HNnhx

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11932002

http://www.amazonsellercommunity.com/forums/thread.jspa?messageID=2850408�

http://www.berkeleyside.com/2011/06/30/charity-book-bins-run-by-for-profit-company/

http://www.readingtree.org/

http://www.auburn-reporter.com/business/42707282.html

http://guerneville.towns.pressdemocrat.com/2012/03/11/do-book-donations-dropped-in-those-big-blue-bins-really-go-to-charity/

http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/192336/0/Battle-Over-The-Blue-Book-Bin-

http://www.sonomanews.com/News-2012/Blue-book-bins-cause-consternation/

nonprofit-book-collection-groups-clash-with-upstart-for-profit-rival/article

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/nonprofit-book-collection-groups-clash-with-upstart-for-profit-rival/article_f092f4c6-8667-540a-8821-eba89d8cdd4b.html

your.kingcounty.gov/solidwaste/.../Textbook_recycling_options.doc


http://blog.thenewstribune.com/business/2011/04/14/thrift-recycling-management-of-lakewood-placing-book-bins-in-california-further-expansion-in-the-wings/

&feature=related

http://money.cnn.com/2009/02/27/smallbusiness/books_that_talk_back.fsb/index.htm

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/worklife/07/01/mainstreet.books/


http://blog.betterworldbooks.com/2009/07/02/better-world-books-on-cnn-today-2-jul-saturday-4-jul-and-sunday-5-jul/

http://blog.betterworldbooks.com/2009/01/23/letter-to-the-stakeholders-of-better-world-books/

http://www.sparknews.com/video/litterature-less-better-world-books-cnn

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2011/05
/book_bins_for_charity_open_up_a_story_of_blurry_relationships_between.html

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2011/05/books_for_charity_bin_in_hillsdale_comes_down_after_oregonian_story.html


http://blog.betterworldbooks.com/2009/01/23/letter-to-the-stakeholders-of-better-world-books/


http://www.prweb.com/releases/used/books/prweb8023670.htm

NOTE: THE www.prweb article above was actually written by the owner/ CEO of the company, Hector Rivas!!
(see contact info to right of article)
Compare that number to the number of years this company has had their book bins for charity and also to the enormous boxes of books at their warehouses. Compare what you see on the youtube videos for Thrift Books to a news article below that indicated Hector reported he makes about $200,000 / year salary to IRS... something doesn't add up.

Better World Books has MANY misleading videos on youtube about their business.

http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2006/07/03/smallb1.html?page=all

"Hector Rivas has found out that a penny can go a long way. His company, Thrift Books LLC, sells more
than 1,500 used books a day online. And 30 percent to 40 percent of those books cost only 1 cent.
"We're going to take over the world," he jokes. And he may, perhaps 1 cent at a time.
Thrift Books is privately held and has about $2.5 million in annual sales, according to Rivas, with 60 percent of sales coming from Seattle-based Amazon.
Since Thrift Books started in 2003, the company has emerged as one of the largest used booksellers in the country -- with 400,000 books in stock and adding 10,000 titles online every day."
"Sitting in his office in the Auburn warehouse - one of four the company operates - Rivas explained one of the reasons his company is thriving in these tough financial times....I believe we are the largest distributor of used books on the Internet in the world," he said. "There is not a company online (selling used books) exclusively that is bigger than us.""

http://www.berkeleyside.com/2011/06/30/charity-book-bins-run-by-for-profit-company/

http://www.auburn-reporter.com/business/42707282.html


http://guerneville.towns.pressdemocrat.com/2012/03/11/do-book-donations-dropped-in-those-big-blue-bins-really-go-to-charity/

http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/192336/0/Battle-Over-The-Blue-Book-Bin-

http://www.sonomanews.com/News-2012/Blue-book-bins-cause-consternation/

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/nonprofit-book-collection-groups-clash-with-upstart-for-profit-rival/article_f092f4c6-8667-540a-8821-eba89d8cdd4b.html

NONPROFIT BOOK COLLECTION GROUPS CLASH WITH UPSTART FOR -PROFIT RIVAL

http://blog.thenewstribune.com/business/2011/04/14/thrift-recycling-management-of-lakewood-placing-book-bins-in-california-further-expansion-in-the-wings/

"Bins are now located in 14 states. New locations include Indianapolis, Milwaukee and Portland, with a further expansion planned for the Eastern Seaboard, especially between Boston and Washington, D.C.



When these used book companies donate the donated free books they got (even if the books are not very desirable to resell online),
these companies get a tax write off for their donations.

There are a lot of Videos on youtube showing their huge warehouses where they collect and store all the donated books for their own profit

Be Smart and READ BETWEEN THE LINES about these FOR PROFIT COMPANIES who are less focused on helping the world that helping themselves and their own bank accounts.

[mvccd1000]

7. Interesting protest...

Even book resellers are fair game now, huh? I've worked overseas for a number of years, and thriftbooks has always had the best selection on Amazon. (When I'd find 10-12 paperbacks I wanted to order, I preferred to have them all come in a single shipment. Instead of going through 4-5 sellers to get them, I'd often find that thriftbooks had all of them for sale. That made it easier for me to get a single package with my books in it.)

While they may not be saving the world, it sounds like they are putting some people to work - I'm not going to complain about that in this economy.

I have a kindle now, though, so I'm not helping anybody's employment (but I'm not killing as many trees, either).

[TBF]

8. Interesting post -

I'll be sure to give my used books directly to the local library from now on. I've been cleaning out my collection now that I have a Kindle.

[XemaSab]

9. How fascinating!

Welcome to DU!

[I Love Reading]

11. question for MRuby99

I have been aware for at least a year that Thrift books is selling under a multitude of names. I found this website because I was trying to find a list of those name under which it does business. I try to avoid buying from Thrift, because I feel they have deceptive practices and they do not do proper ratings on books. I order many books and have dealt with no other store that has nearly the magnitude of improperly rated books. Do you happen to have a list of all the names under which they do business? If not would you be willing to share the complete list of those you know about? I appreciate your time and attention to my request. Thank you so very much.

[Moe Shinola]

10. KC Books for Prisoners

http://kcbooksforprisoners.wordpress.com/

Maybe a better book charity idea, if you're in the Kansas City area.