**For The AA Group** Bravenak Is Suspended

[freshwest]

Last edited Sun Aug 9, 2015, 05:02 AM - Edit history (3)

Check out the links, from oldest to newest. The last two are related to the Seattle event today:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=461603

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251466222

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251470024

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141170737

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251501953

I am angry and sad. At one of the latter threads in the list, Bravenak said she felt afraid. No one supported her feelings, not anyone.

EDIT:

Bravenak, enjoy school. I hope to see you near the end of October.

EDIT 2 : Since this OP was posted, she has gotten two more hides. So now her account is flagged.

Here is the thread with the two latest hides:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141170737

I guess one more can be found so she won't be able to come back until the 8th of December. By that time, she may have moved on to somewhere else. So we may never see here again.

[irisblue]

1. That really sucks

[emsimon33]

3. Off topic, but congratulations on your recent award!

[TreasonousBastard]

2. That sucks...

she's outspoken, but nothing to suspend her for.

[lunamagica]

5. So they got away with it

They can't have anyone bursting their bubble. They'd rather close their eyes and ears and stick to their "truth"

I'm sorry, Bravenak

[Skittles]

26. who is "they" ?

[lunamagica]

32. "They" who wanted to silence her. Look at her threads to see who they are. eom

[Skittles]

42. alert trolls?

[uppityperson]

6. That is really too bad. See you later, bravenak, best wishes to you

[GitRDun]

7. Absolutely stupid

DU NEEDS A TIME OUT!

[Starry Messenger]

8. This totally sucks.

50 white people swearing up and down that black radicals in Seattle are the paid tools of George Soros, and those people get to stay, while one Black poster gets swarmed and shut down for keeping it real.

[Agschmid]

10. Yup.

Fuck this shit.

[Lisa D]

17. +1000

[okasha]

19. It's a well-established pattern by now.

[NuclearDem]

30. After this, absolutely nobody ever gets to claim that Sanders supporters are persecuted on DU.

[Ed Suspicious]

37. Awesome logic, dude.

[Cha]

65. That's right.. because they never were.

[SunSeeker]

33. FYI--You got alerted on, I of course voted to leave it.

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

Mail Message



On Sat Aug 8, 2015, 09:41 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

This totally sucks.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1187&pid=20401

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

It's disruptive,offensive and inappropriate to make this a white vs black issue without any proof that those raising questions are only white DUers.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Aug 8, 2015, 09:56 PM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: If this post should be hidden, then so should a lot of others in this thread. For consistency
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Wow Bravenak has been flagged for review? Someone fix that immediately.
In researching this, I did get a bit of an education about the racist agenda of some Bernie supporters: I think it's important that people be able to educate on that instead of being labeled as "disruptive" and or banned. Perhaps if that weren't happening, this wouldn't be reaching the level of Bernie's events.

That said, NO HIDE. Hope the other jurors did some research as well.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I'm a white guy, with mixed feelings about St. Messenger, but don't feel offended by the comment. It seems to me like some alerter is trying to follow up Brave's suspension with an attack on the people who are unhappy about it.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I don't see how this post is disruptive. If you disagree with the assessment, reply, don't try to shut down the conversation.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[Starry Messenger]

34. Good gravy. !

Thank you SunSeeker. Lots of scrutiny in this forum, but little reading for understanding among the "concerned" alerters, I guess.

[SunSeeker]

39. Yes. Calling it "scrutiny" is very kind.

I can't say what I'd call it because I don't want to risk a hide.

[Number23]

51. All that alert did was shine some sunlight on this fucked up situation and which group is behind it.

So good job, alerter!

[Tarheel_Dem]

45. The invocation of "George Soros" should tell you everything you need to know about the group who....

went after bravenak & 1SBM. Soros is Public Enemy #1 for the rightwing. That his name is being invoked here to use as a bludgeon against the handful of black posters left, says all you need to know about "The Bern".

[Number23]

52. You nailed it. But DAMN, how many times did people tell bravenak THESE PEOPLE AREN'T WORTH

THE TROUBLE?? How many times??

How many times did these people need to crap all over her, twist and distort her statements before she just stopped -- like all the rest of us have?? I TRULY cannot even remember the last time I did an OP in GD or the various iterations of GD-P. This place and these people are NOT WORTH THE TROUBLE.

I am beyond pissed about her suspension. SEVEN HIDES. Goddamnit, she only had three hides like two weeks ago! This is COORDINATED and what gets me is that these people are NOT WORTH IT. This entire situation could have been avoided if she could have realized that she is dealing with libertarians that don't care about her or her issues and stopped trying to rationalize and 'educate' these people.

#BLM will go on. And I will support them as I always have and I suspect that bravenak will too. Suspended from here or not. Truth be told and I have told her this many times, I hope she takes her passion and her wit and her beautiful mind and gives this place the deuces. I don't know if I mentioned this or not already but THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT WORTH THE TROUBLE.

[Tarheel_Dem]

55. Yup. Our "allies" haven't figured out yet that this ain't the 1960's, and BLM ain't SNCC.

Remember when this sort of activity was celebrated here at DU? If ever there were "allies", I would have thought Barack & Michelle Obama certainly qualified, but they've both been heckled by "activists", and they were roundly applauded for it by DU.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027058753#post8

Bravenak fell victim to those seeking revenge for BLM & BS' lack of support in this community. She'll be okay, as will BLM. There's a reason why BS can't climb out of the single digits in terms of minority support. And the viciousness hurled at BLM & anyone who supports them is OTT.

I sat on a jury for a post that challenged BLM to go disrupt a Klan rally, and leave this 73 y.o. soft target alone. Can you believe that? Thankfully, four other jurors agreed that it was racist and OTT. Frankly, I was shocked it got hidden, it must be the time of day.

Besides being homo sapien, I have absolutely nothing in common with that group.

[Surya Gayatri]

61. You said it better than I ever could, N°23. Amen to this...^^^

Courage Bravenak!

Looking forward to your return.

[Starry Messenger]

60. It's straight out of tea-bagger territory.

Last edited Sun Aug 9, 2015, 08:37 AM - Edit history (1)

Some folks aren't going to leave one bell unrung in their race to be as vile as possible.

I'd love to say more, but evidently the free speech advocates are looking for people on their list to silence, without any hint of irony, as usual.

[Tarheel_Dem]

62. I understand. We may all be keeping a lower profile these days.

[Cha]

66. Well said, Starry.. and I just read they couldn't handle your post either for keepin' real.. too

bad their little alert shut down system didn't work that time.

[mcar]

69. Exactly

So much inflammatory nonsense is allowed to stand and bravenak gets silenced.

[Warpy]

9. "Flagged for review"

I hope whoever reviews it realizes a bunch of whiners got lucky with narrow jury votes.

All those hides were 4-3.

I hope she's back soon, she and 1SBM keep me honest.

[Agschmid]

11. She will be un flagged shortly.

But she won't be able to post until the end of
October.

[totodeinhere]

38. Can the admins override this and allow her to continue to post?

n/t

[Tarheel_Dem]

46. They can, but Skinner says he doesn't overturn jury verdicts. I think he should in this case.

[Warpy]

81. Yeah, all close votes and on posts

that never should have seen an alert.

DU has seen an influx of thin skinned bullies lately who can't stand honesty.

I get a little too much honesty, I'll stomp around, throw pillows, swear a blue streak, but I don't alert because eventually I realize the truth can be damned unflattering from time to time.

I don't get these little wimps who alert on anyone who might disagree with their august positions handed down from on high.

[Tarheel_Dem]

82. The current jury system has become a tool of censorship & personal vendettas. I understand...

Skinner's reluctance to address it, because it might mean decreased traffic. But, there has to be a better way.

[Warpy]

83. It has and it's horrible, it's allowed a few bullies a great deal of power

especially with the 5 hides and suspension policy. There has got to be a system of review by board moderators in that case. Some people are being targeted and it's obvious.

As a funny aside, as I clicked on your reply, I was tapped to be on a jury. My reply to the alerter was a little on the scathing side. I might be gone next.

[Agschmid]

67. They can but they won't.

I get it, if you were to overturn this one why not another? Even if the juries aren't fair admin should be.

[emulatorloo]

74. Admin needs to step up and start banning these race-baiting 'progressives'

I don't care how many recs or how much site traffic these too-big-to-fail fake progressives generate for DU. If admins care about the integrity of this site, they know what they need to do.

[sheshe2]

12. Thank you fresh.

I love bravenak.

[Lisa D]

13. Damn, we need her voice at DU.

But some wanted to silence her.

[ismnotwasm]

14. Hey Bravenak

You're an inspiring and courageous woman. And you did tell them.

[SusanCalvin]

15. Oh no.

I've only participated in one of those threads, it would appear. Going to look at the rest of them now or more probably in the morning. This is such a mess, but even so I can't imagine bravenak saying anything that would warrant this.

[gollygee]

16. :(

She won't be back till late September? Very sad Her voice is needed here.

[freshwest]

18. Earliest hide was July 21st? So that makes 90 days to September 21st?

Or maybe October 21st? So it may be even longer?

No calendar to use here right at this moment. Not good at this stuff anymore.

She may not even return.

[Agschmid]

25. October, if at all.

[freshwest]

31. Yeah, that's it. I'll miss her wisdom, graciousness and spirit. DU is losing the best. n/t

[stone space]

56. There seems to be a concerted effort to make the 90 days start on August 8.

I don't know how else to explain 4 hides in one day.

They are just one hide short of doing so, and may yet succeed, so long as she has posts that have not been left standing for 24 hours, yet.

The threshold for hiding has obviously been set very low for her, so pretty much any unexpired post should do.

[BainsBane]

20. I am so angry and ashamed

I can't event express myself, not just about Bravenak but about everything going on here. I find it incredibly disturbing.

Bravenak gave so much, tried so hard to explain to them, and they censored her. It's utterly shameful.

[sufrommich]

22. This. nt

[Bobbie Jo]

21. The bully mob strikes again

Fuck this.

They're making complete asses of themselves and continue to wonder, why Bernie.

Unbelievable.

[William769]

23. This is what I said earlier about her and it still stands true today.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110713486

[Cha]

29. Thank you again for that appreciation thread for bravenak, William.. it's Wonderful for

our friend!

[Live and Learn]

24. I am sorry to read this. I hope she is back soon. nt

[shenmue]

27. She is right

[Cha]

28. I'm going to miss you, brave.. quite the send off.. they can't handle the truth so they try

and shut you up.



Mahalo for your thread, fresh~

[MuseRider]

35. Oh no.

I really like her, she is honest and brave and thinks rather than just reacts.

Bravenak, I hope you can see this. Hurry back as soon as you can. I will miss your posts. You educate me and I so appreciate it. It is so easy to get stuck in a privileged little bubble but posters like you make it easy to see so it can be assessed and put away. Thank you for that.

Enjoy less frustration while you are away. Be well until we see you again.

[JI7]

36. fuck that, a bunch of cowards

[blackspade]

40. That's bullshit.

Alert stalking is the worst.
She did have support, but she speaks with her own voice.
She drops her own hammers when necessary.

[DonCoquixote]

41. OK, so

the privileged who have the luxury of fighting over whether Bernie or Hillary will support their majority based vanity got themselves a trophy. With all due respect to Cecil the Lion, this is worse. One bunch of privileged fools goes to Africa and shoots an nimal, the other side still maintains the right to treat Africans like targets.

And to any Hillary types that were using BLM to their ends, knowing Hillary will be nice and hidden till the Halloween candy is in stores, I say this: some BLM may have been pawns, but there are those who will gladly be able to attack Hillary with all the material she has given them. I really look forward to seeing what happens if sometimes tries to disrupt a Hillary rally.

BY the way, Bravenak...to quote 2pac, keep your head up. The battles are lost, but the war is ours to win. The 21st century is not going to be kind to majorties that try to cling do their old privileges.

[DonCoquixote]

43. Let's state the facts

The Jury system is a JOKE!

Whether you are a feminist like Seabeyond, and AA voice like Bravenak or 1 strongblackman the truth is, Juries do stalk, they do game the system, and they do so in the name of dominating others. I am sick and tired of seeing people publish things that truly belong in freeperville, yet they get shot up to the greatest page, but anyone who dares suggest this this party has to become a party OF THE PEOPLE, including those who have been cast aside, gets slammed.

Now I have argued with both Seabeyond and Bravenak, so please do not think this is about kissing feet. The internet is a place where ideas are exchanged, not just to reinforce the same ideas you had. And if the folks who hide behind that epic badge of courage called "no explanation given" think we do not see them for what they are, then they are fools.

Just remember, all those fine "Reagan Democrats" that are having a beer at Discussionist now, sooner or later, you good buddy that was slapping you on the back and cheering you on about those uppity types will reveal that all along, they considered you just like us, and that they plan to bury you in the same shallow graves you helped dig for us. The one consolation is that we will not be there to hear you whine and ask for help as your good friends push the dirt over your faces.

[AndreaCG]

44. Some sanders supporters are fanatics

Not all of course. But some can't seem to abide anyone who isn't in complete lockstep with them. The irony is Bernie isn't that way, although I didn't read all the BLM threads so don't know how he reacted to the protest.

[jwirr]

47. Very sorry about that. She was extremely upset the last time BLM protested Bernie and I saw a

little of her posting tonight. She seemed even more upset. I hope she is going to be okay.

[Tarheel_Dem]

48. She didn't toe the line, so she had to be dealt with. n/t

[lovemydog]

49. I love bravenak.

One of my favorite people here. Smart, funny and compassionate.

Enjoy school bravenak. See you soon!

[F4lconF16]

50. Damn.

DU has censored one of their best--if not the best I've seen in my time here. And they've done it wrapped neatly in overt bigotry with a big ol' bow on top.

K&R

[steve2470]

53. aw this makes me sad

Bravenak, you've done your best to educate people. Enjoy your time off, and if you come back, just post your insights in AA. Any white person who gives a damn can come here and read. Yes, these alerts are f*****d up.

[Number23]

54. DU continues to be a beacon for liberal thought and action and an inspiration to the entire Internet

A Yahoo! comments section with better coding and less diversity.

Fuck this place.

[Depaysement]

57. She was ridiculous

Whitesplain? Sanders supporters are white supremacists? Please.

Still, no one should be banned because a jury votes your posts down a few times. Your voice should not be silenced, particularly when that voice, however misguided, comes from seeing AA men grossly beaten, gunned down, hunted like animals in living color, by blue gangs of trigger-happy killers.

[Coolest Ranger]

58. Because of what happened to her

and because of how I am seeing DU treat the BLM people. I'm going to stop posting for a while on DU. I have spent the last 24 hours trying to get non people of color to understand why folks like myself are strongly support what the BLM people are trying to do. It breaks my heart to see so many anti BLM threads on DU this weekend that it has turned me completely off from even wanting to post. I'm starting to get sour on debating people any more.

For the first time in my life I feel like I have a target on my back now. I do not feel safe posting on Democratic Underground any more. Every time I have tried to get someone to understand what it is like to be black in the USA in 2015, I just feel like I am talking to a brick wall and then to come back on here and find out one of my favorite posters can't post anymore? All I can think of is the movie 1984.

1984 is real here in 2015. So until I see improvement towards the BLM people and black people in general, this is my final post on DU. I just don't feel safe in participating in politics any more. I just can't. Sorry everyone.

[riversedge]

77. my best to you

In solidarity

[SidDithers]

59. That's fucking ridiculous...

GD: P has become the fringe left version of Discussionist.

And now the Bernie fans have latched onto BAR to justify their vitriol directed at BLM.

I'm sorry, Bravenak.

This situation is really fucked up.

Sid

[Gothmog]

63. Four hides on one day

Wow. That is horrible.

I enjoy Bravenak's posts and will miss her

[greatauntoftriplets]

64. bravenak speaks the truth.

Obviously, the truth hurts.

[brer cat]

68. Angry and sad also, freshwest.

Disgusted as well. There is no getting past the fact that the AA group is being targeted and silenced with bogus hides. If DU cannot hear the truth and must resort to censorship, then this cannot be considered a liberal or progressive site.

Bravenak is one of the most courageous and truthful posters on DU and we will be greatly diminished by her absence.

Sending my love and respect to bravnak if she is reading.

K&R, freshwest, with a heavy heart.

[Zenlitened]

70. White fragility "wins" again.

And, yes, I'm white. But not so fragile, not any more at least.

Still somehow amazed, though, by the reflexive racism of way too many white people when our feelings get a little bit hurt.

Our easy, instinctive willingness to weaponize our privilege and start blasting away at anyone who dares to speak a different point of view.

It's shameful. Toxic, dangerous, and utterly unfair and wrong.

Bravenak, I'm sorry you're having to endure all this. White liberal racism and white conservatism have far more in common than anyone will ever concede. As your mistreatment here makes plain to see.

[Starry Messenger]

71. Nailed it.

By the way, potential alerters in this forum-- today is the 1 year anniversary of the shooting of Mike Brown. Maybe some people could lay off mashing the alert button on posts about racism and white supremacy for 24 hours?

Otherwise it tends to reinforce bravenak's point, even though you've silenced her.

[SusanCalvin]

73. ^THIS^

Thank you for adding a new phrase to my vocabulary - it will be very useful, since it describes something I see all the time.

[gwheezie]

72. Terribly unfair treatment of brave

This is the response AA activists encounter from white liberals on a smaller scale. Any white progressive with an inclination towards self reflection should be smacked upside the head by the treatment of AA posters on this board. And this is the alledged dem board full of progressives. Can you imagine?
I know Bernie supporters will just blow me off because I have stated I support Hillary at this point but supporting Hillary for me is choosing the least offensive dem. I'm not impressed with any of them. To me its irrelevant however who I support because I don't think anyone of them has made a case for why black folks should vote for them. If you look at Bernie or Hillary, both with a decades long record what has either of them done that changed the lives of black folks in this country.
I remember years ago talking with one of my white liberal friends who was disturbed over the million man march because it seemed anti white. I said if the level of violence was happening in the white community we would be marching. We'd be yelling and screaming and disrupting.
My bff is a gay black man, former military and small c conservative. Smartest person I know. If anyone wants to walk around Washington DC go with this guy. He knows everything. For years we've talked about what is wrong with white liberals. Sure liberal policies have inched the country forward but they have not corrected the injustices that this country was founded on and persist today. His thought is the wait and be patient attitude has not benefitted black folks and if anything lulled people into complacency. The policies even by liberals have not set free poc, the policies have not liberated the full potential of a group of people, like the myth of this country promises. Policies both considered pro or con have not resulted in a truly equal playing field. We can debate if one side is evil or good to make ourselves feel better or think we've done enough. In the lives of people who live in their skin every day, pointing to some position a white liberal takes doesn't help much. And it is not a class or economic thing, it is about race.
I'm going to avoid the tedious primary brawl because this has nothing to do with Bernie and Hillary. I will miss brave so much. She has helped me as well as many of you in this group to understand race issues better. I thank brave and y'all so much.

[TexasBushwhacker]

75. Well that is just fucked up

I've been alerted once in my 13 years on DU. I serve on juries and will continue to. Short of personal attacks, I generally say "leave it" because, frankly, I think we're all adults and are competent to defend our beliefs and express our opinions.

There is NOTHING that screams "troll" about Bravenak. If she pisses some people off, so what? I may not agree with her every single time (and I'm white FTR) but that doesn't mean she should be SILENCED. If she her posts were consistently offensive TO ME, I would personally ignore her, not try to silence her to everyone

[George II]

76. Four hides within minutes of each other - someone apparently has a vendetta going on.

Maybe since the account has been flagged it'll be humanly reviewed and some of those hides will be determined to be what they are - ludicrous.

[MADem]

79. Maybe the alerters/pilers-on will be given a vacation from the jury process.

That would be fair.

One can dream, I guess.

[MADem]

78. Why are people so afraid of a contrary opinion?

I hope the admins look at that entire process and correct it. It's obvious that she has been targeted and it's not right.

The admins don't like to do that reversal thing, ordinarily, but in this case, it is called for. I seem to remember that a guy who called the POTUS a piece of shit used car salesman got tossed for threatening a member, and then was allowed back--so exceptions have been made in the past. Also, I would hope that the admins have a look at the alerter(s?) because it's pretty clear that this was "targeting." Post 75 alone is an outrageous abuse of the system. That observation gets hidden, but there's no DU "offense" over a response of "BULLSHIT?" I'll bet anyone telling a Sanders supporter "bullshit" would last about a half-minute.

The response to the hidden post at 138 is even worse--she's told there that she's mentally unstable, and has "gone over the edge." Generic comments are being met with personal insult, but the generic comments are getting hidden, and the personal insults are not. What's up with DU's priorities?

Just. Not. Fair.

And it's obvious.

[kwassa]

80. This is totally fucked up and wrong.

[JustAnotherGen]

84. Amen!

When I seethe proximity of the hides - that was a concerted effort.

My response? Let's give hem hell. We need to start recruiting young AfAm to the site. Strength in numbers.

[Hekate]

85. KnR

Thanks for the update, freshwest.

For DU--->

[BumRushDaShow]

86. Sigh.

But not unexpected. Speak out and be silenced.

[sheshe2]

87. Thanks for your Op, freshwest.

I am going to miss you sweet, bravenak. you are one of our best and brightest.

I will stop by FB to say hi to you.

Luv ya girlfriend.

[octoberlib]

88. This makes me incredibly sad.

I haven't been on DU much and completely missed a lot of this.