'Gay' or 'queer'? On Twitter, the word debate rages on

[Behind the Aegis]

As we’ve covered before, some gays aren’t fans of the word “queer”… and some queer folk aren’t so hot about the word “gay.” The two words aren’t as synonymous as homophobes would have you believe, but that hasn’t stopped those bullies from slinging both words as slurs.

Twitter user @CoolRiderr recently sparked a debate over the two terms on Twitter, tweeting on January 5, “Quit calling gay people queer, we don’t like it.”

Television writer Bryan Fuller, mastermind of the TV shows Pushing Daisies and Hannibal, was one of the famous figures who responded. “Queer is an inclusive word—that is the reason toxic white gay jocks don’t like it,” Fuller tweeted (in all caps, for emphasis).

Preston Mitchum, Director of Advocacy and Government Affairs at The Trevor Project, observed that the “we” in @CoolRiderr’s post “is doing a lot of work.”

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[hlthe2b]

1. I'll be interested in LGBTQ DUer's thoughts on this... n/t

[NullTuples]

12. Everything I've read/seen/discussed indicates it's mostly generational

Younger people use "queer" to be more inclusive. And, to recognize that typically white, cis, gay men for decades used their intersectional privilege to shape LGBTQ equality efforts to suit their needs more than others under the larger umbrella - think Joe Solmonese (though I doubt most of the younger "queer" kids even know who he is/was or have even heard of UnitedENDA).

Old gay men (and a few not so old ones!), on the other hand, want & need a term that can be used to refer to themselves only, especially when the issues at hand pertain to their lives. Gay is the "G" in LGBTQ.

"LGBTQ" however, is often seen as too cumbersome and not inclusive enough - and adding more letters only invites ridicule. So, younger people use "queer" as a reclaiming of the word, as a term that flows off the tongue much easier than a list of consonants, and because they're proud to invoke the original meaning of the word before it was applied to LGBTQ people, which was essentially, "different, unexpected". They are pushing back against the very conservative, very Christian idea that everyone needs to conform to a single societal standard to be recognized as equal members of society.

[irisblue]

2. Lesbian, Lezzie, Dyke, Femme, Queer, Woman Loving Womyn

[Layzeebeaver]

3. I'm straight male, but...

“is doing a lot of work.”

what is this saying?

I've friends who are across the spectrum. they seem to forget the terms, and are comfortable in themselves and around others.

Why do we "as a society" keep finding ways to separate and isolate?

Fuck this shit - can we just let people and souls live as the wish?

We are all little stars that hope to shine even just a twinkle - lets stop snuffing them out.

[NullTuples]

11. It means when he said "we", "I" would've been more suitable. He was making a claim...

...larger than he could support in order to make it more credible. It's a rhetorical technique. So, "we" was not only the subject of the sentence or phrase, but also having to "do the extra work" of implying his position was universal or nearly so.

It's entirely possible that he was referring to his local subculture - perhaps he avoids being friends with people who feel differently and thus felt justified using "we" as to him, his whole world really does feel the way he does.

[Layzeebeaver]

18. Fair enough and a good observation

Thanks for that!

[underpants]

4. I doubt I'd have ever used "queer" because *I* see it as derogatory based on when I was a kid.

We played a playground game called “Smear the queer”. Basically it was football but with one person running and avoiding everyone else. Eventually someone gets ahold of him and a mass of people would pile on or they throw the designated thing that made them the target and someone else would pick it up and run. I know that was a long time ago but to me it stands out how positively drastically things have changed.

[hlthe2b]

6. Yes, I will never use the term for that reason. But, it is not my

opinion that matters in this-- being heterosexual I don't believe I have a stake nor the right to push my opinion on those who do.

That said, with respect to a similar issue that DOES impact me, women who think they are so "evolved" as to try to push the "c" word on me or other women in my circle better be prepared for a WWIII-level eruption/reaction-- because it WAS used against me and other women of my generation to intentionally diminish and harm us in the workplace. It isn't cool, it doesn't matter if the Brits use it differently, and it is never going to be 'reclaimed' if I have anything to say about it. FAAFO (yes, I am serious).

[underpants]

7. Strange Currencies

It’s an REM song but use it otherwise. If someone tells me something offends them - got it ✅. I have more information. C and Q are not anything I use because I know what it means to people. If people still use words they know offends the listener then there’s a cost, an exchange of some sort of currency between that person and the other person. I don’t need the interpersonal expense nor the hassle.

[NullTuples]

13. I read the name of that game & it took me back.

For a time in early elementary school I went to a catholic grade school. The playgrounds were paved, so falling or being piled on resulted in scrapes and bruises that lasted. And when a ball was involved, it was an old-school hard tetherball, minus the rope. The kind that had a hard plastic loop that protruded from the top. The playground was walled in on three sides, so whoever was the target (typically me or one of two other kids) was boxed in.

I use "queer" in support of the way the younger generation has reclaimed it as a matter of Pride, but if someone objects I try not to use it further in that conversation as they've told me it hurts them to hear it.

[hunter]

16. I was called "queerbait" in middle and high school and frequently beaten bloody by bullies.

I quit high school when I was sixteen because of that.

These days I'm still a bit queer but it seems there's nobody in my daily life who has the cajones to call me that in a derogatory fashion.

I have heard it as a compliment, or so I choose to believe.

[Tree-Hugger]

5. Queer has made a strong comeback

Queer is an extremely popular word among Gen Z LGBTQIA+ community and is in frequent use by millennials and older folk. Most "older" folks like myself (GenX) in my groups use it. I remember a lot of talk back in the 90s among teens and 20-somethings about taking the word back. Just in my own experience, the show "Queer as Folk" gave a boost to that in the late 90's/early 2000's.

There's a generational divide, but in my day to say life with LGBTQIA+ folks in all age groups, it's an accepted word with positive connotations. I do not see that changing and I don't see the use of that word within the community going away anytime soon.

I think for a lot of younger folk, the understanding and acceptance of sexuality and gender identity along a spectrum has made "queer" an easy word to describe themselves. For instance, rather than constantly breaking down that you are bisexual, gender fluid, and Demisexual you just say "queer." It lacks the stigma that some of us experienced back in the day and I truly do not see the younger set changing in that regard at all.

Summary - I remember when it wasn't a happy word. I remember folks wanting to take the word back. I've watched the generations after my own embrace it and use it fluidly. I personally use "Queer." Just offhand, I can't think of anyone in ny personal life or communities who do not use it these days.

[underpants]

8. I need to check with my daughter but don't use that word. That being said....

as the most milquetoast WASPy straight male I take the use of “queer” as not just taking the word back but throwing it back in the face of those who used it so negatively in the past. Sort of a “Well look who ended up winning” shove it in their face type thing. But that’s just my smart ass punk rockish F The Man General take on things.

[Pete Ross Junior]

9. Historically ...

"Gay" was our word. "Queer" decidedly not.

"Gay" was a code word because straights didn't know. Until they inevitably did.

"Queer" was the nastiest insult. Much worse than "faggot" and the rest.

[NullTuples]

14. I wonder if the shame of needing a code word is part of what the younger generations...

...refuse to bow to?

[David__77]

10. "Queer" isn't a term I identify with.

I recognize that my reactions are shaped by my own experience. Still, I don’t think I consider the term inclusive. Among non-heterosexual people, there’s a wide range of people with different relationships to and ideas about “traditional social relations”: “queer” seems to me principally signifying difference from traditional social relations.

[NullTuples]

15. That is correct! Younger people use it as an all-inclusive term that includes neurodiversity...

...asexuality, agender, and many other attributes that statistically tend to either be more prevalent in LGBTQ people - or our larger community just doesn't feel the need to conform as tightly to white, allocishet, patriarchal standards of conformity?

They don't seem to feel the need to draw quite as many distinctions between so many groups since we're all attacked for "refusing" to blend in as we once did (we didn't really, but we tried), and because it seems so many of those traits are non-exclusive & have large overlaps in the various populations of LGBTQ vs the allocishet larger society.

[vercetti2021]

17. This one is interesting

Queer like gender queer has been more prevalent nowadays. But like what defines transgender people? Many names...

Traps, trannies, she males, transvestites, lady boys...and one of my favorites futanari...

I prefer just trans myself. I've been called a tranny and trap from friends I have.