Israel/Palestine
Related: About this forumPalestinian village undergoing 'ethnic cleansing' by Israel
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/news/middle-east/19938-palestinian-village-undergoing-ethnic-cleansing-by-israelKhirbet Susiya, a Palestinian Bedouin village of an estimated 300 people, has been under imminent threat of demolition since May, when the Israeli High Court approved the demolition of villagers' tents and homes. One of the tents serves as a school.
"Demolishing the village reinforces that the Israeli settlers, who expropriated the land, are thieves," Al-Barghouti said in a press release. "This decision will not break the insistence of the village, which residents have previously rebuilt."
Al-Barghouti predicted that the destruction of the village would contribute to increasing international solidarity with the Palestinian cause.
2naSalit
(86,906 posts)that's been going on all over Palestine since the end of WWII. Time for that shit to end in favor of the real victims, the Palestinians.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)As opposed to the fake victims?
oberliner
(58,724 posts)What exactly did you mean by that comment. Please clarify.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)is that the Palestinians who are being oppressed, dispossessed, and distressed by Israel's actions are the real victims. The Palestinians have lost nearly 90% of what was Palestine because of European colonialists making decisions about the Middle East, as well as the theft of land by the Israelis that has intensified since 1967.
Hope that helps to clarify.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Do you characterize the Ottoman Empire as Palestinians or as European colonialists?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Do you consider the Balfour Declaration to be the work of a European politician?
Do you consider the Sykes-Picot Agreement to be the work of European politicians?
Do you consider England and France to be among the group of European countries that practiced and benefitted greatly from colonialism?
Do you consider that European colonial powers SHOULD have had the legal right to take away land that was lived on and occupied for thousands of years and decide to create a homeland for a people that had been persecuted and killed by those same European colonialists?
Have you seen the many maps that graphically show how the Palestinian territory that is controlled by the Israelis has grown from 1948 to the present?
Have you read any stories about continuing Israeli theft of Palestinian land?
Yes to the first three.
No to number four, but that didn't actually happen.
Yes - those maps are BS. I've made numerous posts explaining why.
Here's one: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=330332
Yes - Israel should withdraw all the West Bank settlements as far as I am concerned.
Can you answer my question about the Ottoman Empire?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)So the Palestinians went from being controlled by one colonial power (The Ottoman Empire) to another colonial power (The British)
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)over another, or one group to seize such power?
I just think it is important to understand what the situation was before the British got involved.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Israel.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Just look at how much territory the Israeli flag flies over.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)perhaps you can come back to the reality of what I wrote.
Mosby
(16,406 posts)R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)But I understand why you believe it would.
Mosby
(16,406 posts)Is english a second language for you?
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Mosby
(16,406 posts)And straw dog is just a degenerate version of straw man used by people who don't know better.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)get back to the OP, my dear.
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/news/middle-east/19938-palestinian-village-undergoing-ethnic-cleansing-by-israel
The Secretary General of the Palestinian National Initiative Movement Mustafa Al-Barghouti said on Monday that the Palestinian village of Susiya is experiencing "ethnic cleansing" by the Israeli occupation.
Khirbet Susiya, a Palestinian Bedouin village of an estimated 300 people, has been under imminent threat of demolition since May, when the Israeli High Court approved the demolition of villagers' tents and homes. One of the tents serves as a school.
"Demolishing the village reinforces that the Israeli settlers, who expropriated the land, are thieves," Al-Barghouti said in a press release. "This decision will not break the insistence of the village, which residents have previously rebuilt."
Al-Barghouti predicted that the destruction of the village would contribute to increasing international solidarity with the Palestinian cause.
shira
(30,109 posts)1. No one proposed taking away land. The Partition Plan wouldn't have taken land from anyone. It would lead to 2 nations having their own sovereignty. No one would have to move away or lose their land illegally.
2. Those people persecuted and killed by Europeans are indigenous to Judea. That's why we're called Jews.
Am I right to assume that you deny Jews are a nation/people indigenous to the land? You don't believe in the rights of indigenous people (Jews) to self-determination there?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)1) The partition plan did not formally call for the dispossession of the Palestinian people. But that was the result, and the intended result by the Jewish terror gangs that used extreme violence to drive out Christian and Muslim inhabitants of Palestine.
2) As to the "indigenous" argument, the First Peoples are and were indigenous to the Americas. Do you then suggest that all European colonizers, obviously non-indigenous to the Americas, be forced to leave the Americas?
As to your unnumbered question, there are and were many peoples who lived in Palestine/Israel. But one peoples self-determination cannot come at the expense of another's equally valid right.
shira
(30,109 posts)But you were talking about European colonial powers who had no right to take away land from Palestinians while giving it to Jews (who you do not see as indigenous). Let's stick to that argument first. You were wrong about that, correct?
Americans who have relatives going back centuries are not colonizers. They have rights of longstanding presence. Recent immigrants aren't colonists either, since the Americas have been sovereign for a while now. So you're wrong about that. Agreed? And my answer to you is "NO".
I agree & that's what 2 states are for. The vast majority of Jews (both left and right) believe in 2 nation states living side by side in peace. Do you believe there should be one majority Arab state after a full right-of-return?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)a theory accepted in law, does this mean that you also admit that the Palestinians have a similar right of longstanding presence?
As to your last question, define what you mean. There is far too much ambiguity in the question. To wit:
1) What are the boundaries of this hypothetical Arab state?
2) What are the rights of this Arab state?
3) "Right of return" meaning a right of return to lands previously occupied in all of historic Palestine?
Absent much more detail the question cannot be answered.
shira
(30,109 posts)a. Do you believe Jews are indigenous to Judea (Israel)?
1) What are the boundaries of this hypothetical Arab state?
2) What are the rights of this Arab state?
3) "Right of return" meaning a right of return to lands previously occupied in all of historic Palestine?
Absent much more detail the question cannot be answered.
My vision of 2 states is similar to the Clinton Parameters, Olmert's 2008 offer, and the Geneva Initiative. All different but basically the same result.
b. Do you think the Palestinians made the right choice in rejecting the 2000 and 2008 offers?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)is a complete withdrawal to the pre-1967 borders, and that includes Jerusalem as well. In addition, compensation for destroyed housing, businesses, and farms that occurred from 1967 through the present day.
shira
(30,109 posts)They say they'd accept land swaps.
Your argument is with them, not me.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The Palestinian Authority is not a tool of the US.
shira
(30,109 posts)sabbat hunter
(6,839 posts)not be included, as it was never supposed to belong to Palestine under any partition plan.
Additionally, I agree that Palestinians should be compensated for lost housing, etc. But at the same time jews who were forced to leave Arab countries after the formation of Israel should get similar compensation.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)I agree with your second paragraph.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)Mediterranean, or do you believe something else?
I personally believe that there should be no distinction between the rights of either group, but I'm not really sure where you stand...
shira
(30,109 posts)If you still believe in 1-state after a full right-of-return, then you're for Palestinian sovereignty and against that of the Jews.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)Do you think either ethnic group should be favored in the partition of the land into two states?
After all, one state would have the 8 million people it has today, and the other would have like, 10 million people. Logically, the more populous state would then also be the larger one, geographically.
This isn't a trick question, I'm just trying to figure out where we separate on this issue. I personally think that if if there was no right of return to Israel, but to the Palestinian state instead, then Palestine would be no more than an overcrowded rump state with its current size. That wouldn't really be fair, IMHO.
shira
(30,109 posts)So who are you to say they should be holding out for more land?
To answer you, I think Palestinians should at the very least be given the CHOICE to become citizens where they are if they live outside Israel, W.Bank, Gaza. That solves the overcrowding issue.
Do you believe they should be given the right to choose to be citizens where they are, like any other people in any other country?
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Last edited Fri Jul 24, 2015, 12:25 AM - Edit history (1)
in the first place.
shira
(30,109 posts)It appears you really are against nations giving Palestinians the CHOICE to become citizens in lands they were born in.
A right that every other people has.
Amazing.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)It's hysterical to watch the hyperventillation if those that can't handle the historical truth.
shira
(30,109 posts)...remain as refugees or become citizens in the lands to which they were born.
A choice all other people have.
Why the discriminatory attitude against Palestinians?
Riddle me that one.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)That's a question best left to apartheid Israel, it's right wing politicians, the indolent Israelis that voted them in and of course the hasbara machine that wants to push off the Palestinian refugee situation on others instead of accepting well-earned responsibility fir its actions.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Especially considering that the reason so many Palestinians live in foreign refugee camps is because they were terrorized into leaving Palestine.
shira
(30,109 posts)Further, it seems you agree with RDO in that Palestinians should not be given the choice, like all other refugees on the planet, to become citizens in the lands they're born in.
I'm not the one arguing for discrimination of Palestinians WRT denying them universal rights.
But you are doing that.
Now how am I wrong?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)in another country. Everything depends on the country, and the immigration laws of that country.
Many Semites are indigenous to the area known as Israel/Palestine. Some are Jews, some are Christians, some are Muslims.
shira
(30,109 posts)Apparently, you don't believe Palestinians have human rights throughout the rest of the Arab world, where they are denied basic citizenship for the crime of being born in those nations.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)the crime was being driven out of their homeland by the terror tactics of the Jews, followed by the terror tactics of the Israeli government.
shira
(30,109 posts)....in other lands.
Including Jews from all over the mideast.
You wish to deny Palestinians the same right all other people have, which makes your position decidedly anti-Palestinian. Not to mention discriminatory.
This is what I've come to expect from western so-called advocates of Palestinians. They're nothing of the sort. With friends like these, the Palestinians don't need enemies.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)and have also decided who is the guilty party.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)That doesn't seem fair to me.
shira
(30,109 posts)But I'll answer you:
That doesn't seem fair to me.
You're arguing with the Palestinian leadership, not me. They are the ones claiming to want only the W.Bank and Gaza strip. It seems you think they should hold out for more.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)topic of your post. Ethnic cleansing. Could it be because the term "ethnic cleansing" has such a negative tone? I must admit that terms like "ethnic cleansing", or "genocide", or "apartheid" are nasty terms. No nation likes to be associated with such terms, even though the terms may be accurate.
I will wait for a discussion, and an attempted rationalization, of this latest example of ethnic cleansing.
shira
(30,109 posts)Little Tich
(6,171 posts)Source: Jerusalem Post opinion
The fact is that the area occupied by the squatters has only served as grazing land.
On July 16 the daily press briefing of the US State Department astonished legal circles in Israel.
In response to the second question, preceded only by an inquiry on the Iran agreement from which Israel is still reeling, State Department spokesperson John Kirby with a prepared statement pressured Israel not to enforce demolition orders against an illegal Arab encampment adjacent to the Jewish community of Susiya. The State Department took this stand despite the fact that these demolition orders had been confirmed by Israels High Court in May 2015 after decades of appeals.
The Israelis were astonished for two reasons. One, the State Department was apparently misinformed about basic facts of the case. Two, the statement appears to be an arrogant attempt to undermine the Israeli legal system, including its universally respected High Court.
The High Court found that these assertions were demonstrably false, based on comprehensive objective historical and geographical accounts. Historical aerial photography, detailed mandatory maps, travelogues from the 18th and 19th centuries, and the population registry all established that their assertions were a fabrication. Fact: no such village ever existed. The High Court has ruled repeatedly against these false assertions (HC 7530/01, 430/12, 1556/12, 1420/14).
Read more: http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Comment-The-invention-of-the-village-of-Susiya-409861
Note: Regavim is a right-wing hate group that uses legal means to demolish Palestinian housing and evict Palestinians from their lands. They are very involved in trying to remove Susiya.
shira
(30,109 posts)This in particular:
It's well known how liberal/progressive Israel's Supreme Court is. They're not basing their decisions on lies.
BTW, this is a good example of illegitimate criticism (and yellow journalism that's hostile towards a Jewish state). Just another day with more lies & more demonization. The narrative for this one is that the racist Jewish state is expelling Palestinians who've lived in Susiya since....forever. No mention of aerial photos, maps, and travelogues that prove their assertions false. Lies by commission as well as omission. Why would good, concerned "critics" do that?
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)shira
(30,109 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Because the village ever existed, no such village can ever exist?
There is no room for growth in the area?
Does this apply also to the many settlements that have sprung up since 1967, or does this situation only apply to non-Israelis?
Are settlers who set up all of the illegal settlements also considered squatters, or is the term squatters reserved for non-Israelis?
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)I just posted their opinion piece to illustrate the mindset of those who want Susiya removed. The answer to your questions is probably "no".
shira
(30,109 posts)So any source claiming otherwise is lying. That's important IMO.
Now why would these sources lie about the situation?
shira
(30,109 posts)Look up the definition of ethnic cleansing & compare that to evicting illegal squatters.
Then ask yourself why sources would use "ethnic cleansing" to describe what's happening here.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)It's all about removing an established Palestinian village so that its land can be appropriated by settlers. This is what apartheid looks like, and why Israel is hitting rock bottom in the eye of world opinion.
The current leadership of Israel is leading Israel down a dangerous path.
shira
(30,109 posts)....that include removing illegal squatters from state land.
The IDF actually does this to illegal settler outposts. Is that also ethnic cleansing & apartheid? Israel commits these crimes against humanity against Jews too?
Your argument is baseless.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Last edited Mon Jul 27, 2015, 12:15 PM - Edit history (1)
It's funny to watch you build these constructs that you demand others solve; as you sadly believe you have won your decrepit arguments.
BDS is growing stronger because of people like you.
So keep up the good work!
shira
(30,109 posts)Deal with it.
It's obvious you cannot justify or defend your ridiculously absurd allegations.
When you make an intelligent claim or argument, lemme know and I'll be the first to congratulate you. You do know what makes for an intelligent claim or argument, right?
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Speaking of which, you may encounter a fact someday. I wonder if you will notice.
shira
(30,109 posts)You see, ethnic cleansing has a certain definition, which you could easily look up. You could then supply a definition for it that applies to this situation.
But you can't, and to cover for that you come back with a 3rd grade insult & pretend that is an intelligent defense of your position.
Seriously, elementary level school children can defend their arguments better than you.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)move your ever elusive goal posts or cite useless stay after state the reality still remains the same.
Israel is an abusive apartheid state. It's proponents want to bury that fact. Some do it terribly and ignore the inexcusable for some weird gasbaga gold star they can wear on their foreheads.
Sorry, but that kind of bankrupt philosophy doesn't work, shira. If you could at least recognize that any country that wants to set up the majority as the only one that counts, at the expense of the minority, is inherently anti-democratic we could at least start a discussion.
See you when you return.
shira
(30,109 posts)That doesn't seem to bother you in the least.
It bothers me b/c it's clear incitement that will eventually lead to acts of hatred against Jews.
There is no room for growth in the area?
Does this apply also to the many settlements that have sprung up since 1967, or does this situation only apply to non-Israelis?
Are settlers who set up all of the illegal settlements also considered squatters, or is the term squatters reserved for non-Israelis?
Israel has acted upon destroying illegal settlements, did you know that? Do you support that? I know I do. Same situation.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)Source: Wikipedia
(snip)
Palestinian Susya, called Susya al-Qadima ('Old Susya') is a centuries' old village which written records attest the existence of from 1830. It is constituted of permanent cave homes. The construction the Israeli settlement in the neighbourhood of Palestinian Susya, called Susya Al-Qadime, their ownership of which land has been established in law, and which was located near the ancient synagogue, was decided by Israel and the World Zionist Organization in 1982, as part of 8 new settlements. In June 1986, Israel expropriated the village's residential ground for "public use", for an 'archeological park', evicting villagers from their homes and lands. The expelled Susyans settled in cave and tin shacks 500 metres away, at a site now called Rujum al-Hamri, to restart their lives. According to David Shulman, for some decades they were subject, to many violent attacks, and settler recourse to both civil and military courts, to drive them out. The BBC broadcast film of settler youths beating an old woman and her family with cudgels to drive them away from their land, in 2008.
Since then the local villages, like Palestinian Susya, have been losing land, and being cut off from each other, as the nearby settlements of Carmel, Maon, Susya and Beit Yatir began to be built and developed, and illegal outposts established. David Dean Shulman described the reality he observed in 2008:
Susya: where thirteen impoverished families are clinging tenaciously,but probably hopelessly, to the dry hilltop and the few fields that are all that remain of their vast ancestral lands.
The second expulsion took place in 1990, when Rujum al-Hamri's inhabitants were loaded onto trucks by the IDF and dumped at the Zif Junction, 15 kilometres northwards a roadside at the edge of a desert. Most returned and rebuilt on a rocky escarpment within their traditional agricultural and grazing territory. Their wells taken, they were forced to buy water from nearby Yatta. Israel sheep-herding settlers expanded their unfenced land use at Mitzpe Yair and the Dahlia Farm. According to B'tselem, by 2010 settlers were cultivating roughly 40 hectares, about 15% of the land area to which they deny access to the traditional Palestinian users of that area. Since 2000 Jewish settlers in Susiya have denied Palestinians access to 10 cisterns in the area, or according to more recent accounts,. and try to block their access to others. Soil at Susya, with a market value of NIS 2,000 per truckload, is also taken from lands belonging to the village of Yatta.
The third expulsion occurred in June 2001, when settler civilians and soldiers drove the Palestinians of Susya out, without warning, with, reportedly violent arrests and beatings, destroying their tents and caves, blocking their cisterns, killing their livestock and digging up their agricultural land. The settlers established a "Dahlia Farm" in the same year, and an outpost was set up on the archeological site. On Sept 26 of the same year, by an order of the Israeli Supreme Court, these structures were ordered to be destroyed and the land returned to the Palestinians. Settlers and the IDF prevented the villagers from reclaiming their land, some 750 acres. The villagers made an appeal to the same court to be allowed to reclaim their lands and live without harassment. Some 93 events of settler violence were listed. The settlers made a counter-appeal, and one family that had managed to return to its land suffered a third eviction. Land next to the Palestinian village of Susya was confiscated from the village of Yatta, from which a dozen local families had been expelled to make way on the pretext of archeological digs, according to one source. A major expansion of the new settlement began on 18 September 1999, when its boundaries expanded northwards and eastwards, with the Palestinian Shreiteh family allegedly losing roughly 150 more dunams.
According to B'tselem, the Palestinians that remain in the area live in tents on a small rocky hill between the settlement and the archeological park which is located within walking distance. According to Amnesty International, ten caves inhabited by Susya Palestinian families were blown up by the IDF in 1996, and some 113 tents were destroyed in 1998. Amnesty International also reports that official documents asking them to leave the area address them generically as 'intruders' (polesh/intruder). Most of the rain-catching water cisterns used by the local Palestinian farmers of Susya were demolished by the Israeli army in 1999 and 2001. A local Susya resident told Amnesty International,
'Water is life ; without water we cant live; not us, not the animals, or the plants. Before we had some water, but after the army destroyed everything we have to bring water from far away ; its very difficult and expensive. They make our life very difficult, to make us leave.'
(end snip)
Read more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susya
The information in the Wikipedia article seems to be at least in part corroborated by what's on the B'Tselem website, which has numerous items on the subject:
(Blog):State seeks to demolish about half of the village of Susiya before HCJ hearing (16 Jul 2015)
http://www.btselem.org/facing_expulsion_blog
Civil Administration maps Susiya residents fear imminent demolition ( 10 May 2015)
http://www.btselem.org/press_releases/20150510_civil_administration_mapping_susiya
Khirbet Susiya a village under threat of demolition (1 Jan 2013)
http://www.btselem.org/south_hebron_hills/susiya
Which side of the story are we to believe? The Israeli side or the Palestinian side?
shira
(30,109 posts)Little Tich
(6,171 posts)shira
(30,109 posts)....from 2013. Compare to 1999:
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)Source: B'Tselem, 1 Jan 2013
Read more: http://www.btselem.org/south_hebron_hills/susiya
I feel that the evidence given shows that Regavim is wrong (as always), and that I can't add more w/o repeating myself.
Toodeelo.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Humans are not bugs or dirt.
Not expressing any opinion on this specific situation. I just wish that, no matter which peoples are involved, who is right or who is wrong, who is killing and who is dying, that people,most especially politicians and media, would stop using such comfortable and hygienic words for mass murder, genocide, slaughter, etc.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)to avoid the OP yet do everything to vilify the Palestinians.
shira
(30,109 posts)Since your answer is certainly 'NO', then it's not ethnic cleansing in this circumstance either.
See how that works?
=====================
BTW, that directly addresses the OP.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)their presence is illegal and they should go back, every single one of them, to their own country. There are no legal settlements whatsoever.
There is no way that the rights of the civilian population under occupation can be somehow compared to the non-existent rights of the population transferred into occupied territory by the occupier.
There are like 600.000 thousand settlers now, and they have to go home now. They have no more rights than any other tourist to stay, regardless whether they arrived with the occupying forces or not.
It doesn't help that there is an apartheid system in the WB and EJ, where Israelis (Jews) have all rights and the Palestinians have no civil rights whatsoever.
shira
(30,109 posts)....in the W.Bank or Jerusalem.
I can't imagine anyone decent ever calling for a specific indigenous people (ethnic or racial) to be barred from any part of their historic & cultural homeland.
Can you?
================
BTW, it's not illegal. The UN can't even pass a resolution stating that it is.
In fact, point me to binding legislation showing settlement activity is illegal.
I'll help you out:
You can't. It doesn't exist.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)acquisition of territory by war...
shira
(30,109 posts)The problem is that Judea is neither exclusive or sovereign Palestinian land, and historically it never was. That land was administered by the Brits and before them, the Turks.
It's disputed land.
If it were sovereign Palestinian territory before 1967, you'd have a solid case for acquisition of territory by war.
Also, check out the 1964 Palestinian charter. The PLO doesn't make any claims to Gaza or the W.Bank. Their focus was 100% within the green line. Ask yourself why. Here's why: Palestinian leadership has never been interested in their own land as much as they have been against Jewish sovereignty in any part of that area. It's why the conflict persists. Anyone not intentionally blind knows this because that's all Palestinians see on a daily basis in the W.Bank and Gaza.
That's why there's no peace. The existence of a sovereign Israel within 1 square km is intolerable.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)shira
(30,109 posts)Or punt.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Your team is losing game after game.
I'd be really worried if I were you.
BDS.
shira
(30,109 posts)R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)oh, shira, BDS has got plenty, and it's coming to an apartheid state near and dear to your heart.
shira
(30,109 posts)In 2011, the UNSC failed to pass a binding resolution that would declare them illegal.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/02/18/un.israel.settlements/
Now that's a fact. They're not illegal. You know that. Hell, anyone objective knows that.
Hence, the utter depravity of the BDS movement. Keep pushing on, despite the lies....
Why? Hatred.
There is no Justice in hatred.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)I bet that really sticks in your craw. doesn't it?
shira
(30,109 posts)Even your favorite; the 'Apartheid' slander.
No major human rights groups say Israel is apartheid. No western countries say it. Only totalitarian fascist nations (themselves apartheid) claim Israel is apartheid, along with all the other racist hate drivel they peddle in order to control the masses. Like "illegal settlements", the UN can't even pass a resolution claiming Israel is apartheid. I'm not sure they've even tried, as it would be too embarrassing to justify such an idiotic resolution.
So you can't defend that one either, despite your clumsy attempts to mock and gloat.
You know this, I know this, and anyone objective reading this knows it.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)When you are obviously flailing, juggling and apparently hyperventilating with your nonsensical attempts at legitimizing illegal Israeli colonies, white washing the unquestionable form of Israel apartheid visited on Palestinians daily and further attempts by Israel to 'disappear' whole villages: inside and outside its borders.
Please take a bow, shira. I'm sure that all these efforts have won you some kind of award for inhumanities, myopia and defense of the indefensible, but don't expect any praise from me for it.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Show me a binding document "THAT THE STATE OF ISRAEL ITSELF WILL ACCEPT AS BINDING" stating settlers are illegal.
I added the extra wording because International Law is quite clear as to the illegality of an occupying power settling on occupied land. It is absolutely illegal. The only country that disagrees is Israel. The only people who disagree are generally apologists for Israel.
shira
(30,109 posts)....to pass a resolution making it illegal.
U.S. vetoes U.N. resolution declaring Israeli settlements illegal
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/02/18/un.israel.settlements/
So you're wrong & they're not illegal.
You've been deceived. In fact, every single anti-Israel source that makes this claim - along with the fictional right-of-return that also has no basis in IHL - is simply lying.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Last edited Mon Jul 27, 2015, 09:30 PM - Edit history (1)
"So you're wrong I win!" tantrums.
Keep on cherry picking shira.
You are a gift that keeps on giving.
Where would BDS be without the stalwart shepherds of 'wrong' like you?
Oh, and as always, thanks for the kick.
Response to R. Daneel Olivaw (Reply #85)
Post removed
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Last edited Tue Jul 28, 2015, 06:31 PM - Edit history (1)
Thing to watch.
No. Just laughing.
R. Daneel Olivaw
(12,606 posts)Just do it someplace else.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=109669