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Rep. Eric Swalwell NAILS Bill Barr with question he can't escape (Original Post) yuiyoshida Jul 2020 OP
They will argue he COMMUTED Stone he didn't pardon him. Slimy bastard Barr deserves prison. usaf-vet Jul 2020 #1
Nah. The commutation would be just as incriminating as a pardon if RVN VET71 Jul 2020 #2
Thanks for your informative answer. It should be obvious I am not an attorney. Thanks. usaf-vet Jul 2020 #3
I've heard the biggest difference is RVN VET71 Jul 2020 #4

usaf-vet

(6,181 posts)
1. They will argue he COMMUTED Stone he didn't pardon him. Slimy bastard Barr deserves prison.
Wed Jul 29, 2020, 08:50 AM
Jul 2020

They will argue he COMMUTED Stone he didn't pardon him. Slimy bastard Barr deserves prison.

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
2. Nah. The commutation would be just as incriminating as a pardon if
Wed Jul 29, 2020, 12:57 PM
Jul 2020

and it's a big if -- if the Attorney General had any intention of following the law, even (in this case) what he himself declared to be the law when asked about just such a situation during his confirmation hearing.

Stone and Trump could come out in public and admit, together, that the commutation was given as a reward for Stone's silence, They could do a song and dance -- complete with top hat and cane -- in front of the White House about it, do videos for Fox News viewers' eager and drooling consumption about how Trump could do anything he wanted because he was president, hoo-hah! And Barr would still do nothing because that's his job: to do nothing that would hurt this president or infringe on his right and power to do whatever ugly thing he wants to do.

Question to Barr: Do you think the song and dance, complete with top hat and cane, that Trump and Stone did in front of the White House and national news media cameras laughing about the quid pro quo including the lines:
Stone: There's no need for me to do repentance
Trump: Because I'll just commute his sentence!
Do you think that act is enough to warrant an investigation by your agency, especially considering that it was viewed by more than 15 million Americans, all of whom have registered shock and nausea about it?

Barr responding: I . . .I . . .hmmm. . . I was not aware of nor did I see this song and dance you're talking about.

usaf-vet

(6,181 posts)
3. Thanks for your informative answer. It should be obvious I am not an attorney. Thanks.
Wed Jul 29, 2020, 03:11 PM
Jul 2020

I was surprised he didn't just pardon Stone. So I wrongly assumed there must be some legal difference in the two.

P.S. As a former medic I can tell you how to treat a sucking chest wound. Or the use of a tourniquet. Hope you never need either one but...... pardons vs commutation are still out of my pay level.

RVN VET71

(2,690 posts)
4. I've heard the biggest difference is
Wed Jul 29, 2020, 05:04 PM
Jul 2020

Commutation still provides fifth amendment protections against self-incrimination while a Pardon, since it relieves the person of punishment for the crime(s) does not. (I think the idea is that a pardoned felon's incriminating testimony would not place that person in jeopardy so, by accepting the pardon, the felon would also waive the no-longer functioning protections of the Fifth.)

In other words, a pardoned Stone could still be called on to testify as to what he knows about Trump's criminality even if it meant admitting that he was directly involved in it.

A commutation takes away the punishment but does not relieve Stone of possible re-indictment. Thus, he could still just plead the fifth to stay out of the grasp of the law.

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