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EarlG

(21,934 posts)
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:56 AM Jan 2020

Pic Of The Moment: Trump's Defense Boils Down To "Abuse Of Power Is Okay -- If You're A Republican"



Laurence Tribe finds Dersh impeachment VIDEO from 1998: "It certainly doesn't have to be a crime"

Alan Dershowitz’s Old Comments About Impeachment Come Back To Haunt Him



22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Pic Of The Moment: Trump's Defense Boils Down To "Abuse Of Power Is Okay -- If You're A Republican" (Original Post) EarlG Jan 2020 OP
K&R Gothmog Jan 2020 #1
Kick! DesertRat Jan 2020 #2
K & R! Iliyah Jan 2020 #3
What happened to that guy? Piasladic Jan 2020 #4
I'd rather assume he was always this way. Same BootinUp Jan 2020 #15
Kick dalton99a Jan 2020 #5
Well, we certainly have a double standard here. PatrickforO Jan 2020 #6
Such a disgrace. calimary Jan 2020 #7
KNR N_E_1 for Tennis Jan 2020 #8
You nailed it. This is their true brand. JudyM Jan 2020 #9
Self styled "liberal democrat" Moral Compass Jan 2020 #10
I'd be curious to hear Dershowitz's excuse for this. yardwork Jan 2020 #11
You won't. maxsolomon Jan 2020 #12
Lonely for him in the Hamptons. yardwork Jan 2020 #13
Tiny violins maxsolomon Jan 2020 #14
It's because republicans think they are I_UndergroundPanther Jan 2020 #16
He is a fucking sell-out! He used to be liberal until the money became more important. Lowlife! nt Quixote1818 Jan 2020 #17
Yeah right... the founders were all Ok with abuse of power Ohioboy Jan 2020 #18
This makes no sense Shoonra Jan 2020 #19
DON'T GLORIFY THIS NUT JOB!! blakstoneranger Jan 2020 #20
There are two places I would look at when it comes to impeachment. Fortinbras Armstrong Jan 2020 #21
Great post I_UndergroundPanther Jan 2020 #22

BootinUp

(47,072 posts)
15. I'd rather assume he was always this way. Same
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:48 PM
Jan 2020

for Graham. Unless there is evidence to the contrary I am not aware of.

PatrickforO

(14,558 posts)
6. Well, we certainly have a double standard here.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:07 PM
Jan 2020

Party over country every time for guys like Dershowitz.

Moral Compass

(1,513 posts)
10. Self styled "liberal democrat"
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:12 PM
Jan 2020

Alan Dershowitz claims to be “liberal” Democrat. He uses this as a defense against accusations that he is totally a Trump creature.

What evidence is there to support this contention or is it as fictional as his reputation as a “constitutional scholar”?

maxsolomon

(33,241 posts)
12. You won't.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 02:00 PM
Jan 2020

He'll never be in any setting where he has to account for his hypocrisy. He'll never have to answer any hard questions on Fox, and he'll never appear anywhere else.

This is the mediascape we live in.

I_UndergroundPanther

(12,462 posts)
16. It's because republicans think they are
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 04:32 PM
Jan 2020

Aristocrats and are better than us.
They think they are rich and powerful by destiny.

You know the rich peoples psychosis.

They fear equality more than death.

Ohioboy

(3,238 posts)
18. Yeah right... the founders were all Ok with abuse of power
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 05:32 PM
Jan 2020



Isn't "abuse of power" what they were constantly trying to prevent? I'm thinking it's pretty much the whole reason behind and balance, and the 3 separate but equal branches thing they developed.

Shoonra

(518 posts)
19. This makes no sense
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 03:09 AM
Jan 2020

When the Founders used the words "high crimes and misdemeanors" as impeachable offenses, in 1787, there were no federal criminal statutes. The federal criminal laws didn't exist until two years later. That's one reason the Founders explicitly mentioned treason and bribery - two offenses for which statutes didn't yet exist but were easily recognized as wrongful acts. One thing we learned from Watergate was that impeachable offenses were whatever Congress decided, not necessarily something for which ordinary citizens could be jailed.

People who think only statutory crimes are impeachable offenses probably are not more numerous than the people who think the earth is flat.

 

blakstoneranger

(333 posts)
20. DON'T GLORIFY THIS NUT JOB!!
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 09:26 AM
Jan 2020

All he wants is a place in history. He simply want kids to read about him in the history books.

Fortinbras Armstrong

(4,473 posts)
21. There are two places I would look at when it comes to impeachment.
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 09:26 AM
Jan 2020

The first is William Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England from 1765. In Book 4, Chapter 9, "Of Misprisions and Contempts, affecting the King and Government", there is a section on "contempts or high misdemeanours"

of which: The first and principal is the mal-administration of such high officers as are in public trust and employment. This is usually punished by the method of parliamentary impeachment; wherein such penalties, short of death, are inflicted, as to the wisdom of the peers shall seem proper; consisting usually of banishment, imprisonment, fines, or perpetual disability. Hitherto also may be referred the offence of embezzling the public money, called among the Romans peculatus, which the Julian law punished with death in a magistrate, and with deportation, or banishment, in a private person. With us it is not a capital crime, but subjects the committer of it to a discretionary fine and imprisonment.4 Other misprisions are, in general, such contempts of the executive magistrate as demonstrate themselves by some arrogant and undutiful behaviour towards the king and government.


Chapter 10, "Of Offences against Public Justice" describes another set of offenses punishable by impeachment: the "negligence of public officers, entrusted with the administration of justice." Blackstone condemns, in strong terms, a particular "offence against public justice, which is a crime of deep malignity," and especially so because "there are many opportunities of putting it in practice, and the power and wealth of the offenders may often deter the injured from a legal prosecution." That offence is "the oppression and tyrannical partiality of judges, justices, and other magistrates, in the administration and under the colour of their office." All such offences against public justice could be prosecuted "by impeachment in parliament". Such misconduct was "sure to be severely punished" with penalties including forfeiture of office.

Again, in Chapter 19, Blackstone distinguished among "Courts of a Criminal Jurisdiction" and referred to the jurisdiction of parliamentary impeachment as concerned with “high misdemeanors” committed by high officials or peers:
For, though in general the union of the legislative and judicial powers ought to be most carefully avoided, yet it may happen that a subject, intrusted with the administration of public affairs, may infringe the rights of the people, and be guilty of such crimes, as the ordinary magistrate either dares not or cannot punish.


The upshot is clear: As a matter of English practice and authoritative commentary by the mid eighteenth century, impeachment embraced offenses involving official misconduct not necessarily punishable by the ordinary criminal law.

The second place I would go to is Number 65 of the Federalist Papers. Alexander Hamilton wrote

A well-constituted court for the trial of impeachments is an object not more to be desired than difficult to be obtained in a government wholly elective. The subjects of its jurisdiction are those offenses which proceed from the misconduct of public men, or, in other words, from the abuse or violation of some public trust. They are of a nature which may with peculiar propriety be denominated POLITICAL, as they relate chiefly to injuries done immediately to the society itself. The prosecution of them, for this reason, will seldom fail to agitate the passions of the whole community, and to divide it into parties more or less friendly or inimical to the accused. In many cases it will connect itself with the pre-existing factions, and will enlist all their animosities, partialities, influence, and interest on one side or on the other; and in such cases there will always be the greatest danger that the decision will be regulated more by the comparative strength of parties, than by the real demonstrations of innocence or guilt.

The delicacy and magnitude of a trust which so deeply concerns the political reputation and existence of every man engaged in the administration of public affairs, speak for themselves. The difficulty of placing it rightly, in a government resting entirely on the basis of periodical elections, will as readily be perceived, when it is considered that the most conspicuous characters in it will, from that circumstance, be too often the leaders or the tools of the most cunning or the most numerous faction, and on this account, can hardly be expected to possess the requisite neutrality towards those whose conduct may be the subject of scrutiny.


Hamilton clearly foresaw Moscow Mitch and his political shenanigans in this case. And he would not approve.

I_UndergroundPanther

(12,462 posts)
22. Great post
Fri Jan 24, 2020, 04:42 PM
Jan 2020

And it is obvious the founders knew a narcissitic assholes would abuse power. It's as plain as the nose on my face trump needs to be tossed out of office on his diapered ass. He needs to go away.

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