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LiberalLovinLug

(14,164 posts)
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 06:17 PM Dec 2019

Michael Moore Gives MSNBC's Centrist Hosts a MUCH Needed Reality Check



I didn't put it into the primaries forum, because its not about a specific candidate. Moore is addressing the MSM and talking in general, about how the center in American politics has moved, and how the press, even MSNBC, still lives in a world where they ignore the polls showing the majority of Americans are for more gun control, universal healthcare etc, and instead pretend those opinions only apply to some insignificant fringe left.

Okay, the host of the YouTube channel is an unabashed Bernie supporter, as is Michael Moore. So if that fact is too much to handle for some, just skip the hosts preface and go directly to the clip of Moore talking to these regular hosts. From :50 > 3:38. They simply cannot interrupt no matter how much they want to, because there is nothing they can argue with.

I love the capture he uses as the video screen. Those helpless expressions are priceless.

The MSM including MSNBC are so terrified of honestly representing the majority view of Americans as being the moderate one.
I'm not saying MSNBC does not do some great work. I don't know where we'd be without Maddow. But, especially when these Highly-paid commentators and politicians, get on these back-patting panels. they suffer from a lack of understanding, or refusal to understand, that the country actually wants what the more progressive candidates want too. That that is the new "moderate".

I predict another Moore invitational banishment.
54 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Michael Moore Gives MSNBC's Centrist Hosts a MUCH Needed Reality Check (Original Post) LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 OP
MSNBC works to help the Democratic Party, Michael Moore works to damage it Clash City Rocker Dec 2019 #1
Exactly! justie18 Dec 2019 #3
Early prediction validation. KPN Dec 2019 #4
Totally agree! redstatebluegirl Dec 2019 #11
If by "Democratic Party" you mean politicians who are funded by corporations ProfessorPlum Dec 2019 #20
If you want to spin the Democratic Party as some evil entity Clash City Rocker Dec 2019 #22
My party right or wrong eh? ihaveaquestion Dec 2019 #24
You may want to review the forum rules Clash City Rocker Dec 2019 #25
Thank you! True Blue American Dec 2019 #35
I think M. Moore is trying to help defeat Trump. ihaveaquestion Dec 2019 #48
WTF bonniebgood Dec 2019 #23
Define "the Democratic Party". guillaumeb Dec 2019 #29
+1. yonder Dec 2019 #42
++++ still_one Dec 2019 #30
K n R ! Thanks for posting! JoeOtterbein Dec 2019 #2
Right on, Michael Moore mudstump Dec 2019 #5
I appreciate Michael Moore. mountain grammy Dec 2019 #6
Last time I checked Chuckie Todd was jefe at MSNBC pecosbob Dec 2019 #7
Michael Moore is my kind of centrist. BuffaloJackalope Dec 2019 #8
Everything my homeboy said is absolutely correct Leith Dec 2019 #9
Thanks for that story. That's awful after such a tragedy LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 #41
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Dec 2019 #10
I turn MSNBC off anytime Michael Moore is on Gothmog Dec 2019 #12
Ugh, Moore is the biggest pusher of the 'poor widdle white working class' radius777 Dec 2019 #13
This is an ignorant and ugly post ProfessorPlum Dec 2019 #19
Spot on! RobertDevereaux Dec 2019 #14
Agreed - Michael Moore is absolutely right! Gumboot Dec 2019 #15
But when you tell them they're going to take home ten to twenty thousand dollars LESS Lock him up. Dec 2019 #16
look at the Russia stats RussBLib Dec 2019 #26
I don't think it's the average Joe Russian who's pushing the head of the Lock him up. Dec 2019 #52
Your chart appears to refute your point Fiendish Thingy Dec 2019 #27
I (in US) make right around average, and I don't 'take home' as high a % as represented there mr_lebowski Dec 2019 #33
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2019 #51
That's an average, so it's kind of not general, but I agree with Lock him up. Dec 2019 #53
Swapping the huge portion of my paycheck that goes to private insurance ... DBoon Dec 2019 #37
Must be nice being 'neutral' and thus having almost zero military as I assume the Swiss do not ... mr_lebowski Dec 2019 #38
The biggest hurdle is education on convincing Americans that health care would be cheaper LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 #44
I fully agree with that, but it's the convincing and then implementing part Lock him up. Dec 2019 #54
He's so right on. I'm so glad he's out there doing and saying to the public what I too believe. YOHABLO Dec 2019 #17
My Hope for the Democratic Party.... McKim Dec 2019 #18
MSNBC is corporate "news". Nuff said. Magoo48 Dec 2019 #21
Recommended. guillaumeb Dec 2019 #28
Who is Michael Moore? The guy who did all he could to beachbumbob Dec 2019 #31
No he's the award winning documentary film maker LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 #45
I turn the channel when MM is on. lynintenn Dec 2019 #32
Moore alerted that Trump could win 2016. I would take his insights seriously. Auggie Dec 2019 #34
There is a lot of Moore-bashing here. Is it because he warned us that Assface would win? CaptYossarian Dec 2019 #36
+1000 LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 #46
Thank you. MuseRider Dec 2019 #39
I agree LiberalLovinLug Dec 2019 #47
Love Michael Moore. Always thoughtful and interesting. scipan Dec 2019 #40
I predict another Moore invitational banishment. GOOD ! stonecutter357 Dec 2019 #43
I agree with Michael Moore janterry Dec 2019 #49
Moore does speak for middle cp Dec 2019 #50

Clash City Rocker

(3,390 posts)
1. MSNBC works to help the Democratic Party, Michael Moore works to damage it
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 06:21 PM
Dec 2019

I couldn’t care less what that jerk says.

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
20. If by "Democratic Party" you mean politicians who are funded by corporations
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 08:51 AM
Dec 2019

you are correct. If by "Democratic Party" you mean the party that lives up to the ideals and goals of FDR, you have it backwards.

Clash City Rocker

(3,390 posts)
22. If you want to spin the Democratic Party as some evil entity
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 09:44 AM
Dec 2019

Why are you on Democratic. Underground? This is a place for people who support the Democratic Party, not for those who wish to trash it.

Clash City Rocker

(3,390 posts)
25. You may want to review the forum rules
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 12:57 PM
Dec 2019
https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=termsofservice

Attacking the Democratic Party or members of the Democratic coalition, either from the right or the left, is forbidden. If you dislike the party, this may not be the right place for you. That’s all I’m saying.

True Blue American

(17,981 posts)
35. Thank you!
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:21 PM
Dec 2019

This is why the board is called,”Democratic Underground!”

I have noticed many boards being inundated with new posters. All Republican Trump supporters. Wonder why?

ihaveaquestion

(2,505 posts)
48. I think M. Moore is trying to help defeat Trump.
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 03:55 PM
Dec 2019

Take the criticism to heart or don't, but I don't think anyone should argue that he is trying to destroy the party.

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
29. Define "the Democratic Party".
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:12 PM
Dec 2019

IS AOC a Democrat?

Is Joe Manchin?

To take the one issue Moore focused on, the US healthcare system is ranked 37th for a reason. The only way to fix that is by removing the hold corporations have on what should be a human right. And that is single payer.

pecosbob

(7,533 posts)
7. Last time I checked Chuckie Todd was jefe at MSNBC
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 07:07 PM
Dec 2019

and the 'Political Director' of NBC News. Chuckie helps the Dems like having a case of the crabs.

Leith

(7,808 posts)
9. Everything my homeboy said is absolutely correct
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 07:52 PM
Dec 2019

I have a neighbor who retired from a major health insurance company about 3 years ago. She retired with full Medicare and retirees' insurance benefits.

When she still worked for them, she was adamant that insurance companies were the way to go and they weren't going anywhere.

Then, her husband died after a prolonged illness. Every day she got a new medical bill in the mailbox. It didn't take long for her to cry every time she went to get her mail. It took about 10 months to get paperwork straightened out - and she still had connections with high level people at the insurance companies.

She's not so gung-ho on insurance companies any more.

radius777

(3,635 posts)
13. Ugh, Moore is the biggest pusher of the 'poor widdle white working class'
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 08:33 PM
Dec 2019

narrative, conveniently ignoring it was they who ditched Dems over the issue of social justice (civil rights, women's rights, etc), into the arms of Nixon and then Reagan.

Moore likely dreams of the days when the Dem party looked more like him, a white guy in a hat, than like Joy Reid, an urban black professional. That isn't 'centrism vs leftism' but metropolitan diversity (current base of the Dem party) vs heartland whiteness (base of the old FDR/Dixiecrat Dem party).

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
19. This is an ignorant and ugly post
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 08:48 AM
Dec 2019

Moore wants the working class not to get screwed, and that includes whites and minorities. He's done more than nearly anyone on this board to try to help achieve this. He's done more than most Democratic politicians to help achieve this.

This is a classless post, made with either malicious intent or dumb ignorance of the man.

Gumboot

(531 posts)
15. Agreed - Michael Moore is absolutely right!
Thu Dec 5, 2019, 11:35 PM
Dec 2019

He's been a hero of mine since the days of Roger & Me, and he nails it 100% here.

Many thanks for posting, 'Lug!


Lock him up.

(6,920 posts)
16. But when you tell them they're going to take home ten to twenty thousand dollars LESS
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 03:54 AM
Dec 2019

on average each year, sick or healthy, is it another story?

RussBLib

(9,003 posts)
26. look at the Russia stats
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:04 PM
Dec 2019

$9480/yr pay (in US $'s) vs $8456 post-tax take home

Those are extreme poverty wages, and we're letting this punk-ass country (Russia) dictate our politics?

Lock him up.

(6,920 posts)
52. I don't think it's the average Joe Russian who's pushing the head of the
Sat Dec 7, 2019, 03:06 AM
Dec 2019

Russian mob (Putin) to do that. I think their elections are rigged and the dissenters eliminated.

The Russiablican cultists are too stupid to see what's going to happen to them if they keep protecting the orange anus.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,551 posts)
27. Your chart appears to refute your point
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:05 PM
Dec 2019

There are lots of countries where citizens get much more for their tax dollar, and keep a higher percentage of their earnings, than in the US.

Even those with a bigger tax bite get much more in services than the US.

 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
33. I (in US) make right around average, and I don't 'take home' as high a % as represented there
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:18 PM
Dec 2019

I also wonder if 'employee contributions to health care plans' are considered as 'take home pay' in this chart in countries (like US) where it's common for employees to contribute.

I could see it being counted thusly, inflating the apparent % that US citizens 'take home'.

Response to mr_lebowski (Reply #33)

Lock him up.

(6,920 posts)
53. That's an average, so it's kind of not general, but I agree with
Sat Dec 7, 2019, 03:20 AM
Dec 2019

SPHC. It's just that media-driven RW propaganda, like for instance, accusations of ''Socialism'' and ''radical'' seem not being countered loud enough (if at all) with, for example, ''far right'' or ''extreme right'' ...

Also, it's tough for progressive Dems who would want to establish SPHC to win the WH & both the House and Senate to pass and implement the system, taking into account what the insurance corporations would do to fight back (perhaps by going to the SC?).

It would take a massive number of people in favor of it in polls and marches in the streets on a constant basis IMHO.

DBoon

(22,340 posts)
37. Swapping the huge portion of my paycheck that goes to private insurance ...
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:24 PM
Dec 2019

... for a more cost efficient public health system would be an improvement I support.

I can spend $1000 for a private insurance company that will not answer the phone or respond to online questions, that hits me with surprise costs, and that won't cover ordinary expenses.

Or I can spend $990 in taxes for a public healthcare plan that does not spend huge amounts of effort trying to keep me from accessing healthcare I pay for.

When you only look at taxes, and do not consider direct out-of-pocket and pretax payments to private insurers, you are inherently making a right wing libertarian argument that all taxes are bad and all expenditures to private entities are good.

 

mr_lebowski

(33,643 posts)
38. Must be nice being 'neutral' and thus having almost zero military as I assume the Swiss do not ...
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:28 PM
Dec 2019

Someone correct me if I'm wrong on that point ...

LiberalLovinLug

(14,164 posts)
44. The biggest hurdle is education on convincing Americans that health care would be cheaper
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 03:09 PM
Dec 2019

despite the less take home money from your cheque. To show them that it is like contributing to a much larger pool than their own private insurer, thus less cost per person. Add to that, no middle man, or executives or shareholders to scoop off their take. Plus no pleading with insurance companies for coverage as their job is to DENY you, because they work for their companies bottom line. And its 10x harder to educate the public with not only Fox News and RW radio and internet spouting fake news about it, but the MSM networks as well. I still remember Doctor Gupta on CNN smearing single payer and lauding the private system every day during the debates before the ACA.

More than that, its convincing many Americans that Big Gob'mint will do it right, or that its not just another excuse for another tax and less money in their pocket, for some big boondoggle that they don't need. Especially with the push back from the News media, Republicans, PLUS some older respected Democrats who take donations from those corporations. Add to that the more lucrative hospitals and doctors. There is a huge steep unfair playing field just to get anything passed. It would have to be embraced by enough Republicans as well. It would take a 10 + year commitment. If Republicans would stop playing games of pushing buttons, and instead stood by the conservative mandate of reducing household costs for families, and businesses too BTW, they would get behind it.

As a Canadian that has my Medicare, I don't think many Americans understand that its not just a monetary thing, although you would on average pay half of what you do now. Which that chart does not show. Its also effects the national psychology in general in a very positive way. When everyone in a country doesn't even have to think about what happens if they get sick or injured, for their kids, or themselves. All their lives. It is a whole other way of living. There is no such thing as "pre-existing conditions". Here its called your "medical history". Also, we never use the word "insurance" in regards to our medical services, what does insurance have to do with a human right? Anyways, I just think that many Americans do not appreciate what that kind of peace of mind can do to help you be successful in other areas of your life. I mean how can you? I just want the same for you, my friends down there.




There's a reason why some countries are higher on the happiness charts. Although the UK is a bit of an outlier. Grumpy Limeys.



Lock him up.

(6,920 posts)
54. I fully agree with that, but it's the convincing and then implementing part
Sat Dec 7, 2019, 03:25 AM
Dec 2019

that is tough, IMHO. See my reply #53 above.

 

YOHABLO

(7,358 posts)
17. He's so right on. I'm so glad he's out there doing and saying to the public what I too believe.
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 05:09 AM
Dec 2019

Oh yeah, we just love being screwed over by the health care industry. Williams, McCaskill, Reed, Schmidt, just a bunch of Corporate ass lickers. You can tell by the look on their faces that Moore is giving them a real dose of honesty.

McKim

(2,412 posts)
18. My Hope for the Democratic Party....
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 08:48 AM
Dec 2019

My hope for the Democratic Party is that we take a lesson from Michael Moore and learn how to communicate with your average person! The reality is that we are a dumbed down nation and working folks have precious little free time to watch news. The big suits and fancy commentators on MSNBC look very comfortable economically. Their fancy words are not going to win over many in South Succotash PA.

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
28. Recommended.
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:08 PM
Dec 2019

MSNBC is not a progressive channel. Yes, it has some progressive hosts, but it is owned by NBC.

Polling consistently shows that single payer is what most people want. But the healthcare industry is spending billions in advertising to frighten people.

And they are doing so because their profits are threatened.

 

beachbumbob

(9,263 posts)
31. Who is Michael Moore? The guy who did all he could to
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:16 PM
Dec 2019

damage Hillary and see trump elected? That Michael Moore ?

LiberalLovinLug

(14,164 posts)
45. No he's the award winning documentary film maker
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 03:33 PM
Dec 2019

That has exposed corporate greed, Roger and Me
The Bush crime family lies about 9/11, Fahrenheit 9/11
The only journalist to actually go to countries with single payer to compare with the US during the debates before the ACA, Sicko.

Oh right, the guy that dared to support Bernie instead of Hillary,

But still went out of his way to make a pro voting Hillary film in an "October surprise" he called "Trumpland".

Can Michael Moore Actually Change Minds About Hillary Clinton? - Michael Moore in TrumpLand is an impassioned pro-Clinton preach to the choir.

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2016/10/michael-moore-in-trumpland-review

That work was blasted by BTW by some group called the World Socialists I found while googling. So if THEY didn't like it....

Michael Moore in TrumpLand grovels in praise of Hillary Clinton


https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2016/10/27/moor-o27.html

CaptYossarian

(6,448 posts)
36. There is a lot of Moore-bashing here. Is it because he warned us that Assface would win?
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:23 PM
Dec 2019

He never said he was voting for Trump, just that he saw a trend. Moore goes all around the country (including the Rust Belt states) and speaks to people. He didn't call the collusion angle, but he accurately predicted what would happen. Trump got the "Deliverance" states that gave him the Electoral College majority.

You should be just as pissed at Debbie Wasserman-Schultz for that Superdelegate crap that gave us a vulnerable candidate. I voted for Hillary, but she's been in the public eye for too long and the Dem voters who stayed home that night were probably burned out. Shame on them too. And then there are the hundreds of thousands of likely Dem voters who lost their voting rights in 2015 and 2016 by corrupt state governments and the damn Supreme Court.

In this video, Moore is 100% correct. And OUR party (since the New Deal) has consistently been on the side of the majority. We're also correct in our social views. Look at the Viet Nam protests, the Civil Rights Movement, Women's Lib, gay rights, the environment and climate. These are all Democratic Party causes. The problem is that "whoever has the gold makes the rules", and so the rich (American and Russian) bought and won the 2016 election.

Moore wants to make sure Assface is a one-term LOSER (to use one of Trump's favorite words). Give him a break.

MuseRider

(34,095 posts)
39. Thank you.
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:34 PM
Dec 2019

I have always liked MM. You apparently now have to agree with someone 100% (or they have to agree with you) to not smear them all over the place. How lovely, not exactly the way to move anything let alone a party.

Let's all just agree and anyone else needs to be kept away.

Anyway, thanks. I like him, I think he speaks to a lot of people. I don't feel the need to be 100% with him but I find I mostly am very close to the ideas he speaks about.

Did he say something bad about one of our candidates in the past? His opinion, he must be shunned. LOL, thanks for posting this.

scipan

(2,338 posts)
40. Love Michael Moore. Always thoughtful and interesting.
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 01:44 PM
Dec 2019

Remember when he said some people in Flint would vote for Trump as a symbolic Molotov cocktail at the government.

cp

(6,617 posts)
50. Moore does speak for middle
Fri Dec 6, 2019, 04:00 PM
Dec 2019

Will always listen to what he says. Very well paid commentators should spend a year with working stiffs.

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