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LetMyPeopleVote

(145,321 posts)
Sun Feb 4, 2024, 09:33 PM Feb 4

Opinion Why I changed my mind and think Trump should be thrown off the ballot

I have read all of the parties' briefs (other than the TFG brief being filed on Feb 5) and many of the amicus briefs. If the SCOTUS applies the 14th Amendment and use the actual history (and not two witch hunters like Alito did in Dobbs), then TFG should be held to be disqualified.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2024/02/04/trump-ballot-disqualified-14th-amendment/?pwapi_token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJyZWFzb24iOiJnaWZ0IiwibmJmIjoxNzA3MDIyODAwLCJpc3MiOiJzdWJzY3JpcHRpb25zIiwiZXhwIjoxNzA4NDA1MTk5LCJpYXQiOjE3MDcwMjI4MDAsImp0aSI6ImM2MjFjYWFjLTZkZjQtNGVjMi05NzEyLTg4ZDc1YjEzMDc4MSIsInVybCI6Imh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lndhc2hpbmd0b25wb3N0LmNvbS9vcGluaW9ucy8yMDI0LzAyLzA0L3RydW1wLWJhbGxvdC1kaXNxdWFsaWZpZWQtMTR0aC1hbWVuZG1lbnQvIn0.Hjd_Jog2z5XDuc2VQDbcwHnPZHDbFO0HIfKAAopC2_Q

Though I agreed that Trump had, indeed, engaged in insurrection, I thought it would be best for the country to have him go down to defeat again in a free and fair election. Keeping him on the ballot so voters could decide was the path to long-term institutional stability and might finally force a reckoning in the Republican Party.

Many people I respect continue to hold versions of this view. But the more I read and listened, the clearer it became that Section 3 was directed against precisely the conduct Trump engaged in. Its purpose is to protect the republic from those who would shred the Constitution and destroy our system of self-government. What Trump did in advance of the attack on the Capitol and on Jan. 6, 2021, legally disqualifies him from the presidency......

Other historically minded briefs made it harder for me to stick with my earlier, prudent view. A group of 25 historians, including James McPherson, the Civil War’s premier chronicler, and Nell Irvin Painter, a specialist in Black and Southern history, cite the congressional debate on Section 3 to show that it plainly applies to the office of the president. They offer clear evidence that implementing the section “did not require additional acts of Congress,” as some defenders of Trump claim.....

There are paradoxes galore on this matter. Believing Trump should be unable to run, for example, is the opposite of a partisan wish, since he is without question the weakest Republican whom President Biden could face. Another: Even if Colorado was right to block Trump from the ballot, it shouldn’t be allowed to do so on states’ rights grounds alone. This is a national question, and the court should not duck the fundamental issues at stake — though my hunch is that the court might look for a way to punt.

The biggest paradox of all: Throwing Trump off the ballot would seem, on its face, the opposite of democracy. Yet the whole point of Section 3 is to protect constitutional democracy from anyone who has already tried to destroy it. If its provisions don’t apply to Trump, they don’t apply to anyone. The court would not be disqualifying him. He disqualified himself.
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Opinion Why I changed my mind and think Trump should be thrown off the ballot (Original Post) LetMyPeopleVote Feb 4 OP
14A Sec 3 was a gift and warning to future generations: do what you must do bucolic_frolic Feb 4 #1
There is no question Trump was involved in insurrection Groundhawg Feb 4 #2

bucolic_frolic

(43,190 posts)
1. 14A Sec 3 was a gift and warning to future generations: do what you must do
Sun Feb 4, 2024, 10:13 PM
Feb 4

All it took post Civil War was someone who was a gatekeeper, a holder of power temporarily or officially or by act of Congress, to disqualify someone from office. General Grant still oversaw the US Army of occupation. Those administrators did their jobs. In Louisiana throwing 13 office holders off ballots because of their allegiance to CSA. The US Senate refused to seat a SC Senator. Bingo. Congress as a whole also approved some to hold office, usually in groups. This continued over the next 40 years, and it all seems collegial, an old boy network. Wasn't the war crazy but you're a good guy now!

So yes. Gatekeepers. They don't have to agree. Personally I disagree that SCOTUS must rule, because of precedent, because concentrating this disqualification authority in one place weakens it for future generations. And as we see, SCOTUS can be as political as anywhere else. Disqualify Trump but spread the power to do so. What a dilemma.

Groundhawg

(556 posts)
2. There is no question Trump was involved in insurrection
Sun Feb 4, 2024, 10:46 PM
Feb 4

But it's going to look like we couldn't win at the ballot box.

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