NSA, Snowden Clash Over 2013 Internal Email Release

[Hissyspit]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by ucrdem (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Reuters

NSA, Snowden clash over 2013 internal email release

By Warren Strobel

WASHINGTON | Thu May 29, 2014 9:21pm EDT

By Warren Strobel

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - An email exchange released on Thursday shows Edward Snowden questioned the U.S. National Security Agency's legal training programs, but provides no evidence the former contractor complained internally about vast NSA surveillance programs that he later leaked to the media.

Snowden responded in an email to the Washington Post that the release by U.S. officials "is incomplete."

- snip -

"Many, many of these individuals were shocked by these programs," Snowden said, adding that he was advised: "If you say something about this, they're going to destroy you."

The emails were first released by the office of Democratic Senator Dianne Feinstein, chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee.

- snip -

Snowden told the Post there were other emails "and not just on this topic. I’m glad they’ve shown they have access to records they claimed just a few months ago did not exist, and I hope we’ll see the rest of them very soon." The email exchange appears to be the first internal communication by Snowden, while he was working for the NSA, to be released publicly.

Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN0E92DK20140530

[840high]

1. kick

[MADem]

2. I look forward to Snowden releasing all of the emails that he wrote on this topic, all of the

letters of complaint he composed, and all of the responses that he received to those emails and letters.

Questioning how legal training is conducted is a long, far cry from challenging collection methodologies.

He needs to produce those emails. He can't possibly try to insist that he didn't save documents this important--that is just not credible.

If he didn't document his complaints, they didn't happen. He's been in the game long enough to know this.

[billhicks76]

3. NSA Proven Liars

The leadership at NSA should be serving life in prison. But keep focusing on Snowden's emails. Yawn.

[MADem]

7. Excuse me? Snowden is complaining about "Snowden's emails." Follow the plot, please.

And he's in "Whoever smelt it, dealt it" territory.

It is inconceivable that, if he WROTE those letters/emails, that he doesn't have copies of them.

Hell, he made copies of everything else he got his paws on.

It strains credulity to believe he forgot to make a copy, electronically or otherwise.

So you see, he doesn't have to worry about the "proven liars" you're crying about at the NSA. All he has to do is provide his OWN copies.

Why doesn't he do that? Maybe because he NEVER WROTE THOSE EMAILS/LETTERS? Ya think?

[Cha]

10. And another tweet..

Charles Johnson @Green_Footballs
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Snowden copied & stole thousands/millions of documents - but kept NO copies of the abuse reports he claims he sent. Smell test, anyone?
8:35 AM - 29 May 2014
121 Retweets 59 favorites
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[MADem]

12. I made that point, too! It's a valid one. He's just not passing the smell test.

He affects this attitude that he's "smarter" than everyone else; more aware, more up-to-speed, more capable...and he's so frigging stupid to not keep a copy?

If you put your dry cleaning in, you hang on to the receipt. It's the proof that the laundry owes you your shirts! He can't possibly be that stupid.

He's got a personality like Aldrich Ames (who also thought he was the smartest guy in the room).

[joshcryer]

14. Snowden has owned this email.

It will be up to him to deny the veracity of any future emails that are released.

[Cha]

4. He knows his fan club will suck it up.. meanwhile Tweet from David Corn..

David Corn ✔ @DavidCornDC
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Why would #Snowden make direct contact with NSA gen. couns. office on this issue at same time he was plotting to get docs to @ggreenwald?

9:38 AM - 29 May 2014

40 Retweets 15 favorites
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[MADem]

5. I know David Corn. If his middle name isn't Integrity, it's Veracity. NT

[Cha]

6. Precisely, MADem

[joshcryer]

15. And given the Plame affair he is more than qualified to opine here.

[billhicks76]

13. ?????

They seem like vastly different issues that don't preclude one another. Also, I read the article and cannot find where Snowden says he doesn't have any emails he claims he sent. I'm unsure if he claimed he tried to complain about wiretapping through emails or in person. Either way it matters not to me. Snowden isn't what matters to me. That's a distraction. The illegal wiretapping of Americans and frankly any wiretapping without a warrant targeting a specific individual is what concerns me. I'm baffled by people who defend this but I guess I could find people to defend just about any horrible act out there.

[grasswire]

17. I believe he has the emails.

He's just playing cat and mouse with NSA again.

[MADem]

20. All he has to do is PRODUCE the emails. He's had nearly a year to do so.

Why hasn't he?

A good time to have done this would have been right after GG and LP broke the story. Funny how he didn't bother to defend himself back then with this justification.

Snowden isn't a "distraction." He's the story. He is the one making all these claims. They are coming out of his mouth. He's the one who insists that the NSA can see what YOU are thinking. He's the one who claims that they're looking at everyone through their laptop cameras and listening in on their mikes and turning everyone's cellphones into spy devices.

He needs to put up--as in produce those emails he said he wrote--or he needs to come up with a new story about why he doesn't have them. A story that won't be believed, frankly--the guy who copied EVERYTHING didn't copy his own emails? It beggars belief.

He can't keep demanding that people show THEIR copy of something HE says he wrote. He needs to come up with his copy and provide it to the press, so the press knows with whom he conversed, when, and what was discussed.

Asking a technical question about rule of law is NOT "challenging the NSA." That's what any student does when they're unclear about a course of instruction.

And that's all that's on the table, thus far.

[grasswire]

16. I know the answer to that question.

I also have David's private email address. Must drop him a line.

[Cha]

8. I save my emails in case I need to go back to check something out.. it's beyond stupid that

Snowden didn't document.. unless he's lying his wimpy ass off.

Michael B. Kelley ✔ @MichaelKelleyBI
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Snowden: "I had reported these clearly problematic programs to more than ten distinct officials." http://wapo.st/1geYqiP h/t @bungdan

9:16 AM - 29 May 2014

Snowden: I raised NSA concerns internally over 10 times before going...

Edward Snowden says he had no legal avenue for blowing the whistle on NSA spying.
Washington Post @washingtonpost

5 Retweets 2 favorites
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[MADem]

11. If he raised concerns ten times or more he must have ten documents to support his claim.

You know, any time I had to have a contentious meeting with anyone for any reason, I'd take notes, state and restate my points, endeavor to make clear what my opposite number was trying to say, and then MEMORIALIZE the conversation in a memo that I would share with everyone at the meeting and in the chain of command. It's Ass Covering 101.

And why, if he had "no legal avenue" was he bringing this up at all?

Something stinks--and it smells like it's coming from Snowden, frankly. He's not coming off as believable.

Anyone who talks like he's smarter than everyone else, who knows "the game" better than the rest of the rubes back at the farm, should know that you document, you memorialize, you cross every T, dot every i, and you don't rely on verbal orders. Get. It. In. Writing. Otherwise, it didn't happen.

[Cha]

18. 'Zactly what others are thinking.. "The documents Edward Snowden forgot to steal" Ooops. Sociopath.

snip//

"But there’s one problem with the image of Edward Snowden, the meticulous, careful, big-thinking defender of privacy and anti-surveillance ninja: He stole everything at NSA but his own emails allegedly showing he tried to report his concerns about domestic surveillance to the appropriate authorities through the appropriate channels. -

end snip//

"In an exclusive interview with FedScoop published May 22, John DeLong, NSA’s Director of Compliance, said Snowden had not brought any detailed complaints to his office. Snowden, he said, had many options available to him short of stealing the documents. “This is one of those times. It’s a dynamic time. There’s a lot changing,” DeLong said. “What doesn’t change is accountability, respect for the law and the rule of law.”

http://fedscoop.com/the-documents-edward-snowden-forgot-to-steal/

[Cha]

19. Interesting observation.. along the lines of David Corn..

Mark S. Zaid @MarkSZaidEsq
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Date on Snowden's e-mail raises ethical and legal q's on advice from third parties that might have impacted the facilitation of his crime

9:59 AM - 29 May 2014

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Mark S. Zaid @MarkSZaidEsq
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Snowden should publicly reveal EXACTLY what he communicated, when and to whom as to any internal efforts he made to raise his concerns.

9:57 AM - 29 May 2014

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IF he Can.

[uhnope]

9. Yep, Snowden needs to put up or shut up

because he's starting to look like a liar even on this fundamental issue.

[ucrdem]

21. Locking, great story but posted earlier

Please continue discussion here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014814561

Thanks for understanding!