Report: UK Government Spied on Its Allies at 2 G20 Summits
Source: The Guardian
@BreakingNews: RT @BreakingNewsUK: Report: UK government spied on its allies at 2 G20 summits in London in 2009 - @guardian http://t.co/dkQ3w9DCYX
Sunday 16 June 2013 15.46 EDT
GCHQ intercepted foreign politicians' communications at G20 summits
Exclusive: phones were monitored and fake internet cafes set up to gather information from allies in London in 2009
Documents uncovered by the NSA whistleblower, Edward Snowden, reveal surveillance of G20 delegates' emails and BlackBerrys.
Foreign politicians and officials who took part in two G20 summit meetings in London in 2009 had their computers monitored and their phone calls intercepted on the instructions of their British government hosts, according to documents seen by the Guardian.
- snip -
The disclosure raises new questions about the boundaries of surveillance by GCHQ and its American sister organisation, the National Security Agency, whose access to phone records and internet data has been defended as necessary in the fight against terrorism and serious crime. The G20 spying appears to have been organised for the more mundane purpose of securing an advantage in meetings. Named targets include long-standing allies such as South Africa and Turkey.
There have often been rumours of this kind of espionage at international conferences, but it is highly unusual for hard evidence to confirm it and spell out the detail. The evidence is contained in documents classified as top secret which were seen by the Guardian. They reveal that during G20 meetings in April and September 2009 GCHQ used what one document calls "ground-breaking intelligence capabilities" to intercept the communications of visiting delegations.
This included:
?Setting up internet cafes where they used an email interception programme and key-logging software to spy on delegates' use of computers;
?Penetrating the security on delegates' BlackBerrys to monitor their email messages and phone calls;
?Supplying 45 analysts with a live round-the-clock summary of who was phoning who at the summit;
Read more: http://www.guardiannews.com/uk/2013/jun/16/gchq-intercepted-communications-g20-summits
nashville_brook
(20,958 posts)think
(11,641 posts)dorkzilla
(5,141 posts)AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)/sarcasm off
nashville_brook
(20,958 posts)okaawhatever
(9,478 posts)like this.
go west young man
(4,856 posts)for politicians who want to place bets on stock and get rich quick. Sleazy bastards. And I say that as a UK citizen.
nashville_brook
(20,958 posts)dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)Are they going to dribble this out for ages.
okaawhatever
(9,478 posts)political disruption. If someone wanted to make sure they caused as much trouble as possible for the allies at this conference, this should do it.
go west young man
(4,856 posts)not the corrupt nefarious deeds of the government.
okaawhatever
(9,478 posts)doing to us. Do you remember how long it took us to build the new embassy in USSR? They put so many bugs in that thing we couldn't come close to keeping up. When you get caught doing it you have to give the other gov't all kinds of stuff. From releasing one of their spies without their giving you one in return, etc. That's why the blow during the China trip was so significant. We had them by the short hairs proof-wise, but couldn't convert because of Snowden speaking out about what we were doing to China. Ask yourself why he didn't drop the G20 bomb earlier? Seems to me that would have made more sense.
go west young man
(4,856 posts)What if instead we actually set a higher standard and acted like a solid partner to bargain with instead of bugging our friends so we can manipulate them? What if? What you are rationalizing is a lowly method of conducting international affairs with allies. I for one wish we were better than that. Alas we cannot be trusted and the world knows it, which if anything hurts our interests much more than the Guardian releasing information about us.
okaawhatever
(9,478 posts)we play well with others can we ask China to stop hacking the Dalai Lama and human rights activists? Maybe they will give us back the plans to the F-35 we spent billions of dollars and years developing. See, I am American and I think their stealing our shit so they don't have to pay for it is wrong. I think the fact that their new cargo plane comes right off of our drawing boards is wrong. I think their using their military to close down an innocent American business through almost three years of relentless hacking is wrong. I think their hacking the New York Times and every single reporter there (53 email passwords) because they ran a story about how a Chinese official acquired $2 billion in wealth is wrong. You see, if this is about any kind of freedom, China loses. While people like you are railing about our evil government and how our President is "going after" whistle blowers like James Rosen for "only doing his job" N Korea was hacking him and that crazy bitch Sheryl Atkinsson. Oh, she was full of the same outrage you are. Oh, it must be the big bad dept of justice. It's the President trying to silence journalists. Ha! No, it was N Korea or China doing what they always do. They wanted something and they took it. They don't give a crap about freedom or warrants. They've had her computer compromised for almost two years. That's what she gets for participating in the story. Save me your faux fucking outrage.
Maybe our country behaves the way it does because we find out things like China hacked into both McCain's and Obama's campaign computers. I'm glad you're completely fine with a quasi enemy nation state having direct access to our top elected officials. It kind of pisses me off. And I believe it is the computer data mining program that caught that. You know the one their using to spy on every single American?
Snowden isn't a hero, he isn't a whistle blower, he's a narcissistic punk who has probably been a double agent for some time.
magellan
(13,257 posts)If they're going to act like assholes then we have the right to do the same?
Nice. Maybe you could explain what that achieves, since it obviously doesn't STOP anything.
Ya know, I'm sure this same excuse was used for torturing detainees. "They're all terrorists, they deserve it!" It comes from treating people like labels instead of dealing with them as the individuals they are. It wouldn't surprise me to learn you're okay with every single American being spied on by our own government.
okaawhatever
(9,478 posts)tell you China was the first and best at it. They really developed the field. That's a compliment in a way. They wanted to do something and became quite good at it. I'm not okay with waterboarding, but it's also much tamer than what other countries do in the way of torture. I'm pretty sure all the gitmo detainees can still raise their arms above their heads. John McCain can't. All torture is evil. I don't think for a second if we stop doing it anyone else will. I think we should stop because we're better than that.
And if you ever have proof of our government spying on every single American let me know. Right now it's just speculation. I also think Snowden will be revealed as a double agent. I don't think for one second he did this for noble reasons.
magellan
(13,257 posts)But you sound as if it's meted out as some kind of comeuppance. And you know what? Considering how pathetically bad at lying the officials in our "intelligence" organizations are, and the petulance on regular display in our government, you're probably right: it's mostly a bunch of overgrown, witless children who are running our country, exactly the type who'd go after anyone who got in their face just to SHOW 'EM.
Wow, hoodathunkit? Trickle down does work in some cases!
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)So it can disappear in a 24-hour news cycle?
Also it takes time to analyze, discuss, edit, make decisions, research background, and write.
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)They've had that information from the outset. They're milking it.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)knowledge into something useful, such as designing systems that PREVENT any one else form spying on THEM.
Catherina
(35,568 posts)reformist2
(9,841 posts)Duer 157099
(17,742 posts)Yeah, once this involves *them* let's see the outcry.
bucolic_frolic
(43,443 posts)They learned the hard way - during World War II.
bucolic_frolic
(43,443 posts)one of my favorite books is The Double-Cross System by J.C. Masterman.
I believe we might have a vastly different world today without the success
of this operation.
It's a post-war (that term has always meant post-WWII - do we now need to spell
out the war so many decades and wars later ?) account of the British
espionage system during WWII. The British counter-intelligence operation captured
and used the German spies to learn what they could and plant in Germany what
they liked.
I've read the book twice, and at points I thought it might be bragadoccio such as
the remarkable claim that no German spy was successful inside Britain during the
war, but in each case the claims are backed up and the loose ends tied off. It is
also hard to believe that the Nazi government was so gullible, they seem to never
have suspected that they could be receiving bogus information.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-Cross_System
RainDog
(28,784 posts)Earth_First
(14,910 posts)I wonder if this changes the opinion of anyindividuals who were out to peg pure espionage and political sabatoge on Snowden now that his leaked information involves another government entity...
muriel_volestrangler
(101,405 posts)Gun admitted leaking the email to The Observer but said she did it "with a clear conscience", hoping to prevent the war. "I have no regrets and I would do it again", she said. In a BBC interview with Jeremy Paxman, she admitted that she had not raised the matter with staff counsellors as she "honestly didn't think that would have had any practical effect."[1] After her revelation, GCHQ terminated her employment.
On 13 November 2003, Gun was charged with an offence under section 1 of the Official Secrets Act 1989. Her case became a cause célèbre among activists, and many people stepped forward to urge the government to drop the case. Among them were the Reverend Jesse Jackson, Daniel Ellsberg (the US government official who leaked the Pentagon Papers), and actor Sean Penn, who described her as "a hero of the human spirit". Gun planned to plead "not guilty", saying in her defence that she acted to prevent imminent loss of life in a war she considered illegal.
The case came to court on 25 February 2004. Within half an hour, the case was dropped because the prosecution declined to offer evidence. The reasons for the prosecution dropping the case are unclear. The day before the trial, Gun's defence team had asked the government for any records of advice about the legality of the war that it had received during the run-up to the war. A full trial might have exposed any such documents to public scrutiny as the defence were expected to argue that trying to stop an illegal act (that of an illegal war of aggression) trumped Gun's obligations under the Official Secrets Act 1989. Speculation was rife in the media that the prosecution service had bowed to political pressure to drop the case so that any such documents would remain secret. However, a Government spokesman said that the decision to drop the case had been made before the defence's demands had been submitted. (The Guardian newspaper had reported plans to drop the case the previous week.[
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katharine_Gun
The UN responded to Ms Short's claim that, during her time in government, she had read transcripts of some of Mr Annan's telephone calls, by saying that any such spying would be illegal.
Mr Blair refused to confirm or deny the claim, but insisted that intelligence officers always acted within the bounds of national and international law.
...
Asked whether British agencies had been involved in spying activities against Mr Annan, Ms Short - who quit the cabinet in protest over the reconstruction of Iraq - said: "I know, I have seen transcripts of Kofi Annan's conversations.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2004/feb/26/iraq.iraq
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)They'd boxed themselves in and had no choice.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Spy agencies in various countries spy on both allies and non-allies and have been for decades.
Also, the earth rotates around the sun.
dlwickham
(3,316 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)go west young man
(4,856 posts)which many may agree upon is one thing. Obviously it happens. Proof that it happens so people no longer have to speculate is another thing. Now when people debate the subject a factual analysis exists due to the Guardian's revelation. Hopefully in a democracy your happy with that fact.
So many people are saying the same thing you have written but in the course of history there are proven facts and there are theories. This theory you have that many believed to be true is no longer a theory. It's a reported fact.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
dlwickham
(3,316 posts)everyone spies on everyone else
dipsydoodle
(42,239 posts)American spies based in the UK intercepted the top-secret communications of the then Russian president, Dmitry Medvedev, during his visit to Britain for the G20 summit in London, leaked documents reveal.
The details of the intercept were set out in a briefing prepared by the National Security Agency (NSA), America's biggest surveillance and eavesdropping organisation, and shared with high-ranking officials from Britain, Australia, Canada and New Zealand.
>
The disclosure underlines the importance of the US spy hub at RAF Menwith Hill in Harrogate, North Yorkshire, where hundreds of NSA analysts are based, working alongside liaison officers from GCHQ.
The document was drafted in August 2009, four months after the visit by Medvedev, who joined other world leaders in London, including the US president, Barack Obama, for the event hosted by the British prime minister, Gordon Brown.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/16/nsa-dmitry-medvedev-g20-summit
Which presumably Obama knew nothing about.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Are we supposed to be outraged at the fact that spy agencies spy on other countries?
Astrad
(466 posts)it works like this. Russia is part of the G8 + 1 and is invited to attend and participate. So it's natural that they might think they aren't having all their private communications listened to or read. If multilateral international bodies have to operate on a fundamental principle of mistrust then they won't get much done. The idea is to foster communications between nations that might otherwise be adversarial. So just because we know it happens, doesn't mean it's in anyone's interest to let it happen and exposing it might cause it to cease or at least be curtailed. But if you want a world where every single country treats every other country with complete distrust, than by all means, don't be the least bothered by this.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Last edited Sun Jun 16, 2013, 11:17 PM - Edit history (1)
Back then it was all vodka and hookers named "Natashia".
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)melm00se
(4,997 posts)Governments, their officials and communications have the target of espionage efforts since the beginnings of organized society.
Efforts to defeat the same have been going on since then too.
craigmatic
(4,510 posts)but it happens frequently. How else do you think the UK got the atomic bomb in the first place?