Trump moves to cap pay raise for civilian government workers at 1 percent

[left-of-center2012]

Source: The Hill

President Trump on Monday said federal civilian worker pay increases would be capped at 1 percent next year, sparking criticism from groups representing government employees.

The president argued in a statement that the move was necessary to "put our Nation on a fiscally sustainable course."

"This alternative pay plan decision will not materially affect our ability to attract and retain a well‑qualified Federal workforce," Trump said. "[O]ur pay system must reform to align with mission-critical recruitment and retention goals, and to reward employees whose performance provides value for the American people."

In August 2018, Trump initiated an effort to freeze federal civilian worker pay rates. He later implemented the freeze by executive order, but that move was later nullified by Congress in a spending deal.

Read more: https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/482414-trump-caps-pay-raise-for-civilian-government-workers-at-1-percent

[bucolic_frolic]

1. He's gonna spring tax cut at the last minute

that's why he's kneecapping federal spending no matter the damage it does.

[MyOwnPeace]

2. Huh? I thought the economy was doing great?

The government wouldn't have to be worrying about a "fiscally sustainable course" if he and the Repugs hadn't given away the huge tax cut to the 1%!

[underpants]

4. This IS going to hurt retention

The boomers are about to really start retiring in droves.

[NotHardly]

5. If I were them, I'd figure out how to retire before he reduces that % payout

[jls4561]

3. And kickbacks and graft will be capped at %1000!

[NotHardly]

6. Yup!

[oldsoftie]

7. In my area, Fed employees are VERY well paid. I'm fine with this.

I know many who make 6 figures. They dont need another raise IMO. A benefit thats hard to put a value on is job security. PRivate sector jobs can disappear at any time. Its rare to see fed layoffs of any number

[Skittles]

9. 1% is more of a raise than I received

yup

[oldsoftie]

13. exactly.

[Skittles]

44. can you believe

there are people who think if you did not get a raise you either suck at your job or you are in a dead-end field

that is someone who does not live in the real world

[Drahthaardogs]

45. WOW! It's..

Almost as bad as someone who thinks if they didn't get a raise, no one else should either.

Like they are so special they ARE the measuring stick by which everyone else should be measured.

[Drahthaardogs]

20. Maybe you are not very good at your job?

Or your job is not in demand.

I'm curious why you are the measuring stick by whick 1 million others (many scientist and engineers) should be measured.

[BumRushDaShow]

14. As a now-retired fed after 30+ years, those "6 figures" are people who have been FTEs for decades

I.e., that is not "entry level" salary like many equivalent private sector positions, which the media likes to confuse the public about.

Most new federal employees with a college degree start at GS-5 or GS-7. If you are an entry-level clerk or other support position, you may end up coming in as a GS-1.

For example, one of the high-end Locality areas (NYC metro) is here and you can see the starting salaries for GS-5/Step 1 or GS-7 Step 1 - https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/salaries-wages/salary-tables/20Tables/html/NY.aspx

The steps (assuming satisfactory performance) are 1 a year for each up to about Step 4, then it's 2 years between steps to I think to Step 7, and then 3 years between steps up to Step 10 and you max out.

In the private industry lingo - working for the federal government is akin to "deferred compensation". During the "Great Recession", we received no pay increase at all for several years and went through various shutdowns with idiots like Carnival Cruz reading "Green Eggs and Ham" on the floor of the Senate.

[oldsoftie]

23. Who starts as a GS-1 or 2 anymore? Certainly not here. And we have 25k employees here.

I work with relocation people helping people moving in for these jobs. NO jobs opening around here are below GS7 level except for a handful of housekeeping positions; and many are Wage Grade jobs starting at 44k. STARTING. And most of those GS7 spots are 7-9-11 slots where you move up quickly. And again, the benefits for fed workers are as good or better than any other industries around here. Some of my friends have been GS 11-12 since they were 40 yrs old. Add a spouse doing the same & you're killing it. In NY, maybe not so much "killing it", but still not hurting.
Id the pay is so much worse than the private sector then why do we rarely see any federal employees quitting for these other jobs?

[BumRushDaShow]

25. They bring in high school grads who, for example, may assist the mail clerks

and bring them in at that grade. They also bring in co-ops at that pay so they can learn the ropes.

Most of the country does NOT have those high locality scales that you see in NYC metro or D.C. metro, or Chicago/San Francisco. Here is the full schedule for all the localities - https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/salaries-wages/2020/general-schedule/

And as a note - since private industry has a documented poor track record regarding hiring POC/disabled/Vets, the federal government is where you often WILL find those groups employed because private industry won't fucking hire them.

It's a shame to see RW talking points on DU regarding federal employment.

I am saying this from having WORKED for the federal government for 3 decades and had a WW2 Vet father who worked for the federal for 20 years before he died on the job 46 years ago.

[oldsoftie]

26. None of the facilities around here bring in high school students & havent for decades.

I know plenty of senior citizens who started out that way decades ago, but its not done in Georgia, Florida or Alabama anymore. Maybe elsewhere, but it would seem a program like that would be available everywhere. The Co-op programs have been shut down for several years because of no shortage of qualified applicants. I have several friends who started with that program; they were paid WG5 wages when they worked & transitioned into WG8 positions. All of them are now either WG11 & up or have transitioned to GS11+ jobs.
Looking at that locality pay scale, the majority of workers in my area are making 60-125k. And that scale doesnt cover Wage Grade positions. I know several WG workers in their 40s-50s making 75-85k. I grew up here; I probably know 100s of Federal workers that i'm pulling this info from. And again, we never see many federal jobs going unfilled, so there isnt a low pay & benefit issue.
Its not a RW talking point. Its a fact; a good government job is viewed as a "catch' and people rarely leave them until they retire. Show me where thats not true.

[BumRushDaShow]

28. Here in Philly, that has one of the higher concentrations of federal employees on the east coast

we did this routinely in my agency and others in this area. And the Co-Op program here was NOT "shut down" and was implemented here as needed/authorized depending on the workload, any vacancies, and any existing agreements with local colleges.

"Elsewhere" - particularly here in the Midatlantic and Northeast, have more federal employees than the south so you cannot make a blanket assertion based on that one region.

And as a note - the WG scale is done separately from the GS scale and is usually not part of what gets reported in the media about the "COLA pay increases" that get talked about with the annual budget. In fact, the WG scale is not always adjusted with the GS scale.

And you just proved my point about "workers in their 40s-50s" - which in their case as Wage Grade (meaning no college), they may have started with the government at age 17 or 18 and would have worked 25 - 40 years or more before getting that type of pay. They didn't start with that.

Yes it is a RW talking point to compare the pay of government workers who have been in their same positions for decades, with those who may be just starting out or who have only been working a few years and who are in no way getting that kind of salary. I know when I started as a GS-5 step 1 back during Raygun's 2nd term, my starting salary was ~$14,000 while comparable private industry was in the $30,000 - $50,000 range - but I ended up coming out of college during the Raygun recession so they weren't hiring.

And it's also insulting to attach a negative attribute to people who don't want to change jobs every 3 years chasing higher salaries and nowadays, private industry doesn't want to train on the job, which is why they keep trying to increase the H1B (and other) Visas. It's an insult to federal employees who keep this fucking country running day in and day out regardless of who is President.

I know I worked under 6 Presidents and did my job for the public. We have sadly been watching what RWers do to public servants over the past couple months, with the petty insults and vitriol.

[Wuddles440]

16. Really???

This is a classic CONservative talking point that's part of their propaganda campaign to disparage and demean the federal workforce and civil servants in general. To promote their agenda of privatizing public services, they always fabricate claims that the federal workforce is overpaid, inefficient and untrustworthy and contend that significant savings of tax dollars could be realized through privatization. Unfortunately, every independent, nonpartisan study has proven these claims to be blatantly false! The reality is that federal workers generally receive a salary for their services that is commensurate with their education, expertise, and experience and are actually paid significantly less for critical positions that would merit much higher compensation if they were in the private sector. Also, for several decades there has actually been a significant reduction in the federal (civil servant) workforce and expansion of the contracted/privatized workforce - resulting in a greater overall cost to the taxpayers and general public. The only ones who are literally profiting from this arrangement are the corporate whores (aka King Conald's buddies).

[oldsoftie]

24. If the pay is so bad, then why dont we see an exodus from federal employment?

Same old nonsense; if you dont like the message, call it a "conservative/right wing talking point".
You dont live where i live. Where I live we have 25k+ Fed workers who are very well paid. Any job that opens is flooded with applicants. And this area has a low UE rate too. Most of these applicants are already working elsewhere, but they know the Fed job is a secure, well paying job.
Nobody is going to quit because they only got a 1% raise.

[Drahthaardogs]

34. Well, I hate to burst your bubble

But I used to work for DoD and ran $100Million of government contracts for less than $100,000 a year. In private, I would make at least .5% of that total.

[oldsoftie]

35. You've got to be kidding. People arent paid based on the amounts they handle.

Otherwise every contract administrator in every decent sized business would be rich.

[Drahthaardogs]

36. Like hell they don't

And I ran enough contracts, if I were a business, I would be over 3 X's the size standard for a small business.

You have no idea what the fuck you are talking about and just proved it.

[oldsoftie]

38. Oh please. The OWNERS make the % money. You're most likely salary.

I know several people who administer contracts for paving, commercial construction, multi family construction, liquor mfg, etc. ALL handle regional & national contracts that easily add up to 50M a yr. They're all salaried employees. But if the company has a great year, they'll get a bonus. I've known these people all my life. I doubt they're lying, because they're well paid regardless.
And i know 2 guys who handle 30-50M foreign military sales contracts. Same. Salaried. What business would be dumb enough to pay an administrator a % of an enormous contract?

[Drahthaardogs]

39. Every. Single. One.

You know someone who SAID vs. I. HAVE. DONE. IT THOUSANDS OF TIMES.

I have reviewed countless proposals. You don't think I know what a Program Manager makes? GTFO here with your nonsense. You can bullshit people who don't know better. I walked the walk for 25 years as a government toxicologist then a project manager and finally program manager.

You are just angry because you didn't get a federal job so you want to punish everyone else.

It is well documented that white collar feds are underpaid vs. their private counterparts.

[oldsoftie]

41. I guess my friend is a liar. Or needs to move where YOU live. I msgd him to be clear;

He works for one of the largest road & bridge builders in the region. His response:
"I, and the rest of our contract admins, are salaried. Others that I know with a couple other different companies are also salaried. I dont know of any that arent. Of course it could be possible I guess. But if a company uses a third party administrator, they very well may charge a percentage. I HAVE seen that. But they would also be a totally separate company, not an individual. I'm not complaining, I'm well paid & well treated"

But of course you wont believe that I spoke with anyone. Dont know why i should believe that YOU made tons of money on commissions instead of salary either though.

[Drahthaardogs]

42. I didnt make tons of money.

I worked for DoD, but I sure as hell saw a lot of proposals and I know what a senior level PgM charged per hour.

[Drahthaardogs]

43. And a Contract Administrstor is NOT a Project Manager

Two completely different jobs with different responsibilities and educational requirements.

[Blue_Tires]

27. Seriously??

[oldsoftie]

29. Yeah, seriously.

I dont want to hear about the "poor" federal workers when everywhere i go around here they're living very well. I know 100s of them & I work with people who relocate workers coming in to fill jobs. I also know Fed recruiters for higher level positions. They have no problem filling their positions. Maybe the "poor" ones should transfer down here if its so bad where ever they are.
As I said elsewhere, show me where there is an exodus of workers from federal jobs. There isnt. Because the pay, benefits & job security are pretty good.
But you can certainly find openings in jobs where the pay ISNT good. Because people LEAVE them.
Of course in the big cities its harder. But its harder for EVERY worker. There should be pay adjustments for large cities where the COL is SO much higher than the rest of the country. I have no problem with that. But you go to federal installations across the country and the vast majority of workers are well paid. I dont know where you are, but here, making 70k a year gets you a pretty good life.

[Blue_Tires]

32. Sorry, but

Congress is chock full of millionaires and Trump's grifting ass family is robbing this country blind (to the tune of $180 million last year) and he has increased the Federal deficit exponentially...

So I'm not in any great mood to hear about Fed worker salaries somehow bankrupting the nation if the people up top aren't trying to clean up their own games. Nevermind the fact that in recent years republicans have said this about 1. Schoolteachers, 2. College professors, 3. Auto workers, 4. Postal workers, etc... So there's a definite pattern here and it's an ugly one.

[Drahthaardogs]

37. He is angry and clueless

He just told me that your compensation is NOT tied to the dollar amount of contracts you administer. Bullshit.

[maxsolomon]

8. Trying to drive Civil Servants out of the Federal Gov.

Lip service to fiscal responsibility, but actually following Bannon's plan.

Tax Cut, Deficit Ballons, impose Austerity on competent Bureaucrats, point to dysfunction as evidence Gubmint doesn't work.

Rinse, repeat.

[Laelth]

10. I am breaking with my habit of being a Southern gentleman, here.

What an ASSHOLE!





-Laelth

[Quackers]

11. ...

v

[Brainfodder]

12. OK, fiscally responsible toadie, pay for your own golf outings for starters!

So far rumored to be over 500M, yeah....

I want my piece now!



I expect everyone to wanna kick my ass if I blew 500M of your money on golf?

Meanwhile Puerto Rico and lead in water?

[tblue37]

15. To help pay for that obscene tax giveaway to corporations and the filthy rich. nt

[mitch96]

33. Exactly. He gave his biddies a HUGE raise and we get the crumbs... nt

[cstanleytech]

17. I think Trump was told to do this by Mitch as the Republicans want another shutdown as they

plan to try to use it to sway the voters by blaming the Democrats for it.

[oldsoftie]

30. You've probably hit the nail on the head. LOOK for a reason to shut it down

Although i'd think the Medicaid/SS/Medicare issue would be even bigger

[cstanleytech]

31. They couldn't propose to large of a cut though because the voters might side with the Democrats

over the issue.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

21. Tax the rich. They can afford it. They made their money on back of public education & highways. nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

22. It's good this coming out BEFORE the election. Use it. Tell people how it will be worse AFTER. nt

[olddad65]

40. No money left for working people or the poor...

It went to pay for the 40% Corporate Welfare tax cut.
Amazon thanks Donald for being able to pay zero on $60 billion of revenue.