Girls beat up Iran cleric over dress code

[kpete]

Source: CNN

Hojatoleslam Ali Beheshti said he encountered the girls on his way to the mosque in the village of Shahmirzad for noon prayers in late August.

He told one of the girls to cover up, the report said.

"She responded by telling me to cover my eyes, which was very insulting to me," Beheshti said. So he asked her a second time to cover up and also to put a lid on what he felt was verbal abuse.

She hit the man of the cloth, and he hit the ground.



Read more: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/09/20/1134375/-CNN-Girls-Beat-Up-Iran-Cleric-Over-Dress-Code

[valerief]

1. Good for her! nt

[Cleita]

2. LOL! It's about time.

The irony is that it's okay for the cleric to insult the women by basically inferring that they are tramps, but not okay for them to insult him back. I hope Middle Eastern women fight back more often in the future. Time to end patriarchal customs around the world.

[leftyohiolib]

3. YOU are making ME horny therefore YOU must cover up

[Bernardo de La Paz]

7. The men are the weaker sex and can't control themselves. nt

[leftyohiolib]

16. well it's hard to control how you feel -

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. It's about controlling actions (against women), not feelings, which can be kept private. nt

[leftyohiolib]

33. that is exactly my point. controlling your (re)actions. you cant controll how you feel but you can

controll how you act - that was my point

[BlueToTheBone]

57. Especially when you are told you can do what ever

you choose, because you are a man and have all power. Boys will be boys and girls are blamed.

[4th law of robotics]

29. Maybe that's true for clerics

men in general though . . . no.

[leftynyc]

4. Atta Girl!!

My hope is all the women start to react the same way. I understand he was in the hospital for 3 days - she must have some right hook. Maybe he's learned his lesson but somehow I doubt it.

[leftyohiolib]

14. condoning violence are we. HE should a kept his mouth shut and SHE should a kept her hands 2 herself

what about men who belt their women cause SHE said something HE didnt like. "oh but that's different because of blah blah blah" . you dont get to hit each other over words. even though i think she was correct in telling him to close his eyes i hope he sues her and she should be arrested for assault

[Posteritatis]

21. This is a pretty naive post right here. (nt)

[leftynyc]

22. YOU BET YOUR ASS

I CONDONE THIS. Women are treated as virtual slaves and you just want them to stand by and take it? Fuck that noise. It's very easy for you to sit in the comfort your home and pass judgement on women who have no control over their lives - your attitude sickens me.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

27. Violence is not the answer, but something has to be done.

[leftynyc]

31. So if someone is continually

kicking the shit out you - literally and figuratively - you just take it?

[4th law of robotics]

32. Violence in response to violence is acceptable

IMO (I can understand absolute pacifists but I do not agree with them).

Violence in response to words is not.

Imagine a world where the only time anyone was willing to use violence was in self defense. They would never initiate it.

Wouldn't that be a better world than the one we have here?

[leftynyc]

34. Absolutely

And it rained peanut M&Ms, that would be fabulous also. Now if you want to talk about the reality of the lives many of these women are living in some of these middle eastern countries, do let me know.

[4th law of robotics]

35. And if you were speaking to me in such a snarky and condescending way in person

By your philosophy your safety would depend on how big I am compared to you.

By my personal philosophy you would be perfectly safe regardless.

Which do you prefer?

[leftynyc]

41. I met condescension with condescension

A world without violence? Is that the real world? It would also be nice if everyone had an education, a place to live and food in their kitchen. All those things would be lovely. Is it reality? Not even close.

[4th law of robotics]

44. You consider condescending speech to not rise to the level of violence

but since you've already determined that it is acceptable to use violence to respond to speech whether or not your condescending attitude warrants a beating is entirely up to the person you're talking to.

And you can't even disagree with their actions as they pummel you.

At best you could disagree with their standards for initiating violence based on speech.

[leftynyc]

48. Perhaps you live in a black and white

world but I live in a place filled with gray. There are no absolutes on what is acceptable and what isn't behavior. I will always support women fighting back against misogynistic clowns. Since the only statement available is from the cleric - who I see didn't press charges, I wonder why - we only have his word that he didn't touch these women. And even if he didn't, I support their right to fight back against a society that treats them as property. I don't think you live in the real world.

[PavePusher]

38. Quite frankly, the actions (even though only "verbal") of the "cleric"....

were violence, towards women. And thus violence in defense was absolutely appropriate.

I can't help but think that if verbally abusive fuckwads (no matter what nation or culture) got punched in the face more often, they'd keep their shit-nozzles closed more often. YMMV.

[alfredo]

45. After a while you get tired of being pushed around by bullies.

[4th law of robotics]

46. Who decides?

I doubt anyone would cry if the WBC got a beating at a funeral they were protesting.

What about someone protesting for abortion access?

To some this is common sense. To others it is advocating murder.

What about anti-war protesters. Or those who oppose GM crops or nukes. What about people who spout off about football in a crowded bar? Or people who make a point of saying "god bless you" to others they know are atheists?

Where do you draw the line on "verbal violence" that allows a physically violent response?

A lot of people probably deserve a beating. But I can't think of anyone qualified to determine that based solely on what they have to say.

[PavePusher]

56. Well in this case, since the next step is often the beating, flogging or stoning of the women....

I'd say execution of the "cleric" would be fine.

The WBC ass-tards don't generally move on to violence. I suppose I should have been more clear on my dividing line.

[4th law of robotics]

69. So a preemptive strike based on the supposed history of the entity being attacked?

[PavePusher]

70. O.K., I'm being more than a little hyperbolic, obviously.

On the gripping hand, waiting until the call goes out to stone them to death will probably be too late.

Bottom line, we can gripe about their primitive culture until the goats come home, but any change will have to come from within their own society. The good news is that modern electronic communications mean you can't keep people ignorant forever. The changes are coming... the question is what forms they will take, how long it will take, and how much resistance will have to be overcome (and by what methods).

[leftyohiolib]

37. well in this article the only one doing the shit kicking was this woman and he did just take it

so by your logic he should kicked the shit out of her b/c otherwise he's would just be "taking it"

[neovente]

52. turn the other cheek and get you whole butt spanked! n/t

[Dash87]

66. I love this cartoon

Every woman's experience.

[leftyohiolib]

36. she TOOK nothing where does it say she stood there and took "it" what "it" are you refering to

he opened his mouth and she told him to stfu.since when did this become about women "who have no control over their lives" this particular woman seem to have plenty of control. she wasnt cowering she wasnt being pushed around. she responded verbally to a verbal situation and that's where it should have ended. you take this one instance and try to make this into some kind of win in the war for female rightousness it isnt,this was an assault. she over reacted and she should be arrested. that's not me sitting in a chair passing judgement it's the law and you should try and respect it. otherwise what's to stop any violence.


btw i dont care what my attitude does to you.

[leftynyc]

42. Respect the laws

that are geared against women? Never.

[zonkers]

47. Those girls/women are awesome. Hope they won't get their eyes poked out.

Hope this impacts other women. Hope this is Rosa Parks moment.

[leftynyc]

49. That would be wonderful

but they could just as easily hang for it although I see the cleric has not pressed charges (wondering why). I still support what they did and can't think of a reason at all to change my mind on that.

[arcane1]

5. What a novel concept- holding the man responsible for his own actions

If you're offended, look away. It's easy to do when one is a mature adult

[MADem]

6. I think Imam Beheshti is a big fat liar, myself.

We never learn the names of "the girls" in this article--we're not talking about a big city, we are talking a very small town, where everyone knows everyone else. In Iran, there's none of that "we don't name the underaged child in the newpaper" stuff--heck, they'll name 'em with no issue whatsoever.

From the CNN article:

Tehran, Iran (CNN) -- They may be a far cry from their Western counterparts fighting for the acceptance to breast-feed -- or go topless -- in public, but two girls clobbered a cleric recently in a small town in Iran when he admonished one of them to cover herself more completely.
The cleric said he asked "politely," but the girl's angry reaction and some pugilistic double-teaming with her friend landed the holy man in the hospital, according to an account Monday in the semiofficial Mehr News Agency.

...Beheshti, who emerged from the infirmary three days later, said he did not file a complaint against the girls.
But he doesn't mind the local prosecutor's investigation into the matter either "as long as the case helps the cause of Islamic hijab."

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/09/20/world/meast/iran-hijab-fisticuffs/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

The truth of the matter is this--if you are of the female gender in Iran, and your hijab is found to be wanting, you are more likely to be verbally abused or even physically assaulted if you fail to follow directives to adjust your coverings than not. This story is getting play because it's "Dog Bites Man" type news, not because there's a sudden impetus by women to fight back against the absurd dress code (though it would behoove the culture if that were the case).

[Cleita]

8. So you think he got beaten up otherwise and fabricated the story

about the girls to cover up what might be an embarrassment to him? I wonder what that could have been. I mean if I were a man, it would embarrass me to be beaten up by a woman.

[louis-t]

10. Maybe he was hitting on them and they hit back.

[MADem]

20. Or just being a groping grabass--that is not uncommon in that culture. NT

[MADem]

18. It's entirely possible. I don't doubt he got hit, but "why" is a question.

He might have been interfering with one of the girls and the other came to her aid. He invented the story to cover his actions, and then plays the "religious forgiveness" card by not wanting to take action against them. He HAS to know who they are--these aren't strange girls in a city of millions, this is a small town, like a Cheers bar without the booze, a place where everybody knows your name.

It's impossible for a female to get a fair shake in Iran, unless they have powerful male relatives. Hopefully the girls have an Ayatullah in the family--otherwise, they will not be believed and they could receive a very brutal punishment for simply defending themselves.

[marions ghost]

9. Yeah

it's a bit far-fetched. We'd all love to think it's true but the retaliation for such a thing would be severe.

[blackspade]

11. Not a holy man....

A holier than thow man.

What a tool.

[heaven05]

13. even

if it is not true, this is what some of those 'religious leaders' deserve

[lies and propaganda]

12. i wish there were video. n/t

[CreekDog]

15. I can't condone violence

but...

[hunter]

17. A recent photo of the cleric here...

[MADem]

19. Those guys don't go for hotlinking, apparently. nt

[DRoseDARs]

39. I may be wrong but no, I think that picture was the intended one... nt

[MADem]

53. How odd--previously, all I was seeing was a blue box with a dot com address in it.

Now I see the pic, and yes, that could very well be the cleric!

[Posteritatis]

23. "She responded by telling me to cover my eyes" - Yessssss! (nt)

[Comrade_McKenzie]

25. Women, fuck yeah. nt

[bemildred]

26. "Mind your own business, asshole." nt

[4th law of robotics]

28. That's an interesting turn of play

it's usually the girls that get beaten.

I don't really think that warranted violence but I would have been willing to look the other way.

[magic59]

30. I love it but

I wouldn't believe anything a religious fanatic says either here or overseas. He is probably trying to get a few girls stoned (and I don't mean high) so he can get his rocks off.

[alfredo]

40. I don't condone violence, but it is good seeing a woman stand up for herself. AND

A simple act like that could snowball, just as that Tunisian shop keeper who burned himself to death in protest.


Her act could embolden more women to defy those assholes.

[yurbud]

43. This is why we shouldn't let Israel attack Iran--girl power will change them from within

[trouble.smith]

50. I salute them for their bravery but I fear for them now.

Iran will likely feel a need to make an example out of them and that example will be sickening.

[defacto7]

51. Hmmm...

I wonder how many will die or be tortured over this one?

The most likely situation here is that this is incitement of rage for political purposes and it seems it has worked here anyway.

How many times are we going to walk into their religious traps?

Maybe it happened. Maybe it didn't. All I know is that it took just one cleric lying about a crippled girl to get her thrown in jail and possibly stoned to death.

That's the art of incitement.

[MADem]

54. I will bet the cleric doesn't know the names (cough) of the girls.

Even though it is a small town where everyone knows your name.

He's given out a story that will ensure the girls do not come forward, because the cleric will be believed first.

That said, I don't think what he said happened, happened.

The girls probably ran home and told their parents that the Imam tried to touch one of them, their daddies went to the masjid and nosed around a bit, found out what was being said about the girls, and went home and told the kids to zip it and to avoid that pervert in the future.

[lonestarnot]

62. Hopefully otherwise, they should have made him an Earl

[Ken Burch]

55. bastard had it coming!

I hope the hell they offer that girl asylum at some embassy, those wackos never let these things go.

[Ash_F]

58. I don't condone violence BUT...

...that is one hilarious headline.

[BadGimp]

59. You go girl!

[ZombieHorde]

60. Whether or not any adult chooses to wear a burka or hijab should be up to the

individual in my opinion.

Some think those clothes should be compulsorily, and some think those clothes should be illegal, but I think each adult should decide for them themselves.

[MADem]

63. Regrettably, your opinion is not shared by the ulema in Iran.

Women do get accosted and punished for "infractions" of dress. Immodesty is a crime in Iran. It has been for decades.

[ZombieHorde]

64. That is regrettable. nt

[Scout]

67. yes means nothing when no is not an option. n/t

[ZombieHorde]

68. I agree. I also believe the reverse is true.

"No" means nothing when "yes" is not an option.

[lonestarnot]

61. Will they be stoned to death now?

[Ash_F]

71. Iran is a pretty right-wing country, but...

...not even in the same ball-park as our great Allies Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, and now Iraq. Most of the stories of stonings that people read about come from those countries and those who are not familiar with the region tend to clump all those cultures into a single morass. Iran never got that bad and is, in fact, trending the other way.

The cleric sounds like he wants to let it go. The fact of which, I believe, is evidence that the country is trending the other way. I think the women will be fine.







I hope.

[lonestarnot]

72. I hope you are correct.

[ibegurpard]

65. I really fear for these women

but I cannot express how much this story delighted me.
I hope they will be OK.