2 US Teenagers admit to killing Police Officer in Rome, Officials say

[Pachamama]

Source: NY Times

July 27, 2019

ROME — Two teenage American tourists were arrested on Saturday and accused of murder and attempted extortion in the fatal stabbing of a military police officer in Rome, Italian officials said.

The teenagers, identified as Finnegan Lee Elder, 19, and Gabriel Christian Natale Hjorth, 18, both born in San Francisco, were accused of stabbing the officer, Deputy Brig. Mario Cerciello Rega of Italy’s military police, or carabinieri, on Friday morning. The officer had tried to recover a backpack the two men were accused of stealing a few hours earlier, officials said. The suspects have admitted to the crime, according to a statement by the carabinieri press office.

The two Americans were arrested at a four-star hotel room in the Prati neighborhood of Rome on Friday as they were getting ready to leave the country, according to the carabinieri press office. The statement said that officers found “a knife of considerable size,” believed to be the weapon used to kill Brigadier Cerciello Rega, hidden behind a panel in the hotel room ceiling, along with clothes that the men had apparently worn during the attack.

A fight ensued, and Mr. Elder then stabbed Brigadier Cerciello Rega eight times, the police said.

Mr. Elder’s lawyer, Francesco Codini, said in a phone interview that the two teenagers had availed themselves of the right to remain silent during a court hearing on Saturday afternoon. A judge in Rome must rule on whether to confirm the arrest. Asked how his client, who he first met Saturday morning, was doing, Mr. Codini replied, “Not well.” Mr. Elder does not speak Italian, the lawyer said, and declined to address his client’s purported confession. The two suspects are being held in the Regina Coeli prison. A lawyer for the younger man could not immediately be reached for comment.


https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/world/europe/italy-police-officer-murder-americans.html?action=click&module=Latest&pgtype=Homepage




Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/world/europe/italy-police-officer-murder-americans.html?action=click&module=Latest&pgtype=Homepage

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This is horrible news and I am in shock....but for a reason different than others. I know one of the young men, Gabe Natale-Hjorth. He went to high school in Marin County (across from San Francisco) where I live and graduated last year with my daughter. He is dating a friend of my daughters and she just got home from yoga class and was crying and upset because in addition to this news, she said another high school classmate of hers Nick Paoli overdosed and died yesterday on Percocet.

This has been a f**cked up year....months ago my daughter learned that her best friends' parents were part of the pay off scandal for Colleges. This rocked her world and made her furious. Now hearing this news that a classmate and her friends boyfriend is a "cop killer' and a classmate overdosing.

These are not uneducated poor kids growing up in crime and drug infested areas. These are kids growing up in privileged areas of Marin County (Ross, Mill Valley, Kentfield) who have everything.

I feel sick. I am truly convinced the decline of our society and moral fabric is at rock bottom and the wealthiest in this country are right there. I am sad for the friend of hers who just died of an overdose. He was an only child and his mother Leanne is grieving. Gabe who was dating my daughter's friend is involved in a murder of a police officer. My daughters best friend since nursery school has parents who paid $250K to get her into USC. Its all revolting and crazy. As we go into becoming the 4th Reich, the wealthiest among our population are leading the way into the abyss.

[jberryhill]

1. If they don't speak Italian...

Then I would suggest that one hold off on taking the report of a “confession” at face value until more details emerge.

What they may have been asked, and what their answers may have been to what they understood, may not be all that clear.

Police have a habit of claiming confessions when the circumstances are not as clear as one might assume.

As they have counsel and made no such confession to the court, this one is a “wait and see” IMHO.

[Midnight Writer]

3. Italian "confessions" don't always stand up to scrutiny. Wait for more info.

[Pachamama]

18. I agree with you about the alleged "confessions" and holding off until more details emerge

They don't speak Italian and there will be more details coming out

I decided to call a friend of my father who is a retired Carabinieri. He gave me some interesting details that I think will end up being very relevant. He said the two Carabinieri were off duty and it was around 3AM which is the time where its all hands on deck in Rome and all police out. The station house was empty and the two police officers who were not in uniform were there at the time the drug dealer who is from Morrocco reported that he was victim of a crime of theft of his bag (didn't report it was drug dealing related and so this wasn't known by the police and they were treating it as theft and demand for money situation). They volunteered to go check out the situation. They didn't have weapons (pistols) nor radios on them.

This meant also when the knife was pulled and the stabbing began, the other officer did not have a weapon to draw to protect his partner. Had he had a weapon its likely that there wouldn't have even more than a few stabs and the other officer would have shot the assailant with the knife. The two then went running and the officer who not only didn't have a radio to call back up units and report an officer down and suspects on loose, had to choose between running after them, or to stay with his partner. He did have a cell phone that is how he eventually got in touch to report the attack.

Anyway, its going to be more coming, but the retired Carabinieri couldn't believe that the officers had no weapon, no radio and not in uniform and walked into a drug deal situation not knowing what had happened. He thinks that will also make it possible that the defense can be they didn't know they were police and that they fought in self defense thinking they were being attacked by drug dealers. Its also unclear if there were blood tests taken soon thereafter so hard to determine whether they were on drugs at time.

[deurbano]

24. I'd wondered if the police were in uniform. If not, with the language barrier they could have

misunderstood the situation and thought they were fighting for their lives against drug dealers. Of course, this was after several horrendous decisions-- starting with buying the cocaine while visiting Italy as tourists (that decision was more dumb than horrendous)... followed by their extremely reckless (entitled?) and dangerous response to getting ripped off by the drug dealer... then the bringing of a knife to the meet-up with the drug dealer. They voluntarily put themselves in a situation where they thought they might need a knife... and then either bought that knife in Italy, or had already made the decision to bring it from the states in their packed luggage. Either way... My son (from SF!) traveled through Italy with two female friends in the summer of 2017 when he had just turned 19, and I can't begin to imagine a knife in the picture!

[Pachamama]

25. Any time a weapon is brought somewhere - there is a risk that it will be used

My daughter traveled through Europe last year after she graduated and just got back from being there with friends for a month. Never would I worry that she or her friends would do such a thing or make so many bad choices. But her boyfriend who is a lacrosse player and who knows one of the boys Gabriel Natale-Hjorth - might have found himself in this situation if he was in a group situation involving drugs or alcohol because there is impairment and it only takes one person making bad decisions and the groupthink or rather "group-lack-of-think" kicks in. Anytime someone has a weapon mixed with drugs - it can only lead to bad results. Just look at the published picture of one of the men - Finnegan Elder - he is sitting on the bed and his eyes are rolled upwards - next to him on the bed is a prescription bottle.

I thought it was interesting for my father's friend who is a retired Carabinieri to tell me his perspective on this and acknowledge and state he couldn't believe that the two police didn't have their weapons or radios. He also told me that the drug dealer was Morrocan and he told me it was crushed aspirin that was sold to the two. The fact that they were in plain clothes wasn't because they were undercover -they were off duty and happened to be there at station when there was no one to go and they volunteered to go check it out. It violated all protocol and they also are supposed to have back-up before going to meet with anyone. The biggest reason that the police got involved at all was because it was portrayed as theft and ransom (extortion) - not as a drug deal gone bad.

Language barrier was likely also an issue. More details will eventually be revealed. I am horrified this happened and a man is dead. But it feels like it was a result of bad choices all around. And they are in Italy where the head of the country is already tweeting about the death penalty and there is a taste for blood. Italian Justice system is not like here in the US and I am concerned for the safety of these two and not getting a fair trial - particularly Gabriel, the boyfriend of my daughter's friend who by all accounts is not a violent or bad kid. I don't know anything about the other one, Finnegan Elder. I just know from what my daughter has said about Gabriel Natale-Hjorth and she said she can't imagine him killing somebody....but yes, stupid enough to be doing drugs in Rome and making bad choices.

[jberryhill]

32. This is the "confession"

I smell bullshit.

[Pachamama]

35. OMG...

Not sure where you found that photo but this....




I need to say that I am actually after reading the tweets from the Deputy Prime Minister of Italy Matteo Salvini about blood and the death penalty....I am afraid for these two young men and their safety. I am not condoning what happened (we still don't know all the details) but the information I have seen so far and after the conversation I had with my Dad's friend yesterday and also with my daughter and her friends about Gabriel (the one pictured above) - I do not believe he is a murderer or went there with intent to murder. I think there is more to the story and the only thing that gives me chills is that what I know of the Italian Carabinieri as a paramilitary police organization and the way things work in Italy. If we hear of an accident or these two dead from suicide - I won't believe it.

I smell bullshit too...

[lunatica]

29. What a mess!

Your description, as compared with the article, paints a completely different picture. One that actually makes more sense in a way. Foreigners who don’t speak the language, police who don’t look like police. Whatever could go wrong evidently did go wrong.

[Iliyah]

2. Hugs for you and your family,

RIP for the police officer and others . . .

[bucolic_frolic]

4. You know the rot begins with the greed

hold onto your solid center. you have the tools to help those around you redirect.

I might add. $250k to get into USC??? Taking nothing from the school which I know nothing about, but it's not like it's an elite private school ... $250k? Somebody's not the brightest bulb in this equation.

[Tumbulu]

7. USC is an elite private school, perhaps you are mixing it up with some other institution?

University of Southern California.

[bucolic_frolic]

8. nah, I'm just California ignorant

oooooooooooops!

[deurbano]

21. Like several CA (and elsewhere) universities, USC has become much more "selective" (and highly

ranked) in recent years.

[blm]

5. ((Pachamama))

[Pachamama]

27. Sigh....

[Historic NY]

6. Don't expect them home for thanskgiving....

[link:https://www.thedailybeast.com/rome-cops-american-teens-stabbed-police-officer-mario-cerciello-rega-to-death-in-drug-fueled-frenzy|]

[BeyondGeography]

9. Oh well

Sorry you have a front-row seat for this. But if this report holds up these kids sound like a lit match in search of a gas line.

[Everyman Jackal]

10. Has Trump asked the Italian government

to send these two nice boys home?

[dalton99a]

23. Alex Acosta just quit his job. He can be the president's personal envoy on the case

I'm sure he can come up with phenomenal special arrangements

[YOHABLO]

11. It's because they worship money and material goods more than anything else in their lives.

Let these ''kids'' rot in jail, an Italian jail. But as you say, they come from families of 'means', they might very well get bailed out. I hope not.

[dalton99a]

22. +1. Spoiled rich kids who never had to work a honest day in their lives

[TeamPooka]

12. Here we go again with the italian police...they are the worst. Don't rush to judgement here.

[obamanut2012]

38. You are 100% right

[denvine]

13. I understand all the personal stories here,

and the rot of the privileged but how about the dead police officer? My heart goes out to him and his family! He is the victim!

[emmaverybo]

15. Yes. And married only a month. He is to to have a funeral mass in the same church where he was

married. His poor wife and family members.

[Pachamama]

19. I reported the news and I added the info that I have a front row seat because of my daughter knowing

...one of the boys. I don't think anything I wrote indicates that I don't feel any sorrow for the dead Carabinieri - quite the contrary. I am disgusted of course about the rot of the privileged because there is someone dead because of it. Not sure how you somehow derived from my post that I don't think he is the victim.

[Farmer-Rick]

14. What a very weird crime and murder.

I think there is more going on then meets the eye.

My sympathies to the dead police's family. They will be suffering their loss for a lifetime.

[TeamPooka]

17. Stab a guy 8 times then you hide the knife in your hotel room ceiling? How convenient.

[LisaL]

28. Similar to hiding body in your backyard.

Yet lots of people have done it.

[jberryhill]

33. And a lot of cops have gotten confessions like this...

Obviously, he made a free and voluntary confession having been duly informed of his legal rights.

[BannonsLiver]

44. you think these two dumbfucks would be criminal masterminds?

The knife in the ceiling sounds about right TBH.

[iluvtennis]

16. Stabbed this policeman to death because he took back drugs they stole from a dealer...disgusting

https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2019/07/27/2-san-francisco-teens-jailed-in-italy-for-cop-killing/

[jberryhill]

34. That's what the police say

Because, yeah, when a drug dealer goes to the police and says “my drugs were stolen!” the police usually say “We’ll get right on that.”

And people just eat that story up.

[iluvtennis]

36. Valid point. nt

[obamanut2012]

39. Or killed the roommate they were friendly with in a sex-craxed murder

With a man she didn't know and her BF she had known for a few days. Disgusting! Oh wait, that was a total lie and she was railroaded by the Italian cops after an illegal and false confession.

I'll wait for more info on this one. They may be fiends, they may have been Knoxxed. The rush to judgement in his thread after what was done to Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito is bizarre.

[iluvtennis]

48. Again, valid point. nt

[CanonRay]

20. They may have done it,

but the Italian justice system is truly fucked up. I do not have any confidence in any statements made by Italian prosecutors.

[BannonsLiver]

26. With any luck they'll spend the rest of their lives rotting in an Italian prison

Fuck ‘em.

[jberryhill]

31. So, you believe this is a valid method of interrogation?

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/rome-police-officer-stabbing-american-teen-arrested-illegally-blindfolded-2019-07-28/

Rome — An American teenager was illegally blindfolded before he was interrogated as a suspect in the slaying of a newlywed police officer in Rome, an Italian police commander said Sunday after the emergence of a photo showing the young tourist restrained with handcuffs and with his head bowed.

I’m old enough to remember when reflexively believing police claims of a confession wasn’t a liberal value.

You think manacled and blindfolded is how voluntary confessions are made?



18 years old. How long do you think it took to crack him?

[obamanut2012]

40. The interrogation was even more illagl than what they did to Amanda Knox

Who was 100% exonerated, along with Raffaele Sollecito. The Italian cops and the authorities 100% used the media to lie about everything, so my judgement is reserved for now.

[BannonsLiver]

41. Fair enough

If You want to mewl over some entitled brats who murdered a cop over some blow be my guest. I’m not reflexively defensive of Americans simply because they’re Americans. And your complete disregard for the officer is noted.

‘Murica!1!

[BannonsLiver]

43. Btw, the word you're looking for is "illegal".

[jeffreyi]

30. Good luck with that there Italian justice system...

[obamanut2012]

37. Italy already railroaded one young American

who was lucky enough to have the will and support to get herself freed. She also "confessed" after a brutal interrogation session without a translator. So, if these kids did it, I hope they serve their time, but I am withholding judgement until we know they weren't Knoxxed.

And, that includes believing one word of what the media says, after how they lied so badly about Knox and Raffaele Sollecito.

[BannonsLiver]

42. You've made your judgement

“Cuz Amanda Knox ya’ll!1!1”

[RhodeIslandOne]

45. Unfortunately, priviledge is a fertilizer for shit like this.

I'm sorry for your daughter's friends.

[McCamy Taylor]

46. Two words---Amanda Knox.

The credibility of Italian police is in the toilet.

[BannonsLiver]

47. Interesting

So because Knox was shown to be innocent, therefore these two are innocent as well, even though the cases are years apart and completely un-related.

It rained last Tuesday. Should I be expecting rain tomorrow?