How will Obama be remembered?

[MatthewG.]

One year after the election, I find myself wondering how Obama’s Presidency will be remembered.

I believe he will come to be seen as a very good but not great President, who while not completely transformational in the manner of a Roosevelt, succeeded in establishing a basic framework for some sort of national health care policy as well as enacting other important domestic reforms. He also indirectly shepherded important liberal cultural changes in the areas of LGBT rights and drug policy (especially marijuana policy) ; while he came late to backing same-sex marriage his administration was generally supportive of LGBT Civil Rights issues, and while he opposed marijuana legalization, Obama’s policy of tolerating state level legalization essentially set the tone in this area.

I also believe he will be admired for his high ethics and generally decent personal qualities, and that twenty years hence, many conservatives, while not exactly “liking” Obama, will acknowledge the country could have done a lot worse, much like many liberals are now willing to modestly praise Bush Sr.

My main critiques of Obama would be that he was less confrontational with Republicans than he should have been, especially in his first term, and that he erred in entering military action in Libya, the handling of which Obama himself considers his biggest mistake.

What do you think?

(EDIT - some people have suggested that this post was meant as an attack on Obama, or an attempt to stir the pot. That was honestly not my intent. I was merely trying to facilitate friendly discussion on an important historical figure. I have decided to keep this post up, however, I want to make clear this post isn’t meant to create dissension in this group.)

[MatthewG.]

2. Im a former Obama volunteer

Last edited Sat Nov 18, 2017, 01:24 PM - Edit history (2)

I’m a former Obama volunteer and I consider him to have been a fine President, as I explain above. He wasn’t “perfect” but he was a good man and a good Commander in Chief.

[Aristus]

3. I don't think he was perfect, either.

But he was transformational, and he will be remembered as one of the greats...

[MatthewG.]

6. OK, well thats different.

I have no problem with people taking a different opinion from me on Obama ; in fact, that’s why I started this discussion.


I do think his (already high) stock will rise further in a few years, as more conservatives quietly admit that he had high personal ethics and was a good role model, especially as compared to his swinish successor.

[Big Blue Marble]

11. I have notice that the smarter conservatives

are already acknowledging his qualities of character.

[MatthewG.]

12. Me too.

I was literally stunned when Orson Scott Card, who hates Obama with the intensity of a white-hot star, recently acknowledged his moral decency.

[applegrove]

4. I think he will be remembered as a great President who shared the

keys to success with all americans, especially the previously marginalized. He got into power and through a variety of ways extended the ladder down so others could climb up. I would list all that Obama has done but Trump might read the list and start undoing it.

[MatthewG.]

14. Lol. Sad but true about Trump.

One thing I probably should have added to my essay above is that as our nation’s first African-American President, Obama Presidency will necessarily at least partly be remembered as an symbol of progress towards inclusivity.

[jcmaine72]

5. As possibly the last President freely elected by the American people and not the byproduct of

Russian chicanery.

[MatthewG.]

7. Lets hope not...

[BeyondGeography]

8. As someone who reeked

of integrity.

[Snackshack]

9. Agreed.

At this point in time “good” but not “great”. History will give the final decision. There are some really good things he did. Stabilized the economy, ended the conflicts, killed bin laden, ACA. There are also some really questionable things he did as well. “Looking forward, not back” on torture and Wall Street, being virtually silent on Russia.

He may very well be considered “great” at some point. Who knows how bad things may have become had he not handled the economic catastrophe he inherited as he did by stopping the free fall and shoring it up. There is also the aspect of him having to deal with an obstructionist congress. He is certainly the best president to hold the office during my lifetime. He most certainly would have been considered “great” had he had he been able to implement more of his agenda if not for republicans.

[Big Blue Marble]

10. It is so difficult to judge the historical significance of any presidency

from such an early perspective. I have noticed that presidencies like fashion seem
to go in and out of style as time goes by, or sometimes out and in as well. Different
generations of historians will value different aspects of each president's governance.

From our perspective, I would mostly agree with your analysis. He never had the
legislative opportunities that FDR had as he never had a supportive congress. Most of his
presidency was hemmed in by the obstructionist Republican Congress and the
dreadful right-wing media and political machinery.

A brilliant and compassionate person but emotionally stoic, he never was able to
effectively challenge the forces on the right. His message and his mission was one
of consensus, while the Republicans were set on destruction.

Despite it all, he gave us eight years of stability and economic growth. I am
grateful for his service and proud to have been his supporter.

[MatthewG.]

13. Part of the problem with judging Obama...

Part of the problem with judging Obama is that he didn’t set out to radically transform the system in the manner of a Lincoln or a Roosevelt, he set out to improve it.

Apart from Obamacare, a big f—

[karynnj]

16. Both the Paris climate change accord and the Iran deal are

Also his legacy. The Paris Accord is a very significant achievement because it was signed by all but two countries, that have now joined it. Even though Trump signalled that we are withdrawing, the rest of the world is moving together. This would not have happened without Kerry and without Obama agreeing.

The Iran deal likely avoided an imminent war. It is true that Trump, Saudi Arabia and Israel will lead us to war anyway, but that does not mean Obama and Kerry did not accomplish a goal that was thought unlikey. If we get through Trump's term without war, it will likely be because the military sees the status quo as better than several years ago.

[MatthewG.]

17. Iran Deal was a big deal...

Iran Deal was certainly a big deal. Maybe not an accomplishment on par with negotiating peace between Egypt and Israel, but it did represent a legitimate diplomatic accomplishment with a hostile power.

How much lasting impact it will have is probably unclear at this time. I certainly hope we avoid an Iranian war, which is likely to be catastrophic.

[karynnj]

38. I think Carter gets too little credit for the Camp David Accord

I think the brilliant, robust design of the Paris Accord is probably more significant than either and it has unified the entire world to move to change. It is true Trump pulled us out, but that has triggered many states, cities and businesses to state they are still in.

It is amazing that an accord passed without a single UN nation objecting. The two that did not sign on then we're Nicaragua which wanted a tougher (undoable) measure and Syria, which was in a civil war. This is a big deal and the US led in getting it done.

[CakeGrrl]

20. "Judging Obama"

And the need to do this now, given the very real threat to American democracy the current cabal poses, is what?

ZERO indictments or scandals from the Obama administration. Start with THAT benchmark.

I posted other thoughts separately.

[Hekate]

21. +1000

[MatthewG.]

46. Just wanted friendly debate

I just wanted friendly discussion on an important historical figure.

I see that some people think I was trying to stir the pot, but honestly, that wasn’t my intent.

[BannonsLiver]

15. He fulfilled his commitment to me as a citizen with dignity and class.

He is the best president of my lifetime. Born in 1971. How historians view him is not relevant to me. For one, by the time there’s any real meaningful perspective most people here will be dead. Two, I made up my mind a long time ago. He was a great president. I have very strong feelings about Obama. We’re worse off with every passing day he is out of office.

[annabanana]

30. I'm with you.

We have gone from the Sublime to the Ridiculous in one election cycle.

[CakeGrrl]

19. He was an excellent President in the face of unprecedented racism and obstruction.

The only upside to Trump is the speed with which people will come to understand what Obama has accomplished, evidenced by what Trump seeks to reverse and/or eradicate.

Thanks to a disrespectful and GOP-enabling media, neither President Obama's accomplishments, nor the uphill battle he faced from a deliberately obstructionist (borderline treasonous) Congress, was brought to public awareness.

And every day this corrupt administration continues, his decency and moral clarity are increasingly evident.

[Hekate]

22. Best president of my 70 years. Exceptional character and intelligence, zero scandals or indictments

Loved and respected his wife and daughters.

Went into his office every damned day of his presidency and worked for us, trying to make the country and the world a better place.

Dragged down every damned day by Republican obstructionists, and, based on my experience at DU, by whinging "progressives" who couldn't get over his not having a magic wand to make their every wish come true on Day One.

Held his head high, never complained, kept working. Killed Osama bin Ladin, who Dubya let escape at Tora Bora.

Got the ACA passed while Ted Kennedy was still alive.

Worked on the Paris Climate Accord and made sure we were a part of it.

Worked on a nuclear deal with Iran to make sure they stopped developing weapons, and returned their own money to them.

Tried to close down Guantanamo, but was blocked by the GOP.

Tried to get a 21st Century multi-nation Pacific trade deal passed, which would have helped rein in China's aspirations, and you would have thought he was selling puppies to them for soup the way some here carried on.

And on and on, while every single day people on the Right and Left bitched and moaned. Barack Obama came in after we had 8 awful years of Dubya. Obama kept the entire economy from collapsing into another Great Depression.

And now look what we have in Washington DC. Look at the fcking nightmare we have in DC.

Why you want to engage in shit stirring (sorry: "judging" ) regarding Barack Obama at this particular moment I can only speculate, MatthewG. But I will tell you this: History will not be kind to Dubya. History wll not be kind to Trump, nor will it be kind to the American people who brought him in to power. History WILL be kind to Barack Obama.

[Demsrule86]

31. I agree... Pres. Obama was a great president in my view. He saved my husband's job (autos) and

the economy. I don't get those who talk down a popular Democratic president. As for Johnson and Roosevelt (Kennedy really was in office too short a time to really judge his presidency), they were good for their times-great presidents...but consider they had Democratic congresses and after being abandoned by the left left green riff raff...Pres. Obama had a hostile Republican House...yet he still managed to save the economy despite the Republican's best efforts. And he got healthcare through...neither Roosevelt nor Johnson could manage that.

[karynnj]

39. Wonderful reply. I wish we could recommend responses. Nt

[greatauntoftriplets]

40. + 1000

You speak for me. Thanks, Hekate.

[SharonClark]

41. Agree 100%

[MatthewG.]

42. Thats a little unfair.

Hekate, I was an Obama volunteer from the time of the ‘08 primaries onward through the election - and I’d happily do it all over again - and I was proud to call him my Commander in Chief. Obama wasn’t “perfect” but I was and am grateful for his service.

I’m not trying to shit-stir.

At this point, Barack Obama is an important American historical figure, with a legacy that will be discussed for centuries to come. I don’t see how it could be fairly be construed as inappropriate to want to discuss his impact on history and policy. I don’t mind if people disagree with me - in fact I want people to - but that’s more along the lines of a friendly discussion than stirring poisonous envy and negativity.

[misanthrope]

23. As a good husband and father, a level-headed and moderate leader

whose mere abundance of melanin and ethnic classification was enough to drive America's racist reality to the surface beyond any further denial. The lather of the nation's worst nature was enough to cause terrible damage to the country he merely sought to serve.

If there's any objective justice, he'll be viewed as a perfectly fine president America simply didn't deserve.

EDIT TO ADD: LBJ's Great Society programs -- especially the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Medicare -- keep Obama from being classified as "the greatest POTUS of my lifetime."

[Demsrule86]

29. I think you are wrong...LGBTQ marriage and a healthcare plan for the uninsured make President

Obama a great president...as great as Johnson. He changed this country just as Johnson and Roosevelt did.

[goldwax317]

24. If there is any justice left in this world...

...Mr. Obama will be remembered as a classy and highly intelligent man who did a good job as president and might have done a great job if he'd had a Congress who didn't oppose him at every turn. Similarly, if there is any justice left in the world, the Republican-controlled Congress will be remembered as one of our all-time worst.

[Demsrule86]

28. Health care and saving the economy make him a great president...consider that Roosevelt's two

Last edited Sat Nov 18, 2017, 08:44 AM - Edit history (1)

biggest, long lasting accomplishments were Social Security and saving the economy. Pres. Obama was a great president and will be remembered as such in history.

[GoCubsGo]

34. LBJ gave us Medicare, not FDR.

Did you mean Social Security? That was Roosevelt.

[Demsrule86]

35. I know that thanks I mistyped...will fix...the point is all three...

Obama, Johnson and Roosevelt gave us pretty much the same thing...a healthcare bill of one sort or the other, extended civil rights (Obama and Johnson and I would say Eleanor helped with this too) and saved the economy.

[patricia92243]

25. He will be rememberd as one of the several presidents that saved the nation.

First was Lincoln - preserved union.

Second was FDR - brought nation through Great Depression.

Third was Obama - brought nation from worse "recession" since the Great Depression.

We've survived all this - now comes Trump. Looks like one man is going to be allowed to bring down the whole nation.

[TEB]

26. I will remember president Obama as the greatest president I knew

[Demsrule86]

27. Really? Obama like Roosevelt saved the economy...and he also gave us healthcare which is now

viewed as a right and will continue despite GOP best efforts. I have no idea why you would post this...seems like an attack on a great President...President Obama. Why you would talk down a popular Democratic president here is mystery to me...You know who will viewed as the worst president in history? Donald Trump.

[MatthewG.]

43. Not trying to attack Obama

I was an Obama volunteer from the time of the ‘08 primaries onward through the election - and I’d happily do it all over again - and I was proud to call him my Commander in Chief. Obama wasn’t “perfect” - God knows nobody could be - but I was and am grateful for his service.

At this point, Barack Obama is an important American historical figure, with a legacy that will be discussed for centuries to come. I don’t see how it could be fairly be construed as inappropriate to want to discuss his impact on history and policy. I don’t mind if people disagree with me - in fact I want people to - but that’s more along the lines of a friendly discussion than an attack.

[Demsrule86]

48. It is appropriate to discuss his legacy...but it sure feels like bad mouthing a person whom I

consider to be right up there with Johnson and Roosevelt. I think he was a great president. He saved our economy. He saved the auto industry...and he passed healthcare for the uninsured...something Roosevelt was unable to do and that Johnson managed only for those over 65.

[MatthewG.]

49. OK, noted.

Several people here have felt that I was trying to attack Obama.

That wasn’t my intent, but obviously, something I wrote gave rise to the perception. I’ll bear that mind in future posts.

[Demsrule86]

56. It might not be you to be fair...there are some here who do this carefully so as not to

get in trouble but there meaning is clear ...some years back there was one guy who call him a used car salesman...so some of us may be a little too sensitive. Obama was attacked mercilessly on the right and the left for years. I am sorry if I was a bit oversensitive.

[MatthewG.]

57. I appreciate this.

I appreciate your thoughtful words.

Tone is tough to measure online, and honestly, I’m sure this group gets plenty of crazy spammers and trolls (I’m relatively new here), so thinking about it I can see why people might think I was here to stir the pot.

[sweetroxie]

32. As a president stripped of his legacy

nt

[kydo]

33. Great. That's how. And even better then raygun.

[GoCubsGo]

36. Being better than Raygun is a pretty low bar to set.

Reagan was a terrible president. He had one of the most corrupt cabinets in history. He set record budget deficits, a lot of it coming from illegal wars, he illegally dealt arms to Iran and other countries, he caved to terrorists on numerous occasions, some of which lead to the creation of Al Qaeda. He robbed the Social Security Trust Fund to pay for his budget shortfalls. He ignored the AIDS crisis, letting thousands die before he even acknowledged it was a national health issue. He let hundreds of thousands of family farms go out of business or declare bankruptcy by vetoing the farm credit bill that would have helped them avoid foreclosure. His policies caused the Savings and Loan collapse. He only looks good because Dumbya and Trump were/are so much more incompetent and corrupt.

[kydo]

37. I didn't make the comment because I thought st raygun was a good president.

If grading on an A-F scale 'A' being great and 'F' being failure, I would give raygun at best a C- barely.

My point was Obama will go down as a great President even better, far better, then st raygun that the right props up as some type of high standard barer.

Orange man is a failure, worst president EVER! W, was also a failure, second worse president EVER! Obama will be up in the top 5.

[MatthewG.]

45. Reagan wasnt even that liked when he left office

I’ll backhandedly agree Reagan was a better President than W or Trump - even despite the fact that the Iran Contra scandal probably alone should be enough to have blackened his reputation forever.
He wasn’t hugely popular when he left office - I was alive and kicking at the time, and he was mostly snickered at, even by centrists, for being dimmed by age and out of touch with what the really smart people in Washington were up to.


Mostly Reagan was a bit better than W and Trump because the GOP was less insanely conservative in the 1980’s and conservative culture was less ossified at a media level, which gave him a little more freedom to make moderate judicial and advisory picks.

If Reagan were President in today’s culture he’d be as bad as W was. Maybe very slightly better than Trump, in the sense that while not brilliant, he wasn’t a Trump level egomaniac or swine and his presence didn’t endanger the integrity of the country through inappropriate ties to Russia.

[StevieM]

44. I think Obama will be remembered as a great president who made one huge mistake.

He appointed James Comey, an FBI director who launched an assault on our democracy.

Other than that he was terrific.

[MatthewG.]

47. Good point

Yeah, that was an error, although there’s no way Obama could have realized that.

[USALiberal]

50. By GOP idiots as a traitor, by intelligent people as the best president ever! nt

[Irish_Dem]

51. Mt. Rushmore president nt

[rzemanfl]

52. I am very much afraid he will be remembered as the last legitimate President of the United States

of America. In whispered conversations behind closed doors or in gulag bunkhouses.

[MatthewG.]

53. Lets hope not!

I despise Trump, but I think he’s too sloppy to just hijack the system totally.

[rzemanfl]

54. Putin isn't sloppy. n/t

[GentryDixon]

55. The adult in the room.

[D_Master81]

58. Will benefit from being between Bush and Trump

50 years from now he will be viewed much more highly than now. Mainly b/c people will see him as much more intelligent than Bush and "adult" than Trump.

[MatthewG.]

59. I think youre right.

Honestly, you’d have to be an incompetent of epic proportions not to look good sandwiched between George W. Bush, probably the worst President of my lifetime, and Donald Trump, the worst human being to become President in my lifetime!