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Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:30 PM

if it does happen (Pence is charged then pardoned, will and or could he continue being VP?)

for the lawyers here

22 replies, 1634 views

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Reply if it does happen (Pence is charged then pardoned, will and or could he continue being VP?) (Original post)
bluestarone Oct 2017 OP
lagomorph777 Oct 2017 #1
ClarendonDem Oct 2017 #2
rsdsharp Oct 2017 #3
lagomorph777 Oct 2017 #4
solara Oct 2017 #5
eleny Oct 2017 #7
bathroommonkey76 Oct 2017 #21
bluestarone Oct 2017 #8
H2O Man Oct 2017 #9
bluestarone Oct 2017 #10
rock Oct 2017 #22
Jose Garcia Oct 2017 #6
Abouttime Oct 2017 #11
onenote Oct 2017 #13
trotsky Oct 2017 #16
sarisataka Oct 2017 #17
onenote Oct 2017 #12
bluestarone Oct 2017 #14
onenote Oct 2017 #15
bluestarone Oct 2017 #18
onenote Oct 2017 #19
bluestarone Oct 2017 #20

Response to bluestarone (Original post)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:35 PM

1. Mueller (if he does charge Pence) will time it

so that Turd can't pardon him. There can't be a pardon until there's a conviction. And once Turd is out, there can't be a pardon. So Turd must be ousted while Pence's charges are pending (between the indictment and the trial).

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Response to lagomorph777 (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:39 PM

2. Someone posted yesterday

 

That Trump can issue blanket pardons, even before a conviction. That person cited a Supreme Court decision.

I don't see any reason from a legal perspective Pence would have to resign if pardoned, although he probably would resign.

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Response to lagomorph777 (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:39 PM

3. There can be a pardon without a conviction

Bush I pardoned the Iran Contra defendants before all of them had been tried or pled guilty.

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Response to rsdsharp (Reply #3)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:41 PM

4. OK I take it back. But I'd guess Mueller has such scenarios in his planning.

And I am nowhere near clever enough to guess what his strategy will be. Which is a good thing.

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Response to rsdsharp (Reply #3)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:49 PM

5. If there can be a pardon without a conviction

then, why bother? Why is Mueller working so hard to find the truth if the truth, in the end, doesn't really matter to anyone in charge, not the PINO, his thralls or his Vichy Congress?

Pardons without convictions, trumpMedia, trumpDOJ, trumpCongressionalCommittees, there are no checks, no balances. trump considers himself and his thralls above the law and apparently there is no one who can set him straight. So, if trump can pardon his thralls, his corrupt family and the Vichy GOP whenever he feels like it and for whatever reason--

Whats the freaking point?

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Response to solara (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:52 PM

7. the court of public opinion can be very strong

it can maim or even kill an admiinsitration's agenda.

and besides all that, the president can't pardon for state crimes. so in some cases with this administration's sins, the states can take action and those courts can judge.

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Response to eleny (Reply #7)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:23 PM

21. Maryland and NY state will be the saviors if pardons are issued. n/t

 

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Response to solara (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:52 PM

8. man my thoughts

exactly THE SYSTEM IS FUCKED UP

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Response to solara (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:57 PM

9. There can be

a pardon before a conviction. More, than can be a pardon before any legal charge is filed (re: Ford pardoned Nixon). However, even under such circumstances, were it to happen, Pence could -- and would -- be impeached and removed from office.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #9)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 01:18 PM

10. well that's good BUT

how much more damage could HE do before all this would happen? (removed from office)

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Response to solara (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 03:24 PM

22. Bear in mind

That a pardon does imply guilt -- i.e. you can't pardon an innocent person. Most politicians could not function as a convicted criminal. "And now, here's the criminal, VP Pense!" I doubt we'd hear much clapping.

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Response to lagomorph777 (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 12:51 PM

6. There can't be a pardon until there's a conviction? You might want to ask Gerald Ford and

Richard Nixon about that one.

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Response to bluestarone (Original post)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 01:35 PM

11. I think it'll go down like this..

 

Trump leaves office soon, Mueller will bring charges of conspiracy and obstruction against tRump and he will have no choice to leave, if for nothing else to spare his children and grandchildren a life in prison or worse. Pence will assume the Presidency but only as a figurehead long enough to appoint Hillary VP, he will then be spared prosecution and life in prison by resigning the Presidency in a grand bargain to prevent civil war.
If Pence refuses to resign I could see California and several other states declaring their independence and taking the military resources with them. Washington would likely join California and together they would have arguably the strongest navy in the world with the pacific fleet in San Diego and the nuclear missle submarines at naval base Kitsap.
Trump has pushed our nation to the brink of breaking apart, unfortunately we can't bring back Obama to heal our wounds, the only person capable is Hillary and she must be made President.

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Response to Abouttime (Reply #11)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 01:40 PM

13. Zero is too high a percentage for how likely that scenario is.

Bad fantasy is bad fantasy.

I like it better when this board tries to remain tethered to reality.

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Response to onenote (Reply #13)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:05 PM

16. Only way it could be better is if everybody gets a free pony. n/t

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Response to Abouttime (Reply #11)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:09 PM

17. Interesting scenario

Leave a copy of your script with the front desk. We'll contact you.

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Response to bluestarone (Original post)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 01:38 PM

12. Unless and until he's impeached or resigns, yes he continues to be VP

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Response to onenote (Reply #12)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 01:54 PM

14. confused here do you mean after Pence being pardoned?

he (Pence) will continue to be president after tRump is removed?

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Response to bluestarone (Reply #14)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:01 PM

15. There are only two ways to permanently remove a President or VP

One-they resign
Two - they're impeached by the House and convicted by the Senate.

Nothing else changes anything.

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Response to onenote (Reply #15)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:15 PM

18. scenario (trying to be clearer)

pence charged ok? tRump pardons Pence ok? (after pardon is Pence still VP?) then tRumped impeached ok? NOW does Pence become president? not disagreeing just trying to figure in my mind the process.

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Response to bluestarone (Reply #18)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:17 PM

19. Yes. Pence is still VP and in the event of a vacancy in the Presidency he become President

Again, he's VP until he resigns or is impeached. Being charged, not being charged, being pardoned, not being pardoned -- none of it matters.

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Response to onenote (Reply #19)

Tue Oct 31, 2017, 02:21 PM

20. TY i'm almost

considering this as a possible theory for them assholes to continue with this shit indefinitly wouldn't surprise me at al

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