General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDON'T BE A SUCKER--Antifa video made in 1947 by US Military
Link to tweet
That's a clip, here's the full video:
Link to tweet
Of course, this was made by The Deep State, so beware.
https://theintercept.com/2017/01/11/the-deep-state-goes-to-war-with-president-elect-using-unverified-claims-as-dems-cheer/
I and my family are watching another radical antifa video as our after-Sunday dinner movie:
Warpy
(111,417 posts)Freethinker65
(10,090 posts)Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)spanone
(135,919 posts)eleny
(46,166 posts)Scene from 1946 Oscar-winning film "The Best Years of Our Lives"
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)"Don't Be a Sucker" appeals to reason. Antifa appeals to violence and is a "cure" that's as bad as the disease.
Iggo
(47,586 posts)annabanana
(52,791 posts)They look to me like false flag goons
Iggo
(47,586 posts)But if I get even the slightest whiff of whataboutism, especially when it comes to Nazis, I pull the trigger.
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)The is no "whataboutism" when it comes to Nazis. Pure evil.
Just as plainly, Antifa is a dangerous and violent extremist movement that is antithetical to liberalism and whose antics only aid the Nazis.
We need to repudiate any association with Antifa. They are not allies.
haele
(12,688 posts)It's easy for conservatives to play "whataboutism" and smear genuine liberal protests and activities because while Conservative movements have a single focus, a single, lockstep authoritarian core that their fellow-travelers are required to accept if they're going to get support, Liberal movements will encourage a wide range of coalition issues that fall within the tenants of "progressivism" and "liberalism".
Liberals are the "big tent" - a we're all in it together attitude. People who "don't fit" in the status quo tend to be initially accepted unconditionally, which makes it especially difficult when the occasional hard-headed true believer or socially damaged borderline personality feels that the big tent is less constrictive than what the Conservatives are offering, and piggyback their pet ideologies onto generally Progressive public activities.
Antifa as a group, similar to BLM and many of the women's groups, has a Progressive goal, but each local group has control over the way their organizations are run - if the local environment is such they will need to be prepared to physically protect themselves and their families both at the event and afterwards (because of the Nazis and Trumpeteer groups in their areas), they're going to be wearing those black masks and carrying protection. But they're not breaking store windows and burning cars, because that's not what those organizations are about.
This big tent approach is the primary reason there's so much f'ing infighting amongst Liberals (not to mention Democrats), and why Anarchists and the disaffected "anti-current hierarchy" protesters will often latch onto legitimate Liberal movements - IWW/Socialists, various forms civil/social rights - and hijack an otherwise peaceful gatherings and protests with outbursts of rage because they're not being listened to the way they want to be heard.
However, the history of various Liberal Organizations expose the following conundrum: if Liberal Organizations try to play hierarchal games and micromanage their members as the Conservative Organizations do, 3/4 of the membership would leave and form their own splinter groups, and there would be no Coalition that will be strong enough stand up the development of an organized Fascist or Despotic regime. Democracy will slip, and fail.
Progressivism requires a Coalition to win, but that Coalition is both our weakness and our strength. We have to navigate between wants and needs of each of the participants, and shape the road forward in a way that everyone will be willing to use it, whether it's "perfect" or just functional to them.
Haele
Expecting Rain
(811 posts)That's the point. These Antifa groups are not liberal and are not progressive. They are our political enemies and letting them "inside the tent" (or anywhere near us) is a huge mistake.
Tolerating violent Antifa groups in our midsts weakens our coalition. It is damaging to allow these fanatics to be associated with us.
Antifa doesn't have a "progressive" goal. Not in the least. They are addicted to violence and wish to push politics even further towards polarized extremes. Nothing could be worse for liberal progressives that to think these folks are some sort of "allies." They are mortal enemies of liberalism.
haele
(12,688 posts)I know three people who belong to Antifa here in the City, and they have always been clear about the fact that the local Antifa does not go out looking for violence. They will protect themselves, but that's where they are. Most are members of the local LGTB community, and they're used to getting attacked while protesting peacefully over the years. They've had enough of that, especially when young people - basically children, are being hurt just for trying to make a space for themselves in the community.
They are Anti-fascists. They intend to get in the faces of the Fascists and Nazis.
And that means that depending on where they are located, they will meet violence with violence if necessary.
Unlike Black Bloc, who are out for themselves, because "all governments are corrupt".
I would agree with you on Black Bloc, who have no place in any progressive movement because they don't believe in the Progressive movement.
But to paint Antifa the same as Black Bloc is becoming very close to including other Civil Rights movements such as BLM in that bucket also.
Haele
annabanana
(52,791 posts)And my first reaction is that it is (if not at it's inception) ripe for false flag operations.