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Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:13 PM Apr 2017

Dems hatch plan that could make Trump resign

http://www.palmerreport.com/opinion/senate-democrats-hatch-plan-that-could-leave-donald-trump-with-little-choice-but-to-resign/2481/


Senate Democrats are hatching a plan that could lead Trump to conclude that he has no real choice but to resign.

The plan, on its surface, is simple enough: sue Donald Trump. But the genius is in the details. This isn’t a plan to merely tie up Trump in court with some willy nilly lawsuit. The effort is being crafted by Senator Richard Blumenthal, a former State Attorney General with detailed knowledge of how these things work. The idea is to sue Trump over his financial conflicts of interest in violation of the Emoluments Clause, forcing him to think twice about how far he’s willing to go to remain in office.

Because the lawsuit would focus on Donald Trump’s financial conflicts, it would open the door for Senate Democrats to try to subpoena his tax returns and financial records. If the judge in the case orders Trump to turn over that evidence, he’ll have to do it. During the election we saw that Trump was willing to risk losing just to avoid forking over his tax returns, because they contain things just that awful. If the Democrats back Trump into a corner where the only way to avoid surrendering his tax returns is to resign so the lawsuit goes away, it just might mean his exit.

More at the link
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Dems hatch plan that could make Trump resign (Original Post) Maraya1969 Apr 2017 OP
Please, right away. mahina Apr 2017 #1
Sooner, if possible. rgbecker Apr 2017 #20
Lol MFM008 Apr 2017 #28
Four Words of Caution Virtual Burlesque Apr 2017 #47
He's dangerous onlyadream Apr 2017 #67
I agree. KPN Apr 2017 #73
Excellent point! drmeow Apr 2017 #89
Sounds good to me (so far.) elleng Apr 2017 #2
What if... 2naSalit Apr 2017 #3
They don't have any more standing to sue than the rest of us, unf. But they could take him out back JudyM Apr 2017 #10
That would be a good start... 2naSalit Apr 2017 #12
Me too. Such an historic dereliction of duty by the rethugs, I hope history is unkind to them in JudyM Apr 2017 #19
Louise Mensch tweet that makes me feel better womanofthehills Apr 2017 #4
I hope the net is big enough to catch Mitch McConnell as well Tanuki Apr 2017 #5
And Pence for sure triron Apr 2017 #9
Don't leave out Ryan and Nunes BSdetect Apr 2017 #11
Nixon and Reagan demonstrated how... yallerdawg Apr 2017 #6
Nixon didn't really "go free," he needed a pardon from President Ford to avoid being indicted, red dog 1 Apr 2017 #92
And Carter Page? Mr. Ected Apr 2017 #8
Pence and Ryan also need to go with them AwakeAtLast Apr 2017 #40
Sounds like a plan kacekwl Apr 2017 #7
If the public gains access to his tax returns, he might end up in jail. L. Coyote Apr 2017 #13
We dont want Trump to resign, J_William_Ryan Apr 2017 #14
If he stays in office, we won't SEE 2020! FailureToCommunicate Apr 2017 #16
Yes. DT has to go quickly. Then, we can deal w Pence, et.al Alice11111 Apr 2017 #83
I agree, plus I think Pence will better for diplomatic relations with other countries. Zing Zing Zingbah May 2017 #110
Yes, even if he doesn't believe in evolution, he's still better than DT Alice11111 May 2017 #119
If Pence replaces tRump he'll be tarnished like Gerald Ford. Pence is ignorant evil, but lesser. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #17
Don't think that if Trump is impeached that the whole russia thing is dropped! Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #36
It doesn't have to work that way. bluescribbler Apr 2017 #76
That's exactly my point: Nixon/Agnew. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #77
Depends though. Kentonio May 2017 #115
I have a dream of "them" declaring the election as stolen and giving it back to Hillary Maraya1969 May 2017 #131
Dems better dig deeper Wibly Apr 2017 #24
Excellent post, Dems have become a naive party, radius777 Apr 2017 #33
You are still blaming Sanders. Now THAT is deplorable. - nt KingCharlemagne Apr 2017 #72
Yep. Deplorable alright. kcr May 2017 #100
I agree. We gave up a lot just to take the high road. Now, Alice11111 Apr 2017 #86
The exception I have with that analysis is that Lil Missy Apr 2017 #57
I'm sure the FBI and others will not stop their investigations just because Trump Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #30
NEXT FOUR YEARS???? The US can't afford that. Sculpin Beauregard Apr 2017 #58
yes and no. tomp Apr 2017 #61
There's no constitutional way to invalidate an election. Kentonio May 2017 #116
I know. tomp May 2017 #118
I agree with the principle Kentonio May 2017 #120
which is stronger, logic and common sense or the constitution? tomp May 2017 #121
Over 30,000 people die from firearm related deaths each years Kentonio May 2017 #122
good point. but I won't advocate for it. tomp May 2017 #123
I want impeachment too. Kentonio May 2017 #124
another good point. tomp May 2017 #125
Completely agree. Kentonio May 2017 #129
No one is more dangerous than Trump...he needs to go. Demsrule86 Apr 2017 #62
Good thought, but the correct term is Democratic President. catbyte Apr 2017 #63
"Democratic" president, please, thank you northoftheborder Apr 2017 #80
This is beyond electoral strategy Bradical79 Apr 2017 #81
We who? malaise Apr 2017 #84
Gerald Ford got the shit kicked out of him in 1976 Volstagg May 2017 #106
Yea, we can't afford another couple months with this nut. Thank God Maraya1969 May 2017 #130
+1. Great post, even if it is Palmer Report. Could work. . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #15
Oh, FFS! WE on DU thought of that a long time ago. WHY is it taking Squinch Apr 2017 #18
he'll just declare executive priveledge and refuse... Softail1 Apr 2017 #21
He is not above the law. If he is issued a subpoena he must comply Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #32
The IRS has copies and can answer a subpoena. If tRump refuses he'd be violating the law. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2017 #48
The question is whether they can GET a subpoena FBaggins Apr 2017 #65
It's very unlikely they could get his tax returns Jim Lane Apr 2017 #22
It is different here because of the emoluments clause in the constitution which Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #35
But if you can NOW say it's almost certainly being broken... Jim Lane Apr 2017 #41
No, they can get his returns if they are "relevant" to the inquiry Alice11111 Apr 2017 #87
It isn't that simple... but let's imagine that it was FBaggins Apr 2017 #95
His prior tax returns would indicate holding he has Volstagg May 2017 #107
Not good enough FBaggins May 2017 #109
Not without some financial records Volstagg May 2017 #112
Ah... but now you've left the case behind FBaggins May 2017 #113
One word: Pence Wibly Apr 2017 #23
Pence is a rat fucking disaster, granted. But... Texin Apr 2017 #85
Sounds plausible surprisingly. nt Quixote1818 Apr 2017 #25
Good idea. If they could only uncover some real dirt on Pence. nt oasis Apr 2017 #26
Nope. It would go to SCOTUS and they would kairos12 Apr 2017 #27
Why would they need a trial balloon? PdxSean Apr 2017 #29
How is it that people still post The Palmer Report here? oberliner Apr 2017 #31
Because there actually is some there there Brother Buzz Apr 2017 #37
The Hill article is the one that has the actual reporting oberliner Apr 2017 #42
That's what they do, and often with a less the honest spin to sensationalize it... Brother Buzz Apr 2017 #43
I've not seen him be wrong Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #51
Time for a stronger prescription. Nt FBaggins Apr 2017 #54
That was completely unnecessary and just plain wrong Maraya1969 May 2017 #102
You're right FBaggins May 2017 #103
Yea well like I mentioned in a previous post Joy Reid follows him along with a lot of Maraya1969 May 2017 #105
Credibility by twitter follower count? FBaggins May 2017 #111
I'm willing to try almost anything. lpbk2713 Apr 2017 #34
Two questions. PoindexterOglethorpe Apr 2017 #38
The Palmer has been right all along. It's one of those places that seems like like they Maraya1969 Apr 2017 #50
No, they have not been right all along. beaglelover Apr 2017 #79
That is only one that has been mentioned here. If that is the only one he got Maraya1969 May 2017 #99
OK well there's that. But Joy Reid follows him on Twitters and some others that have Maraya1969 May 2017 #104
Agree, Palmer is entertaining and insightful, a liberal Drudge type imo, radius777 Apr 2017 #98
Media Bias Fact Check: "Left Bias" / Factual Reporting: "MIXED" NurseJackie Apr 2017 #53
As if mediabiasrepory or any site can be impartial sharedvalues Apr 2017 #66
Yeah, agree Alice11111 Apr 2017 #88
Where do I send the check? lindysalsagal Apr 2017 #39
Maybe he'll use this as a convenient excuse to resign BigmanPigman Apr 2017 #44
Anything - I just want him and his evil family to go away forever. smirkymonkey Apr 2017 #45
Just do it. We need to stop playing nice &letting gop/ orange idiot steamroller us onetexan Apr 2017 #46
We can only hope! anniebelle Apr 2017 #49
The Orange Sphincter Wart Removal Team!! sellitman Apr 2017 #52
The time for talking has ended. Democrats need to do it ASAP. Vinca Apr 2017 #55
What's worse? DownriverDem Apr 2017 #56
i don't want trump to resign. tomp Apr 2017 #59
I knew from the title alone... EL34x4 Apr 2017 #60
i always thought We The people could sue him for... samnsara Apr 2017 #64
The sooner the better n/t Littlered9560 Apr 2017 #68
If a judge orders Trump to release his tax returns, he'll simply refuse Orrex Apr 2017 #69
They might be able to maneuver it to SCOTUS. If SCOTUS Alice11111 Apr 2017 #90
Judge, here are my fake tax returns because facts don't matter bucolic_frolic Apr 2017 #70
I believe he will resign at some point. louis-t Apr 2017 #71
He is sure talking like he liked his old job better. Alice11111 Apr 2017 #91
Or he'll die in office. GreenEyedLefty May 2017 #127
I like this mcar Apr 2017 #74
Yeah for Senator Blumenthal Gothmog Apr 2017 #75
Ho hum. Scruffy1 Apr 2017 #78
Trump would claim executive priviledge benpollard Apr 2017 #82
It can't happen soon enough Richard D Apr 2017 #93
There is one other option and that is Trump could simply decide to put cstanleytech Apr 2017 #94
There is no way he would do that. Volstagg May 2017 #108
Depends how much he wants to remain president and or stay out of prison. nt cstanleytech May 2017 #114
Do it. He has used us long enough. We are not lying down for him any more. The Wielding Truth Apr 2017 #96
K&R red dog 1 Apr 2017 #97
Seems like this has a reasonable chance. Voltaire2 May 2017 #101
this will be awesome if it works. aikoaiko May 2017 #117
Sure get the red out May 2017 #126
Resigning is the only viable option to removing from office. no_hypocrisy May 2017 #128

drmeow

(5,017 posts)
89. Excellent point!
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:23 PM
Apr 2017

Hopefully enough people have been 'woke' and/or mobilized that the removal/ouster/resignation of Trump won't erase the resistance.

elleng

(130,857 posts)
2. Sounds good to me (so far.)
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:17 PM
Apr 2017

Watching movie Judgment at Nuremberg (on PBS) now, so 'into' legalisms and horrors tonight. Fine with me.

2naSalit

(86,509 posts)
3. What if...
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:19 PM
Apr 2017

ALL the live former presidents gathered and made a former appeal to SCOTUS (maybe) and brought charges against the cheato? I don't know how that could work but it would be interesting if they chose to bring some suit against him and the Legislative Branch for collusion and treason.

Just dreaming, since i have little to no hope left at this point.

JudyM

(29,225 posts)
10. They don't have any more standing to sue than the rest of us, unf. But they could take him out back
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:30 PM
Apr 2017

and beat the orange out of him.

2naSalit

(86,509 posts)
12. That would be a good start...
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:35 PM
Apr 2017

but I wish they could do something. I don't know how much more I can stand.

JudyM

(29,225 posts)
19. Me too. Such an historic dereliction of duty by the rethugs, I hope history is unkind to them in
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:52 PM
Apr 2017

return.

womanofthehills

(8,688 posts)
4. Louise Mensch tweet that makes me feel better
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:19 PM
Apr 2017
Louise Mensch?Verified account @LouiseMensch 2h2 hours ago

Daily reminder #TrumpRussia is going just fine, Trump is being impeached, Flynn, Epshteyn, Nunes, Chaffetz, Sessions all affected so far

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
6. Nixon and Reagan demonstrated how...
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:26 PM
Apr 2017

"All the King's Men" can go down, but the chief crook goes free.

I'll be happy if they mess with his money - so important to him - and drive him out of office with a resignation.

red dog 1

(27,792 posts)
92. Nixon didn't really "go free," he needed a pardon from President Ford to avoid being indicted,
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 05:21 PM
Apr 2017

But he did have to resign. (Not exactly "going free&quot

Reagan, on the other hand, did "go free" - was not indicted or impeached, and didn't have to resign.

As far as your statement:
"I'll be happy if they mess with his money...and drive him out of office with a resignation"
I couldn't agree more (God, I hope that happens)

J_William_Ryan

(1,749 posts)
14. We dont want Trump to resign,
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:37 PM
Apr 2017

however appealing, appropriate, and warranted that might be.

Pence – or whomever replaces him – will be that much more difficult to defeat in 2020.

We want the scandals, and dirt, and crimes to pile up for the next four years where the American people will have no choice but to vote Trump out of office and elect a Democrat president.

Alice11111

(5,730 posts)
83. Yes. DT has to go quickly. Then, we can deal w Pence, et.al
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 03:49 PM
Apr 2017

Pence has lied too, about Flynn
I think he can be taken out. Plus, he has no personality, no following, and he can be beaten. He would have even lost Indiana, had he run. I think a lot of them will see this big investigation coming like a tornado and they know their name is in there...so they will get the hell out of dodge quickly...like Chaffetz. Geez, what could have so dramatically changed his life plan so quickly.

Zing Zing Zingbah

(6,496 posts)
110. I agree, plus I think Pence will better for diplomatic relations with other countries.
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:06 AM
May 2017

At least he can talk and not sound like a total idiot every time he opens his mouth. Pence has much more self control. Even though I don't like Pence's stances on the issues, I think he would be a much better president than Trump because I think he is far less likely make reckless decisions that could put the world in peril.

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,988 posts)
17. If Pence replaces tRump he'll be tarnished like Gerald Ford. Pence is ignorant evil, but lesser.
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:44 PM
Apr 2017

Don't fear Pence. But try to purge Pence first.

Ideally we impeach and convict tRump & Pence simultaneously so that Ryan is forced into the Presidency so that HE can be Ford. It would derail his ambition to be Reagan in 2024. If Pence or tRump go singly, Ryan does not ascend and would not accept appointment.

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
36. Don't think that if Trump is impeached that the whole russia thing is dropped!
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:57 PM
Apr 2017

I bet what they find out from Trump's taxes will be smoking gun type of stuff

bluescribbler

(2,114 posts)
76. It doesn't have to work that way.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 01:05 PM
Apr 2017

Remember Nixon/Agnew.

Agnew was forced to resign before Nixon. Nixon then nominated Ford to VP. When Nixon resigned, Ford became POTUS.

45 would inevitably nominate a GOPuke for VP, but, if we can wait until 2019, Dems might have a majority in the Senate, so Cheato would need to nominate moderate in order to win Senate confirmation.

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,988 posts)
77. That's exactly my point: Nixon/Agnew.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 01:10 PM
Apr 2017

But with regard to waiting until 2019, that would be very destructive. If tRump can be gotten rid of sooner than later, then the sooner the better.
 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
115. Depends though.
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:39 AM
May 2017

Say he left next week, then that gives the pukes 3 and half years for the public memories of Trump to fade away. When you think about how short people's attention spans have become, that could be dangerous.

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
131. I have a dream of "them" declaring the election as stolen and giving it back to Hillary
Wed May 3, 2017, 11:11 AM
May 2017

who rightfully won it. But it's just a dream

Wibly

(613 posts)
24. Dems better dig deeper
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 10:59 PM
Apr 2017

If the Dems are relying on running on a ticket of Anybody is Better, they'll lose again. That's basically what they ran this last election on. They trusted the intelligence of the people not to pick Trump, and believed all Clinton had to do was not make any major blunders.
If the Dems want to win in 2020, they'd better start leading and showing a new way, not spending all their time satirizing the Clown Car.
Give Trump the rope to hang himself, but win the 2018 Congressional races, and get serious about the rule of law. They should not be giving him any legitimacy at all. But they should also be strongly focused on Pence. There is an obvious closet in that man's house. Getting rid of him would be key to stopping not just Trump, but the maniacs behind him.
Jared Kushner too. If I know anything about humans it is that busy people are stressed people. The Dems need to zoom in on the agencies under Kushner's direction, and pay close attention to anything that happens, or doesn't happen. Put Kushner, and his wife, to the fire. If there is a weak point anywhere that could cause the cards to fall, it is in Trump's nepotistic appointments.

radius777

(3,635 posts)
33. Excellent post, Dems have become a naive party,
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:55 PM
Apr 2017

one that lets a guy who has never liked the party run in their primary against someone who was a loyal Dem (and one of the major icons of the party) and damaged her badly, then run a general election campaign relying too much on the 'moral compass' or whatever of the typical dumbfuck voter... Obama got nowhere with that for 8 years. The Republicans are a thug party, they were before Trump, who is simply more shameless about what their party/base really thinks.

Dems play by Marquess of Queensbury rules when the other side are playing by streetfighting rules, useless. Sure, Dems do need to maintain the high ground, but one can still play a tougher/harder game that is still fair. Go after Pence harder, go after Trump/family and their connections much harder, go after Comey/FBI who threw the election to Trump, go after the GOP movement to disenfranchise voters all over the country... and most importantly don't give Trump or the stolen SCOTUS seat (that was rightly Obama's pick) any legitimacy.

kcr

(15,315 posts)
100. Yep. Deplorable alright.
Mon May 1, 2017, 08:15 AM
May 2017

Not liking Bernie Sanders is the same thing as being a bigoted racist Trump voter. You nailed it

Alice11111

(5,730 posts)
86. I agree. We gave up a lot just to take the high road. Now,
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:06 PM
Apr 2017

we are getting kicked around by the thugs in the gutter.
Obama should have made a recess Supteme Court Appointment and let Comey release the Russian info.
I know he didn't want to appear to be interfering in an election, and he was pretty sure Hillary would win.

He was a great prez, and I love him, but he.made some mistakes, as did many others, in those last few months of the election.

We have to quit making safe assumptions and exploit every possible advantage in every place, to turn this giant tanker around. Stop thinking sbout how this or that will make us look. The Repubs are going to make us look bad anyway, with truth or lies. Also, we will gain much more respect for fighting, than conceding. Look at DT, one reason they love him is that he is a street fighter, and his base wants a fighter for their "values."

I'm not advocating deceit, but when we have the cards, don't hold back, just to avoid s fight or to look like the good guys...it doesn't work...play the cards FAST, AGGRESSIVELY & HARD!

Lil Missy

(17,865 posts)
57. The exception I have with that analysis is that
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 07:45 AM
Apr 2017

Dems didn't lose this election. Hillary/we won. It was stolen.

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
30. I'm sure the FBI and others will not stop their investigations just because Trump
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:52 PM
Apr 2017

is in the White House.

They know that we know and I think too many of them are pissed at how flagrant their abuse of the law has been

Sculpin Beauregard

(1,046 posts)
58. NEXT FOUR YEARS???? The US can't afford that.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 08:19 AM
Apr 2017

By then he will have wiped his ass with the constitution and installed himself as king. You will have no way to remove him.

 

tomp

(9,512 posts)
61. yes and no.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 08:42 AM
Apr 2017

yes, resignation not the best option. no, this is not about 2020.

exposing the electoral crime of the entire trump team is the way to go, thus INVALIDATING, the 2016 election. this is not about 2020, it's about exposing and correcting the crimes of 2016. This means the entire regime is taken down. if this does not happen by 2020, due to congressional delays and obstruction, then we can talk about that election. our main focus should be why the entire trump regime is illegal.

 

tomp

(9,512 posts)
118. I know.
Mon May 1, 2017, 05:59 PM
May 2017

It would be a constitutional crisis, OF COURSE. I think it should be done any way. I mean, come on, if you prove the election was rigged, particularly by collusion with a foreign power, what else can you do? You can't have anyone associated with it remain in power. You HAVE TO invalidate it. We simply have to find the way forward from there.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
120. I agree with the principle
Tue May 2, 2017, 07:56 AM
May 2017

But realistically I don't think there's any chance it could actually happen. As soon as you step outside the constitution, then you're stepping into completely uncharted territory. The right would call it a coup, and many of our own party would struggle to agree with anything that went outside constitutional boundaries. I think about the best we could get would be a constitutional amendment to put added measures in place for if anything like this ever happened again.

Remember, even in the middle of the Civil War and WW2 the election schedule still continued as normal.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
122. Over 30,000 people die from firearm related deaths each years
Wed May 3, 2017, 05:16 AM
May 2017

And even in the wake of a school full of children being slaughtered, the country still couldn't come together around even minor gun control legislation.

I think we know what wins when logic and common sense conflict with the constitution.

 

tomp

(9,512 posts)
123. good point. but I won't advocate for it.
Wed May 3, 2017, 05:51 AM
May 2017

and based on this argument I would advocate for impeachment rather than resignation, which would involve a higher level of accountability and continued investigation into trump/republican crimes. of, course I would not outright oppose resignation, as that would bring pence more out front and not hiding in the wings pulling strings.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
124. I want impeachment too.
Wed May 3, 2017, 06:06 AM
May 2017

Unfortunately if it looks like it might happen I'm expecting him to pardon himself, setting off yet another huge constitutional issue. Even if he doesn't, he'll probably step down and Pence will certainly do it for him ala Nixon.

The way the system is built, I just don't see any way that Trump ever faces justice. Then again what can we really expect when the highest elected official in the land can just hand out pardons as they like?

 

tomp

(9,512 posts)
125. another good point.
Wed May 3, 2017, 06:16 AM
May 2017

we seem to keep bumping up against the constitution in pursuit of justice. that should tell us something.

It is fairly extreme conservatism to hold to a document that does not avail us of justice. progressives should consider ways of fighting that instead of acceding to it.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
129. Completely agree.
Wed May 3, 2017, 08:38 AM
May 2017

It seems insane to me not allowing logical, reasonable modifications to how society works simply because they were written in a document centuries ago.

catbyte

(34,364 posts)
63. Good thought, but the correct term is Democratic President.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 08:57 AM
Apr 2017

Democrat President, or Democrat anything is a cheap slur against Democrats popularized by Newt Gingrich and is one of my pet peeves. Thank you!

 

Volstagg

(233 posts)
106. Gerald Ford got the shit kicked out of him in 1976
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:00 AM
May 2017

Pence would have the stink of Trump on him if Pence becomes president due to Lord Dampnut resigning/impeached.

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
130. Yea, we can't afford another couple months with this nut. Thank God
Wed May 3, 2017, 11:08 AM
May 2017

we have a Judiciary system that has kept him in check so far.

Squinch

(50,935 posts)
18. Oh, FFS! WE on DU thought of that a long time ago. WHY is it taking
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 09:48 PM
Apr 2017

the "professionals" so long?

Honestly, I despair.

 

Softail1

(56 posts)
21. he'll just declare executive priveledge and refuse...
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 10:35 PM
Apr 2017

...it is an interesting approach, who knows? maybe it will work!

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,988 posts)
48. The IRS has copies and can answer a subpoena. If tRump refuses he'd be violating the law.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 06:10 AM
Apr 2017

Tax returns for years before the Presidency would not be covered by Exec. Priv. any way, and I doubt if ones during it would be covered either.

There are many ways to expose him and #TrumpRussia, but I think the tax returns are a key piece of the puzzle.

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
65. The question is whether they can GET a subpoena
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 09:13 AM
Apr 2017

What he would be accused of in this case occurred while he was president. That's unlikely to pass muster even if they could get standing (less than certain).

Of course Congress can get subpoenas... But the minority can't act on behalf of congress.

 

Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
22. It's very unlikely they could get his tax returns
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 10:41 PM
Apr 2017

Courts are extremely reluctant to order disclosure of tax returns. Why would they be needed here? It's clear from publicly available information that Trump is reaping personal financial benefit from businesses that have dealings with foreign governments.

The most I could see happening -- and even this much is unlikely -- is that a judge might order in camera production. That means that Trump provides the tax returns to the court, but not to the opposing counsel. The returns are reviewed by the judge and/or his or her law clerk and/or some Special Master that the judge appoints, who will be someone the judge trusts to keep everything totally confidential. The plaintiffs would then get only what was absolutely necessary for the suit, e.g., "In 2015 Mr. Trump reported income of $___ from the business known as ________, and the returns for that business showed that its revenues from its subsidiary in Russia were $_____."

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
35. It is different here because of the emoluments clause in the constitution which
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:55 PM
Apr 2017

is almost certainly being broken.

 

Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
41. But if you can NOW say it's almost certainly being broken...
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 12:51 AM
Apr 2017

then that's an indication that the plaintiffs don't need the tax returns.

They could do a simple Request for Admission, for example:
1. The hotel in DC often receives payments from foreign governments.
2. The hotel is owned by (name of Trump company).
3. Trump has an ownership interest in that company.

Trump probably has to admit all these things. If he admits them, there's no need for the tax returns. The Emoluments Clause is violated whether he profits by $100 or $100,000.

Alice11111

(5,730 posts)
87. No, they can get his returns if they are "relevant" to the inquiry
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:17 PM
Apr 2017

Courts order tax returns released in discovery all day long. With all of his lawsuits and loan applications DT has had, there must be hundreds of copies out there. It is amazing they haven't been leaked.

Nonetheless, an investigating body could subpoena them, and DT could refuse to release them. Who knows , he might eventually be ordered to jail for contempt, but he would probably have a deal for a pardon by then.

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
95. It isn't that simple... but let's imagine that it was
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 06:20 PM
Apr 2017

What tax returns has he filed since he became President?

Nonetheless, an investigating body could subpoena them

Unfortunately - Congressional Democrats don't have an investigating body.

 

Volstagg

(233 posts)
107. His prior tax returns would indicate holding he has
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:02 AM
May 2017

which are tying him to foreign powers and getting money from them. They would also show, over the years, if those holdings have been sold.

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
109. Not good enough
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:04 AM
May 2017

The fact that he owned something in the past has no bearing on whether or not he owned it as President... and you can find that out without his tax returns.

 

Volstagg

(233 posts)
112. Not without some financial records
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:08 AM
May 2017

We have no idea what his holdings are. He clearly doesn't want people to know either:
1. what he's really worth
2. who he owes money to and does business with.

He would need to show some records of where his holdings are. Those would answer both 1 and 2 above. He won't want to do that.

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
113. Ah... but now you've left the case behind
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:15 AM
May 2017

I know that we want to see his tax returns (and for just the reason that you state)...

... but we're supposedly (according to the OP) trying to get them by filing a different case in which we could force him to turn them over.

The problem is that the imagined case couldn't do that - because tax returns from prior years wouldn't show anything relevant to what he has done since he became president (re: the emoluments clause). All this, of course, ignoring the problem of bringing the case in the first place.

Wibly

(613 posts)
23. One word: Pence
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 10:45 PM
Apr 2017

They'd better be working on a similar plan to make sure Pence doesn't succeed him.
Pence, when you look who is behind him, is way scarier than Trump.
And, he has "God" on his side.

Texin

(2,594 posts)
85. Pence is a rat fucking disaster, granted. But...
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:05 PM
Apr 2017

the fact remains that the people that put this asshole cheeto into office did NOT VOTE FOR PENCE. They voted for their orange dictator. The people that put this criminal idiot over the top would not have so much as gone out of their way to piss on Mike fucking Pence if he was on fire in a ditch somewhere, let alone go out on a cold November morning to cast a vote for him. He was deeply unpopular in Indiana and may not have been able to even get himself reelected as Governor. I think the GOP brass, i.e., Priebus, knew that and threw him a lifeline, and because his views reflect so much of the mealy-mouthed so-called 'regular' rethugs, they knew he'd tow the party line. I don't believe Pence would be popular enough to get himself elected POTUS, especially after what these robber barons have planned for the American populace.

PdxSean

(574 posts)
29. Why would they need a trial balloon?
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:51 PM
Apr 2017

Call me cynical, but if the legal team thought this plan had any teeth they would just file suit.

Brother Buzz

(36,409 posts)
37. Because there actually is some there there
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:59 PM
Apr 2017

Sen. Ben Cardin (D-Md.) confirmed that Blumenthal had pitched the idea of a lawsuit but stressed that no decision has been made.

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/330996-democrats-exploring-lawsuit-against-trump

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
42. The Hill article is the one that has the actual reporting
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 01:05 AM
Apr 2017

The Palmer Report takes the article from The Hill, rephrases the content, and puts a clickbait headline on it.

Brother Buzz

(36,409 posts)
43. That's what they do, and often with a less the honest spin to sensationalize it...
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 01:15 AM
Apr 2017

I read the OP, saw Palmer report, and searched for conformation. I'm always ready to dispel their story, but this time there actually is some there there.

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
103. You're right
Mon May 1, 2017, 10:46 AM
May 2017

I should have left open the possibility that you've never read anything that he posted.

I can't think of a third possibility... because it sure ain't that he's a reliable source.

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
105. Yea well like I mentioned in a previous post Joy Reid follows him along with a lot of
Mon May 1, 2017, 10:55 AM
May 2017

people on Twitter that have huge followings. And that is just the ones that I also follow. He has 61K followers so if you're right we are all just stupider than you

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
111. Credibility by twitter follower count?
Mon May 1, 2017, 11:06 AM
May 2017

What if I'm following him just for the free laughs?

Trump reportedly has tens of millions of twitter followers. Does that mean he's credible?

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,839 posts)
38. Two questions.
Sat Apr 29, 2017, 11:59 PM
Apr 2017

First, is this a reliable source?

And why would this plan be made public like this? Wouldn't just going ahead and filing the lawsuit, once all the details are actually in place, make a lot more sense?

Why does this feel like yet another daydream?

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
50. The Palmer has been right all along. It's one of those places that seems like like they
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 07:10 AM
Apr 2017

have either someone on the inside or they are just really smart. Same with Adam Kahn. (sp)

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
99. That is only one that has been mentioned here. If that is the only one he got
Mon May 1, 2017, 05:31 AM
May 2017

wrong I think he is pretty on the mark

Maraya1969

(22,474 posts)
104. OK well there's that. But Joy Reid follows him on Twitters and some others that have
Mon May 1, 2017, 10:52 AM
May 2017

huge followings folllow him so either they all are stupid, (which could happen as we all know) of they might think he is pretty on most of the time

radius777

(3,635 posts)
98. Agree, Palmer is entertaining and insightful, a liberal Drudge type imo,
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 11:55 PM
Apr 2017

and is right about a whole lot of things the MSM won't cover.

He is sensationalist, but not overly so, one just has to take some of what he says with a grain of salt.

What I like about him is that he's a true blue supporter of the Dem party and mainstream Dem figures and focuses on topics rank-and-file Dems are interested in - unlike most left leaning sites that are infested with the alt-left types who hate the party, or overly clinical NPR-ish type sites that are boring, or left-leaning corporate media sites that are too trendy and superficial.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
53. Media Bias Fact Check: "Left Bias" / Factual Reporting: "MIXED"
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 07:19 AM
Apr 2017

I hope you're not on a restrictive diet. It appears that you may exceed your daily salt intake if you read his stuff often. From what I can tell he has great appeal to the left leaning partisans. But as "fun" and satisfying as he may be to read, it looks as though he's getting mixed reviews when it comes to facts and reliability.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/palmer-report/



These media sources are moderately to strongly biased toward liberal causes through story selection and/or political affiliation. They may utilize strong loaded words (wording that attempts to influence an audience by using appeal to emotion or stereotypes), publish misleading reports and omit reporting of information that may damage liberal causes. Some sources in this category may be untrustworthy. See all Left Bias sources.

Factual Reporting: MIXED

sharedvalues

(6,916 posts)
66. As if mediabiasrepory or any site can be impartial
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 10:01 AM
Apr 2017

Agreed that Palmer report offers little reporting

Disagree that there is any human who can be entirely impartial on media reporting. All reporting including mediabiasreport will have some bias.

Bias is a subjective thing that cannot be reduced to objectivity.

BigmanPigman

(51,583 posts)
44. Maybe he'll use this as a convenient excuse to resign
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 03:27 AM
Apr 2017

(choosing to maintain his personal business empire). He'll save face and it's better than a disgracing impeachment. Besides, the job is too much work and too hard. And he needs to play more golf.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
45. Anything - I just want him and his evil family to go away forever.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:08 AM
Apr 2017

I have almost forgotten what life was like before this horror was brought upon us.

onetexan

(13,035 posts)
46. Just do it. We need to stop playing nice &letting gop/ orange idiot steamroller us
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 04:12 AM
Apr 2017

Time to take the gloves off

DownriverDem

(6,227 posts)
56. What's worse?
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 07:41 AM
Apr 2017

What about pence? He is a radical religious RWNJ repub. If pence were to go, we'd get ryan. Who would be better to destroy all I care about?

 

tomp

(9,512 posts)
59. i don't want trump to resign.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 08:32 AM
Apr 2017

i want the entire regime to be implicated in electoral crimes/treason, thereby invalidating the entire election, including some congressional elections.

i understand this will precipitate a constitutional crisis. but trump resignation just gives us pence, etc, down the chain of succession. that's not good enough.

Orrex

(63,195 posts)
69. If a judge orders Trump to release his tax returns, he'll simply refuse
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 10:55 AM
Apr 2017

"Fake judges," he'll gurgle, and his entire army of asshole fuckheads--including the congressional GOP--will support him.

Then what? After Trump shits once again on the separation of powers and judicial authority, what happens next?

Scruffy1

(3,254 posts)
78. Ho hum.
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 01:19 PM
Apr 2017

Any gaggle of lawyers could stall this in court for years and years. Our legal system is right out of Dickens' "Bleak House". Trumpism won't be defeated by the courts, but by organization. 2018 is only a few months away, and this is what we need to concentrate on.

cstanleytech

(26,280 posts)
94. There is one other option and that is Trump could simply decide to put
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 06:13 PM
Apr 2017

all his assets in a blind trust the judge would then Trumps lawyers would move for a dismissal of the case.

red dog 1

(27,792 posts)
97. K&R
Sun Apr 30, 2017, 07:14 PM
Apr 2017

There already is a lawsuit against Trump for violating the Emoluments Clause.
It was filed back in January by Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016183503

no_hypocrisy

(46,067 posts)
128. Resigning is the only viable option to removing from office.
Wed May 3, 2017, 06:34 AM
May 2017

The Republicans in the House will not vote to impeach him and even if they did, the Republicans in the Senate will not vote to convict.

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