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factfinder_77

(841 posts)
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:06 PM Feb 2017

There are no Sanders movement - GE voting numbers - millenials turnout rate is down and more diverse


CIRCLE’s analysis of the national exit poll data also suggests that levels of racial and ethnic diversity among the youth electorate were consistent with the previous two presidential elections: overall, millennial voters are more diverse than the rest of the electorate.


About half the number of eligible voters between the ages of 18 and 29 (whom we’ll refer to as “millennials,” although millennials also include people in their early-to-mid-30s) cast ballots in this election. That rate falls well below the estimated general voter turnout rate of roughly 58 percent. About 55 percent of those millennial voters supported Clinton, as compared to the 60 percent who supported Obama in 2012, according to CIRCLE’s analysis. Conversely, youth support from Republicans remained relatively constant: Trump got about 37 percent of the youth vote, roughly equivalent to what Mitt Romney received in 2012.


https://ww2.kqed.org/lowdown/2016/11/14/how-millennials-voted/

That gap in millennial support this year is evident in the increase in support for third-party candidates (from 3 percent nationally in 2012 to 8 percent this year) and potentially lower voter turnout, particularly in swing states. Although millennials nationwide still favored Democrats by 18 points, that margin of support was 5 percentage points lower than in 2012, and more than 20 points lower in some of the swing states that Obama won and Clinton lost.

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There are no Sanders movement - GE voting numbers - millenials turnout rate is down and more diverse (Original Post) factfinder_77 Feb 2017 OP
Say it aint so... Democrats voting 3rd party caused a shift to Trump.. boston bean Feb 2017 #1
Utterly predictable. MineralMan Feb 2017 #2
These people were like bible thumpers, cultists much of the time. boston bean Feb 2017 #3
Cultists. Yes. There's no other word that works. NurseJackie Feb 2017 #4
You could not reason. it was useless. They had drunk themselves into a tizzy boston bean Feb 2017 #5
Even the current reality of having Trump in office won't awaken them. They're still in denial ... NurseJackie Feb 2017 #14
There was one poster since no banned, who always claimed to be bullied, yet was the biggest bully of boston bean Feb 2017 #15
Well said, Jackie.. thank you! Cha Feb 2017 #70
I think what we missed was convincing people MineralMan Feb 2017 #6
That is true. But how to reach those? They believed the hype and decided they couldn't vote for boston bean Feb 2017 #8
Here's what I think. I think we became overconfident that MineralMan Feb 2017 #10
I really do think the Comey thing gave many people an excuse to vote trump. boston bean Feb 2017 #12
"Democrats fall in love but Republicans fall in line" SharonAnn Feb 2017 #69
There were a lot of factors, but I think complacency was a big one True_Blue Feb 2017 #61
Millenial GOP was the same, Millenial DEM down and shifted to 3 party factfinder_77 Feb 2017 #7
Sanders wasn't on the ballot. bunnies Feb 2017 #9
No. We know. He would have lost, too. MineralMan Feb 2017 #11
Youre psychic, eh? Cool! bunnies Feb 2017 #20
No, I'm not psychic. I don't believe anyone is. MineralMan Feb 2017 #68
You cannot possible know that Calculating Feb 2017 #66
I see, but I might possibly know that. MineralMan Feb 2017 #67
That is not part of this discussion. this is a thread about the GE. Not Bernie/Hillary. boston bean Feb 2017 #13
I'm talking about the GE bunnies Feb 2017 #17
Bernie wasn't a candidate in the General Election. boston bean Feb 2017 #18
My point has nothing to do with the primary. bunnies Feb 2017 #21
It certainly doesn't have anything to do with GE, because he wasn't on the ballot. boston bean Feb 2017 #22
That was my point!!!!! Nt bunnies Feb 2017 #25
and??? If he were.. which he wasn't, but he should have been, but he wasn't boston bean Feb 2017 #26
The title of the OP prompted my first response. bunnies Feb 2017 #36
That is what this post was about. boston bean Feb 2017 #40
Hubby is a musician, so a lot of 20 somethings are around our house. bunnies Feb 2017 #48
I also started to vote as soon as I was able. LisaL Feb 2017 #52
I don't think they gave it much thought. At all. bunnies Feb 2017 #57
the question is, what was the point of the headline? What are those numbers supposed to say? nt JCanete Feb 2017 #23
Third party voters in the GENERAL. boston bean Feb 2017 #24
what does that have to do with Sanders? nt JCanete Feb 2017 #27
Read the OP. boston bean Feb 2017 #28
what? Where is his name mentioned other than the title? It's not in the article either, unless I JCanete Feb 2017 #30
I read the OP. boston bean Feb 2017 #31
and? Is the point to talk in some code that only certain people understand? Say I'm slow, or dumb, JCanete Feb 2017 #32
I don't particularly enjoy having words with you. And it aint because I can't handle it. boston bean Feb 2017 #33
Then why did you go as long as you did, saying absolutely nothing. nt JCanete Feb 2017 #35
I just told you, I don't enjoy having words with you, so I gave nothing. boston bean Feb 2017 #39
fair enough...you just couched it as if it was something. At least we both know it was worthless. JCanete Feb 2017 #41
now you know. boston bean Feb 2017 #43
Ignore that disruption. Hopefully, it will be gone soon. nt LexVegas Feb 2017 #42
Thanks Lex! boston bean Feb 2017 #45
oh really? What exactly are you fighting against here? Was my question legitimate or not, and if not JCanete Feb 2017 #46
It appears that the title of the OP... bunnies Feb 2017 #49
Sigh. NurseJackie Feb 2017 #19
Wheres my snarky gif? bunnies Feb 2017 #29
Okay, here you go. NurseJackie Feb 2017 #51
lol bunnies Feb 2017 #54
If the primaries were any indication... joshcryer Feb 2017 #44
they weren't, not that we should be back here again. Bunnies point was fair, JCanete Feb 2017 #53
millenial turnout was abyssmal in both joshcryer Feb 2017 #64
I disagree with you on that. No doubt super progressive candidates have an uphill battle. JCanete Feb 2017 #65
Plus they won't stay off my goddam grass. n/t QC Feb 2017 #16
HRC got a higher share of youth vote than any Dem candidate since the 26th amendment, except Obama fishwax Feb 2017 #34
Except.. cannabis_flower Feb 2017 #37
Is there a way to block terms so I can make all mention of Bernie disappear? NoGoodNamesLeft Feb 2017 #38
Only in thread titles, but yes: joshcryer Feb 2017 #47
How exactly does the data here back up the headline? BarackTheVote Feb 2017 #50
Rec'd. Iggo Feb 2017 #58
Should we have expected a 'Sanders movement' to carry over to the GE? jmg257 Feb 2017 #55
lulzy! Rex Feb 2017 #56
Millennials are not brand loyal - they just aren't. Blue Idaho Feb 2017 #59
Can we just stop with the Bernie bashing please? This article mentions absolutely KPN Feb 2017 #60
Sore winners. Iggo Feb 2017 #63
all i know is that in my local dem party, those who show up majority were for bernie dembotoz Feb 2017 #62
Bernie Sanders is never going to be President. Warren DeMontague Feb 2017 #71

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
1. Say it aint so... Democrats voting 3rd party caused a shift to Trump..
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:10 PM
Feb 2017

Who would have thunk it?

Everyone who warned please do not do that!

MineralMan

(146,242 posts)
2. Utterly predictable.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:15 PM
Feb 2017

I thought the rest of the Democratic voters would make that irrelevant, but I was wrong. Many people were wrong. We failed to do what was needed to secure the election for Hillary Clinton. I blame myself, too, for being too complacent.

I don't necessarily blame millennial voters. I blame all of us for not making absolutely certain enough people would turn out in every state to block Donald Trump. We failed to do that. More's the pity.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
3. These people were like bible thumpers, cultists much of the time.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:16 PM
Feb 2017

Talking with them was useless.

It made the job very difficult.

We gotta find ways around that.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
5. You could not reason. it was useless. They had drunk themselves into a tizzy
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:19 PM
Feb 2017

and no amount of narcan was bring them out of the fog.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
14. Even the current reality of having Trump in office won't awaken them. They're still in denial ...
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:33 PM
Feb 2017

... still justifying their choices and decisions, and still making excuses.

They're still fighting old fights, picking scabs, stirring up old arguments.

It never stops.

Frankly, I believe they are a distraction that weakens the party. People like that are divisive and only create feelings of ill-will and put a damper on getting the flames of motivation ignited.

They feel entitled, they want special attention and extra considerations that they're not willing to give to others. They are a wet blanket.

In my opinion they're dead-weight. The add nothing to our party and instead are holding us back. We're wasting our time with people like that and we'd be better off just to cut them loose and move on.


boston bean

(36,217 posts)
15. There was one poster since no banned, who always claimed to be bullied, yet was the biggest bully of
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:34 PM
Feb 2017

them all.

Remindeds me of Trump.

It's gotta be some sort of condition....

MineralMan

(146,242 posts)
6. I think what we missed was convincing people
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:20 PM
Feb 2017

who don't normally turn out. Turnouts were down among people who do vote for Democrats when they bother to vote. Even in my precinct in St. Paul, MN, turnout was lower, although we still gave Hillary about 60% of the vote. Even Minnesota was close this year. That should never have happened.

WI, PA and MI were the states where we lost this election. That was absolutely shocking to me. Somehow, we failed in those states to get enough Democratic voters to the polls. Why? I don't know. I'm a local worker, and don't engage in GOTV activities out of state. It's something that needs to be figured out and corrected, though.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
8. That is true. But how to reach those? They believed the hype and decided they couldn't vote for
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:22 PM
Feb 2017

either.

I don't think they could have been convinced either. Not in the environment of that election.

MineralMan

(146,242 posts)
10. Here's what I think. I think we became overconfident that
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:28 PM
Feb 2017

people would not vote for Trump and didn't work as hard as we could have.

In my own circle of Minnesota friends, there were two people who voted for Jill Stein. I talked to them several times, trying to convince them that was a big mistake. Their answer was, "Well, Hillary will win anyhow, so it's a protest vote." Now, they're horribly dismayed at the outcome. They do understand that they voted foolishly.

In Minnesota, they were right, but just barely. Hillary did win Minnesota. But, right next door, she lost Wisconsin.

We were overconfident, and let that lull us into less action that we should have taken. I've been doing GOTV for decades. The "sometimes" voters are always the target. You can never get them all to the polls, but if you work really hard, you can get some of them to the polls. I don't think they turned out this year, based on my review of my own precinct's vote. I think they simply stayed home and let things happen. That's always their default choice. GOTV should focus on that group, and usually does.

In 2016, we failed. Our overconfidence led to our defeat, I believe.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
12. I really do think the Comey thing gave many people an excuse to vote trump.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:30 PM
Feb 2017

That is what I also think happened. Not sure what anyone could have done about that. However, they all still knew what a bigoted, authoritarian piece of shit he was.

Bigotry is a deal breaker.

No matter what one though of Hillary, she was not bigoted.

SharonAnn

(13,771 posts)
69. "Democrats fall in love but Republicans fall in line"
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 03:17 PM
Feb 2017

Famous quote about primaries and the two parties. Democrats fall in love and if their chosen one doesn't win, they often disengage. Republicans will vote for the winner of their primary, whether not is was their chosen candidate.

True_Blue

(3,063 posts)
61. There were a lot of factors, but I think complacency was a big one
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 02:11 PM
Feb 2017

There are a few people I work with that supported Hillary, but didn't vote because they were too busy. They were sure that Hillary had the election in the bag and didn't need their vote anyway. Needless to say, they are sick over Trump and regret not voting now.

 

factfinder_77

(841 posts)
7. Millenial GOP was the same, Millenial DEM down and shifted to 3 party
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:22 PM
Feb 2017

Who would have known that being for a green economy "green party" actually would lead us down to the most corrupt, anti-environmental, anti LGBT, anti cultural and anti diverse precedency of all time.

MineralMan

(146,242 posts)
68. No, I'm not psychic. I don't believe anyone is.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 03:13 PM
Feb 2017

You have just read an opinion I hold. I don't need to be psychic to have one of those.

MineralMan

(146,242 posts)
67. I see, but I might possibly know that.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 03:12 PM
Feb 2017

When I write on DU, it is my opinion. It says so right in my signature line. Pretty much everything anyone writes here is that person's opinion, unless they're just posting something from somewhere else.

In any case, the election is over. It is finished, and the results are known. Speculation about something that has already occurred is not of much value, really. Just like my opinion.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
17. I'm talking about the GE
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:35 PM
Feb 2017

And since the title mocks the "Sanders movement" as it relates to the GE turnout, I think it's more than appropriate to point out that he wasn't on the ballot.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
18. Bernie wasn't a candidate in the General Election.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:35 PM
Feb 2017

Your point is about the primary and how he should have been the nominee.

Therefore, reliving the primary.

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
26. and??? If he were.. which he wasn't, but he should have been, but he wasn't
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:40 PM
Feb 2017

and it was rigged, blah blah blah.

He wasn't on the ballot. The only impact he had on the GE was him allowing his supporters to feel so aggrieved by the Democratic Party that they voted third party.

You wish to discuss his supporters who voted third party in the GE???????

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
36. The title of the OP prompted my first response.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:48 PM
Feb 2017

I in no way want to refight the primary. It was hell. I was a Sanders supporter. I voted for Hillary in the GE. I'd be happy to discuss his supporters who voted 3rd party. My honest opinion is that the years long trashing of Hillary took its toll. I know people who typically vote who didn't vote this time for precisely that reason.

Fuck. I couldn't even get my other half to the polls. Do you know how much of a failure I felt like? I'll never forgive him.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
48. Hubby is a musician, so a lot of 20 somethings are around our house.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:55 PM
Feb 2017

I badgered them relentlessly before November. Seeing them after the vote, almost none of them bothered. The silver lining, I guess, is that many of them are horrified. Maybe they'll wake the hell up.

I couldn't wait to vote when I was 18. Just happened to be for Bills first term. I don't understand those who can't be bothered. *sigh

LisaL

(44,967 posts)
52. I also started to vote as soon as I was able.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:17 PM
Feb 2017

WTF did they think was going to happen if Trump was elected? I guess they are finding out now.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
57. I don't think they gave it much thought. At all.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:34 PM
Feb 2017

I just hope they smarten up ahead of the midterms. I won't hold my breath though.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
30. what? Where is his name mentioned other than the title? It's not in the article either, unless I
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:43 PM
Feb 2017

missed it.
 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
32. and? Is the point to talk in some code that only certain people understand? Say I'm slow, or dumb,
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:45 PM
Feb 2017

and help to educate your fellow DUer. Don't be so damn coy. What purpose does that serve?

boston bean

(36,217 posts)
33. I don't particularly enjoy having words with you. And it aint because I can't handle it.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:46 PM
Feb 2017

It is really just very mundane to me.

So let me move on and stop with the badgering.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
41. fair enough...you just couched it as if it was something. At least we both know it was worthless.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:51 PM
Feb 2017
 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
46. oh really? What exactly are you fighting against here? Was my question legitimate or not, and if not
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:53 PM
Feb 2017

hell, I'm happy to learn.


Btw, what in your opinion, was being disrupted?

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
49. It appears that the title of the OP...
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:05 PM
Feb 2017

mentions Bernie just to be inflammatory. There is nothing even close to that in the article.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
53. they weren't, not that we should be back here again. Bunnies point was fair,
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:18 PM
Feb 2017

and not fighting the primaries,but yay, look at where we are?

There is no question Sanders lost. Sanders movement is not so big when it comes to the general populace. I'm a big fan, and I'm still willing to accept that, just as anybody who uses primary numbers or says that Democratic voters rejected him, should be more honest about how the game was played by both candidates. Regardless of whether or not he lost, it is truly unprecedented that a national candidate got so far on private donations. That isn't to blame anybody for that playing field. It's a choice he made, and frankly, had he not made it, he wouldn't have even faired as well because that was kind of part of his brand which propelled him into prominence, but it is still a reality that he was the outsider with far less name recognition. Lost is totally legit. "Rejected&quot which you didn't use here, granted), is in a whole other category.

But back to Bunnies question though, which was apparently misconstrued. It was, how do the GE numbers have to do with Sanders, given that he wasn't on the ballot in the GE?

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
64. millenial turnout was abyssmal in both
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 02:29 PM
Feb 2017

There is no "movement"

It's politics as usual. And there's still the outstanding issue of how we win red states. It's going to have some tough as hell answers and it certainly isn't running super progressive candidates.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
65. I disagree with you on that. No doubt super progressive candidates have an uphill battle.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 02:36 PM
Feb 2017

They don't have any friends with money, and that hurts. Not only do they not get any support there, that's a big ass target on their back from industries that find them particularly unfriendly. But the message can catch on, and anything else loses more than half the time to Republicans anyway, so why go a route that has proven to attrit Democratic office holders in all state and federal races over the last 30 years?

fishwax

(29,148 posts)
34. HRC got a higher share of youth vote than any Dem candidate since the 26th amendment, except Obama
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:47 PM
Feb 2017

Good job, millennials!

cannabis_flower

(3,764 posts)
37. Except..
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:48 PM
Feb 2017

lots of Sanders' supporters were not millenials. I done know the percentages but I am 58 and many of my older friends supported Sanders. Most of them also voted for Hillary.

 

NoGoodNamesLeft

(2,056 posts)
38. Is there a way to block terms so I can make all mention of Bernie disappear?
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 12:48 PM
Feb 2017

So.fucking.sick.of.seeing.his.name.

BarackTheVote

(938 posts)
50. How exactly does the data here back up the headline?
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:12 PM
Feb 2017

First, the article seems to presuppose that the enthusiasm among millennials for Sanders' candidacy would transfer over to Clinton. Apparently, it didn't. Instead, it seems to have transitioned (among those who did vote) into protest votes for Stein (a five point swing toward third parties is nothing to sneeze at). Second, it's impossible to compare individuals who voted in the primaries with those who voted in the general; how many did one and not the other? What was the overlap? And how many millennials who may have voted for Sanders in the primaries stayed home, either as another form of protest, or simply because they were disheartened by what they perceived in the way in which the primaries were conducted (i.e., to show favortism to the "establishment candidate"--don't shoot the messenger here, this feeling/perception *was* real and *did* have an effect on my cohort).

The sad--and I know that's an understatement--truth is that the appearance of impropriety thanks to the DNC and Debbie Wasserman Schultz may have turned off a huge portion of that generation for years to come. There's also the fact that, look, we all expected Clinton to win--every single sign was there. A lot of people felt comfortable with their staying home/casting protest votes because we saw the tidings of a landslide. Unfortunately, when people make these sorts of personal decisions, they very rarely consider the hundred monkeys--that is, that if they are feeling/doing something, then there are likely hundreds if not thousands of people who are feeling/doing the same thing: enough to swing an election.

Polls bear this out: millennials are one of the most progressive cohorts around (and have a huge distaste for Republicans, their xenophobia, misogyny, racism, and austerity). At the same time as you have this low voter turnout, you're also seeing literally the largest protests in the history of the united states. And not just one, but in series and rapid succession. Do you really think you could have those kinds of numbers without millennials swelling the ranks?

I think a few lessons here, are: 1) millennials have no party loyalty; they support the candidate, not the party. 2) Millennials are vindictive, especially when it comes to perceived slights. 3) Millennials are extremely skeptical of anything they perceive to be "establishment" (conspiracy theories run like wildfire through my cohort; they don't "trust The Man." 4) Millennials are more likely to take their activism to the streets than to the ballot boxes. Take it or leave it, but I think these things need to be at least acknowledged. I think reaching out to millennials should be much easier than, say, reaching out to the blue-collar rustbelt worker who has let their animosity toward minorities fester and swell as their jobs get cut and their paycheck gets slashed (i.e., the people who apparently were instrumental in actively swinging this election toward 45*).

Then, there's the structural clusterf*ck that is our "representative" democracy at this moment in history. We've had a ticking timebomb sitting enshrined in law for 87 years: the Permanent Apportionment Act of 1929. Millennials are right, the fix is in. This one ruling destroyed any semblance of representation and skewed the electoral college in a radical way. This Act explains why Clinton could get such a commanding popular vote victory, and still lose the EC. Millennials are right, even if they might not know exactly why: the fix *is* in. They feel like they're not represented in popular elections--and they're right. And this feeling of disenfranchisement translates into a high likelihood of throwing in either a protest vote, or not voting at all. Getting this Act repealed should be a #1 priority for every progressive, and I think it's a movement with the potential to really capture, harness, and use the unique political tendencies of millennials. The fact is: gerrymandering is the reason the House is so far out of the reach of progressives, and the EC is responsible for giving us two of the least-qualified presidents in the history of this nation. These two facts play a huge role in why millennials are so turned-off to politics, but are so very willing to take to the streets. Don't blame us (nothing will get us to turn on you faster). Use us.

Please note: I voted for Sanders in the primaries, and Clinton in the general. Most of my interactions are with people from my cohort, and I have never seen so many of them paying attention to politics as in recent months, nor so active. There's a sleeping giant here, folks. Again, this sleeping giant *can* be reached with the right strategy, and playing the blame game ain't it.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
55. Should we have expected a 'Sanders movement' to carry over to the GE?
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:31 PM
Feb 2017

Wouldn't they be disappointed? Dejected? Less interested in the choices?

May also help explain the 5% shift to third party of those who were interested, which is the dif between Clinton % and Obama (while rep support remained the same).

Blue Idaho

(5,036 posts)
59. Millennials are not brand loyal - they just aren't.
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 01:36 PM
Feb 2017

The Millenials I know are more than happy to drop one party, product, or service for another at the first sign of dissatisfaction. Didn't have a great cup of coffee this morning? Fine, I'll go to a different coffee shop. Sign up for cable or satellite service? No thanks, I'll use the internet to get just the programming I want. My primary candidate didn't win? I'll go find someone else to support that fits my alt-tribal gestalt.

Is there anything really wrong with this? I dunno. It may be short sighted in terms of immediate outcomes but they seem to think more about what a politician can do for them rather than thinking about what they can do for our Democracy.

KPN

(15,633 posts)
60. Can we just stop with the Bernie bashing please? This article mentions absolutely
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 02:06 PM
Feb 2017

nothing about Bernie Sanders, yet you decide Bernie needs to stand out as the key phrase in your thread.

Bernie wasn't in the GE. Bernie didn't lose the GE. Stop dividing.

dembotoz

(16,783 posts)
62. all i know is that in my local dem party, those who show up majority were for bernie
Sat Feb 18, 2017, 02:17 PM
Feb 2017

and i can assure you they worked to get hrc elected....

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»There are no Sanders move...