General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThere is only one reason why corporations have moved overseas
The greedy owners and shareholders want more profits at the expense of their workers - they do not want to provide health care, insurance or vacation. They want to pay less and less so they can grab more and more. They do not believe they should pay taxes anywhere. Groper Don the Con has practiced this for decades.
Fuck them all.
madokie
(51,076 posts)Nothing like putting a fine point on what the problem is.
malaise
(268,725 posts)madokie
(51,076 posts)my friend
Jeffersons Ghost
(15,235 posts)These billion dollar money-makers do not plan to meet rational pollution standards or realize that Climate Change is having a much worse effect on the planet than media reports. Before factories of China and the USA were allowed to totally destroy it, Beijing was one of the most beautiful and historic places on Earth. Destroying the atmosphere is China, destroys the climate on a worldwide basis.
Richard D
(8,741 posts)I was there in 1983. Such a beautiful place.
Also, few people have noticed that in the Northern Hemisphere there's now a constant haze in the air. Even in the deepest of nature, it's there. This is from pollution from mainly China and India.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)This was once a beautiful 'small' city on the coast... ( right across the Yellow Sea from South Korea) and a major destination for Chinese vacationers with several beaches, beautiful hills....the home of TSINGDAO BEER yea !!...now.. the air is getting worse and worse....not as bad as inland but, pretty depressing....
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Get rid of healthcare, insurance, vacations, minimum wages, and corporate/upper income taxes.
The "Grapes of Wrath" model of employment.
Or worse.
Jeffersons Ghost
(15,235 posts)INdemo
(6,994 posts)"Hitler viewed Unions as a powerful threat
1933: Hitler Abolishes Unions
https://www.laprogressive.com/hitler-hated-unions/
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/03/senator_brown_says_hitler_and.html
Think about this Trump is sounding the Anti-Union alarm
Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)That way, outsourcing can be blamed on the government instead of greedy business owners. Try to get a Republican to blame cheap labor as the reason for outsourcing. They refuse to even acknowledge it.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)malaise
(268,725 posts)The idiots who voted for Groper Don the Con
IronLionZion
(45,380 posts)Oddly enough, many of the Trumpers I know are against "the cheap labor express". Mainly against immigration. But they think they will have more jobs and higher wages with Trump.
Bear Creek
(883 posts)They must not like his labor Secretary pick. The ones at work want everything as cheap as possible.
FarCenter
(19,429 posts)Those "trade missions" are designed to keep or acquire US alliances. The globalist foreign policy establishment does not care about American workers -- only American global political, financial, and military power.
RKP5637
(67,089 posts)malaise
(268,725 posts)Nice pliant governments who are 'grateful' for jobs make great allies - they turn against their own people.
RKP5637
(67,089 posts)those making obscene profits by dumping on their own country are immersed in US politics and power pulling the strings.
Trump is capitalism on steroids. It laughable and sad that the deplorables think he and his crew are going to be their hero. None of this is going to end well for the US.
malaise
(268,725 posts)panader0
(25,816 posts)the world will know peace." (Jimi and Gandhi)
CincyDem
(6,338 posts)I can't help but wonder about the effect of diminishing technical education and skills. When you look at where we are on the global rankings for math and science skills, it's only average at best. In Math we're below average trailing countries like Vietnam, Lithuania, and Hungary to name a few. In Science we're tucked in just a hair above average and well behind Slovenia - you know, the country we mock because it produced Melania.
So part of it is the economic drivers of company management but I don't think you can rule out that Republican's destruction of the public education system has not only hampered critical thinking skills (see 2016 election results), it's also hampered technology thinking skills necessary to compete in the new, post industrial age world.
malaise
(268,725 posts)you can drain other countries of their home trained scientists
TheBlackAdder
(28,169 posts).
At least that is the excuse that the RWers gave last year to justify such actions.
Most of the financial institutions are shifting their staff to Eastern Europe and Pacific Rim, a slow migration.
Of course, those moves will not be reported on, even though it's tens of thousands of jobs a year.
.
treestar
(82,383 posts)It's the capitalist's nature to lower costs of production. What surprises me is the distance! China is so far way yet their labor is so much cheaper that the shipping cost does not undo the benefit.
Wounded Bear
(58,605 posts)close down the oil and the whole economy collapses. That's why they cling to the oil based economy and geopolitics.
Yavin4
(35,423 posts)To meet global demand for products, you need a massive work force to meet the demand. We don't have a large enough workforce to do it.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)Some companies move their operations overseas not because of labor costs, but because they want to finance stock buyback plans that artificially inflate stock prices for their shareholders. See Carrier.
SunSeeker
(51,523 posts)The union chief for Carrier, the one Trump bashed on Twitter and blamed for jobs moving, told Lawrence that the union asked Carrier what they could do to keep the jobs in the US. Carrier said there is nothing the workers could do because they'd need to take less than $5 an hour, which would be illiegal as less than minimum wage.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)UT share prices were down. UT decided to buy up $16 billion worth of shares. This would artificially inflate the price of UT stock, which makes UT shareholders very happy. The trouble is, $16 billion isn't exactly chump change for a company that profits about $2 billion a quarter, give or take.
In other words, United Technologies executives decided to kill thousands jobs to keep their stock options strong.
Of the two stories, "we're outsourcing you to save labor costs" is probably the one least likely to generate outrage.
Here's the skinny: http://www.wsj.com/articles/united-technologies-unveils-12-billion-buyback-1445343580
SunSeeker
(51,523 posts)Like Carrier told the union chief, "it's just business." That is why business must be regulated. Left to its own devices, it does horrible things to workers, because workers are a commodity to corporations, much like paper clips. Corporations will go for the cheapest paper clips, every time, unless the law prevents it.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)There's really no point in continuing this if you can't be bothered to read what's put in front of you.
SunSeeker
(51,523 posts)It says:
The maker of Pratt & Whitney jet engines, Otis elevators and Carrier air-conditioning equipment reported a 5.6% decline in third-quarter sales to $13.8 billion, while profit fell 26% to $1.36 billion.
Looks like poor profits drove them to prop up their stock with a buy back to prevent the stock from tanking from a shareholders' sell-off. To make their bottom line look better and bolster stock price, they cut costs, including resorting to cheap out of country labor.
The labor savings from moving to Mexico will be about $65 million annually. Considering United Technologies has annual revenues of $55 Billion, that kind of cost savings "starts to approach irrelevant." https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/amp/articles/2016-11-30/united-technologies-trump-focus-on-carrier-shows-farce-of-deal
They do this shit because, short of laws forbiddong it, that is what for-profit businesses do. It is not spurred by any particular stock buyback scheme or actual need to cut costs. It is spurred by what capitalism is all about: maximizing profits, even if they are already profitable. It is never enough. They always want more profit.
2naSalit
(86,378 posts)given above and I'll add another... they don't want to be environmentally responsible either. They hate that we have clean air, water and other protective policies and laws to protect the biosphere and these greedy fucks don't want to clean up their acts, they just want to do everything "down and dirty" because it costs less. So now you see the selections for high office this past two weeks turning out to be the very enemies of the environment these laws were intended to protect us from,... and they intend to kill all of those laws protecting our air, water, wildlife, natural resources.
malaise
(268,725 posts)We're fugged collectively
2naSalit
(86,378 posts)I live at the edge of one wilderness, in view of two others and near two national parks as well... these and all National Forest and BLM lands surrounding them are all at risk now.
MrModerate
(9,753 posts)Many corporations are genuinely global -- they work across state boundaries. A lot of US-based companies have grown to cover the entire world.
And it's a basic rule of business to reduce costs when practical to do so.
The trick is to set the rules so that sophisticated private entities can't game the world system. If the UN had any teeth, it could police transnational commerce and mitigate abuses.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)it all on Unions I could scream. Why are do so many working people side with the 1%?
Aimee in OKC
(158 posts)while at the same time going along with the demonizing of government as the problem, not the solution, to society's ills.
Done properly, though --> "Government Is Good" . This is an extensive website (look in the left-hand column) which is the project of Douglas J. Amy, Professor of Politics at Mount Holyoke College, with some excellent resources.
"A Guide to Rebutting Right-Wing Criticisms of Government"
http://www.governmentisgood.com/feature.php?fid=14
"The Forgotten Achievements of Government"
http://www.governmentisgood.com/articles.php?aid=7
And the classic "A Day in Your Life"
http://www.governmentisgood.com/articles.php?aid=1
* * * * * * *
It would be nice to see a billboard along the lines of
" Are you a fish?
Fish don't think about water ...
http://www.governmentisgood.com/ "
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)I have bookmarked on my computer for further reading and reference.
rainy
(6,088 posts)When we taxed Corporations at a high rates after the first few million in profits they wisely chose to put that money back into their companies in the form of good wages and benefits, rather than pay 70% taxes on excess profits.
Now that they have written all the laws and bought all of our politicians, they get to keep all of their profits and they just keep enriching themselves and their CEO's and investors without having to pay for all that taxpayers give to them in the form of good roads, educated employees, court systems, fire and police protection and so much more. Tax payers now pay for all of THEIR benefits!
malaise
(268,725 posts)NRaleighLiberal
(60,009 posts)ghostsinthemachine
(3,569 posts)If they don't, they are illegal. PUBLIC corporation must maximize profits in every way possible. It is the ONE AND ONLY responsibility they have.
End Corporate PERSONHOOD, unless that changes, NOTHING CHANGES.
Moostache
(9,895 posts)Then make them all criminally liable (and more importantly prosecutable and actually PROSECUTED, TRIED AND CONVICTED) for any malfeasance their corporate "person" commits. And since right-wingers all *claim* to love "law and order", let's make sure that the death penalty is applied generously to their crimes against humanity...
Environmental dumping? Will not happen if the CEO believes he could be electrocuted as a result of authorizing it.
If we really want to balance the behavior of corporations with humanity, we will end the "fiduciary responsibility" bullshit and replace it with human, environment and communal responsibilities that must be balanced AGAINST the "fiduciary responsibility".
Make CEOs HUMAN again...and the world will instantly become a better place!
CCExile
(465 posts)This meme is a rightist lie.
byronius
(7,391 posts)-- had as part of its language that the corporation must serve the good of the public first. This was the 1600's.
This language was adopted by the British and then by the Americans in turn. In the early 1930's, a series of court cases allowed the then-absolutely-corrupt Republican Party to remove that language from the corporate charter.
It's just who they are. Burn it all down for pure profit.
my ancestors were highly profitable to the Chambers of Commerce
randr
(12,409 posts)were American Unions. Once they were neutralized and the corporations gained access to writing international trade agreements, one of Clintons' mistakes, we are left with the world we live in today.
As long as Walmarts showed up in every city to provide the foreign imported goods replacing American made products consumers were happy to trade jobs for cheap crap.
We are all complicit and the 1% are more than happy to take advantage of the situation.
Kolesar
(31,182 posts)Continental tire could not sell into South America with the cost of American labor in the tires, so they built plants near the markets. Then shipping tires back to America was just an obvious, profitable plan. To their credit, Goodyear makes Indy Car tires in Akron still.
50 Shades Of Blue
(9,928 posts)YOHABLO
(7,358 posts)Fast Walker 52
(7,723 posts)LittleGirl
(8,280 posts)Sunlei
(22,651 posts)When they allow Corporations to take full advantage of our 13th amendment.
About 50,000+ work for Corps today, many thousands more fight the wildfires, work on Corporate farms, slaughterhouses, fish farms. That number of 3rd class, unpaid worker can easily increase to several million workers.
IronLionZion
(45,380 posts)if we have universal Medicare for all. It's the pro-business, pro-jobs plan. If rich people don't like it, they can buy their own private supplemental insurance, just like Canada.
The groper might actually support this and said good things about it before.
But most likely they're going to cut taxes. Dems should make sure they cut many of the corporate subsidies and deductions they abuse too. Especially if they take taxpayer money and then move jobs outside our country. Those types should be called out for a lack of patriotism.
SleeplessinSoCal
(9,088 posts)raccoon
(31,105 posts)rurallib
(62,387 posts)in some industries that are harder to move facilities (meat packing for instance) enticed workers to enter the US illegally to be used as union busters.
Then when the heat gets turned on about illegal workers the corporations know nothing.
malaise
(268,725 posts)ananda
(28,837 posts).. nobody is stopping them.
They're oughta be a law ...
BlancheSplanchnik
(20,219 posts)Right you are.
Fuck em, we shall.
Rusty flagpole, we will use. Sideways.
Initech
(100,043 posts)They could make $85 billion in profits in one quarter, and they would be like "How can we increase our profit margins?". Fuck them.
malaise
(268,725 posts)like drug addicts
spanone
(135,795 posts)Mike Nelson
(9,944 posts)...quite nicely.
Bear Creek
(883 posts)Remember he turned our economy into a service economy. Every one was going to lineup for America's money making prowlness. I remember telling the republicans what is going to happen when there is no one left here to buy their crap. They said they wanted people here "not them" to take any job they could get with low wages and be glad they got it. They did not want to pay $5.00 for a hamburger.
malaise
(268,725 posts)He turned citizens into consumers and society into a marketplace - their aim is to destroy the public good
Bear Creek
(883 posts)Funny how they now dont like Reagan's policies now