Holy fucking shit. So this is really happening.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

Last edited Wed May 4, 2016, 10:17 AM - Edit history (1)

We're actually going to see Donald Fucking Trump as a major party nominee, with--strictly on paper, mind you--a 50% chance of obtaining the presidency and most powerful position in the world.

Donald Fucking Trump, a classic NPD egomaniac with zero elected experience and an awful business record.

Donald Fucking Trump, a man with a third grade vocabulary and someone who feels it necessary to pick Twitter fights with Rosie O'Donnell.

Donald Fucking Trump, a man who rose in the polls thanks to the support of fascists...no, really, fascists.

Sure, in all logic we should wipe the floor with him, but still, if we don't....the stakes are so high.

Donald. Fucking. Trump.


EDITED TO ADD FOR THE GD: P-SPEAK CREEPING IN HERE: My trepidation about Donald Trump and my disgust that he could potentially be president has absolutely nothing to do with any perceived weaknesses of either potential Democratic nominee, both of whom I'd be glad to vote for and against Donald Trump, and both of whom I believe can win, assuming the American electorate has any sanity whatsoever.

Let's clear that up right now. And let's not turn this thread into GD: P.

[TDale313]

1. Yep. It's happening.

The frightening thing is he could actually win this thing.

[litlbilly]

37. especially if Hillary is the nominee.

[TDale313]

43. Yeah, Trump v Hillary is a really bad match-up for Dems.

Her weaknesses feed right into his strengths. Nominating her is a big mistake.

[litlbilly]

48. I think down ballots would suffer as well. WE need all the indies voting for down ballots as well.

If we can get the nom for Bernie, it would open the door to flood as many true progressive candidates and maybe make huge gains in the house. Maybe a bit wishful thinking, but not out of the question.

[dchill]

179. There's that, too.

Hillaroids don't care. Downballots are just a way for HRC to steal campaign funds.

[SylviaD]

208. "Hillaroids"?

Trump doesn't have a chance in hell to beat Hillary. Not one iota of a chance.

And neither does Bernie Sanders have a chance in hell of being the nominee. Not one iota of a chance.

I'm tired of taking abuse and my candidate taking abuse. From Trump supporters AND from Bernie Sanders supporters.

President Clinton - get used to it.

[dchill]

214. "President Clinton - get used to it."

That's something I already had to do. 23 years ago. "Hillaroids" is not a smear on your candidate. I'd think that would be obvious. We BernieBros Unicorn Free Stuffers are used to abuse, what's your problem? Don't play the victim card with me - I don't care.

[Shadowflash]

220. Resistance is futile. prepare to be assimilated.

[fun n serious]

56. She is NOT WEAK. She is winning.

Bernie does not have the votes. VOTES show strength NOTHING else

[Android3.14]

63. She isn't winning

With all the help she is receiving and her support is so weak with everyone.

Sanders is a uch better candidate for beating Trump.

[fun n serious]

64. She has won.

Her supporters obviously turned out the vote

[pangaia]

81. But won WHAT?

There is "winning' something, and then there is winning,.. and then there is winning 'something else.'

[RiverNoord]

164. Precisely.

Your question goes directly to the heart of the matter. That is probably the most important question for Hillary Clinton and her campaign to examine and analyze. If they are genuinely interested in broad Democratic Party success, they need to appraise the situation very, very carefully.

The better question, when the primary started becoming competitive, would have been, 'if we win, what exactly have we won?' Given the conduct of the campaign, I doubt that it has been given much consideration at all...

[pangaia]

182. Thank you for saying that.

I am glad someone else sees it.. And you said it much better than I could.

What price victory...or... defeat....?

[RiverNoord]

185. You said it exactly right.

I just threw a few more words at it.

Your words brought something lingering in my subconscious up to full realization, and I'm very grateful for that.

The thanks is yours

[RiverNoord]

213. Oops - I forgot to mention this...

I hope you don't take this negatively, but, OK, I was a big Tom Baker (Dr. Who) fan as a kid. Even now, looking at your Dylan pic, it's like one of those gimmick images that change when you look at in from one side or the other...

The hair, the scarf... It just makes we want to ask if you want a jelly baby.

If you don't get the reference, you've missed out on some really fun sci-fi with astoundingly badly costumed aliens.

[pangaia]

216. You are way over my head. LOL,,,

But there is a guy here, "ACTOR" fairly new, with Bob Marley for his avatar who thinks it is Dylan.

Click the link, then scroll down to see his reply to me and my reply to him..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1900670

[Beartracks]

218. Wow, I guess I never looked at your avatar closely.

I thought that *was* Tom Baker!

==============================

[RiverNoord]

229. lol - see?

[RiverNoord]

231. Well, hell. I thought it was Bob Dylan too.

And beartracks thought it was Tom Baker, but I only thought it looked a lot like Tom Baker at a glance.

Which means I've just got to straight-out ask - who is the person displayed in your avatar pic?

You've got us all perplexed

[pangaia]

232. My avatar is Dylan..... I think I screwed up.

That's why I deleted my post.. I think.. I had just returned from Seoul.. I was awake for about 20 hours before I left and awake for another 24 or so hours when I posted.....






So y'all can relax. :&gt ))

[RiverNoord]

233. LOL

Got it.

I'm not going crazy - at least not based on confusion about your avatar pic.

It was a little bit of fun trying to sort it out, but I hope you get your system re-synced soon.

I suppose you can see - I'm not much of an avatar guy. However, your other-side-of-the-planet system lag might just have inspired me to find an enigmatic one and drop perplexing anti-hints when people ask.

[pangaia]

234. I had to read that last paragraph three times.

Which means,, I DO think you have a future here in doing exactly that.



Go for it.

[geardaddy]

196. Excellent analysis.

Thank you.

[JDPriestly]

82. She does not appeal to independents or disgruntled Republicans. That is her problem.

She has a free trade, NAFTA, . . . AFTA problem.

[fun n serious]

84. Obviously DEMS want her over Bernie

He failed to appeal to dems. The strong hold

[TM99]

89. Still going with that

popular vote myth eh?

Technically, the count is accurate, but in reality the claim that Clinton is leading the votes is another Hillary distortion, a reflection of the dishonesty that leads to her being highly distrusted by most voters. But none of the mainstream media have called her on this distortion.

For example, in Washington state, where there are, according to the 2015 census numbers, about 7.17 million people, here are the numbers, Sanders won 19,159 votes for 72.7%. Clinton won 7,140 votes for 27.1%. Based on those numbers, Bernie Sanders gets a 12,000 voter advantage in Hillary's way of counting. Really? 12,000 voters are all the credit Bernie gets for winning a state with over seven million people? (actually, over 250,000 participated in the caucuses. Still those numbers don't reflect the size of the state's population.)

If you do the math on all the caucus states, Bernie's wins could easily represent populations that exceed Hillary's 2.5 million votes, not even including the primary state votes he won. It is insulting to the people of Washington to suggest that they be counted based on the 26,000 who voted in the caucuses.
Because Minnesota is a caucus state, Bernie only gets an advantage of 45,000 when it should be hundreds of thousands. The same is true in Kansas, where he only gets credit for 14,000 advantage, when it should be at least 80,000. Colorado would give him a 23,000 advantage based on caucuses, but he should get at least a 120,000 advantage based on population.

This applies to the following caucus states that Bernie won, Washington, Utah, Kansas, Minnesota, Colorado, Nebraska, Maine, Idaho, Alaska, and Hawaii, representing about 32 million people.
Bernie won many of these by 60, 70, even 80%. Of course some are primarily conservative, which has an effect on the numbers. Let's say that Democratic leaning voters represented 45%, which would be 14.4 million. If Bernie won with an average of 60 to 40% that would be a 20% difference, or 2.9 million. Of course voter turnout has to be figured in.

Let's compare Massachusetts with Minnesota. MA has about 6.7 million people. Minnesota has about 20% less, with 5.5 million. Hillary won MA by a 1.4% margin. Bernie won MN by a 23.4% margin. Hillary gets 17,000 margin for her miniscule margin win. Bernie, with a margin thats gets 44,000. A proportional accounting, for a state that large would give him close to 750,000, or 700,000 more. The same kind of math applies to all the caucus states mentioned above.

The truth is that using popular vote numbers is a deceptive way to talk about comparing campaigns. An honest candidate would not attempt to do so. Clinton embraces it.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Hillary-s-Disingenuous-Cla-by-Rob-Kall-2016-Presidential-Primary-Candidates_Hillary-Clinton-160401-967.html

[NJCher]

152. thanks for that

I was trying to explain it, and this will help.

Is it any wonder she has an honesty problem?



Cher

[TM99]

217. You are welcome!

Anyone paying attention for the last 30 years knows that both the Clintons have an honesty problem.

[JDPriestly]

99. Something I noticed about the Indiana primary.

The number of Republicans who voted for Trump v. the number who voted for the Democrats.

634,678 Democrats total. 1,096,179 Republicans when I last looked.

http://www.nytimes.com/elections/results/indiana

Hillary got 301,604 Democratic votes.

Bernie got 301,604.

Indiana is a conservative state, but think about those numbers.

Cruz got 402,115 votes.

It's important that any Democratic candidate be really strong. Republicans have hated Hillary for a long time. It may not be fair, but that is the way it is.

Lots of Independents and some Republicans really like Bernie. He is strongly opposed to the trade deals and is trustworthy. We need a candidate people trust. Bernie is it.

We need a candidate who knows his way around Congress. Bernie is it.

Bernie is the best candidate for Democrats for this year in every respect.

[fun n serious]

106. I have to respectfully disagree..

Hillary has been fighting negative ads from BOTH republicans and liberals this whole primary Bernie hasn't had any negetive ads against him. He is not tested. She is. This is not a close race. She is beating Bernie pretty big. Voters win a race not stats. She has a comfortable win.

[JDPriestly]

111. Have you read Bernie's book, Outsider in the White House?

Republicans have tried negative advertising against Bernie for many election cycles. The don't work.

Read his book. He is a man of courage and of integrity. Just read it. Get to know who he is, something beyond the in-crowd's scuttlebutt.

[Petrushka]

129. I ordered a copy over the weekend. It'll be here by tomorrow.

[leeroysphitz]

145. Wasting your time. The blinders have been on for years. n/t

[pangaia]

187. YES ! Exactly...

[Petrushka]

128. The Democratic vote figures in your reply#99 (Hillary 301,604 & Bernie 301,604) would indicate a tie

Here's a copy-and-paste from the NYT link you provided:


Democratic Primary

Sanders has won Indiana, according to A.P.
Candidates Vote Pct. Delegates
Bernie Sanders 334,348 52.5% 43
Hillary Clinton 302,676 47.5 37

637,024 votes, 98% reporting (5,263 of 5,374 precincts)
Winner

[brush]

175. So Clinton and Sanders got nearly the same number of votes/delegates?

He spent millions in ad buys in Indiana and she made zero ad buys, a prudent and wise decision to save resources as the delegate math shows.

Sanders spent millions for a net gain of maybe 10 delegates. Clinton still leads in pledged delegates by 290 instead 300.

Making good decisions on how to spend campaign money shows who is running their campaign best, and with not enough states or delegates left for Sanders to catch up, the Clinton campaign is showing how it's done.

[JDPriestly]

184. Read Bernie's book. He is the one with good judgment about how to sped money.

He spent more in Indiana because he did not go into this primary with a lot of name recognition. Hillary did.

[brush]

188. He didn't go into the Indiana primary with name recognition? Are you serious?

What, has Indiana been asleep for the last year and not heard about Sanders running in primary after primary, caucus after caucus in state after state — adjacent states included?

You have to do better than that.

This campaign has been going on for over a year and Sanders' name has been all over TV, newspapers and the internet. Indiana has those "newfangled" things right?

Your argument makes no sense whatsoever.

[JDPriestly]

189. He does not have the name recognition that the wife of a former president has.

No way.

Think about it. President Clinton is a household word. President Sanders is not. That's the difference. It is not a matter of conscious thinking but of the subconscious and how we store language. Hillary has a name recognition that we rarely see in a presidential contest. George W. Bush benefited from the same kind of name recognition.

And in addition, Hillary was Secretary of State.

She demonstrated immense incompetency in much of what she did in the Congress and the State Department (for example, the e-mails), but her name was heard on the news constantly.

Bernie actually has more experience and has proved more competent in his years in government, but was not referred to in the news on a frequent basis so he has less name recognition.

[eridani]

125. Dems are 30% of the electorate. Independents are 42% n/t

[Petrushka]

131. That's just some more of that gosh-durn unrealistic unicorny Bernie Math that . . .

. . . Camp Weathervane hasn't learned because it doesn't want to
accept that Hillary's appeal outside the camp might be much less
than expected.

[freebrew]

170. He got half of our votes in MO(probably more)...

so obviously, not ALL Democrats want her.

[doc03]

104. One hell of a lot of disgruntled Democrats and Union members wil never vote for her either.

Bill Clinton brought us NAFTA, the steel industry was destroyed while he was president and he did nothing.
Then she says she is going to put a lot of coal miners and companies out of business. But Hillary does stand far better
chance than Sanders does.

[fun n serious]

107. WOMEN, BLACK,S LATINOS nt,

[doc03]

113. Believe it or not there are women, blacks and latinos that

will vote for him. Nobody thought Trump would get this far, what makes you think they are right now?
He is going to be on Morning Joe tomorrow at 6am telling us about Crooked Hillary. The news media is
going to keep falling over each other to cover Trump.

[fun n serious]

120. Yep. It's sickening.

I still thing Hillary is stronger than Bernie. The media needs some responsible journalist. There are none left.

[The Wizard]

172. The media played a large role in lying about Al Gore and John Kerry

Our propaganda outlets painted Gore and Kerry in a bad light. Gore was a serial liar and Kerry faked injuries to get Purple Hearts. The media/propaganda outlets played a major role in inflicting the criminal Bush cartel an the world.
If Hillary wins there's a 50 / 50 chance of an unnecessary war. If it's Trump we will be in an unnecessary war. If it's Bernie we'll not be in an unnecessary war.
Our propaganda outlets love war. It makes people pay attention to them.

[Petrushka]

133. Oh, how I would enjoy hearing she plans to campaign at Wheeling's Waterfront Wharf in WV . . .

. . . where her hubby campaigned (with Gore) way-back-when. Although
I wouldn't be able to attend, I'm sure the steelworkers and coal miners
would be pleased to listen to Hillary talk at 'em and make more promises.
Better yet, maybe she could send Bill.

[doc03]

200. As far as steelworkers go we weren't doing too bad until "W" crashed

the economy in 2008. Coal is being hit by natural gas and the EPA. Then there is Bernie that wants to kill natural gas. Hillary says she will put a lot of coal miners and companies out of business. I think I saw Gore back in 2000 at the waterfront in Wheeling. I saw Kerry in Steubenville in 2004 and Bill Clinton in Steubenville 2012 campaigning for Obama. But I remember back in 1992 Bill Clinton and Al Gore both sat in Weirton WV and said they would enforce trade laws and stop illegal dumping, I think 39 steel companies liquidated. Then when "W" took office he put sanctions on all steel imports then immediately started exempting products, then you remember the 2008 crash that was the end of steelmaking in the Ohio valley a nearly 200 year tradition..

[Nitram]

148. So you think idependents will vote for Trump over Clinton?

That actually doesn't make sense. At the very least they will vote forCclinton in order to vote against Trump.

[RiverNoord]

174. You're absolutely right. And I want to be very careful about what I write next.

There has been constant, obviously planned, in lots of cases, media discussion about how Bernie wins in 'heavily white' states, but not in states with considerable ethnic minority populations. It's hard to find an article about a Sanders primary or caucus win in the MSM, not to mention a lot of progressive/liberal-oriented web sites, that doesn't include 'but <the state> is largely white.'

To be very clear, I do not believe in 'races.' I believe that the minor differences among human populations that are based on how long ago their ancestors likely migrated from Africa are, genetically, trivial. That's why I use the word ethnic. The word 'race' is still used in abundance, and I consider that to be a significant part of the overall problem of American racism. I consider the 'but such and such state is largely white' theme to be a racist, divisive tactic, that exemplifies how willing the Democratic machinery is to exploit racism to its own advantage, even as it decries the clear and extreme racism of the Donald Trump following.

Well, setting that aside for a moment, Donald Trump's base is largely comprised of racist (to varying degrees) people of fairly recent European ethnicity. He's stoking that racism as part of his campaign.

How many people among that crowd might re-evaluate their largely racist-based support for Trump and consider voting for Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton? As a percentage? Maybe... 1%? She just doesn't have the background, temperament, experience, or public image that would be necessary to persuade a significant number of these people that maybe they've got a few things a bit out of joint.

However, Bernie Sanders, whose record of fighting for civil rights for minority populations is poignantly better than any other European-American member of the United States Senate, and certainly that of Hillary Clinton, has a message that has a demonstrated appeal to a tremendous number of European-American independent voters, and even quite a lot of historically Republican voters. And he's very good at persuading racists that we're really all in this together.

In a General Election, how would the images of Bernie Sanders getting arrested in Chicago play with ethnic minorities? Because, at that point, information like that wouldn't be suppressed to the extent that it has been throughout the primary campaign. I suspect that, in the end, Bernie Sanders might draw a greater level of ethnic minority support than Hillary Clinton would.

On the other hand, he has been much more successful among the large population of non-party-affiliated American voters than, perhaps, any Democratic candidate since FDR. And how many disaffected historically Republican voters, who are alarmed about the rise of Trump's extreme racism, will not vote for Hillary Clinton, but might consider Sanders an acceptable alternative to Trump? I suspect... lots.

Frankly, he's just about tailor-made to trounce someone like Donald Trump and, in the process, relegate the racist Tea Party phenomenon to obscurity.

However, Clinton will probably have just enough pledged delegates to make a proper case that the 'superdelegates' should keep backing her. And, if she has more substantially more delegates, then that's the way this ought to go. If the DNC and media hadn't effectively blacked out Sanders's campaign among the general public, he would have won. And there will be hell to pay for all of that. As it stands now, by the time of the convention, Sanders will probably be marginally more popular among Democrats than Clinton. But if she's got the delegates, then she's won the nomination.

But her campaign needs, right now, to understand this situation. She doesn't have the background of Bernie Sanders. She's a divisive public figure, moreso as a result of a couple of decades of assholes like Rush Limbaugh making careers out of bashing people like her than her extensive and intimate connections with big money. But that's already done. It ain't gong to get any better for her. Unless she makes some very serious, hard decisions, very soon, that substantively change the nature of her candidacy and agenda, the Democratic Party is going to be in a world of hurt very soon.

[Gene Debs]

186. Hell, she's unbearable to a sizable chunk of Democrats.

[sorechasm]

191. Trump is to the left of Hillary on many trade issues

Meaning Trump may appeal to some Dems.

If over 1/3rd of the GE electorate are independents who will not vote for Hillary (apparently she does not seem to want their vote), and 25% Repubs who will vote against Hillary (in spite of Trump), what chance does she have of winning the GE? Her maximum seems to be 45% of the electorate.

That's the only math that matters.

[maindawg]

195. The Donald is a liberal

He has always been a liberal. People don't change. I am amazed at the pure delusion of the entire Republican party. They push further and further to the right every year. They openly mock the Constitution, commit war crimes and loot the Treasury right out in the open. Acting like ,since they aren't ashamed or hiding it these crimes are somehow OK. They promote fascism on the hate radio for 25 years. They poull a political coup install an idiot Bush as president ,steal the 04 election and they wonder how come some guy ,posing as a fascist , has taken away their toys, is eating their lunch and fucking their wife.

Meanwhile the corporate fascist have left the Republican party in tatters now turns it's evil eye on the Democratic party having spent the past 25 years setting it up, swooping in for the kill , with a well groomed corporate friendly candidate who is willing to get right down on her knees for them.
Hill is ill. She is sick. She may be dying. She can't campaign anymore. She has pneumonia at least if now worse.

[Rockyj]

193. Yep, Voter Surpression,

Independents not being allowed to vote in some states, the flipping of voting machines, Wall St. & 1% big bucks, spreading lies about Bernie, etc., have ALL worked well for Hillary. Which won't help her against Trump.

[RiverNoord]

71. Dude.

OK. Here's someone who lost a race for the same nomination 8 years ago to a relatively unknown junior United States Senator.

She's come very close this time to losing to a Senator who, while respected and admired in Vermont, was virtually unknown by most of the people in the country. Why? Because his strengths are directly aligned against her weaknesses. Polling has been indicating this repeatedly.

That's a reality that doesn't run away and hide in the corner when people loudly declare that it doesn't exist. Reality doesn't work that way.

And if she secures the nomination, she'll be going up against someone whose weaknesses are very similar to hers. Only that bastard has made a career out of making his weaknesses as a human being amusing. He's better at it.

So instead of trying to shout down reality, it would make a lot more sense to scrutinize it carefully, even it you don't get how it could be. I don't get how a creature like Donald Trump could actually be nominated by a major political party as their candidate for the office of the Presidency. Not at all. But it's happening.

And the grown-ups in the room had better be thinking very hard about what it means and how to keep it from blowing up into an insane mess.

[fun n serious]

73. Bernie vs Hillary actually has never been close

Look at the math. Barack Obama has 17 million votes this time 2008. Bernie has 9 million... Obama had a revolution. Bernie does not.

[RiverNoord]

92. This isn't about Bernie Sanders or Barack Obama.

Hillary Clinton had almost the entire DNC laying down the groundwork to fast-track her past token opposition straight to the nomination. There was a straightforward plan to move her briskly along with a bit of token opposition to create the impression that it was a real contest. And with just about the entire Democratic Party machinery backing her, aggressively backing her, yes, she has had a very serious fight on her hands. It appears that Bernie Sanders just won the Indiana Democratic Primary.

Right now, most national polls show equal support among Democrats for Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders.

That doesn't matter, as you say, in terms of who now will have the most delegates at the convention.

It does mean, however, that Hillary Clinton has overall lukewarm support among Democrats. The reason I compared 2008 to 2016 is that, back then, her general favorability among Democrats was higher than it is today.

Subjective statements like 'Obama had a revolution. Bernie does not' are irrelevant and pointless.

We are not going to be coming into the general election from a position of strength. Don't bury your head in the sand pronouncing 'the math! the math!' It's just math. Grade school math, not algebra or calculus. People are a lot more complicated than that. You may not like it, you may be stunned that people seem to be seeing phantoms where you see nothing but math showing you it's all good, don't sweat it. But if it really was all that good, conversations like this wouldn't be taking place. And supporters of Hillary Clinton are going to have to be diligently working on these issues, as lots of supporters of Sanders aren't nearly as motivated to do so.

[fun n serious]

112. I do not see Sanders as a strong candidate

It's not about math. It's about producing votes.

[RiverNoord]

181. OK... Maybe a bit of consistency in your arguments would be a good thing?

Here's your reply to me from yesterday:

"Look at the math. Barack Obama has 17 million votes this time 2008. Bernie has 9 million... Obama had a revolution. Bernie does not."

Your were making the same assertion as you are here, with the math of vote counts as the basis of your assertion.

And I see that you've posted the exact same thing again in this thread. Literally copied and pasted it.

If an argument isn't a good one, making it repeatedly, and word for word identically, in what is essentially the same discussion, isn't going to make it any better an argument. And if it is a good one, then it shouldn't have to made more than once during that discussion. Maybe expanding on it when appropriate, but not just throwing the same words out there...

[truedelphi]

219. I'm admiring what you wrote, RiverNoord.

She had crazy backing and a huge war chest, and yet people still refuse to like her or vote for her.

So who gets blamed for that? Why we Bernie Sanders supporters get blamed for Clintons's un-likeability, her dishonesty, her selling out of the middle class.

You would think that we Bernie Sanders supporters had twisted her arms and made her be so bad ass in bed with Big Corporate America, just as her husband was while President and is now.

[OwlinAZ]

108. Howard Dean does not speak for me.

He did up until about 6 months ago.

[strategery blunder]

126. The primary schedule was also far different in 2008.

In 2008, for example, California voted on Super Tuesday.

This year, CA is one of the last states to vote.

[mountain grammy]

98. +1

[RKP5637]

155. Very well said. It's going to be a very close call in 2016. Hillary is definitely not a shoe-in

for the WH 2016. And that's just looking at it realistically/strategically. Often when people vote it's just a gut feeling, and Trump is feeding that gut feeling that he's the one. I find it so sad and frankly frightening that many Americans today fall for all of the propaganda and rhetoric fed to them. To me, the democratic party has loss control by over the years constantly running more rightward, as well as the flaws brought on by the DLC and all of those shenanigans, plus IMO some ridiculous trade deals.

[AlbertCat]

91. VOTES show strength NOTHING else

except maybe

1) Name recognition
2) Advantageously over-coverage in media
3) "A woman president!"
4) Vote tampering
5) Arm twisting, re super delegates.
etc

[dchill]

177. If slowly losing while facing an imminent FBI report means winning...

She's "winning."

[LannyDeVaney]

60. Please elaborate ...

Please list the weaknesses that feed right into his strengths. TIA

[TDale313]

67. She's the ultimate status quo candidate.

She's a symbol- fair or not- of the very broken system he's railing against. She comes off as guarded, poll tested, weighing every word. And she doesn't handle criticism well.

He may well self destruct. He should. He's misogynistic and racist and a bully. But he has very effectively savaged every establishment opponent in these primaries. He's feeding into a real frustration with the system- a system she's had a major part of shaping.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

72. Trump's position on Muslims feeds dangerous strategies.

[Yavin4]

76. I'd take status quo over Trump

Only a fool would do otherwise.

[RKP5637]

159. Agree!!! n/t

[RiverNoord]

180. We're all fools when it comes to politics.

And millions of people have very different perspectives on what the status quo is, and what is and is not foolish.

When you make a statement like that, you are telling people that your perspective on what constitutes the 'status quo,' whether it is desirable or not, and what constitutes foolishness, is the correct one.

If you go through life without ever trying to persuade others that alternatives to particular position, behavior, perspective, etc., of theirs, is flawed or has a better alternative, that's fine.

On the other hand, if you care at all about whether someone who doesn't share your perspective comes around to see things roughly as you do, telling people that they are fools ain't gonna help.

[Yavin4]

190. If you think that President Donal Trump is any sort of improvement over the status quo

Then you are a fool.

[RiverNoord]

212. I do not think that.

I think that a President Donald Trump would be a colossal disaster. I don't pretend to know the nature of the little disasters that would make up the great grand disaster of a Trump Presidency, but they would likely be pretty damn disastrous.

So, this isn't about me. Although I sure as hell am a fool, in the sense that I've done foolish things during my 45 years. And I certainly will do quite a few more foolish things before I stop kicking. Because I'm human. But I certainly don't want my country to elect Donald Trump as its President. Ugh. So, not about me.

It's about everyone who might consider voting for the bastard. Because there are an awful lot of them. And you know what makes good publicity for a Republican presidential candidate who is really, really disliked by most of the Republican party machinery?

Hillary Clinton supporters telling people who might vote for him that they're fools.

So, please, for God's sake, don't use that approach on anyone you know that says 'you know, I might just vote for Trump.'

And, by the way, who were the fools during the David Souter confirmation process, the 9 Democrats who voted against him (including Ted Kennedy and John Kerry) or the 46 who voted to confirm? Because, of course, he turned out to be a bastion of right-wing co... Um... Well, where I was going with that - I was all wrong there. It funny how people are often not quite who you think they are.

[Politicub]

201. Not everyone is like you

Foolishness is voting for anyone who is not the Dem nominee. The election is not the time for navel-gazing.

[RiverNoord]

207. So, regardless of who becomes the Democratic candidate for the Presidency,

no matter what happens, say,

if the Democratic nominee turned out to be addicted to cocaine, was married but visited a favorite prostitute every couple of weeks, and had a Swiss bank account with a $50 million balance, although that person had not inherited or legally earned anywhere near such a sum during all working years,

and this was discovered 3 months before the general election,

every Democrat who didn't vote for that person would be a fool for not doing so?

I would be very interested in your answer.

[Politicub]

215. That's a strawman argument

So I'm not going to entertain it. The discussion would be a descent into logical fallacy.

[fun n serious]

78. I like the Status quo!

Obama has done an awesome job. She actually handles criticism really well. Look what she has been thru and is still standing stronger than Bernie. He is the one who flies off the hook..

[AlbertCat]

95. She actually handles criticism really well.

Yeah. She even ignore being voted "most untrustworthy".

[LannyDeVaney]

80. Thanks for replying. I think you give Trump too much credit ...

He is doing way more than railing against a system. He is the system the Democrats are fighting.

"She comes off as guarded, poll tested, weighing every word. And she doesn't handle criticism well. "

Regarding these criticisms of her, I just flat out disagree with and I'll leave it at that, if I elaborate I'll get a hide.


Have a nice evening.

[TDale313]

96. I'm not giving him too much credit...

So much as not having a lot of faith in the American public to see through his con. As I said, he may and should self destruct. But he plays the media like a drum, so they're not gonna help. And a lot of people are really pissed off, and giving the whole system the finger in electing Trump might appeal to more than we'd like to think. I was shocked and horrified to see us elect The Governator here in California. The dynamics have a lot in common.

It's all a con, but he fakes "authentic" really well. It may be an authentic asshole, but a lot of people lap that shit up. And I'm sorry if this is hurtful to Hillary supporters, but it's a weakness of hers as a politician. She does not come across as authentic. She doesn't come across as trustworthy. You can argue it's unfair- I would actually agree to some extent- but it is what it is. Once a public persona is as widely accepted and baked in as hers is it's really, really hard to get people to re-evaluate. And if we nominate her (and yeah, it looks like we're doing just that) that will be something we're gonna have to contend with.

[LannyDeVaney]

100. Really great reply ...

thanks. Really points out a general problem the Clinton campaign will face. I feel like she is working on that issue by campaigning "table side" with people who won't even vote for her, but she still talks to them.

I have more faith in the American public after electing Obama. That restored a lot I lost after W was re-elected in '04. Wow, that one shocked me, and your "shocked and horrified" line was dead on that night too. I remember the day BEFORE that election being excited, because I did indeed have too much faith in the American public.

Rest assured, I'll be voting for Sanders if he does win the nomination. And I'll vote for every Democrat on my Alabama ticket, even though I may be the only one.

[Volaris]

121. I had a whole big long thing written and then I deleted it

Then I had a shorter thing written, and I deleted that too, because

This general election will be about Money In Politics, Inside vs Not.

[Nitram]

149. Bernie fans keep saying that, but it is a blatant falsehood.

Just look at her platform. There is no status quo in it.

[TDale313]

154. Disagree. I think it's exactly the case.

And if the status quo were better that might not be such a bad thing. But look around- look at the rise of Bernie and Trump. There is a serious frustration with politics and business as usual. We're about to nominate someone who represents precisely that. And I have looked at her platform. It's Bernie's, without the decades of actual commitment to those issues.

Look, we need to beat Trump. He's genuinely frightening. And yes, I get the math and know Hillary is most likely gonna be our nominee. But some of her supporters have blinders on about her weaknesses, how she's perceived, and how easy Trump will be to beat. This is not gonna be easy, and yes, I think it's a problematic matchup. She can still win, but it's way past time to be realistic about what a general between these two will look like.

[Nitram]

156. If some of Clinton's supporters have blinders, based on your comment I'd have to add that

some of Berni's supporters are a wearing Statue of Justice costume. You just keep repeat6ing the status quo canard without reference to a single one of her platform policies.

[TDale313]

161. I believe in economic and military issues nothing will change.

And frankly, I don't take much of what she says in the primary that seriously. She has moved to the left cause that's where the energy is. Even then it was begrudgingly. And it is not where she's actually been in the past.

[Android3.14]

74. overly ambitious, wealthy, connections to Wall Street, egotistical, arrogant

Are you writing these down?
mean, sneaky, unpredictable, entitled, manipulative, media grabbing, narrow band of support, trying to buy the election, supports of law enforcement, lacks support of progressives, supports unlawful military intervention,...

His STRENGTHS feed right into her WEAKNESSES.

[Nitram]

147. Both Bernie and Clinton are ahead of Trump in the polls.

Trump is the most unpopular nominee ever to have been put forward by any party in the US. Bernie might get disgruntled white blue collar Republicans, and Clinton is likely to get a lot of disgruntled female Republicans. Clinton is at an advantage against Trump because he can't help but say stupid misogynistic stuff about her. Not to mention, she brings an incredible wealth of talent, experience and knowledge to the campaign.

[TDale313]

151. I hope you're right. President Trump is a terrifying thought.

I think it's possible- maybe likely- that either of our candidates could beat him. Maybe enough people will see through his schtick. Maybe he'll self destruct. But I stand by what I said. Hillary v Trump is not a good matchup for us.

[rtracey]

162. too bad

too bad your Bernie or bust slag will do in the country.... there is always 2020.....party or bust, party or trump

[TDale313]

163. I'm not Bernie or Bust.

I despise Trump. I want the Dem to win. I think Hillary has some serious weaknesses that will make the General harder than some of her supporters believe. I've said what I feel they are. We're still in the Primary- it's likely where this is headed. It's still ok to talk about those issues.

Go ahead and keep pissing on the nearly half the party who wanted someone other than Hillary. That's a winning strategy right there.

[rtracey]

173. sorry but

The other 1/2 of the party has already pissed on the election. Even though you might not be Bernie or bust, there are many who are, and already have come out and said they will not vote for Hillary, so don't preach your "keep pissing on 1/2 the party bullshit" Noone knows how Hillary will be as president, no one know how Bernie will handle the GOP house that will NEVER, NEVER, NEVER pass his agenda. You think MR. Obama met with stalemate, you have not seen anything yet if Mr sanders is elected. Preserve the party will defeat Trump, instead of Bernie or bust, it must be PARTY or BUST, PARTY of TRUMP.

[YoungDemCA]

54. ....

[mindwalker_i]

101. :cackle:

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

105. Relax, Bernie's got this one handled.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[JoeOtterbein]

77. Bernie is the Only Antidote

[rurallib]

2. Scary

[Siwsan]

3. I shakes my head

I've always thought that if would be a good idea if a potential candidate should have to be able to pass a basic civics test, before he can officially run for the highest office in the nation.

[immoderate]

87. No. The system was designed to allow for this. (Though head shaking may be apropos.)

--imm

[shanti]

222. IOKIYAR

the dems have super-delegates to counter that.

[roamer65]

119. I agree.

[craigmatic]

4. If Hillary loses this she didn't deserve to be POTUS.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

9. Well if she loses this she won't be, so....yeah.

But for the record, she's not what I'm worried about. Or--if by some unexpected turn of events--Sanders.

It's the electorate that scares me. More than once they've left me nonplussed.

[malokvale77]

117. Weird...

I find Trump to be the least scary on the GOP side.

I find Clinton to be the most scary on the Dem side.

Maybe we'll all wise up and just vote for Senator Bernie Sanders. The least scary world all around.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

141. Are you absolutely out of your mind?

Donald Trump is not "the least scary" of the Republicans.

Donald Trump, with his fascist base of support, gross incompetence and unchecked NPD, is the most scary of the Republicans.

Not only that, he's one of the most scary human beings to ever run for President on a major party ticket, definitely in my lifetime and perhaps ever.

He is pathological, plain and simple.

This isn't about Sanders vs. Clinton. Let the chips fall where they may. Either of them is so infinitely more qualified to be President than Trump that whatever flaws they have become absolutely inconsequential.

[Fumesucker]

160. Trump knows what the M$M wants and craves, eyeballs

Trump plays the Gish gallop to perfection, he's simply impossible to keep up with he spews so many lies so fast. But Trump's lies are truthy, many of them are lies that a lot of us would like to believe, that we can be made safe and protected if we just get rid of those people.

If you try to directly refute a Gish gallop you'll put your audience to sleep with amazing speed, it's one of the most difficult propaganda techniques to effectively counter.

Hillary is the not-particularly-gifted athlete who through sheer doggedness and tenacity has made it to the big leagues without true big league talent. Trump is the big league talent who never really stuck with it until now and doesn't have the real basics but is such a natural he's a contender anyway.

[imari362]

230. ^^^^Exactly

Trump was the number one tv reality show personality and has now found the biggest audience ever in real reality....the only problem is that the majority of his supporters actually believe the bull he spews, for them it's just as great as when he was yelling "you're fired" at some has been star....and...the crowds cheered

[FlaGranny]

169. Trump has some

very populist views - or at least says he does, like rebuilding infrastructure, creating jobs, etc. It sounds good, but if you look back in history about 70 or 80 years ago at the careers of Mussolini and Hitler, they also spoke about those same things, and once they took control they each improved their country's economy and created jobs and their people were very happy with the way things were going. Look how those two had their populations' full support in the beginning. I see so many similarities with Trump. In fact, if Trump did not insult so many groups of people, he would be a shoe-in in the general election. Even so, a large part of the population seems to not care. I am very worried.

[malokvale77]

237. Trump is nothing more than Hillary's "trump card".

He's there to assure her win in the GE.

Also, the Republicans must have been sleeping (or not) when Soros bought the software that runs both eVote machines we use in our elections.

Weird (not) that only Democratic primaries didn't match the exit polls.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

239. Your tinfoil is showing. nt

[elmac]

31. She can't lose

there is no way for Trump to get the African American or Latino vote, unless, voter turnout is low + republicans dirty tricks, then it could be close but still don't see a Trump win.

[TDale313]

47. Do not underestimate him. He can win.

Too many people saying there's no way. We elected Arnold here in "liberal" California. The appeal of celebrity and anti-establishment rhetoric is very powerful. And if we nominate Hillary we are literally nominating the poster child for everything he's railing against.

Be prepared for a dog fight. Who knows- maybe he'll self destruct or enough people will see through his schtick. But we can't count on that.

[Bucky]

166. did you see Van Jones's video post yesterday? He outlines Trump's victory plan

We're all in deep shit and our apparent nominee is poised to lose.

[TDale313]

226. A lot can happen, but yeah, it's absolutely possible.

Perhaps even likely.

[shanti]

223. exactly

i'm in california too, and was appalled when arnold won...with ZERO experience at governing. it definitely can happen nationwide with drumpf.

[litlbilly]

49. so you say, dont bet on that.

[elmac]

62. I would never bet on it

and Bernie is my choice to run but I would never underestimate the Clinton machine. As the dems continue to slug it out the repugs will start to solidify, unify or die on the vine.

[ffr]

168. The M$M loses out if they don't do everything possible to make this a close race

All media outlets will be giving Trump a pass at every turn. If people find this contest as a runaway, they'll tune out. No viewers, means no advertisers for M$M.

We all know it's about the money.

[Vincardog]

206. Wait till the machines start stealing votes for him instead of HRC then we will see who can win.

[Lordquinton]

35. If Clinton makes it to the GE, and doesn't win it

It will be her own fault, regardless of who they try to blame.

[LovingA2andMI]

83. THIS^^^^

[AlbertCat]

97. If Clinton makes it to the GE, and DOES win it

it won't be because a majority love her, agree with her, or even want her there.

[Lordquinton]

116. A race with a virtual unknown

And a lot of his suppoters have been shut out of the process and there have been election mishaps and she hasn't been able to clinch it by now does not bode well for her future.

I'm really happy that California is getting a say this time though, everyone in the state should thank Sanders for that fact.

[Volaris]

122. Yep. She should be taking the critiques of her Mastery of a Dirty System seriously,

And making the case that she has the tools to master a clean one as well.

[BlueMTexpat]

136. Actually, it will be the fault of

those who did not vote for her. Just sayin' ....

You can sit back and blame her for everything - as all too many do here, whether she had anything to do with it or not - or you can look to the real culprits who, in spite of everything that is at stake, do NOT vote for her. Period.

[A Simple Game]

153. Funny, I will blame it on the people that did vote for her in the primaries

knowing that outside the Democratic party, where at best even there she is only tied with Bernie, she has very little support.

Then inevitably there is going to be the canceled check Trump has with her name on it and the favor he will claim he got from her in return.

When Hillary destroys the Democratic party will you then blame that on Bernie?

[Lordquinton]

176. It would be her own fault for the campaign she choose to run

Technically it would be because not enough people voted for her, because that's how you loose a campaign. You need to get more votes than the other guy, if she were to loose it would be because she couldn't get enough votes, which would be the fault of her and her campaign, regardless of who you want to blame.

[RiverNoord]

75. Um.. yeah, that would kind of be the self-evident reality of a loss.

Not really an argument you have there as much as a statement of the obvious .

[FLPanhandle]

5. It's great

What an amazing gift to the Democrats.

Don't let all the hand-wringers scare you, Trump is the greatest thing to happen to the Democratic Party in a very long time.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

10. I'll agree with you the day after the election...

...but not a moment before.

As I said, the stakes are huge.

[840high]

24. I don't think so. People

are fed up with too much om both sides.

[BlindTiresias]

32. I suspect

Trump is far more competitive than many assume and will continue to surprise.

[RiverNoord]

51. I'm afraid I agree.

He's an appalling and pathetic excuse for a human being. But he's always been that, and he's got a very large celebrity fan following.

I could never understand why people would watch a television program during which a rich prick would tell some young person, 'you're fired!' Still don't. But just because I don't get it doesn't mean it's not real.

If Clinton takes the Democratic nomination, the two major party candidates for the Presidency will be two widely disliked people. But Trump has made a career out of fascinating people with his caricature of bufoonish, narcissistic cheap-shot bullying. Hillary Clinton, on the other hand, has largely become disliked because of her perceived lack of trustworthiness.

When Trump tells people 'Trust me,' many at least seem to feel that they're in on the joke themselves. And they seem to get a kick out of the predictable punchline - 'You really thought you could trust me?'

The candidate to send against a serial liar is someone voters believe is relatively honest, trustworthy, and likeable. Instead we're probably going to send someone who has as much of an image for being untrustworthy as Trump, but can't match his audacity.

This whole damn thing is going to get very, very ugly.

[elljay]

110. Agreed

He has the ability to win states like Pennsylvania, Ohio and Wisconsin, with lots of working class, white voters. He'll win the South, even though evangelicals aren't that find of him, because he is a Republican. I'm not seeing Utah, Idaho, and the other conservative western states voting for Hillary, either. She will have to win in Florida, NC and Virginia, states Democrats do not consistently win. This will by no means be a cakewalk.

[Martin Eden]

137. Don't underestimate the ignorant masses

They relish the opportunity to flip the establishment a big fat bird in the form of Donald Trump, while Hillaty Clinton generates underwhelming enthusiasm.

[NickB79]

197. People said the same thing about that idiot George W. Bush

As the European press so succinctly put it after he was RE-elected:

[femmocrat]

6. It makes me sick that anyone believes his act.

He cares nothing about the country. This is all to stoke his gigantic ego and he will steamroll anyone who gets in his way.

The campaign for the GE is going to be really ugly.

[RiverNoord]

59. I don't think they truly believe his act.

I think that most of his supporters are quite aware that it's an act, and, for some reason, want to be part of it.

He's made a career out of bullshit, and somehow he's turned his rambling, petty bullying version of bullshit into a commodity many people find amusing.

But I do agree with you on this:

"The campaign for GE is going to be really ugly."

[spanone]

7. who would have thought? he's the scariest i've seen in my lifetime.

he's a phony and a fraud and a great percentage of the republican party thinks that is just fine.

[Plucketeer]

165. Yup

In response to the OP, Trump IS horrific. Even the Rethugs think so. But however you cut it, it WAS the Rethugs who laid out the Red carpet for this beast. They've been prepping the stage for his introduction LONG before they even knew just WHO was gonna take the role on.

AND....... the Dems are almost as culpable as the Right. With true shit offered us for "representation" - shit literally dumped in our faces (remember the Feces for Faces bill that was a bipartisan sweetheart?), the stage has finally been set for the grotesque actors we're slogging thru. We're down to a LIAR - an EGOMANIAC - and an ANGEL (and you know, of course, that you can't SEE an Angel - that's why the MSM has clung to that tradition). I'll leave it to you to sort out the LIAR - EGOMANIAC persons!

[basselope]

8. and the dems arent smart.. it will be pres trump

[Agnosticsherbet]

11. We need to take what Van Jones said to heart, and take Trump seriously.

Come together and start fighting to win this, or:
tRump Supreme Court
tRump Justice Department
tRump FBI
tRump Department of Defense

https://www.facebook.com/vanjones/videos/10154143952024910/

[Jack Rabbit]

45. Let's see . . .

Trump supreme court pick: Judge Judy
Trump Attorney General: Judge Nepalitano
Trump FBI Director: Sheriff Arpaio
Trump Secretary of Defense: Chuck Norris
Trump Secretary of State: Don Rickles

Good luck, America.

[3hummingbirds]

102. trump

Totally scary.

[Jack Rabbit]

115. Clump vs. Trinton

Scotally Tary.

[octoberlib]

12. I thought maybe he was just trolling the GOP and would engineer some way

to drop out of the race. I never thought he was serious about wanting the job but I guess he's going all the way with it.

[Hydra]

18. His people say the plan was always to get 2nd and drop out

But something unexpected happened on the way to that plan- the Republican party died on the table. There's some noise about putting Paul Ryan out there, but otherwise they simply cannot field a candidate that a 2yo can't knock over with a sneeze.

I'd be happy about that, but the DLC wing of our party is busy burning the place down.

[maryellen99]

13. Also someone who has appeared on a WWE ppv and is in the WWE hall of fame

JFC

[Person 2713]

34. Hey those are big pluses with his voters!

Idiocracy

[Volaris]

123. Soooo...President Comacho then. Thanks got it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. And some of us are going meh!!!!

Why? We took him that seriously starting last year, and are not surprised at all about this.

I should probably let the rest of you process this... Trust me, I knew he was one scary dude after I started to compare his speeches to some ahem historical speeches.

[Katashi_itto]

21. +100000

[TM99]

36. The scariest thing is that people

still think he is a buffoon.

Cruz starting playing behind the scenes politics to garner (steal!) more delegates. Trump hired new consultants, made deals, and moved forward to big wins. Cruz is now dropping out.

This man is not stupid. He may speak on a 3rd grade level to appeal to a certain type of voter (basically all Americans who are dumbed down zombies!) but he is not a 3rd grade level intellect.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/are-billionaires-smarter-than-you-2013-04-24

Now I should clarify that IQ may be high but that doesn't mean that he or anyone else this smart is not an NPD with serious character flaws.

[nadinbrzezinski]

38. Why I made the direct reference to those historic speeches

they were also written at 3-4 grade level.

Yup, the man is a fascist. But he is far from a clown, a buffoon or dumb.

[LovingA2andMI]

85. Trump Is A Master Marketer...

And the Right Marketing Strategy, Can Win Everything. Especially against a possible candidate that makes folks sleep.

[TM99]

88. Fascist?

Absolutely.

Dumbass? Not on your life.

Democrats will do something stupid, which seems to be modus operandi, by putting forth someone like Clinton when they need someone like Sanders.

[zalinda]

15. Did Bill Clinton help this along?

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2015/08/donald-trump-and-bill-clinton-collide-best-conspiracy-story-ever

Z

[Tommy_Carcetti]

17. No. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

39. Since this guy has been toying with a run for the WH since 1988...

[TomCADem]

16. Don't Underestimate The Power of Tapping Into Racial Animus

What is amazing is that even on DU, there are sometimes efforts to sanitize Trump as some sort of moderate. Trump is not a moderate. He is the closest thing to a facist that we have ever had. What is worse is that Ted Cruz was the GOP candidate that came close to him.

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. I confess I will have to read EVEN MORE of his philosphy

but here is exactly we ran on this a few months ago, when people were still not taking him seriously.

https://reportingsandiego.com/2016/03/25/trumpism-as-political-philosophy/

[Katashi_itto]

19. She's inevitable. Don't worry about. It's all good.

You don't even need votes because it's her turn now.

[jimlup]

20. Apparently you can fool a whole lot of people a lot of the time...

I kinda feel sorry for the fools who support him but I shouldn't as most them are bullies like their candidate.

Horrible and amazing fucking situation isn't it?

[chwaliszewski]

23. I'm not worried one bit.

Hillary has got this. No worries. Trump doesn't stand a chance because it's her time.

Piece of cake.

[MFM008]

127. and Sanders is Ancient

the great hope is 75.
Big bold new ideas from a guy a heartbeat away from a nursing home.

[chwaliszewski]

132. Hillary only looks ancient

and her ideas are nothing new...keep Wall St. happy, spread the fracking, and drop more bombs.

I don't like her chances against Trump. The smarter choice would be Sanders.

[elmac]

25. Rumor has it that his VP pick will be

Deez Nuts.

[SunSeeker]

40. Why not? I think he got more votes that Kasich.

[kairos12]

26. If the economy tubes, or their is a 9/11 style attack before November he gets

elected, otherwise he's toast.

[Drahthaardogs]

27. Remember your history. An angry middle class votes in fascists.

It happened in a lot of Europe. Keep the faith though. After they fail, they vote in socialist.

[Kip Humphrey]

28. A certified narcissistic archetypal psychopath nominee

as representative a republicon as you will ever find!

[Bernardo de La Paz]

29. Get out the Democratic Vote. SCOTUS / Senate. Can't afford to be complacent

Can't afford to assume the Democratic nominee will beat Trump. Even if they can, there is the Senate to win and 2 to 4 Supreme Court nominations upcoming. Plus Ryan needs to sweat the House. Plus plus State Governors and Legislatures need to be won unless you want to see more North Carolinas.

[Jester Messiah]

30. The presidency is a magnet for narcissists.

He would hardly be the first.

[Don Draper]

33. If Hillary is the democratic nominee

We are in big trouble. She won't get the independents, is viewed overwhelming negative by the general public and doesn't have the enthusiasm. DWS and the dnc won't be able to rig the GE the way they did the primaries.

[retrowire]

42. This. This one thousand times, THIS.

Bernie has the masses, Bernie has the passion.

Trump also has the masses and the passion.

This is something they both have and Hillary does not. That is why, for the fairest fight, you put Bernie in the ring with Trump, NOT HILLARY.

[chwaliszewski]

134. +1,000

[roamer65]

46. She doesn't have my enthusiasm. N/t

[Egnever]

94. I dissagree

While Hillary does have high negatives. Trumps are even higher. Trump is quite possibly the only republican she could have beat.

The TV is making a lot of noise because they want it to be a horse race. Meanwhile the GOP leadership is freaking out. They know what a disaster this is for them. Cruz could have been masked as a moderate for the general, Trump can't be controlled period.

This is going to be a massive blow out.

King of the clowns does not make one a serious contender for the Presidency.

[the_sly_pig]

41. *W elected twice.

What's the difference? This is the result of turning education into a business and the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Thanks Bill.

[Ford_Prefect]

55. W never won a straight up election. He was selected the first time and flipped into office the 2nd.

I agree commercialized education is the business of trading tax dollars for charter schools of dubious credibility and academic value. Bill was investing in America's future all right.

[HooptieWagon]

44. DNC sure picked a bad time to alienate the left.

i guess Hillary going to target right wing voters...I wonder what she'll promise them? Compromise on choice? Lots of war? Frack, baby, frack? Privatize SS?

[Bigmack]

50. "Donald Fucking Trump"... it just rolls off the keyboard and tongue...

...doesn't it?

I just posted those exact words on Facebook.

[villager]

52. "You still think you can control them?"

[Eric J in MN]

53. Not only zero elected experience but zero in a gov't job. NT

NT

[shanti]

224. not to worry

he'll be persuaded to have the big guns of the rep party as the real leaders, and he'll be a puppet for them. no experience required.

[kimbutgar]

57. So scary to even think it could happen

[PatrynXX]

58. yeah and stands for everything most Right wing Republicans are against

like the biggest Moderate they'll ever see. yes closer to the Authoritarian side compared to Libertarian which is where Hitler is usually. Hitler was a moderate. he wasn't an extremist Right Wing.

I don't agree with the placement of Trump here because of his record but http://politicalcompass.org/uselection2016 Still interesting. Yes it still puts me down as a Libertarian. Left Wing Libertarian but oh well

[NutmegYankee]

61. Hitler was not libertarian.

He was a strong authoritarian, but was economically moderate.

[jeepers]

65. You gotta laugh

The media fixated on Trump giving him all that free teevee time in part to help in the Bernie blackout. In doing so they have created a hated and feared monstrosity that has a good chance of devouring their anointed sweetheart come the GE. I love the irony.

Whats more, both The democratic and the republican parties must know that only one who can save them from the Donald is Bernie.

Who ya gonna call

[cyberswede]

66. We should have wiped the floor with GWB...both times

I'm still floored that we "elected" him twice.

[eleny]

68. Yup. And I just can't laugh

He scares the crap out of me.

[AgerolanAmerican]

69. It's worse than that

we're on the path to nominating one of the few Democrats who will lose to him - the worst possible representative of Democratic values

what a horribly flubbed opportunity this election will have been

[PasadenaTrudy]

70. I'm not surprised a bit... n/t

[hibbing]

79. No one ever went broke underestimating the stupidity of the American people n/t

[Volaris]

124. Best quote ever.

[ailsagirl]

235. H.L. Mencken

One of my heroes

[eissa]

86. The scariest nominee in my lifetime

To think this misogynist, racist buffoon could pick the next SC judge, or be anywhere near the WH is just mind-boggling. I don't know whether to rejoice at the stupidity of the republican base, or recoil in horror that this asshole has that many supporters.

[Bangbangdem]

90. What a Fuckin scam.

Top to bottom. Back to front. Who do they think they're fooling? You?

[braddy]

93. This will be unpredictiable, but my guess is that Hillary is more comfortable with this than

most people think, she has a lot on her side as well, things that Trump will have great difficulty in dealing with.

[hrmjustin]

103. God help us!

[Samantha]

109. Hey, Republicans were always against funding education

and now that has finally bitten them in the asinine.

Sam

[Jim Beard]

114. I am seeing Cruze out of the picture anlong with Carlie's short Vice Presidency

I'll bet she is really pissed about singing those horrible songs to his daughters.

[Volaris]

118. The alternatives were all worse.

Think on THAT for a second.

[Warren DeMontague]

130. Little surprises me. We had Delbert Dubya Doofus actually occupy the office for 8 years.

Then we had Cranky McGrampspants run a campaign with a certainly plausible path to victory, one which would have installed an incompetent, incoherent, oft-drunk, barely sentient grifter a heartbeat away from the Presidency.

In 2012 at least we ran against two people who were superficially capable of stringing together coherent sentences.

But Trump is a logical outgrowth of everything that has been happening in the GOP for years. I'm not surprised at all.

[denbot]

135. These are interesting times..

We get out the vote come November, or else..

[anamnua]

138. It would be foolish to underestimate

the Trumpenproletariat.

[IronLionZion]

139. That's his appeal

His voters want something radically different or are curious to see what would happen.

I was sure his party would have taken him out long ago. But it sure looks like the GOP has lost control and will hopefully fall apart soon. Social conservatives should revolt. And any decent republicans should not vote, or vote for the Dem this time.

[BillZBubb]

203. Social conservatives have been voting for him.

Most republicans will vote for him. Few will vote for Hillary.

trump offers hope to those who have economically suffered for the past few decades. He's right on trade (whether or not he stays that way is another question) and working class people get that. It is also easy for him to scapegoat immigrants which sadly also appeals to the working class.

Don't forget trump is going to pivot before the election just as Hillary will. He'll soften his image but keep pounding the economic unfairness issue. He can win it. This will be a close election.

[IronLionZion]

210. For both trade and the economy, he is blaming someone else

it's those sneaky foreigners who are manipulative and dishonest and cheating good decent Americans.

Yes, that appeals to many. But it doesn't even begin to address what the investment bankers and many large American corporations are doing to all of us.

[Melurkyoulongtime]

140. In all fairness

The Simpson's DID try to warn us

[SmittynMo]

142. More than 50%

If its Trump vs HRC, then we're screwed. She don't hold a chance in hell of beating him.

Bernie, on the other hand, would beat him handily. See the polls. I strongly suggest that the remaining states give him a chance against Clinton, to get him where he should have been all along.

For those that haven't noticed, this election is not about who. It's about a revolution against the corrupt establishment, on both sides. Get on the train and let's take our country back.

[TexasBushwhacker]

209. Maybe yes maybe no

Trump's delegate count is misleading because of all the GOP's winner-take-all states. Sure, he would still be on top, but not by as much. The clown car of candidates at the beginning also diluted his support. Most of his early wins were with less than 40% of the vote. Sum total he received 11 million GOP votes, but the "not-Trump" total is 14.5 million. Most of those not-Trump voters will go ahead and vote for him, but some will stay home and some will vote for the Democratic nominee.

[fred v]

143. Vote For. The Fucking Democrat. In November.

Simple!

[sinkingfeeling]

144. I'm calling a real estate agent this morning. Leaving

[Nitram]

146. It is the logical conclusion to the strategies and tactics Republicans have been using to win elect

candidates since Reagan came along. No facts, just fear and bombast, lies and innuendo.

[Jim__]

150. Yup. Donald Fucking Trump.

It does make you wonder about the efficacy of democracy.

[greatauntoftriplets]

157. Fuck Trump.

[SpankMe]

158. The proper long form is: Donald Mother-fucking Trump. n/t

[seabeyond]

167. I know right? Both son and I really expect Republicans to do something about it.

We are with you. Holy shit!!! This is really gonna happen. I hear Ya.

[Nay]

171. Yep, Donald Fucking Trump. Unfortunately, he encapsulates the qualities of a

large segment of the US public, which consists of a pack of howling animals.

[Phlem]

178. Oh Noes! You mean a majority of low information, ignorant, Americans

are voting for the worst possible candidate for their party!!??!!

Wow, I've never witnessed this event ever!!!

[WhiteTara]

183. Amy Goodman had a segment on Trump being mobbed up

with very close ties to the US and Russian mob.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

192. This is not the same country that I was born in.

So sad to see this happening, it shows such a lacking of critical thinking by most voters.

[DCBob]

194. It shocking and an embarrassment to our country.

The GOP created this monster.. they need to deal with it.

[pansypoo53219]

198. the gnewz media LOVES ratings and will whore for the golden squirrel. SQUIRREL!

clinton is BORING. tRUMP is not BORING!

[billhicks76]

199. Republicans For Hillary

The establishment is saying they will run a 3rd party candidate to divert votes to Hillary who they support and whose policies they agree with while giving themselves cover by not explicitly voting for her and just peeling votes away from Trump. Maybe a 4th candidate will do same to Hillary. How interesting would that be?

[Todays_Illusion]

202. The U.S.Republican Party has shown the nation how much they care by delivering Donald Trump as the

Republican candidate.

Why do Republicans hate us the people of the nation and their own nation. This is the party backed by the wealthiest people in the nation.

They hate the very ideas of voters and a democratic republic.

[BillZBubb]

204. "This is the party backed by the wealthiest people in the nation."

That's true of both parties now. Where does Hillary get all her campaign money? Where did the Clinton's get all those millions they've racked up?

As far as delivering trump, is there ANY republican candidate that would be much better? I don't think so. They all suck.

[Todays_Illusion]

205. I agree Hillary is captured by the same money. Trump is no accident, this is a planned outcome to

deliver the candidate they want to be President, namely the one who will sign off on the documents.

That will be Hillary or any Republican.

[sagat]

211. Not surprised in the least.

U.S. Americans are largely morons.

[ailsagirl]

221. Pardon??

[mac2766]

225. Welcome to "Idiocracy".

It's here... it's real...

Americans have officially become idiots. The transformation from intelligent to idiot is complete.

[Crash2Parties]

227. At least Reagan had been governor...

and he still managed to mess up our country for decades. I shudder to think of the damage Trump could do - it would likely last through my grandkids' lives.

[Corey_Baker08]

228. Regardless Of Who You Support, We Must Vote For The Democratic Nominee

[Katashi_itto]

242. Bwhahaha!

[valerief]

236. Nope. TV is playing the ratings game. We'll see a change come July. nt

[maggies farm]

238. I would accept

Trump choosing Hillary as his running mate.

They could run as the quintessential Ugly Americans. This would be the 2 for 1 America has fallen for before.

Trump/Clinton would be similar to a Bush/Cheney administration.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

240. Well, that's because you're an.....

...never mind. I'd say something that might get me locked out of my own post, and I'd rather not, so I'll just zip it here.

[Katashi_itto]

243. She is on to something. Hillary with Trump as VP....

[Katashi_itto]

241. Hillary or Trump