They Key to Non-Violent Protests Is To Win The Police Over

[Yavin4]

Not confront them with sticks. Doing so puts you in a confrontational position. If you hit cops with sticks, then they will turn on you.

Read up on Gene Sharp's From Dictatorship to Democracy:

Paraphrasing here:

div class="excerpt"]Defiance strategists should remember that it will be difficult or impossible to disintegrate the dictatorship if the police, bureaucrats, and the military remain fully supportive of the dictatorship. Strategies aimed at subverting the loyalty of the dictators' forces should be given the highest priority.

pg. 64

http://www.aeinstein.org/organizations/org/FDTD.pdf

[datasuspect]

1. a little insight about LEOs

if you aren't one of them or police family, you are either a civilian or a shitbird.

civilians get in the way, shitbirds get abused.

in either case, they don't care about you, they aren't your friend, they aren't your brother or sister.

[Fire Walk With Me]

2. Exactly. I've been in several completely peaceful protests and cops fucked them up on purpose.

Last edited Tue May 22, 2012, 05:10 PM - Edit history (1)

They're ordered to.

March 17 in LA is a prime example. Occupy LA were eating vegan chili on a huge public sidewalk, during the rain, no traffic, no pedestrians, Facebook notice that we'd only be there for four hours...cops were there from the start, constantly escalated their numbers, did multiple walk-throughs, changed their minds several times about what was allowed and gave orders, pushed into people (I saw it), intimidated, walked through recording us, ignored our pleas that they stop escalating the situation and to leave us alone, and eventually mobbed someone they found "arrestable", creating three more arrests in the process (one of which was a grab from behind, no announcement, cop smiled). They brought out a "less-lethal" shotgun, a cop shouted and pulled his baton above his head at me, they repeatedly punched that first man as he was being held on the ground (caught on video), and it goes on and on and on. Wouldn't give out badge numbers and names, breaking section 830.10, etc. etc. etc.

John Lennon was SO correct when he said cops have to taunt you into being violent, because that's what they understand and then they know what to do with you. Don't feed the violence trolls!

[2pooped2pop]

3. when the protesters get beat by the cops when they are peaceful

we win the public opinion which is needed to make more people want to join us. When black bloc starts fires breaks windows and assault the police first. We lose the public support.
I don't think we are ready for an all out war with the police. I think the black bloc is taking us in the wrong direction.
We are already having to deal with the one sided media telling the people how dangerous we are. If we give them "just cause" to attack us we will never win. They will simply outlaw protests and they will have the publics support in doing it. If u hit a cop or his horse with a stick, and he shoots and kills u, the public will support the shooting. It's only a matter of time til that happens at this rate.
i just can't help but feel black bloc is hurting our chances. And yes I know they are infiltrated. They infiltrate all protest groups but it,s only the black block that they can get to do the stupid shit.

[Fire Walk With Me]

6. Some people WANT to fight the cops directly, and many are utterly righteous in this

but they forget cops have guns and a craving to use them. An LA kid just ate 90-some bullets after a recent high-speed chase. Cops don't need a reason at all. I don't want to march with anyone looking to give them one! They can go attack cops =anytime= they want, so long as I'm not around, or others not counting or planning on being shot at or worse

[2pooped2pop]

9. I agree

so how do we march without the tagalongs? With them in our marches the people see the waste of the huge presence as being our fault. Without the violence and juvenile crimes the people see the over sized police force as a waste of their resources and taxpayer money. They see the police state and loss of rights.
When they see windows broken and police attacked they justify the overkill.

so what can we do? Everyone move ten feet away from them to isolate them? Occupy was so adamant about not being co opted by the DNC or Moveon but it seems that the anarchist are co opting us.

[Fire Walk With Me]

11. Extremely good points!

Early in Occupy, they did indeed move away from anyone being violent, or promoting it. Now, yes indeed, those who want opportunity to smash things seem to have gained some weird credibility.

The 1% would LOVE for us to become an FTP movement, and forget entirely about fighting the 1%.

They'd laugh and laugh and laugh.

[sabrina 1]

4. Um, you need to talk to the cops. Fyi, over 99% of the violence at OWS protests

has been caused by the Cops. Tell them to lay down THEIR sticks, you know the batons they regularly beat people up with. Then maybe we can somewhere. Protesters are not armed, not sure about the point of this OP. Doesn't relate to anything regarding this issue of police brutality, now recorded for the world to see.

Got some video btw, of armed protesters attacking the police?

[Union Scribe]

8. Yep. The cops come dressed like stormtroopers

with their adrenaline pumping for conflict and weapons in hands.

[Yavin4]

13. When The Serbs Organized Marches Against their Leader, They Put Old Women in the Front

The old women would go up to the soldiers and give them kisses and flowers.

This was far more effective than hitting cops with sticks.

[sabrina 1]

15. Not sure what that has to do with OWS. They HAVE been treating cops with

kindness. This weekend for example, as they have done elsewhere, they bought coffee and doughnuts for them, which the cops promptly threw on the ground.

Who has been 'hitting cops with sticks' over the past seven months of protests? You know that OWS adheres to Gandhi's philosophy and MLK's and are instructed before every protest not to allow the cops to provoke them. That protesting peaceful is part of their TACTIC to gain support and it has worked brilliantly, helping the movement to spread around the country, rather than remain only in NYC.

They agree with what you just described. But someone needs to talk to the cops. Beating up peaceful protesters, nearly killing several of them, arresting Journalists at the point of guns, preventing people from getting medical help when they need it, refusing gestures of kindness from protesters, not all of them, some have accepted them, this is what is causing the violence.

It would be dangerous to put old people in front of the demonstrations here, the cops have nearly killed people in wheelchairs, old women and war veterans. Maybe the Serb leaders were more susceptible to having sympathy for vulnerable people. But the cops here have shown no such signs of being moved by anyone, even the disabled.

[Comrade_McKenzie]

5. You can't win over rabid animals. Ask any vet. nt

[coalition_unwilling]

7. Um, this appears to be a drive-by OP, but I disagree. The key to

non-violent protests is to win the public over by remaining non-violent when the state uses violent force against the protest. Win the public over and the police will eventually have no choice but to follow or risk being relegated to the dustbins of history.

[randome]

10. I believe you have me on Ignore, but for what it's worth...

...I agree completely with what you said.

[Yavin4]

12. Um, NOT A Drive By Post. Read Gene Sharp's "From Dictatorship to Democracy" Manifesto

which has been used to overthrow dictatorships in Eastern Europe and Egypt, and it almost over threw the Iranian government.

Sorry, I will go with Gene Sharp's work over you.

Read the pdf at the link.

[randome]

14. I don't think it's a drive-by, either.

Did not agree with that.